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Thread: New Book About The Rise And Fall Of MOTU Listed On Amazon.Com!

  1. #76
    Heroic Warrior Dr. R.K.Z's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Omega
    Since the book is a first hand experience of working for Mattel and helping to create MOTU in the 80's, why would any of the fanbase be contacted?


    Dr. Omega

    Maybye if the book DID cover the 90's version and the new version, they would be invaluable.

    Bah, the guys behind the Org should just write a book themselves on the subject, I mean, lord knows the revival has it's own fair share of political B.S

  2. #77
    Assimilate, or else!! krosfyah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. R.K.Z
    Maybye if the book DID cover the 90's version and the new version, they would be invaluable.

    Bah, the guys behind the Org should just write a book themselves on the subject, I mean, lord knows the revival has it's own fair share of political B.S
    Val should pen it. he has some great inside info to put out there.
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  3. #78
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    *does a backflip* Yee haw! David's going to consider PoP for the book! I'm going to compile some damn good reasons why PoP is important and share a few childhood memories too! (Maybe even send a childhood photo LOL) Help me come up with more good reasons PoP fans!!

    hey, Jim....

    She-Ra has not been a focus, but if you think she should be, tell me
    why and I'll give it due diligence. We have been in touch with Val and
    are working to get him an excerpt and whatever else he wants.

    Are you a collector?

    david

  4. #79
    Assimilate, or else!! krosfyah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar
    *does a backflip* Yee haw! David's going to consider PoP for the book! I'm going to compile some damn good reasons why PoP is important and share a few childhood memories too! (Maybe even send a childhood photo LOL) Help me come up with more good reasons PoP fans!!
    NICE!

    way to get Val involved too!

    Reason to include She-ra pro and con...Mattel shifted the money to she-ra and killed off he-man (cartoon) and She-ra did help extend the MOTU mythos advert some characters (rokkon stonedar snout spout etc in the show) and kept Eternia on the air for guest appearances.
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  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar
    *does a backflip* Yee haw! David's going to consider PoP for the book! I'm going to compile some damn good reasons why PoP is important and share a few childhood memories too! (Maybe even send a childhood photo LOL) Help me come up with more good reasons PoP fans!!
    POP WAS GOLDEN GIRL RIP OFF!

  6. #81
    Heroic Warrior Dr. R.K.Z's Avatar
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    The cartoon series appealed to two target demographics (males and females) by making use of both the Horde characters and Princess of Power characters, and making She-Ra distintcly less "stereotypically female" than most girl cartoon characters at the time, making her a strong character, very few animated girl shows can appeal to several audiences (JEM is the only other one I think that both of the demographics watch, although I admit, I'm a fan of the sadly missed Princess Starla and the Jewel Riders).

  7. #82
    Eternian Jedi Knight He-Fan's Avatar
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    Chris here...

    First of all, well done Mikey locating this link - this looks like it'll end up on many He-Man.Orgers' bookshelves!

    As to why She-Ra should be included, I've no idea how much the cartoon show is going to feature in the book, but I would say that one of the strong points of the Filmation She-Ra cartoon is that it took the concept of good vs. evil and ran with it in the totally opposite direction to MOTU, exploring the idea of evil having the upper hand and the band of freedom-loving Rebels having to fight to regain control of their world. Whilst there were some goofy episodes where you could be forgiven for thinking that She-Ra and co. had the upper hand, just watch an episode like "The Price of Freedom" or "Unexpected Ally" to see what can be achieved!

    Actually, that's a thought - how big a section of this book is to be devoted to the cartoon show? IMO one of the biggest reasons for MOTU's ongoing success throughout the 1980s was the awesome work by Filmation - something that shouldn't be overlooked!

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  8. #83
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    Hey there Chris,

    I get the impression that he's mainly interested in the vintage toylines, but I'm only basing that on the two responses, so that might not be a very accurate conclusion. The cartoon is definitely going to get more than just a little mention though! I'm going to try to tie it into the toyline so it's relevant to his book.

  9. #84
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    Here's what I wrote. Please let me know what you guys think...

    I do indeed collect all the various items from the Princess of Power toy line, but I am also very much a lover of the Filmation She-Ra cartoon series, which I would have to say was a powerful motivator for wanting the toys in the first place. It's a wonderful, well-written spin-off series, that is often viewed as a extremely important extention of Masters of the Universe. (There were several crossovers with He-Man and other MotU characters)

    Sure, you'll always have your extremists and purists out there, who believe that anything outside of the original Masters of the Universe is garbage, but I highly believe that the vast majority view He-Man and She-Ra, in all its various forms, as one and the same. I'm basing that conclusion on what I've heard in person and read on all the message boards. Even Mattel's own research for the revamped 2002 He-Man line seems to correspond with that reasoning. See, Mattel's brand manager, Jeremy Padawer, conducted a little survey. He went around asking people to list what they remembered about the original Masters of the Universe. Well, guess what? She-Ra came in the top five list of things that people remembered and technically she's part of a totally seperate property. But I digress.

    I'll be honest and say that, while I'm very enthusiastic about the original He-Man cartoon and toy line, I do have a preference for She-Ra. In many ways, I feel that her show improved upon the parent Masters of the Universe series. Not only did the writting get better, but the creators took everything a step further by giving She-Ra this great cause. See, on He-Man's world of Eternia, the heroes were mainly in control of the planet and fought to keep Skeletor and crew from taking over Grayskull. But on She-Ra's Etheria, Hordak and his Horde had devestated a majority of the planet with their rule, enslaving many people, and now it was up to She-Ra and these small bands of freedom fighters (The Rebellion) to try to win back their world. Do you see how this could make for some really compelling storylines?

    Speaking in regards to the Princess of Power toy line...

    Now obviously (and understandably) many of these harsher elements were omitted from the Princess of Power toy line mythos, and the figures were adjusted to cater to young girls (the majority of which are used to Barbie), making Catra and Entrapta the main villains. But even so, I still feel that there's enough of a link between the two universes to make She-Ra relevent to your book.

    For starters, the writters' on the Princess of Power mini-comics could not resist linking the Eternia and Etheria. This is very evident in "The Story of She-Ra" packaged with She-Ra, which is pretty much a retelling of "The Secret of the Sword" and a crossover with He-Man, Man-At-Arms, The Sorceress and Hordak. There are also other references, such as mentions of The Horde, as well as actual Horde Troopers appearing in a later mini-comic called: "Where Hope has Gone."

    Anyhow, I'll end this by saying that I feel like the Princess of Power property is often unfairly judged as a failure in comparison to Masters of the Univere. (I think the second series line-up dropped down to $40 million before Mattel finally cancelled Princess of Power) What many people don't realize though, is that She-Ra's cartoon was one of the main vehicles of advertisement for The Horde Masters of the Univere figures and a lot of the later characters that didn't get a chance to appear in He-Man's series.

    And while it might appear as though She-Ra destroyed both properties, I don't believe that to be correct. From what the fans were told in the past, Mattel highly believed that reruns of the He-Man cartoon were enough to support the MotU toyline. So, if She-Ra hadn't come along, I think they wouldn't have made anymore episodes of He-Man anyway. She-Ra extended the life of Masters of the Universe.

    P.S. Is it okay to send you a childhood photo to help convince you to include Princess of Power in your book?

    Thank you,
    Jim

  10. #85
    Master of Physics VZX's Avatar
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    Tallstar: I'd also include some info on celebrities who are She-Ra fans. I know that Anne Hathaway from The Princess Diaries is a big She-Raver. She stated so on Live with Regis and Kelly. She was asked what superhero would she like to be and her response was She-Ra. She then went on to explain why and that she's a big fan.

    Anyways, I'd also ask him to describe the collector community to an extant. It'd be interesting to read the types of people that are fans, I'm sure that the author will be impressed.

    that's my two cents...
    "Everything comes to he who waits."

  11. #86
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar
    Here's what I wrote. Please let me know what you guys think...

    I do indeed collect all the various items from the Princess of Power toy line, but I am also very much a lover of the Filmation She-Ra cartoon series, which I would have to say was a powerful motivator for wanting the toys in the first place. It's a wonderful, well-written spin-off series, that is often viewed as a extremely important extention of Masters of the Universe. (There were several crossovers with He-Man and other MotU characters)

    Sure, you'll always have your extremists and purists out there, who believe that anything outside of the original Masters of the Universe is garbage, but I highly believe that the vast majority view He-Man and She-Ra, in all its various forms, as one and the same. I'm basing that conclusion on what I've heard in person and read on all the message boards. Even Mattel's own research for the revamped 2002 He-Man line seems to correspond with that reasoning. See, Mattel's brand manager, Jeremy Padawer, conducted a little survey. He went around asking people to list what they remembered about the original Masters of the Universe. Well, guess what? She-Ra came in the top five list of things that people remembered and technically she's part of a totally seperate property. But I digress.

    I'll be honest and say that, while I'm very enthusiastic about the original He-Man cartoon and toy line, I do have a preference for She-Ra. In many ways, I feel that her show improved upon the parent Masters of the Universe series. Not only did the writting get better, but the creators took everything a step further by giving She-Ra this great cause. See, on He-Man's world of Eternia, the heroes were mainly in control of the planet and fought to keep Skeletor and crew from taking over Grayskull. But on She-Ra's Etheria, Hordak and his Horde had devestated a majority of the planet with their rule, enslaving many people, and now it was up to She-Ra and these small bands of freedom fighters (The Rebellion) to try to win back their world. Do you see how this could make for some really compelling storylines?

    Speaking in regards to the Princess of Power toy line...

    Now obviously (and understandably) many of these harsher elements were omitted from the Princess of Power toy line mythos, and the figures were adjusted to cater to young girls (the majority of which are used to Barbie), making Catra and Entrapta the main villains. But even so, I still feel that there's enough of a link between the two universes to make She-Ra relevent to your book.

    For starters, the writters' on the Princess of Power mini-comics could not resist linking the Eternia and Etheria. This is very evident in "The Story of She-Ra" packaged with She-Ra, which is pretty much a retelling of "The Secret of the Sword" and a crossover with He-Man, Man-At-Arms, The Sorceress and Hordak. There are also other references, such as mentions of The Horde, as well as actual Horde Troopers appearing in a later mini-comic called: "Where Hope has Gone."

    Anyhow, I'll end this by saying that I feel like the Princess of Power property is often unfairly judged as a failure in comparison to Masters of the Univere. (I think the second series line-up dropped down to $40 million before Mattel finally cancelled Princess of Power) What many people don't realize though, is that She-Ra's cartoon was one of the main vehicles of advertisement for The Horde Masters of the Univere figures and a lot of the later characters that didn't get a chance to appear in He-Man's series.

    And while it might appear as though She-Ra destroyed both properties, I don't believe that to be correct. From what the fans were told in the past, Mattel highly believed that reruns of the He-Man cartoon were enough to support the MotU toyline. So, if She-Ra hadn't come along, I think they wouldn't have made anymore episodes of He-Man anyway. She-Ra extended the life of Masters of the Universe.

    P.S. Is it okay to send you a childhood photo to help convince you to include Princess of Power in your book?

    Thank you,
    Jim

    Wonderful Jim! I couldn't have written it any better myself! I wish I had thought of E-Mailing the authors myself, but you have handled things much better! I hope She-Ra and POP are included as such a book needs to incorporate the best parts of the mythos and POP - especially as you have described here and what we all feel in our hearts is one of the most powerful and symbolic parts of the mythos. Well Done, Stretchy One!

    Hamato Yoshi: For your information, the author asked the fans for their input from what several people who have E-Mailed them have indicated. Get used to it, POP is a part of MOTU, and a much beloved and important part of the mythos and we POP fans deserve to have it considered if the authors are willing to take fan consideration into account. Don't turn my good news thread into a POP bashing hate fest please. That's the crap we don't want shoved down everyone's throats.
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  12. #87
    Master of Physics VZX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamato Yoshi
    Why do you She-Ra fans insist on shoving that crap down everyone's throats? Let the guy write his book the way he wants to.

    I wish there was a She-Ra.org.

    HUH? You make no sense!

    I'm not a She-Ra fan, but it has its place and many fans. Any book about MotU absolutely should include She-Ra, since their lines are related.

    If She-Ra fans really bother you this much, then you need to......aww shucks, I don't want to start a flame war, so I'll stop right there.
    Last edited by VZX; February 4, 2005 at 11:03am.
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  13. #88
    Human Mutant Power! carlo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamato Yoshi
    Why do you She-Ra fans insist on shoving that crap down everyone's throats? Let the guy write his book the way he wants to
    you mean down your throat? you dont like it with she-ra, dont buy it then! simple! and if the dude wanted to add she-ra in his book, guess what.. its his call, not yours

    maybe you should wrote your own he-man book and then you can keep all the crap out of yours, which probably wont sell anyway


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  14. #89
    Heroic Warrior Dr. R.K.Z's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamato Yoshi
    Why do you She-Ra fans insist on shoving that crap down everyone's throats? Let the guy write his book the way he wants to..

    What a marvelous, constructive, mature post, DO keep it up, we need more of that...NOT.

  15. #90
    Assimilate, or else!! krosfyah's Avatar
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    She-ra.

    She-ra is a bitter sweet thing for me. I will always say that she is part of MOTU but the kid in me dislikes the fact that she 'stole' the Horde. I was really looking fwd to seeing them in the MOTU cartoon. But as an adult I can appreciate She-ra and I also know mattel shifted resources etc. so I don't have that 'bitterness' I had as a kid. She-ra did have some good stories, but the toyline was too far away from the show IMO.

    Anyway I think the She-ra fans want She-ra included because;
    A. there was only ONE incarnation of she-ra and they really want to see her again in new stories and want to see her get some love...and
    B. I don't think She-ra is strong enough to stand on her own on a nostalgia level. (not that a relaunch wouldn't work in the right hands, but from nostalgia truth be told she is a footnote in the success of MOTU)

    And though Hamato Yoshi's comments were harsh, I understand how he feels a bit...everytime a new MOTU thing pops up, the She-ravers are very quick to try to fit in She-ra somehow. It doesn't annoy me, but if She-ra is to come back in the MOTU world, I would like to see it develop rather than be wedged in too soon. It feels like the She-ravers don't want to let MOTU develop. I know that's not it...I know that they want to see their fave come into the light asap. but sometimes it comes off in a pushy way. but that's love for you right?? But anyway a chapter on POP would fit in, because it was part of the reason motu declined IMO. as well the Horde only appeared in there, as well as other MOTU figures. so it does deserve a mention.
    Last edited by krosfyah; February 4, 2005 at 12:26pm.
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  16. #91
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamato Yoshi
    Why do you She-Ra fans insist on shoving that crap down everyone's throats? Let the guy write his book the way he wants to.

    I wish there was a She-Ra.org.
    *shrugs* I didn't shove anything down his throat. I told David that I wasn't going to bother him with lots of questions (because Val is handeling that for all of you), but that I was just curious to know if She-Ra's Princess of Power line was going to get any mentions. That's when HE asked for my input. As far as I'm concerned, he's free to include whatever he wants in his book.

  17. #92
    He-Man.org Forum Admin TheShadow's Avatar
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    Let's not strike up the MOTU-POP battles in this thread please. It is perfectly fine for people to wonder if She-ra will be mentioned. Whether you like it or not, She-Ra is apart of the whole thing.


    Now back to the book discussion please.
    Last edited by TheShadow; February 4, 2005 at 05:17pm.

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  18. #93
    Atomic Powered G-Man's Avatar
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    This book sounds cool.
    Last edited by TheShadow; February 4, 2005 at 05:17pm.

  19. #94
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    It sounds like it will be a very interesting book about MOTU, and I'm looking forward to checking it out when it's released.
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  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar
    *shrugs* I didn't shove anything down his throat. I told David that I wasn't going to bother him with lots of questions (because Val is handeling that for all of you), but that I was just curious to know if She-Ra's Princess of Power line was going to get any mentions. That's when HE asked for my input. As far as I'm concerned, he's free to include whatever he wants in his book.
    Your just super Obbessed.......... with fictional, fantasy, character ,
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    your holding too tight.

  21. #96
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    Krosfyah, how can you say that She-Ra stole the Horde? Was it not always the impression that the plot was developing from the beggining with "The Secret Of The Sword" that eventually there would be more and more collaborations between the two? As it is by the time that the "Christmas Special" was done in that storyline weren't they mainly on Eternia? Besides one way or the other I don't see why both can't exist at the same time and cross paths storywise since in my view they always were one in the same. I always believed that the storys should have developed farther from there leading to the mysterious unsolved past of He-Man with the dinosaurs with that explained further. In truth that is why I thought the latest series was a let down because I think it should have deloped the original further and not repeated what frankly what I thought had already been done. Then again I never really saw much of it as it was hardly ever on...so what do I know?

  22. #97
    Heroic Social Worker Fisto's Avatar
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    Hey Friends,

    This book is truly wonderful news!

    I really cannot wait to read this. I imagine, that we are all going to learn heaps of things.

    I really like "She-Ra: Princess of Power", and think it is only fair, to have it included here.

    However, I do have some concerns. I am fearful that some really cool "MotU"
    information will be left out or scrapped.

    Tallstar, I was wondering, is their anyway, as fan you could suggest that the size of the book is increased in size? This may pave the way to do even greater justice to both "MOTU and "POP".

    I know, most people probably think I am a hypocrit, because I love "MotU",
    even more then "PoP" or "NA". However, I would just love as much information
    on the whole property as possible.

    It is just an idea.

    By the way, everyone thank you for posting all of the information that you have seen on this, I appreciate it.

    Take it easy,
    Darren

  23. #98
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    Have any of you prolific emailers asked about the Wonderbread situation?

  24. #99
    Heroic Master of Sleep Lay Ze-Man's Avatar
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    Hey, now THAT is a great question!

  25. #100
    Tri-Solar Lord Oceanwalker's Avatar
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    I hope She-Ra isn't mentioned, that was a bad idea from the get-go.

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