Answers to WTFWTK 2.30!

Yeah, it really does sound weird on alotta levels, to make that statement.

First off, How is this "fan-pitched", when the stuff that is passing for "continuity" (i.e., the bios) sounds very pedestrian?? I'm surprised that they didn't consult with Val, Emiliano, etc. to begin with... What, they were good enough to create the comics, but not to continue the legacy of MOTU, like they were doing the whole time?

Secondly, the story of MOTU is kinda "complicated" to begin with. Randor and Keldor are brothers, but they look like day and night to each other....? That's not complicated??? And these new bios aren't really doing anything to un-complicate things either.

A couple things literally in front of my mind this moment:

I’m stunned with the answer for #5 - it’s either worded really poorly or ToyGuru clearly has some conflict with Val or Emiliano. I say this because there is NO WAY Scott does not understand how much MOTU means to both of them and what they accomplished with the comic, yet his answer comes off very disrespectful on a lot of different levels.

Most simply first, (and already stated above) perhaps this was an error in typing, but the studio was MVCreations not “MVP”.

Second, a question, is Illumina a Mattel owned character? I know she was created by Val and Emilliano (aka MVCreations) while they were hired (by Mattel) to do the comic. So who owns that story and her character? If Mattel does not, I can see where they may not be inclined to work her in, BUT, if they own her (which I assume is the case since the story that was “pitched” has never been able to be posted), why not try to work her in as a nod to that era? It's been said MANY times that the goal of the MOTUC story and line is to bring all the mythos together.

Third, The backstory is too complex?! Try me. I truly doubt this to be the case when we all know that the people who wrote and “pitched” this story know MOTU inside and out and have stated many times the vested interest they had in tying the MOTU mythos together when they were hired by Mattel. Even if it’s not the MOTUC direction, why not change her story up a bit to work her character in at the very least? Could anything be more complex then Wun-Dar? Yet he’s been worked in. In fact - in MOTUC, the best place one can be is in a place where your willing to let go of what you thought you knew and enjoy the ride because things are being added, omitted and changed from the mythos. Something like adding the character of Illumina is certainly NOT going to be what makes following the MOTUC story complicated...we crossed that bridge a long time ago.

Lastly, If Mattel owns the story but Illumina was never officially accepted by Mattel - ok, fine but good lord, MVCreations was hired by Mattel to do the 200x comics. To just have Illumina, or Val and Emilliano’s story for her, which MANY people would love to see incorporated in some way, dismissed as a “fan pitch” is disrespectful to them. They are FANS yes, but also very successful, currently working professionals and were working for Mattel when this was pitched.

I love MOTUC and have appreciated ToyGuru’s communication with the community as well as his passion for MOTU. I also have jumped to his defense when people were ripping him apart because, like or dislike, agree or disagree, I believe everyone should be treated with respect. I find myself now jumping to Val and Emilliano’s defense. Maybe I’m taking this the wrong way but Scott’s answer sure opened himself up to this and I sure hope Scott posts soon here and clears the air.

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Originally Posted by PaTrIcKfOgArTy

Third, The backstory is too complex?! Try me. I truly doubt this to be the case when we all know that the people who wrote and “pitched” this story know MOTU inside and out and have stated many times the vested interest they had in tying the MOTU mythos together when they were hired by Mattel. Even if it’s not the MOTUC direction, why not change her story up a bit to work her character in at the very least? Could anything be more complex then Wun-Dar? Yet he’s been worked in. In fact - in MOTUC, the best place one can be is in a place where your willing to let go of what you thought you knew and enjoy the ride because things are being added, omitted and changed from the mythos. Something like adding the character of Illumina is certainly NOT going to be what makes following the MOTUC story complicated...we crossed that bridge a long time ago.

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Great point! MOTUC can work in everything else, but somehow can't work in Illumina? They have even created multiple He-Men. Something's wrong here.

As others have already said, unless you use Ebay, every single thing related to MOTU is "out of print" EXCEPT for the MVCreations Comics . I just checked 3 online comic stores where they were still being sold.

Also, as full of spelling errors, confusing phrases, and contradictions(at least they seem like contradictions so far) as the MOTUC bios are, how could a comic that was supposed to have an Encyclopedia tie-in(which Mattel put an end to) be more confusing? Considering a new fan couldn't buy any of the MOTUC toys right now, how would they learn one thing about the new MOTUC continuity.

ToyGuru is really starting to come off as a guy talking about his girlfriend's ex-boyfriend; he gets the name wrong and dismisses anything related to them as unworthy. Imo, that makes no sense. Mattel should be on He-Man.org's side, not in competition with them.

While I only made less than 10 posts on Matty's new forum, this really seals the deal. I'm not going to be spending anymore time on a site that is dismissive of fans and seeks to set up a wall between them & fansites offering their franchise free promotion. I love how Mattel had no problem using this site to advertise their products or gauge fan interest before they got their own forum.

Very brilliantly put, PaTrIcKfOgArTy. You have such a talent with words! :)

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Originally Posted by PaTrIcKfOgArTy

A couple things literally in front of my mind this moment:

I’m stunned with the answer for #5 - it’s either worded really poorly or ToyGuru clearly has some conflict with Val or Emiliano. I say this because there is NO WAY Scott does not understand how much MOTU means to both of them and what they accomplished with the comic yet his answer comes off very disrespectful on a lot of different levels.

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I agree and:

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I love MOTUC and have appreciated ToyGuru’s communication with the community as well as his passion for MOTU. I also have jumped to his defense when people were ripping him apart because, like or dislike, agree or disagree, I believe everyone should be treated with respect. I find myself now jumping to Val and Emilliano’s defense. Maybe I’m taking this the wrong way but Scott’s answer sure opened himself up to this and I sure hope Scott posts soon here and clears the air.

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I totally agree. If there has been an misunderstanding, I hope the air is cleared soon. Val and Emiliano have done so much for this community that statements that could be seen insulting towards them can definately raise and uproar. I have been on this site for 8 years. I mean, I've gone to college, had my first child and met my partner while being a member on this site. :sklol: I have an emotional attachment to this place and to those who have worked hard for this site. And, Emiliano's Homecoming comic was what got me into MOTU again. Val and Emiliano are professional artists. Sure, they are fans aswell, but so is ToyGuru too. What's the difference?

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Third, The backstory is too complex?! Try me. I truly doubt this to be the case when we all know that the people who wrote and “pitched” this story know MOTU inside and out and have stated many times the vested interest they had in tying the MOTU mythos together when they were hired by Mattel. Even if it’s not the MOTUC direction, why not change her story up a bit to work her character in at the very least? Could anything be more complex then Wun-Dar? Yet he’s been worked in. In fact - in MOTUC, the best place one can be is in a place where your willing to let go of what you thought you knew and enjoy the ride because things are being added, omitted and changed from the mythos. Something like adding the character of Illumina is certainly NOT going to be what makes following the MOTUC story complicated...we crossed that bridge a long time ago.

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I personally feel that MVC comics raised MOTU to the level where it should be. Yes, they were comics that were propably aimed at youth and adults, but that's what made them great. I would guess that the majority of MOTUC fan-base is in their 30's at the moment. We need complex storylines that are aimed at adult-readers. Does that mean there could not be another comic aimed at children? No. The 200X TMNT relaunch had a comic aimed at kids and at the same time Mirage kept making their V4(?) comic. No one ever complained about that.

I personally hope that MOTUC would prove that there is an active adult fan-base for MOTU-stuff. At the moment that's all Mattel has. If MOTU becomes a big hit with the kids again, why couldn't that co-exist with something more complex aimed at adults? Transformers, G.I.JOE and TMNT have all done that successfully.

Heidi

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Originally Posted by MegaGearMax

Great point! MOTUC can work in everything else, but somehow can't work in Illumina? Something's wrong here.

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This is why it would be very helpful to understand if Illumina and the story that she was a part of is owned by Mattel or not. If so, logically, she should be fair game and be able to be worked in if fan demand is there. In fact, I'd love it if her "Real Name" was "Illumina Staples Santalucia" :hmwink:

If Mattel doesn't own the character / story or and it simply was just a rejected "pitch" nor have any interest in working with them to work her in, I'd LOVE to have Val and Emiliano finally be able to post it PLEASE!

That way we'd potentially get her character, or her story (or both) either way and those of us who have been waiting a very long time would be happy :)

aaaaaaand here it is ladies and gentlemen, another example of how Mattel want to keep everything MOTU related directly under his strict control, and how continuously disrespect the people who, for the love of the franchise, have tried to create new characters, new backstories and new life for a long-time forgotten (by his owner) toyline.

not a polemic (well maybe just a little), just my two cents.

Lately, Toyguru was REPEATEDLY taken at fault with what he's doing, or with what he's saying... :hmmad:

- Unacceptable so-called "solutions" for the female bobblehead problem (i.e. no more up and down movement OR no more alternate heads for female figures)

- Refusing to take responsibility for the 2009 SDCC debacle (scalping issue, not enough art books etc.)

- Manipulating the votes' results the way HE wanted (cf. the flocked or non-flocked Panthor issue)

- Stating courageously BUT SHAMELESSLY NONETHELESS that Mattel doesn't actually have ANY kind of quality control regarding the production of the figures in China ! He didn't even show any WILL to change a thing as far as QC is concerned !

- Punishing in a very unfair way the MOTUC fans because the bonus figures (who sold in less than 2 weeks every time) "didn't sold fast enough" (while the purpose was, at first, to ALLOW EACH FIGURE TO BE SOLD FOR AT LEAST A COUPLE OF WEEKS TO A MONTH !). And THIS while other lines don't sell out so good and so fast !

- Telling us there would be an SDCC reveal at the MOTU art exhibition, THEN coming back on his word



I could go on and on (and I don't even start with the lame sub), but it is not my goal, here...:hmshift:


Now, with these answers to WTFWTK 2.30, it seems like Toyguru doesn't even read the questions properly (the question was stating MVC, not MVP, yet Scott - alias Toyguru - still misspelled that SIMPLE and EASY 3 letters word !:hmshift:

Even worse : Toyguru seems to criticize and show contempt to the MVC comics, saying that it's a "fan pitch" or that the "storyline was too complicated".

We could even wonder if Toyguru has something against Val or Emiliano (who are fans, BUT WHO ARE ALSO PROFESSIONAL COMIC BOOK WRITERS !). They invested lots of efforts, time and love in their comic and in it's AWESOME STORYLINE, and now this storyline is "too complicated" ? Too complicated for who ? The fans (and in THIS case, it is the WORST of all, because Toyguru is actually INSULTING US) ? Or for HIMSELF ?


I'm quite frightened that MOTUC's fate lies in THIS GUY'S HANDS ! :sksad:

Toyguru's job is actually to MAKE A SUCCESS OUT OF MOTUC ! A real PRO would put any animosity or bitterness against anyone aside, and work to improve the line and make outstanding figures and great money !:hmwink:

So I hope that this attitude regaring MVC and the fans in general is gonna change, and soon !

I really am nostalgic about the time Jeremy Padawer was on the forum... HE at least was a great Mattel guy !

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Originally Posted by PaTrIcKfOgArTy

A couple things literally in front of my mind this moment:

I’m stunned with the answer for #5 - it’s either worded really poorly or ToyGuru clearly has some conflict with Val or Emiliano. I say this because there is NO WAY Scott does not understand how much MOTU means to both of them and what they accomplished with the comic yet his answer comes off very disrespectful on a lot of different levels.

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Agreed, and not only that, but given that MOTUC is supposed to be the ADULT COLLECTOR's line, as opposed to just the retail mass release of yester year, Mattel should be taking a very fan-specific approach to this. It's the fans, and the fans alone, that have kept this line alive, when it's practically failed MORE THAN ONCE.

If we had a problem with the MVC comic, we would never have supported it.

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Most simply first, (and already stated above) perhaps this was an error in typing, but the studio was MVCreations not “MVP”.

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Yeah, that's a common mistake, but MVC was just as pivotal in the revival of MOTU as MYP.

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Second, a question, is Illumina a Mattel owned character? I know she was created by Val and Emilliano (aka MVCreations) while they were hired (by Mattel) to do the comic. So who owns that story and her character? If Mattel does not, I can see where they may not be inclined to work her in, BUT, if they own her (which I assume is the case since the story that was “pitched” has never been able to be posted), why not try to work her in as a nod to that era? It's been said MANY times that the goal of the MOTUC story and line is to bring all the mythos together.

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Good point.

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Third, The backstory is too complex?! Try me. I truly doubt this to be the case when we all know that the people who wrote and “pitched” this story know MOTU inside and out and have stated many times the vested interest they had in tying the MOTU mythos together when they were hired by Mattel. Even if it’s not the MOTUC direction, why not change her story up a bit to work her character in at the very least? Could anything be more complex then Wun-Dar? Yet he’s been worked in. In fact - in MOTUC, the best place one can be is in a place where your willing to let go of what you thought you knew and enjoy the ride because things are being added, omitted and changed from the mythos. Something like adding the character of Illumina is certainly NOT going to be what makes following the MOTUC story complicated...we crossed that bridge a long time ago.

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Man, what part of MOTU is NOT complex???

How's about how in Filmation, Marlena (and others) come from earth to Eternia, and meet people who look just like her, with whom she's able to reproduce with, and bear twins, one of whom isn't so much as mentioned until they decide to create a new story?

Or how about Teela now being "magically cloned" from the Sorceress. For what?

How much of Filmation was based on ancillary characters that were not a part of the core MOTU canon? Yet, people are clamoring for those characters, so why the bias against MVC?

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Lastly, If Mattel owns the story but Illumina was never officially accepted by Mattel - ok, fine but good lord, MVCreations was hired by Mattel to do the 200x comics. To just have Illumina, or Val and Emilliano’s story for her, which MANY people would love to see incorporated in some way, dismissed as a “fan pitch” is disrespectful to them. They are FANS yes, but also very successful, currently working professionals and were working for Mattel when this was pitched.

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That "fans" statement from TG was ultra-condescending. I thought the 4H were "fans" as well. So by that logic, they shouldn't be doing the sculpts?

Clearly, whoever's writing the bios for MOTUC now, probably are not fans, because that stuff sucks. :hmsad:

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I love MOTUC and have appreciated ToyGuru’s communication with the community as well as his passion for MOTU. I also have jumped to his defense when people were ripping him apart because, like or dislike, agree or disagree, I believe everyone should be treated with respect. I find myself now jumping to Val and Emilliano’s defense. Maybe I’m taking this the wrong way but Scott’s answer sure opened himself up to this and I sure hope Scott posts soon here and clears the air.

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Agreed. I appreciate TG's efforts with the line as well. In the past, most companies wouldn't dare communicate with the fans, let alone appoint a representative to do so. So I'm definitely grateful for that.

However, this last response from TG leaves much to be desired. If your goal is to rally the fans around your product, putting down one aspect of the community (and a VITAL one at that) is definitely not the way to go about it.

I think the big thing Toyguru should address is if the Mattel staff working on MOTUC are such big fans of the property, why is there a resistance to using the professional fandom to create a better product, especially if some of those fans are professional writers and artists who are currently working?

Some of this stuff seems like a no-brainer. Even "corporate lawyerspeak" Hasbro hired fan artists ***** Guidi, Don Figueroa and James Raiz.

I do appreciate all the time it takes to answer the questions of fans and everything, but the Illumina answer is completely unacceptable.

1. MOTUC is an all-encompasing toyline. From day 1 we were told this MOTUC line would include all-eras of MOTU that Mattel can officially use...including all PoP, NA, 200X, etc. MVC is a MAJOR part of this. Val and Emiliano were actually a BIG part in re-energizing MOTU. Both the He-Man.org website and this comic helped keep MOTU alive and fresh in many people's minds. Without this site, especially, MOTU may very well have died in the 90's after NA was finished.

TG's latest quote mentioning this line is all-encompasing, etc.:

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Originally Posted by Toyguru

We've posted this before but here we go again: (*sigh)

We will be doing figures in MOTUC that had figures in the original MOTU, POP and NA lines, figures from the Mini comics (i.e. Goddess) figures that were original to or had major redesigns on the 2002 series (i.e. Adam, Randor, Evil Lyn, etc...) and figures who had unmade prototypes in the vintage lines (i.e. He-Ro, Star Sisters, etc...). If a figure had a redesign in the 2002 series we will most likely do the original toy version first, but that is not a hard rule.

All of the figures will be done in the "Classics style" meaning we are looking at the original toy first and updating it with modern detail and articulation. The marching orders to the Horsemen are to make these figures as if it was in the 1980's with today's technology and standards. If a figure did not have a toy in the 1980s (like say, Lord Dactus) the Horsemen would create that character as if it did have a 1980s toy (using shared parts, repainted weapons etc...) and "update it" to the Classics look. We may throw in some "2002" details (such as Webstor's extra arms) but for the most part we are talking classic toy look. There will be no action features. We may replicate features like giving He-Man swap-able battle armor panels or Webstor a rope, but they won't work like action features. It is just too expensive and we want to save tooling for new heads and weapons!

We will not be doing characters created by Filmation for the series (i.e. Shadow Weaver, Strong Arm, etc...). As for why we do not just "get the rights" that is not information we can share at this time. We're well aware of fan demand for these characters and it would be fun to include them, but it is just not something we have rights to at the moment. If that changes you can be sure we will let all the fans know!

TG

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2. NOT a "fan-pitched" idea! They held the licence to make official MOTU comics. Everything that was put in them had to get the A-okay from Mattel. So, again...this was not a "fan-pitched" idea. It was an idea by two professionals who held the licence to make the comic. Hired talent by Mattel. It's just like when we watch the documentaries on the Filmation DVDs and the writers explain their ideas of what was going to happen with the series (like the episode that was going to expand on Eternia's history in a 3 part episode, Huntara's home-world battle episode that was "too violent" for TV, etc.). These were NOT fan-pitched ideas, nor were any of the MVC plans.

It's also like saying He-Ro, Eldor, Sharella, the Star Sisters, Vikor, Demo-Man all the concept figures/drawings we've seen in the Tomart magazines (like Hand-Some) are all fan concepts. All articles made for Mattel, but not green-lit at the time. You cannot put MVC's ideas and concepts in a "fan-pitched" category, while the others are not.

3. Too complex storylines. This is an ADULT collector lines, done for the fans. TG...you keep telling us things like how Demo-Man was a huge wink to uber MOTU fans. Yet...the stories have to be kept simple and not introduce characters from a much-loved, officially licenced comic that was MADE for an adult audience? :hmconf: Again...say something with Illumina's storyline was insanely complex that most people wouldn't understand (like lots and lots of timetravel which keeps erasing things that happened). Well...Mattel has the power to change things, make them simpler or exclude them altogether. Evil-Lyn's bio was VERY watered down. Her Earth name was kept, but she is not from Earth in her bio.

4. Stories too difficult for fans to access. Everything in MOTU is out of print including MOTUC figures, actually. They are issued once and last between 27 minutes to a few hours, with SOME being re-issued every now and then. Only the hardcore fans buy MOTUC because of scarce availability. Part of the fun of collecting action figures is when you get something new or unexpected that looks awesome. Take Illumina, for example. If you make her, there will be people who see her and go "Woah...who is she? She looks pretty awesome." They'll read her bio to get an idea and get in some discussions about her, look info up about her, etc. This gets people talking about mOTU which is a good thing. More exposure, brand-growth, not getting the same characters we've received for over 25 years.

Plus, fans CAN pick these comics up online, in comic book stores (they still have some) and there is at least one place online that has the whole MVC series for download. I'm sure there are many more, but I saw one.

Mattel Legal did stop the MVC Bible from being published, even though it's based on the 200X-era, is 7 years old and isn't going to give away any Mattel secrets. The Bibles from all the other series were allowed to be released...why will Mattel not allow this one to be released? This would also allow people to read about these characters from the "stories too difficult to access." If Mattel allows its release, it will be accessable to everyone with a computer, like MattyCollector. Fans have been waiting for this for MANY years! Mattel didn't green-light a lot of the MVC stories and are forbidding the company to share them with the public! Even though these are NOT "fan-pitched" ideas...if Mattel deems them as so, why will Mattel Legal NOT allow the Bible of said ideas be published to the public?


So, in short:

- Allow MVC stuff to be incorporated into bios (like all the other eras are being included).
- Allow the possibility of MVC characters to be made into figures (ex. Illumina, Might-Bite, Council of Wisdom, etc.)
- Allow MVC release their series Bible!

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Although Illumina does appear on a few panels in the MVP comic series

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It's MVCreations. If you're going to downplay your former licensee, at least get the name right.

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her larger backstory was part of a fan pitch

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So, you're looking at the work of the official comics licensee as fan work? Why don't you allow them to post their pitch online then? Cause if it was just a fan pitch, the same can be said of Lou Scheimer's "He-Ro Son of He-Man" pitch. Or are you going to let the org shut down that one as well?

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that was ultimately deemed too complicated for publication.
We are including the “Icons of Evil” series in MOTUC storyline but the other MVP comics and characters will not be included as toys. We may allude to them in bios, but these stories are too difficult for new fans to access (i.e. out of print)

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Who deemed it too complicated? The same guys who decided that it's NOT too difficult for new fans to access things like Keldor being Randor's older half-brother being injured then merged with an interdimensional being into Skeletor? Yeah, right, that's why fans love Demo-Man so much.

And as for Illmunia, who ever said that you would have to use the biography MVC intended her to have? You already changed He-Ro's bio completely and you turned a black-haired He-Man into a totally new character called Wun-Dar, so what would halt you from creating a new bio for Illumina that DOES fit into your current franchise direction?

You could have easily argued that Illumina and her cat might be too obscure to justify figures. Instead, you chose to downgrade the official 200X comics licensee's work into a mere fan pitch and deemed it too complicated for new fans to understand (while doing complicated bios yourself), though the question wasn't at all about whether or not you would use the MVC pitch. Way to go, Mattel.

I tell you what, I'd much rather have so-called "fans" create a MotU history that incorporates all canons while staying true to the source materials, than so-called "professionals" writing biographys that alienate old fans and confuse new fans.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Shokoti

While I only made less than 10 posts on Matty's new forum, this really seals the deal. I'm not going to be spending anymore time on a site that is dismissive of fans and seeks to set up a wall between them & fansites offering their franchise free promotion. I love how Mattel had no problem using this site to advertise their products or gauge fan interest before they got their own forum.

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I was beginning to wonder about this myself. It does seem like ever since the Matty forums went up, Toy Guru's presence around the .org is minimal. Granted he may very well be busy with the up-coming NY Toy Fair. But if Illumina is off the table because they don't have the rights to do her, would be a better, more acceptable answer as opposed to their stories are too complex forthe bios.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Shokoti

As others have already said, unless you use Ebay, every single thing related to MOTU is "out of print" EXCEPT for the MVCreations Comics . I just checked 3 online comic stores where they were still being sold.

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Good point, and even if it was out of print, how does that devalue the MVC work any moreso than any other MOTU media?

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Also, as full of spelling errors, confusing phrases, and contradictions(at least they seem like contradictions so far) as the MOTUC bios are, how could a comic that was supposed to have an Encyclopedia tie-in(which Mattel put an end to) be more confusing?

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Yeah, for the most part, those new bios are terrible. Some of them are cool, but those that are, are just what was taken from the past. Alot of those are just stuff added from 200X continuity, which is fine with me. But the rest of that stuff is just bad.

Mattel's goal was to merge the various continuities, but they only convoluted them even worse. Why wouldn't you hire on someone who has actually had a few years of experience with writing MOTU in publication form, to write these bios for you?

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Considering a new fan couldn't buy any of the MOTUC toys right now, how would they learn one thing about the new MOTUC continuity.

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Yeah, see that's just another example of the counterintuitive stuff that Mattel has continued to do: What "new fans" are they trying to reach, when this is an adult collector's line, and they only produce a small amount of product to sell, and with no other form of media (no toons, no comics, no movie, no video games, very little advertisement, no mass market appeal, etc)???

MOTUC is pretty much a nostalgic line, just like pretty much everything else from the 80's is. It basically only appeals to long time MOTU fans, and that's pretty much it. That being the case, the fans should have the total ear of Mattel, and they should be listening to whatever the majority of us say, and creating their product based on that.

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ToyGuru is really starting to come off as a guy talking about his girlfriend's ex-boyfriend; he gets the name wrong and dismisses anything related to them as unworthy. Imo, that makes no sense. Mattel should be on He-Man.org's side, not in competition with them.

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Preicsely. Especially since, if it wasn't for the .Org, MOTU would have remained "dead" all these years. It was this site, and it's owners (MVC), that brought He-Man back, almost singlehandedly, and practically against the "better" judgement of Mattel.

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While I only made less than 10 posts on Matty's new forum, this really seals the deal. I'm not going to be spending anymore time on a site that is dismissive of fans and seeks to set up a wall between them & fansites offering their franchise free promotion. I love how Mattel had no problem using this site to advertise their products or gauge fan interest before they got their own forum.

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I'm wondering what the talk has been, in regards to this so far on their site.

*EDIT* I just went there, and no one seems to be talking about this.. Perhaps it's too recent.

Fan pitch and "storyline was too complicated" :hmlol:

Looks like history is going to repeat itself since MOTU 2xxx failed at retail due to ineptitude, the NECA Staction line failed the same way, and MOTUC is heading in that direction if that is what the "brains" behind the operation think.

Wonder if Hasbro considers all the work Devils Due and IDW did/do for their properties (GI Joe and Transformers) as fan pitches and complicated stories? Those must be some awesome fan pitches since Hasbro actually produces toys based on the comic work, even though its not much different then what MVC did for Mattel.

I also do not need to point out how when you slight someone you might want to at least get the name right, as someone said above MVP is a WWE Wrestler, MVC is the company behind the 3 series Mattel licensed run of comic books.

This is plain insulting. Those comics were released and SOLD to the public so calling them "fan stories" is even TECHNICALLY wrong.

And about the stories being too complex for the fans...well, after all we are those stupid fans who, when they said "Webstor comes with real WORKING grappling hook just as you remember", didn't understand that it meant that his grappling hook DOESN'T work... Maybe those stories are indeed too complex for us to understand.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Shokoti

As others have already said, unless you use Ebay, every single thing related to MOTU is "out of print" EXCEPT for the MVCreations Comics . I just checked 3 online comic stores where they were still being sold.

Also, as full of spelling errors, confusing phrases, and contradictions(at least they seem like contradictions so far) as the MOTUC bios are, how could a comic that was supposed to have an Encyclopedia tie-in(which Mattel put an end to) be more confusing? Considering a new fan couldn't buy any of the MOTUC toys right now, how would they learn one thing about the new MOTUC continuity.

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All exceptionally excellent points! I didn't even think about online comic book stores. A third venue fans can find the stories! I completely forgot about the MOTU Encyclopedia! The part of it they did get to release was amazing! This would make any type of complex storyline easy to follow. That is, if Mattel allowed them to finish making the Encyclopedia...:hmshift:

Again, you are a genious! Any fan getting into the line this year won't be able to follow the MOTUC mythos as you need every figure to get it. Especially the Goddess and how she mentions the multiple He-Men. Toyguru has stated not every figure will be re-released...so, to me, it sounds like MOTUC's storyline is already too complex for those who haven't been collecting the figures since day 1. ;)

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Originally Posted by MegaGearMax

I think the big thing Toyguru should address is if the Mattel staff working on MOTUC are such big fans of the property, why is there a resistance to using the professional fandom to create a better product, especially if some of those fans are professional writers and artists who are currently working?

Some of this stuff seems like a no-brainer. Even "corporate lawyerspeak" Hasbro hired fan artists ***** Guidi, Don Figueroa and James Raiz.

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Emiliano's also working for Hasbro right now and was a major force with MVC. I'm not sure if he jsut does artwork or gets to pitch ideas...but everything he does is cannon and not a "fan-pitch." :D

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Originally Posted by Darkspecter

Emiliano's also working for Hasbro right now and was a major force with MVC. I'm not sure if he jsut does artwork or gets to pitch ideas...but everything he does is cannon and not a "fan-pitch." :D

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If that's true that maybe the reason they won't touch Emiliano and there might be some bad blood because of that. Maybe?

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Originally Posted by kagamigod

If that's true that maybe the reason they won't touch Emiliano and there might be some bad blood because of that. Maybe?

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What Emiliano does right now in his profession should have no impact on the fact that MVC were Mattel licensees and had to receive approval from Mattel for their "fan ptiched" stories. There was no reason to slight them like Scott did, no valid reason at all given the humongous black hole of confusion the MOTUC bios make (collect them all to make some damn sense out of the story, but its not confusing) :hmwink:

At first I thought the reason they stopped the 200X comic bible from being posted was because they intended to use elements from it for the Classic bios.

Now I doubt we'll see much of anything from MVCreations used in this new canon. I don't understand why they're choosing to use stuff from every other source they own (minicomics, MYP toon, etc) with the sole exception of the 200X comics. Those were the most well written part of the modern stories! Icons of Evil was great, but why stop at that? Use all of their material.

If Val & Emiliano had veen writing for the cartoon we might have avoided a lot of the poorly conceived ideas that MYP came up with, like changing He-Man's ancestor from He-Ro to King Grayskull.

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Originally Posted by markatisu

Fan pitch and "storyline was too complicated" :hmlol:

Looks like history is going to repeat itself since MOTU 2xxx failed at retail due to ineptitude, the NECA Staction line failed the same way, and MOTUC is heading in that direction if that is what the "brains" behind the operation think.

Wonder if Hasbro considers all the work Devils Due and IDW did/do for their properties (GI Joe and Transformers) as fan pitches and complicated stories? Those must be some awesome fan pitches since Hasbro actually produces toys based on the comic work, even though its not much different then what MVC did for Mattel.

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Excellent point. I can't believe that Mattel is not looking at what their competitors are doing in regards to their similar lines.

So, just because MVC is not Marvel or DC (they were attached to Image and CrossGen), that means that they are just fan publishers?

Like you said, Hasbro used IDW and Devil's Due for GIJoe, and IDW and DreamWave for TF's. All three are very small companies, the likes of MVC, but all 3 put out decent work for their lines.

For me personally, MVC and MYP are the definitive canons for MOTU. Just the same way Devil's Due and DreamWave were the definitive canons for GIJoe and TF's, respectively.

The difference is, Hasbro didn't throw those companies out in the wash, like Mattel is apparently doing with MVC. Ironically, Emiliano is working for Hasbro, so what does that say??? :hmshift:

Maybe Val or Emilliano can clear this up, but who is exactly responsible for the Icons of Evil books? i ask this because I remember back in the day, they also wanted to do an Icons of Evil comic based on Evil-Lyn, but they didn't get the go ahead because they had plans on touching on her back story on the MYP series, which we later got with the "Price of Deceit" episode. I mean, one can make an easy argument for the Goddess and Wun-Dar, but in the end of the day, even though the bios have been changed up a bit, those 2 characters ARE the pre-Filmation He-Man and Sorceress that we were introduced to us in 1981 or 82. And, in some ways, even though their bios have been shoehorned into the current MOTUC canon, one can make the same point for the existence of Adora/She-Ra in both the Filmation series and MOTUC canon. In the end of the day, guys like Vikor and Demo-Man will sooner see the day of light than someone like Illumina and her white tiger. Now, mind you, I would prefer Illumina than Vikor, but Vikor, even just being on the drawing board, will be made before an Illumina figure. However, if Mo-Lar is indeed the SDCC exclusive and they make a bio for him, even if it's humorous and comes with a Robot Chicken sticker on the package, I think it contradicts Mattel's stance on the subject because not only is Mo-Lar a fan created character, but he is a farce/parody figure, which in a sense makes fun of the MOTU universe. Why would a made-up joke character created by people who have never had any part in past MOTU literature take precedent over a made-up character that was being given a serious back story from the people who were responsible for the comic book series of the time and for this here fan website is beyond me.

If anything, MVC should have been given total reign over the story element of the MOTU universe - they are the only ones to have done it perfectly. To belittle their efforts now blows my mind.

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Originally Posted by kagamigod

If that's true that maybe the reason they won't touch Emiliano and there might be some bad blood because of that. Maybe?

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Originally Posted by markatisu

What Emiliano does right now in his profession should have no impact on the fact that MVC were Mattel licensees and had to receive approval from Mattel for their "fan ptiched" stories. There was no reason to slight them like Scott did, no valid reason at all given the humongous black hole of confusion the MOTUC bios make (collect them all to make some damn sense out of the story, but its not confusing) :hmwink:

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Yeah, as a freelance creator, Emiliano is free to work where ever he wishes. Comic artists and creators do it all the time. Very few of them actually sign exclusive contracts.

But I'm pretty certain that his loyalty is to MOTU and MVC, first and foremost.

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Originally Posted by RocketPunch

At first I thought the reason they stopped the 200X comic bible from being posted was because they intended to use elements from it for the Classic bios.

Now I doubt we'll see much of anything from MVCreations used in this new canon. I don't understand why they're choosing to use stuff from every other source they own (minicomics, MYP toon, etc) with the sole exception of the 200X comics. Those were the most well written part of the modern stories! Icons of Evil was great, but why stop at that? Use all of their material.

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This was EXACTLY my thought! That was the only reason I could fathom, that Mattel didn't want MVC to share the bible because they wanted to use the stories later on (MOTUC). Toyguru has just confirmed this is not the case. So, unless Mattel changes their stance on Icons of Evil-only for bios, there should be no reason the series bible SHOULDN'T be published.