If the line is in such dire strife as Scott is saying then obviously something is wrong with the marketing of the company.
Yes, He-Man is a favorite among collectible lines and yes they are of quality builds. But to corner customers as the reason for its impending failure is a doomed practice. I refuse to blind buy a whole years worth of figures, being forced to live with whatever comes out and whatever is decided to be sold to me (three packs, variants, unpopular figure designs, etc). So instead of passing on the blame to me, take some initiative and fix the problem yourselves: Take a hiatus and get ahead of the releases, allowing enough figures to be sculpted and made so that fans can see what they're in for ahead of time. Allow enough figures to be designed ahead of time so fans can have the chance to ask for alterations and changes to be made rather than being told "It's too far in development" when they're close to release. And for once stop telling fans that Mattel is so innocent when it comes to price increases, shipping errors, product defects, and other stuff that customers have problems with. It's all so passive, and when Mattel doesn't take responsibility it automatically defaults to being the fans problem to deal with.
No, I won't be getting a sub this year and I won't ever get a sub until these problems are met and dealt with by Mattel. If the line does somehow fail, then it was meant to be and I at least got what I got from the line for the past years it's been in existence. If the continues on, then obviously what I'm being told today is another scare tactic that Mattel is trying to use to get over on me at the moment and for shame on them.
Its kind of a weird night. Every Sunday after I drop my fiance off I have a couple rum and cokes, watch some Filmation and always end up thinking of which Filmation characters would be cool to get a figure of. Now here I am tonight just wondering which one of two more we might get this year and who knows about next year. I bought my sub again.
With the news of the revamped 2014 sub that will have all A-LIST figures...This is what we have all wanted !!!
Every figure in 2014 will be an A-LIST figure. BUY A SUB !!!!!
I have bought a 3rd subscription in the faith that Toyguru is being honest and that we will get more Killer and no Filler now.
That better mean no more lazy figures like SMAA and no shoehorned in Mighty Spector-types
MOTUC has expanded too much, imo it needs to shrink down and Mattel should release only stuff, most fans want. No Vykron, Chief Carnivous, Tytus, Fearless Photog. Put those aside.
Just bring highly fan demanded characters like Glimmer, Hydron, Flogg, Castaspella and the rest of the vintage fan faves. Those figures keep the line going. THAN you can think about obscure stuff for 75$.:sklol:
I got my sub and even a sub for the Watchmen too. I will get ever MOTU and be happy I won't miss any. I just hope thry can get deep enough into the filmation, POP and NA to keep us happy.
With the revamped 2014 it is going to be all A-List and VINTAGE figures!
In response to me comparing the Fighting Foe Men to them earlier in this thread, you replied making a point about they original intention behind them, their purpose within the POP mythos being similar to He-Ro's in the MOTU mythos, the fact that the day-of stock sold out, the gay.net article supposedly generating interest in them (and potentially the line as a whole), etc. I meant to reply to that sooner, but have been busy, so this will serve as my reply to that and the quote above.
While the purpose of the Star Sisters may have been intended to be similar to that of He-Ro, that doesn't mean that the fan community is going to by default have equal interest in having them as figures, or even in the concept, itself.
Like it or not, the POP toy line was aimed mainly at girls. Yes, a decent number of boys had some of them as kids. I had some of them. I like She-Ra a lot, I like the idea of her being on the same level as He-Man, and I like the whole idea of the 2 of them fighting side by side. SOTS is probably my favorite thing from the Filmation era of the overall collective franchise of He-Man and She-Ra. But as such, my main interest in She-Ra comes from Filmation as seems to be the case for the majority of the now adult (and mostly male) MOTUC audience. My interest in the POP figures/dolls that I owned as a kid was that they were the "best" (because they were the ONLY) available representation of the characters that I knew from the Filmation cartoon available to use in conjunction with my MOTU figures.
As such, my interest really wasn't in the POP doll line in-and-of itself. By contrast, while the Filmation He-Man cartoon certainly heightened my interest in owning the figures, the toy line in-and-of itself was awesome and appealing to me on its own merits.... it's something that I likely would have still had a great deal of interest in, have many fond memories of, and I therefore have a greater interest in getting things in this line like Tytus and Megator who were only released overseas in very limited quantites in the 80s, or He_Ro with him being the basis of what would have been the direction the line would have gone in had it continued back then, or even Photog, who was the winning entry in the create a character contest back then and appeared in MOTU magazine.
The POP figure/doll line is something that I would have had absolutely NO interest in had it not been for its connection with the She-Ra cartoon and that show's connection to He-Man. As such, the POP doll line served little more purpose for me than giving me than giving me SOME kind of toy representation of the POP characters that I most wanted next to my MOTU figures. That is the only purpose that it served for me, and with all due respect and in all honesty, I can't say that I really care all that much about any unrealized concepts from it as a result. Now, I have read some of the info and interviewing you've done regarding their origins (I haven't read it in full because there is a lot of it, but I do intend to read more of it in time), and it is something of an interesting read, but not enough to really make me love these characters.
Another way of looking at it is like this... I am first and foremost a MOTU fan, with the center of that interest being the 80s MOTU toyline and cartoon series. From there my interest in other things related to it depends in large part on how direct of a tangent it is to MOTU, and how well tied in it is. The POP cartoon, particularly SOTS, ties in very much for me, hence my intesest in it (bare in mind though that outside of SOTS, I've only seen a small handful of episodes in recent years despite owning the DVDs, so random one off appearances , including that of the Star Sisters, don't mean much to me). My interest in He-Ro and things like that is because it was the next direction for the Toyline. I'm not so much an NA fan because despite the intent of it being sort of a continuation of MOUT and He-Mans adventures, the cartoon was SO far different from Filmation in most every respect that it just felt like something totally unrelated.
But my point is that the more direct and the more related the tangent, the more interest I tend to have. But when the tangents splinter off into further tangents that are less and less related to and in the spirit of he subject of my main interest (MOTU), the less interested I am likely to be (unless there is something there and-and-of itself that draws me in). The Star Sisters are one such distant tangent. Filmation She-ra and POP are of interest to me because they are a direct tangent of Filmation MOTU. The POP toyline was of some interest to me because it was the only way to get toys of some of those characters from the toon (which I would otherwise have no interest in if it wasn't for that connection). The Star Sisters and any other unrealized prototypes or concepts that are more or less directly tied more so to the POP toyline and not the animated series are just too much of a distant tangent for me to care that much about. Therefore while their intended purpose may be roughly similar to He-Ro's, they just will never hold the same interest for me that he does.
Now, I don't have any hard statistics, and while the preferences of the overall fanbase vary widely from person to person, just from general experience from over the years, it would very much seem that the interests and preferences of the average MOTU fan who also likes She-Ra and POP to at least some degree tend to be at least roughly more similar to something like what I described my interest being than yours. They like She-Ra (in some cases a lot) as an extension of He-Man and MOTU, but have much less interest in where some girls toy line from the 80s was heading (at least less so than their interest in where the MOTU line was heading). Odds are if they had any POP figures as kids, they didn't have the whole collection, and probably just had more of the high profile characters, and probably dind't get many if any of the characters at the end of the line with whom the Star Sisters would have been advertised. And I think it's safe to say that at least the vast majority of them sure as hell weren't reading "Magic Girl Magazine". :hmlol:
So, the result is that something like a Star Sisters 3 pack is actually on par to the bulk of the MOTUC audience as being just as obscure as something like the Fighting Foe Men 3-pack. Yeah, the day of stock for the Star Sisters sold well (maybe the gay.net article helped with that, but apparently didn't do much to bring enough interest to the line as a whole), but the bulk of the stock was sold via the subs to people who wanted to lock in their figures and probably get Shadow Weaver, but were essentially "stuck" with a 3 pack of figures that they didn't want. Both the poll from this very site about people's interest in the pack and the very low secondary market prices back that up. Big Bad Toy Store still has them in stock, and I'm guessing they are probably still sitting on a lot of them (they currently have them on "clearance" for something like $58, which is still way more than they have been averaging on ebay). Probably at least part of the reasons for the low subs sales for this year is probably because secondary market sellers like BBTS aren't buying up as many subs if any after getting burned on the Star Sisters pack and with there being another 3-pack of really, really obscure characters included in the 2013 sub, now at a price of $15 more than the Star Sisterse. So, tye certainly did nothing to help the current situation, and probably did more to help get things to where they are now. They are by no means to the only reason for the current situation, but they didn't help anything.
In your response to me earlier, you compared them to the like of King Grayskull, He-Ro, Tytus, and Megator being in the line. But except for Megator, all of those figures were released as non-sub items and sold out with no problem (including both the original release of King Grayskull and his later carded re-relase). The interest for them was proben by people specifically buying them and not a larger subscription of figures that they just happened to be included in. By all indications, had the Star Sisters been produced in the same quanttiy as they actually were, but had been released as a non-sub item, they probably would have been another Gygor or Mo-Larr, with absurd amounts of stock to spare.
I know you are a huge POP fan, and that's perfectly fine, and you have every right to like what you like. And for your sake if no one else's, I'm glad that you finally got these characters, even if it wasn't the exact versions that you wanted. But make no mistake here. They weren't demanded by the larger fan community, they would have sold horribly as non-sub items, and no amount of spinning this or trying to over emphasize the silver lining is going to change the fact that figures like these just aren't THAT highly desired. You keep having these delusions of grandeur about POP in-and-of itself, outside of and possibly separate from MOTU having some big successful resurgence if just the right marketing or promotion in one direction or another were to occur.. but that's simply NOT going to happen, and there's about a 99.999999999999% chance that it never will. I'm not trying to be mean or disrespectful here, just honest. I honestly have a lot of doubts about MOTU ever really being big again or that anyone will ever have interest in it outside of the existing fan community... but I think the odds of that happening are still a lot greater than of anything happening with POP on its own, separate from MOTU.
The subway stations in NY are in excess of 100 degrees during July. They are fetid, and the humidity underground is suffocating.
Friday night by the shuttle train I heard screaming. It was a rat. About the size of MOTUC Granymyr, but brown and without wings. Not on the tracks mind you, on the platforms.
If I didn't have Mattel's SDCC reveals to get me through every Summer I don't know what I would do.
For this, and myriad other reasons, from a grateful community, I thank all those recent subscribers.
You guys are saving the line...and my sanity in the Summer.
For these figures, I'm very happy the classics line is here. For these guys, I say to give Mattel a chance. Let them finish the line. We will get all our figures in time. A complete MOTUC line with all the characters you have wanted.
If these characters ever meant something to you. Then stand with them. Support them. Your heroes don't give up. Don't leave because you had a bad experience. Stay because of the good figures that will be coming. Do it for the love of MOTU. If this line is saved and it continues. It wasn't because TG lied. It was because we (the fans) put in and got a subscription. We pulled together and saved the line.
I really wish TG would just have waited a little longer. What if the expected amount of sub numbers came in but it took slightly longer without the panic laden updates? Then the long term road plan need not be altered and the line lasts til 2017/18 with the inclusion of more Filmation, POP, NA, and lesser known characters. I guess based on some of the responses though, this all inclusive approach to the subs isn't popular anymore (if ever). That's too bad. It sounds like we now have a definitive end in sight possibly two or three years too early IMO. So much for having a complete collection. This stinks.
MULTIPLE COOL SUBSCRIPTION LINEUP NEWS UPDATES
"taken from the toy guru replys over on ask matty!!!!"
PoP FANS READ!!!!!! [here comes your happy place]...
Toy Guru has CONFIRMED in a reply Scorpia is coming in 2013-or-2014.
....then in a following question, he stated that the following PoP figures WOULD be out by the end of 2014 using this new 2013 - 2014 sub sale lineup...
...and commented that MANY of this list below would also be out by the end of 2014...
...and those that are not can be covered by programs outside the 2014 sub, like con exclusives, etc.
READ these 2 posts on ask matty...
post 1 - http://forums.mattycollector.com/eve...7/m/6561092767
Post 2 - http://forums.mattycollector.com/eve...7/m/1231023767
..a 3rd "earlier" post was what confirmed that Scorpia was coming also. but I forgot to snag its link.
[ALSO]... from this post...
Tallstar: I'm hoping Mattel will finish off characters that will probably get left behind in 2013 and 2014, including the winning classic toy versions of the Star Sisters, Perfuma, Flutterina, Mermista, Entrapta, Sweet Bee, Starburst She-Ra, Original toy version Catra...to name but a few.
ToyGuru: By the end of 2014 our goal is to hit all the major POP and NA and vintage MOTU and Filmation. Many many will be in our already locked in 2013 line (that is fantastic I might add!)
We won't get to EVERY POP and NA and Filmation by 2014, but we can always hit the last remaining POP, FM or NA figs that didn't make a full year program in 2013 or 2014 with a few strategic convention figs or other programs beyond 2014.
We're still reviewing options based on where we end up with 2013 subs on how we can continue the line.
Oh, and if I forgot to mention, there will NOT be a price increase in 2014. One of the reasons we went to 25.00 is to try and hold this price for at least 2-3 years.
...so from this we now know that we will be getting at least 1-2 [at minimum] further PoP figures in 2013 already, not even counting PoP figures slated for the revised "going out with a bang" 2014 MOTUC figure lineup.
[might wanna snag these links MegaGearMax for the front page]
I don't agree with #3. If a significant number of new customers want to subscribe, they can. Production numbers are fixed (so are ALL toy production numbers...), in this case based on subscriptions. So they do respond to demand. They ARE the demand.
#1 is also drawing conclusions based on no data. You don't know that the number of sales lost is more than the number of sales gained. You can never quantify sales not made...because they weren't made. Sales not made can range from 0 to infinite, but there's absolutely no way to quantify that.
- - - Updated - - -
If TG could somehow sign a contract with the fans that this stuff would happen or there would be a negative consequence for Mattel, I'd sub up. I just can't believe this will happen. I still may sub, but I'm waiting to see how the next 2 weeks pan out before deciding. IF they'd drop the FFM, it would help my decision.
Holy crap man, please re-read his actual post. I would say chances are good those figures will come out based on Scott's post, but please don't say he confirmed those specific figures are getting made.
Yes, these would all be characters we want to try to get out before 2014 ends. But that all depends on the 2013 sub selling. Some of them may already be in the 2013 sub...
No guarantees but the first thing we need is to sell in the min order on 2013. If you have not renewed now is the time! MOTUC depends on you!
Tons of Toyguru answers....I've updated the front of the thread with this information too.
How are the Subs Selling As Of Today (7/22)?
With 2 weeks left, where is the thermometer standing at this point for MOTUC? DCIE? Watchmen?
I don't know. It is Sunday and the office is closed. I'm looking forward to getting a report in the AM.
Can you reveal how many POP and NA you have planned for the year?
Not identities of the characters, but how many NA and POP characters are CURRENTLY PLANNED for this year? Since these characters might be hard or impossible to get through day-of sales, the NA and POP fanbases might seek a little encouragement on the number of characters that they could be missing out on if they do not buy the subscription.
At min 2 monthly slots of each per year every year now. Maybe more....
Remember, there aren't THAT many POP and NA characters. If we did 2-3 per year for the next four years that is 8 to 12 figures in more years.
With that in mind, and knowing we always had long term plans for the MOTUC line to keep it going (unless price points killed the line) then this certainly feels like the right pace.
Future of ANY Beast
Is it likely that the most popular/asked-for beast, Stridor/Night Stalker, can be placed into the line-up for 2013 or 14? Many people seek these beasts way more than Gygor, Griffin, Megator, Procrustus and Tytus.
And we hope to get to a tom more. All depends on the 2013 sub selling in. We can't do full robust lines each year without locked in sales. It is what helps us bank the fully tool'd figures with the partial tool figures for an overall blended margin.
Finishing off GR/POP Can be done
If Matty really wanted to, they could get ALL of the main vintage GR/POP characters (11) out.
2 more monthly slots, and a Guides from Brightmoon 2pk
2 monthly slots, and a Defenders of Good 3pk
Yes, as you noted, there are not that many more to do. So finishing them off in the next two years can be done if we work on it. Lets see how the 2013 sub sells before figuring out next steps! One thing at a time.
Question for Toyguru
I just watched your video for the 2013 Sub and I totally understand. I have already done my part by purchasing the Club Eternia and Club DCIE subs.
My question is a "what if"
What if, the MOTU and DCIE subs do not meet the quota and get passed for 2013 Subs.
I heard you say at CC that the already tooled figures would still be made and be more like a "day of" sale.
If that was the case, would you atleast offer these already tooled figures to the people that bought the sub before the general public ??
The best comparison is to look what happened to GB. We originally wanted to do a full year of 6 figures plus a sub figure and a SDCC figure. Due to the club not selling through, we released only the figures that were far enough along which wound up being a total of 4 for the full year including SDCC's fig. If we don't get support for the 2013 sub, we might be able to release 1-4 figures for the year and call it a day. Everything depends on the sub. It is what lets us do fully tool'd figures like Ram Man because we can bank his tooling with other partial tool figures for a blended margin. If we released RM on his own without the full year his tooling would kill the figure.
Core POP characters in 2014
Scott it's been great to hear you say Scorpia would be a sure thing for 2014 that takes one of the top 5 POP characters off the missing list.
That does leave the fate of Glimmer, Castaspella, Queen Angella and Mermista up in the air though as they are all core POP characters. Can you confirm that all 4 of these popular rebels will be included in the line by the end of 2014? If you can I know myself and I'm sure many other POP fans will buy subs instantly!
GLIMMER, CASTASPELLA, QUEEN ANGELLA & MERMISTA are 100% needed for the POP section.
Yes, these would all be character we want try to get out before 2014 ends. But that all depends on the 2013 sub selling. So of them may already be in the 2013 sub...
No guarantees but the first thing we need is to sell in the min order on 2013. If you have not renewed now is the time! MOTUC depends on you!
Why CAN'T you remove the Fighting Foe Men?
You recently said you can't make changes to the items offered in the 2013 sub. My question is: Why not?
You always tell us that you can't release info regarding a full year's lineup because it is fluid and subject to change.
Yet now, when you have a reasonable option in front of you (i.e. dump the expensive and potentially unappealing high ticket item), the line-up is suddenly rigid.
Nobody is asking you to REPLACE the FFM with anything else. We're asking that you consider dumping that slot altogether.
Offer a small window in which subscribers can cancel if the FFM mean that much to them (you know, just like you did last year when you offered to cancel DC CIE subs).
I GUARANTEE you will gain more subscribers than you lose as a result of this. Guaranteed. Trust me.
All of the figures for year roll up together under the product margins. We can't just pick and choose which figures to release this late in the game. 2013 is a packaged deal for all skus.
MOTU Panic Button
If we don't hit the minimum number, would you consider giving it another shot in 2014? Maybe a MOTU-less year would lead to people appreciating them more once they're gone. Also, how close are we? We we like 25% there? 50%?
I don't know how close we are since it is Sunday and the office is closed. But if the 2013 sub does not sell, it will be very hard to put together any type of program for 2014. If you want more MOTUC, your best way to vote is to purchase a sub. It is in fan's hands!
why not take any action?
if the situation is complicated, why not take any action?emergency measures ,i don't know announcing one more figure(atractive)from the sub 2013 or sell the sub for 3 days at 20 dollars, things like that would be like a blow effects that would appeal to buy more subs.
I feel that mattel is seated waiting for the miracle.
any comment please?
We can't change the schedule or offer extensions. After all the schedule slips in 2012, we built 2013 to be rock solid and that means locking in our quotas on Aug 7th. Anything after that and we slip schedule on Jan and Feb offers.
Our desire to maintain schedule for fans is why we can't offer extensions anymore (remember what happened last Dec and Jan? We are trying to avoid that...)
Please NO MORE Concept Character 3 packs Scott?
I think the low sub numbers stem from over saturation of concept characters in the subscription & MOTUC's line. First we had Vikor, then Demo-Man, then The Star Sister 3 pack (which you know full well went over like a lead balloon) Then Vikron and now you hit us fans with another subscription expensive concept character 3 pack The fighting foe Men.
Honestly scott Please stop with concept 3 packs in the subscriptions? People want to complete their factions first and I believe the 2013 sub would have sold much faster had you given us The Horde Trooper 2 pack with the price increace instead of yet another concept character 3 pack like the Fighting Foe Men.
Fans are worried that their collections will be incomplete because of the character choices you have made with so many concept characters. Fans are worried the line could end premature and we won't have The filmation characters (now that Mattel FINALLY got the rights) Like Scorpia, Seahawk, Lord Mask & Shokoti, Glimmer, Castaspella, Queen Angella, A filmation Hordak, Filmation He-Man & Skeletor, General Sunder not to mention the rest of the vintage figures like Mantenna, Ninjor, Snakeface, Tung Lashor & squeeze, Clamp Champ etc.
If we make it through 2013 and into 2014 with 2014 possibly being the final year for MOTUC's I think you and Mattel owe it to the Fan Base to Deliver Castle Grayskull before this wonderful toy line ends since you have been quoated as saying that if 2014 ends up being the final year you want it to go out with a bang.
You got it. This is the last one.
Releasing those POP figures we're all itching for
I've said it before, and i'll keep saying it.
Announcing some POP characters would definitely boost sub sales.
The likes of
and my personal favourite Double Trouble
Do not underestimate POP. We've held out for almost 5 years and we don't even have 1/5 of POP, whereas MOTU Vintage has just over 3/4 released.
We are a big group us POP fans and we KNOW the 4H can work their magic on our beloved characters.
We're working on it. Many of these figures are already in the 2013 and 2014 line. Ask us again at the end of 2013 and see how you feel!
I know you can't change the slots
But Double Trouble would mean the world to me.
Thankyou for reading this. I shall be purchasing a sub on the 31st, when i get paid :-)
Nothing to confirm yet but stay tuned!
Suggestion: announcing there will be no Fighting Foe Men available 4 day-of sales?
I hope this might help! Since this set seems to be holding a lot of people back from subscribing, could you make it a sub only item with no stock available for day of sales, and make that announcement right away? I think that would make people feel better about subscribing since that would make it easier for them to sell this set off if they don't want it.
No we can't. The whole 2013 line is carefully constructed Profit and Loss statement. Costs have already been locked in and negotiated with our vendors based on the min order of sub holders we need (the same we had the last 4 years). We can't make changes to sub figures for 2013, but we can make changes to 2014 and based on the sell in for 2013 we are changing 2014 to make sure to include all the key MIA figures (or at least as many of them as we can).
After that, we can always fill in the last remaining gaps with convention items or one offs if a full year sub is no longer possible due to rising costs.
But bottom line is we can't make changes to the 2013 sub. It is a careful balance of partial and fully tool'd figures to have an overall blended margin that rolls up on our P&L statement that hits our bottom line. We are well beyond making changes like removing a figure (or set) at this point.
Glimmer would certainly help sell subs
Many POP fans would jump on the sub if a core POP character like Glimmer was announced. Don't underestimate us Toyguru
As would Ram Man, Fang Man and Jistsu. We can't release every figure fans want every year. Remember when Trap Jaw was the one everyone asked for? Then Sorceress, then Ram Man. We keep knocking them off one by one. Given enough time, that has always been the plan.
Now that it looks like prices are affecting sub holders we are going to try and excelerate the release of key characters before the end of 2014. But we can't make changes to 2013 at this point (not that it isn't already chock full of demanded figures, just wait and see what we have in store!)
I know fans are clamoring for more reveals despite getting so many just a week ago. Can you please leave something to reveal at Power Con?
We will have approx the same number of reveals for Power Con and NYCC as we had last year. It all depends on what is done in time.
Scott, I fully support you, and right now, I know you are feeling a lot of pressure from the fans, and many people aren't being kind in light of recent developments. I do not envy you your job right now. That being said, I have always supported and stood behind what you and Mattel have announced and said regarding these figures, and though you were speaking honestly, I only felt that it could have been worded better.
That being said, others have proposed that Mattel announce a few more figures to help generate interest in the sub. You continue to turn down these requests, and it all falls behind "We have nothing new to announce." Fans see through that, and here is why.
In other posts, Q&A, and even at conventions, you yourself have said repeatedly that figures are planned out 2 years in advance. 2013 was planned in 2011, 2012 was planned in 2010, etc. Now, Mattel has no idea what comes beyond March 2013? I call shennanigans. Either figures are planned two years ahead, or less than six months ahead. Either way, it feels like we have been lied to.
Look, though most are concerned with cost increase, and we all understand it, we all also knew it was coming. But most people cannot fly blind anymore with the costs where they are. And the 2013 reveals were lackluster at best.
This isn't a "pretty please tell us more" request, Scott. This is a "you must reveal more" request to keep interest peaked. You know, drop a couple of names. Not a full lineup. Don't even say what month they are planned for, since yes, we all know schedules can slip a couple of months, etc. And the reason that you can't reveal characters because of possible schedule slips, well, my friend, 2012 was FULL of those, so we have come to expect that. But you know what you have planned at least for 2013. Just drop a couple of names, don't say when, just that they are planned for 2013. Many people are on the fence, and Mattel simply saying "Please buy a sub" isn't going to cut it anymore, I'm afraid. Fans need to be excited about these figures again, and it is up to Mattel to do that.
And if you honestly don't know what else is coming for 2013, then I guess Mattel doesn't plan figures out years in advance.
We'd love to reveal more figures but we just aren't in a position to do so.
Besides, the sub is for the completionst. The line is dependent on the completionist. It is just the cost of running a very low run highly detailed collector line. Completionists by definition want every figure no matter what. So by the book, for this type of consumer it really shouldn't matter how many we reveal because as completionists (not cherry pickers) they will take all the figures.
I wish the line could work for cherry pickers, I really do. But we just aren't in a place anymore for a line like MOTUC with such a tiny production run can survive without the min number of completionists (sub holders) willing to take all the figures no matter who they are.
Worst case scenario: Please don't forget 200X too
If this worst case scenario happens and year long subs were to come to an end, please consider 200X/MYP characters too. Evilseed, Prahvus, 200X King Hssss, 200X King Randor, 200X Sorceress, Calix to name a few would all make awesome figures, and it would be a real shame if they wee ignored.
All characters we want to get to but the vintage figs come first if the line is truly on its way down to the figures costing more then fans are willing to pay. BUT should 2013 sell in the same quota as 2010-2012 we can get back to the plan that includes all of these figures too.
It also doesn't mean we couldn't get to them in a post 2014 line where we switch to fewer figures without an annual sub (like we did for GB). But right now we have to wait and see how 2013 sells before figuring out any next steps.
Scott...I bought a sub
Obviously, I am in full panic mode here regarding MOTU and DCU subs. I have no understanding of the finances or logistics that goes into these lines. All your answers to fan concerns is "buy a sub." Scott, I did. Minutes after the went on sale. Both DC and MOTU, I can't afford more than one each. I think many fans are in the same boat. The fans that didn't buy the sub clearly do not want these figures at these prices. Personally, I do. I'm cool with the increase and the selection. But it's not me you have to sell too.
There seems to be an unwillingness to budge by you guys in terms of format and selection. Obviously pricing is what it is, but I think we are all going to have to think outside the "buy the sub" mindset if we want these things to continue. Please, help. I need my monthly package
I wish we had wiggle room but NO ONE expected prices to shoot up so much over the last few years. If we had known this we might have released more core characters sooner.
But facts are facts and it costs 25.00 to produce a figure in 2013.
But the one good side is we will not have a price increase in 2014. We raised the price to 25 in the hopes that this price can last a few years.
A way to encourage people who have not gotten a sub yet
I know you won't say names but how about factions
like Jan - pop. Feb - motu. Mar - violation. Apr - horde. And so on people would like that. Or how about something like 2 pop 2 NA 2 horde 2 comic 3 motion 1 concept
I"d love to do that but we just are not in a position to do so.
But remember, sub holders are completionsts. By definition, a completionist will buy any figure no matter what. So by that logic, reveals should not matter.
I really do wish a line like MOTUC could work for cherry pickers, but in today's market it just can't. Without the min number of people willing to buy any figure (i.e. completionists, i.e. customers who don't need to know every release because they will get them no matter what) we wouldn't be able to keep MOTUC going. It is a VERY low run line with passionate fans. The only way to keep it going is with guaranteed sales.
For 2013- 2014 do you mean all that were toys? and what about the variants like Flying Fist, Laser Light, NA, Snake Armor He-Man and the Skeletor ones
Right now we are talking about everyone who had a toy in the 1982-1987 MOTU line including variants and most of the key NA, Filmation and POP figures. We can fill in the gaps with others through conventions or other offerings should a full annual line not be possible after 2014.
But nothing is set in stone right now. First thing we need to do is sell in the 2013 sub. THen we can look at other options.
A kind word and a message to people on the fence.
Despite any kind of personal animosity I've directed towards you in the past Scott, it's very clear from recent goings on that you are extremely passionate about the line and you are obviously doing whatever you can to ensure we have a line to complain about to begin with!
To all the people that perhaps are on the fence about the subscription think about this: In 30 years when we're all old and in our golden years, would you like to think back on your adult life and childhood and be able to see this wonderfully diverse collection you were able to be a part of not only once but twice in your life; or would you rather look back at what could have been? The sub is certainly an expensive item and not for everyone but if you are even the least bit interested in seeing this line continue then please everyone...SUB UP NOW!
It doesn't hurt that we get some amazing incentives this year as well with first access to outside of the sub items, King He-Man far before we thought we'd ever see him, and a mini-comic that finally tells the full story of Skeletor in detail! Plus don't forget the fan vote that will obviously shape the future of the line!
All in all, Scott you're doing a heck of a job with a lot of pressure on you at the moment and I'm sure I speak on behalf of the fans when I say we appreciate everything you're doing- even if we sometimes disagree with certain decisions.
Couldn't agree more. With all the passionate fans we have, if we can just get all the fans who bought either a 2010, 2011 or 2012 sub to buy a 2013 sub we are good to go. I have faith we can pull this off together! Who is with me! Buy a sub today! Heck, buy 4!
Almost not buying Sub....
I first would like to say that I love the MOTU classic line. You guys are doing a great job! I was a late comer to the line. I started my collection by buying lots on ebay. When the MOTU mystery packs came up( which I love) I added even more to my collection. I eventually bought a sub for 2012 due to the fact that Shadow Weaver was the exclusive.
So far I've loved the 2012 line. I do hope we can get more filmation and POP figures but I understand the need to rotate A-C list characters to help the line continue.
Now that 2013 subs are here, I'm waivering on purchasing one. Not because of the characters or only quarterly reveals or 2013. I like only getting a few reveals. Adds to the suspense. Not even because of the price hike.
I waiver mainly due to DR and the shipping costs. I find it ridiculous that I buy a sub and if I order more on day of sale that they can't ship those all together to save on shipping. I especially dislike it on Black friday when only a few figures are revealed at a time and I get charged every time I order a set of figures when they come up. For me, shipping always comes to about 1/2 of the total I spend. It's almost more cost effective to not purchase the sub. Buy the figures on day of sale and buy the exclusive figure on ebay or some sight.
That's really the only reason I waiver on buying a sub, not because of the figures revealed or the price hike but because of the outrageous shipping charges.
Anyway, now that you've read my rant on way I hesitate to purchase a sub...
I just want to say you guy's are doing a great job and i hope the line can keep going
Appreciate the thoughts. We need the min number of fans to buy a 2013 sub. Without that, we'll have trouble keeping MOTUC coming out. We need guaranteed sales for such a low run highly detailed line to get the resources it needs to continue. Everything depends on this.
I'm considering buying a second sub. Will it ship together
Dear Toyguru I'm considering buying a second sub for 2 reasons
1. My collection includes 2 of every figure with a second head and I want to keep it that way
2. I know we are in a crisis and I want to help out and keep the line going
my question is if I buy another one now will they ship together?
As long as you pick the same shipping method.
The subscriptions thermometer
Can we have one for club eternia and if yes, when?
Blind sailors will just crash on rocks,
sailors seeing the danger coming will take the good decision to move forward
Working on this!
I know all the discussion has been about the subs im not sure if anyone asked about the reissues and if the will continue next year. I am hoping these continue as im missing a few figures like whiplash and i need two of em. Any info?
A few older figures (pre 2012) may still crop up, but no figures from 2012 or 2013 will be reissued (outside of selling off any remaining customer service stock not claimed).
Changing shipping options in 2013?
Hi Scott. I was wondering if subscribers will be able to change their shipping methods throughout the year in 2013, or if they will be locked into one type upon subscribing? Such an option may convince more people to buy subscriptions, with more leeway from month-to-month.
Ideally yes. The "my subscription" page we are working on should let you do this. We are trying to get it out ASAP.
Scotts Update Video
I know like others I found your initial message you posted about the sub a little off putting originally. "I" read a more negative tone than I think was intended by yourself. That being said, your Update video was a better delivered message to the fans i think. I appreciate the way this was delivered and I would suggest the update video again in the future for the fans as opposed to the written post as it conveys your thoughts and feelings much clearer IMO. Hope all the POP and NA fans understand there is less of the Original He-Man line figures to be made as we've gone through the vast majority of them. Snake Men and Horde is close to complete with the inclusions of Rattlor and Snake Face (Shield was Shown @ SDCC) and it allows for more Filmation Characters like Madam Razz, Scorpia, Sea Hawk and Strongarm that fans wanted. We have the Final Figures like Mantenna, Two Bad (and hopefully Tuvar and Badrus) Horde Troopers, Peekablue, NA He-Man and Skeletor.....the Option for the next years are some of the best yet. Fans Begged for Mekanek and Ram Man for 2 years and Thanks to a Man like Scott....we got them. I Personally want to Thank You Scott for listening to us fans and doing everything and Continuing to do so Everything to ensure the longevity of this Line because in the End.....this is a fan line built and essentially run by the support of the fans like yourself. Long Live MOTU!
Tell your friends!
If we can just get everyone who subscribed in either 2010, 2011 or 2012 to subscribe in 2013 we are golden. Knowing how passionate our fans are I have 100% faith we will get their in the next two weeks and keep MOTUC going!
If Mattel is so concerned about the non certainty of day of sales figures, would it not make more sense to have a pre-order system. A genetic check sheet with the figures for the year (people don't care what month they are released), both sub and non-sub items, which will give you a set indication of how many to produce. That way you alienate none of your customer base, people that don't want all the figures get the ones they actually want, and the ones that want everything can opt for that on the Pre orders. It's a win win for both customers and Mattel, you still know what your base sales are for the year, without the uncertainty of day of.
A pre order is interesting but what it doesn't let us do is bank the fully tool'd figures with the partial tool'd figures for a blended margin. The full year program is what lets us get to figures like Ram Man. If we did these as one offs we could only do a small handful of figures each year. Also, if we offered figures one off for pre sale and they didn't hit the min quota that would be a lot of wasted resources and management would start shutting us down. The full year sub which is a mix of fan demanded and more obscure characters (and what makes a complete collection) is depended on guaranteed sub sales. One off built to order models would prevent us from doing figures like Ram Man. We need the full year or partial tool figures to balance him out and create a blended margin on our P&L.
Re: Sub Idea
Scott, when I brought this up before you seemed unclear on what I was saying, so I'll try rephrasing it.
You've said that you're worried about the marketability of a sub which included all the items as opposed to the current basic sub that has items outside of it.
At the same time though as I'm sure you can understand, some people do want to lock in everything.
Therefore wouldn't the solution be, much like the way the 30th Anniversary line was a subscription for ONLY the 30th Anniversary figures; to offer a secondary MOTUC sub which was for only those figures/vehicles not covered by the current sub?
That way you're able to get guaranteed sales for higher ticket items while still having the Club Eternia sub remain unchanged.
If we did another vehicle we would do it like the HB and presell it only and only if we hit the min. The customer base just isn't there based on current sales of the Windraider.
Follow Up: Change the Packaging = Lower Costs?
In your response to my question about changing the packaging, you said that it could lower costs, but not return the figures to $20.
That is fine. I subscribed on day one. What I'm asking is would changing the packaging perhaps lower your overhead so that you could get by with fewer subscribers than you currently need? If so, do it, I say! Do it!
We are locked in to the standard package for 2013 but certainly something we can look at for 2014.
Madame Razz & Broom
Thank you for answering Celsius' question so openly. I share his enthusiasm for Scorpia and am delighted to hear that she would be a candidate for 2014. I know you probably don't want to start addressing this on a character by character basis but I have to ask, do Madame Razz & Broom have as likely a shot at a spot in 2014? I just can't bear to think of this line ending without them never having had a shot at being immortalized in plastic. Thanks!
Everything depends on how the 2013 sub sells. If it does well, it makes getting to both of these characters that much more likely. If you want more MOTUC now is your chance to vote with a sub purchase. The future of the line is in fan's hands! I have 100% faith we will get there. If we can just get everyone who had a sub in either 2010, 2011 or 2012 to renew we are fine.
But we are not there yet.
When you say you're adding as many "core" characters to the 2014 line as possible, are you automatically thinking any character that had a vintage figure is a core character? For many of us, you've already released most of the core characters that had vintage figures. I don't think characters like Extendar, Ninjor, and Clamp Champ, who never appeared on any of the TV shows, are more core than characters like Scorpia, Madame Razz, and Skeletor's robots just because they've had a figure before.
Specificly, what are the odds of seeing characters like Spirit and a proper sized Cringer by 2014? They were in almost every episode of their shows and you don't get much more core than them.
If the audience is there, anything is possible. We will keep making these figures as long as we have guaranteed customers (i.e. sub holders) to buy them. Once that drops out the chance of getting to new version of Cringer or Sprit becomes smaller. We certainly would like to. Everything depends on sub holders.
"Interest in the line is going down" - INACCURATE
Perhaps the statement made "Interest in the line is going down" is made more from a business standpoint, rather than actual fan/consumer interest in MOTUC.
Several variables have gone into why 2013 sub sales:
1. Too many New/Obscure characters in the line
2. Imbalance of character offerings
3. Increase in international pricing, with little support
4. Ongoing issues with DR
5. Production flaws
6. Overall product and shipping price hikes
NONE of these issues have anything to do with fans/consumers losing interest in MOTUC. And though many of them are out of Mattel's control for the most part, it is not settling to see the statement that "interest is going down."
1: Too many New/Obscure characters in the line
If we only did fan demanded figures the line would end much quicker. The goal was always to make as many figures as possible before the line got more expensive to produce then fans were willing to pay. We didn't want to just burn through all the fan demanded A list figures in year 1. Look what happened with the Staction line...
2. Imbalance of character offerings
Every year is a careful balance. That is why the long term road map was created.
3. Increase in international pricing, with little support
Maybe you should check up on our sister sites like Hotwheels.com, Barbie.com and Redineclub.com. They offer zero international shipping. The only way international fans have to buy product from those sites is by finding a pen pal in the US to buy produce and reship to them. Matty fans actually have it really good. Try checking out those boards sometimes and compare your "issues"! Shipping internationally is very difficult and add many factors we have zero control over. We offer international shipping on Matty but have very little control over costs or specific issues to the destination address. I mean this in the nicest way, but international fans are really lucky we offer shipping at all. Most direct to consumer sites (like Hotwheels.com) don't even offer international due to the difficulty involved. It is the same for US fan wanting to buy Japanese toys. Importing toys is expensive. It is just a fact of industry, not something specific to Matty.com.
4. Ongoing issues with DR
Always something we are constantly improving. Our new US based customer service group is making huge strides. It is not perfect but we are making major progress!
5. Production flaws
Every figure is hand made and hand painted. If you have an issue we replace and ship new product for free. So this is not really an issue unless you are in the very small group of international fans that choose a non trackable option. As long as you ship with a trackable option we will replace any damaged product at no cost to you. So i don't see this being an issue.
6. Overall product and shipping price hikes
Something we have zero control over. Material and labor costs have gone up. I've always said what will "kill" the line is when the figures cost more to make then fans are willing to pay. We can't control the cost to make these figures. The very low production run is what makes them even more expensive. Not something we can change.
I know this is the little line that could. In my eyes i hated New Adventures as a kid and was totally upset when Optikk was announced, But upon getting Him, Flipshot, and Slush Head i think they are three of the best figures in the line.
Will we get to any of the hugely important Jet Lag Characters like Mara, Crita, Sebrian, Drissi, Caz, and DArius who was a prototype or will the key New Adventures characters be considerd this of the toy line. Because i would love to get their equivalents of Teela, Evil-Lynn, and Zodac being Mara, Crita , and Master Sebrian. These would be LARGE HOLES in the NA collection due to their prominence in the cartoon.
We'll have to see how the 2013 line sells in as a sub first. But the long term goal has always been to get to these figures. We'll keep making these figures as long as their are fans ready to buy them at the price it costs to make them. Hopfully we are not at the point yet that it costs more to make then fans are willing to buy.
Can we please get an update on the fate of notice?
Has the subscriptions picked up enough since your announcement?
Wondering if everything is ok now. even I got a sub for the first time.
It is Sunday and Mattel is closed. I'll try to post an update next week.
I have to agree with the other poster who mentioned if you announce Glimmer (not SHOW her, just announce her) and more people will subscribe.
Perhaps not even Glimmer, you could even announce Castaspella, Angella, Octavia, Scorpia.
ANY of these characters would encourage people to subscribe.
They sure would be. But you can say the same for Ram Man, Fang Man, Strobo and Jistu that we did announce. We can't do every fan demanded figure every month, but by the end of 2014 you should see quite a complete collection (if we can get enough subscribers for 2013).
2013 & Obscure figures
Reading the boards... it's plain to see that the subs are hurting a lot due to the announcement of the obscure, expensive and relatively unattractive FFM 3-pack. I know you won't release the rest of the line-up... but can you at LEAST confirm that the FFM are THE most obscure package in the line-up? I think confirming this would really help...
While some people may not like the FFM, the only reason we put them in was because fans were asking for them. Sure not all fans, but enough were that we included them. Without initial fan support for these figs we would not have added them. They have been quite demanded for a few years.
the major complaint
i notice that alot of people major problem is shipping $25 fig $10 tax shipping = $35 one figure whats the posibility of doing 2 figs every other month or 3-4 fig quarterly this would save on shippping cost for the customer i would hate to wait 3 mounths to get my figures but it would probally change a lot of minds about the subscription
Not something we can offer for 2013. We'd love it if we could make the line word for every type of customer with every type of social/economic or location need but in the end, to do a very low run collector line with out major entertainment (i.e a movie) the 2013 sub is what we have. It may not work for everyone, but if you want more MOTUC this is your best way to vote for more. (by supporting the sub)
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Are these guys considered beasts or vehicles? Hoping they are considered beasts and we see them soon! Figure it would be a good figure to do since it's one sculpt for 2 figures.
They would be great to do, but nothing to announce right now.