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Thread: The Official "Console War" and Video Game Thread

  1. #1301
    Movie Machine shigsy2003's Avatar
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    Howdy

    I have been waiting for this:

    Tiger Woods PGA Tour 07 Hands-on
    El Tigre has a new favorite club in his bag -- the Wii-mote. First Wii screens and vids.

    Tiger and the Wiimote have something in common, and it's not that whiny little kids push their buttons. They were both born to golf.

    While golf is nothing new to the console, Wii Sports and Super Swing Golf are not going to satisfy true golf fans longing to grip and rip the Wiimote on The Old Course at St. Andrews. Only Tiger Woods PGA Tour 07 can do that.

    At Electronic Arts in Redwood Shores, Calif. on Tuesday, we had a chance to sit down (or is it stand up?) with the first installment of Tiger Wii, currently slated for a March release. While we've played our fair share of golf games with newfangled control schemes (ProStroke Golf and Real World Golf, to name a few), we've always wanted to see how a Tiger game would turn out with a new control setup. As fun as those other games are, where else can you play as John Daly and, bless her heart, Annika Sorenstam?

    Thankfully, Tiger is as fun as ever on the Wii and even more accessible. Want to see for yourself? Click on the media links below for new gameplay footage and screens.

    The swing tracking is very accurate for drives and approach shots, and I found myself interlocking my fingers on the Wiimote, trying to get a traditional golf grip. Here's how the controls break down:

    To swing, hold down B and make a golf swing. It's that simple. Like in other versions of Tiger, if you don't take the club back all the way, you will have less power on your shot. Unlike in other version, power is controlled by the speed of your downswing. The faster you swing, the farther it goes. Of course, if you push your downswing left or right, you're very likely to dig your Nike ball out of the bushes.

    Once the ball is in the air, you induce spin by tapping the D-pad and shaking the Wiimote. The wrist strap is recommended here. To fade or draw the ball, you simply open or close the club face, respectively. Since the club face is really the Wiimote, you rotate it so the A button is facing the screen or facing away from the screen. Then take a natural swing and admire your physics-defying spin.

    Ninety-nine percent of short putts don't reach the hole.

    EA removed power percentages from the Wii and added a practice feature. In the past, you would have had to hit a pitching wedge 85 percent to hit, say, 110 yards. On the Wii, you simply press the minus button and enter practice mode and take a swing. If you rip it with a wedge, the indicator will tell you that you swung 107 percent and the ball would have traveled 135 yards. So you tone it down a little bit until you can hit the 110 yards distance consistently. Then you address the ball and knock it on.

    While weekend golfers will certainly have an advantage making accurate shots, newcomers to the game will have no problem pulling the Wiimote straight back and straight forward to make a nice golf shot. A simple tutorial will walk you through the process if you think Randy Johnson is a pitching wedge. More importantly, Tiger feels much more rewarding on the Wii as you are making the golf swing yourself. You pull your front arm straight back, you bend your knees, you break your wrists at the right moment and you hit the ball. You just can't get that feeling with an analog stick.

    And then you get on the green.

    While Tiger is still being finished, the putting mechanic is still a bit off. The problem is that real putting is such a subtle movement, usually of only a few inches, that the action doesn't put enough force on the Wiimote. If you make a traditional putting stroke, the Wiimote will not recognize it. So no amount of golf training will help on the green. The simplest way we found to put was to break you wrist and rotate the controller so it's pointing away from the screen, then rotate the pointer to face the screen. It's not even close to a putting motion but it gets results. Of course, this could all change in the next six weeks as EA finalizes the game.

    Practice is key on the putting green, now that percentages have been removed. If the distance to the hole is 35 feet, you simply hit the ball 35 feet -- elevation is taken into account into the distance. Then use the perfect putt camera and the grid to judge the break and sink it. With elevation taken out of play, it's less to think about on the Wii, but more difficult to master with the Wiimote.

    While the golf swing and putting mechanic do not make the perfect golf simulator we were hoping for, the gameplay is fun for golfers and grandmas alike. And if you don't like kick-ass motion sensors, you can plug in the Nunchuk for a traditional analog swing.

    In terms of presentation, Tiger Wii is a nice blend of current-generation and next-gen Tiger. From the 360, the Wii borrows True Aiming, in which golfers aim for a landing area instead of a precise point. The better your golfer, the smaller the landing area. Of course, you still have to hit the ball well to hit the landing area.

    Grip and drag the aiming area with the Wiimote.

    There are 35 golfers in the game including Daly, Sorenstam and Vijay Singh, as well as Tiger's trademarked fictional hackers. There are also 18 courses including Aviara, The K Club, Pebble, St. Andrews, Kiawah Island and the Falls, to name a few. Visually, Tiger looks a lot like the PS2 version of this year's title, and it supports 480p widescreen. While we couldn't hear a thing at EA as Def Jam: Icon blared in the background, the commentary of David Feherty and Gary McCord will return, and the Wiimote speaker will also spout sound effects from your swing.

    We only had a chance to play four holes at the event, but we do know that the Tiger Challenge and PGA Tour Season mode featuring the FedEx Cup will comprise the bulk of the single-player experience. Multiplayer foursomes can share a Wiimote and play a variety of mini-games -- some Wii specific -- and traditional modes like stroke play and skins.

    With about six weeks left to work on the game, we hope EA can iron out putting to resemble a true putting stroke. It would be perfect if Tiger matched your movements with the Wiimote, so we'll see if EA can tweak the putting sensitivity. As it stands, Tiger 07 is impressive and is looking to be the golf game we hoped to find on the Wii. Now we just need to find a caddy to carry our Wiimote from hole to hole.


    http://uk.wii.ign.com/articles/756/756124p2.html

    I think I will have to get this

    Chris M
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  2. #1302
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    I was reading about that same game this morning and it sounds great, my only concern is the putting but with almost 2 months left I think EA will figure it out.

    EA really is putting a lot of effort into the Wii, I would have never expected that after they basically refused to do anything with the Gamecube outside Madden. They even have a specific Wii studio that is building games from the ground up rather than porting so there must be something $$$$ to gain which they could not on the Gamecube platform.

    I am more excited for SSX Blur myself, I am hoping they allow you to import you own music tracks since EA's taste in music has never fancied me much (hell Amped on the Xbox allowed you to import music years ago).
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  3. #1303
    The power has returned MOTUfan's Avatar
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    I wonder if there will be any pro wrestling games coming to the Wii

    Brent
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  4. #1304
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOTUfan View Post
    I wonder if there will be any pro wrestling games coming to the Wii

    Brent
    Well since the greatest wrestling game of all time (No Mercy on the N64) uses simple controls that the Wii can use I dont see why a really good wrestling came cant be developed.

    What would you use the remote for? Playing Marvel UA I can see how you could get crowd momentum using the nun chuck and I guess you could taunt with the wiimote but I dont think you could pull off many "moves" the same way Wii Sports is played

    I for one would not mind a next gen version of the old NES Pro Wrestling...go Starman lol
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  5. #1305
    Heroic Warrior IronAvatar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cimmerian View Post
    PS3 die hards keep talking about the processor or the graphics or the blu-ray or whatever, but right now it's kind of a cry in the dark because at this point right now the majority doesn't even care anymore. it's like the backlash against the hollywood special effects blockbusters - We've SEEN how good effects can look, but if you don't give us a good movie or a fun movie to go along with those effects your number 1 opening weekend will drop off REALLY fast
    Actually, you could say that opposite is true.

    All we see from the extremely anti-sony camp is that the Cell is too complicated or not as powerfull as people think (make up yer minds!), that blu-ray is crap and doesn't serve a purpose (keeping in mind that Resistance needed 16Gb's of disc space) and how nobody wants flashy graphics and that's all the PS3 is about.

    The average consumer doesn't care about that crap though, and Nintendo really have pulled off something of a success with the Wii. A friend has one, which I got to play on Tuesday evening and...hate me if you want, but what's all the hype about?

    Twighlight Princess is an absolutely AWFUL game, and I was really looking forward to it! It feels like it's been severely rushed and just didn't grab me like Windwaker did.

    I didn't enjoy playing Wii Sports or Red Steel either. The feedback/motion from the wiimote just seemed really clunky and didn't respond to acceleration properly (but that's probably just the games and not the hardware). Honestly guys, I REALLY tried to give the thing a fair go again, even with my issues with the hardware and even after messing about with the wii controller a few months ago on a GC dev-kit.

    I just hope that they don't screw up Pilotwings.
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  6. #1306
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronAvatar View Post
    I didn't enjoy playing Wii Sports or Red Steel either. The feedback/motion from the wiimote just seemed really clunky and didn't respond to acceleration properly (but that's probably just the games and not the hardware). Honestly guys, I REALLY tried to give the thing a fair go again, even with my issues with the hardware and even after messing about with the wii controller a few months ago on a GC dev-kit.

    I just hope that they don't screw up Pilotwings.
    Did your friend change the sensitivity settings and configure the remote? I know I felt the same way initially but then I reconfigured everything and it made a huge difference...much more responsive

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I tend to agree with you somewhat on Zelda, I still think its a great game and cant wait to finish it but I am not getting into it as much as Windwaker

    I will note that a lot of us who are married seem to be enjoying it more because (I can safely say I think) for the first time our wives/girlfriends actually want to play the system. My wife wants to play Wii more than I do and that says something for somebody whose last care about a console was the NES and Genesis

    Us tech geeks can have our ****ing contests all we want but it seems that Nintendo finally found a way to get a lot of women excited about video games
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  7. #1307
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronAvatar View Post
    Actually, you could say that opposite is true.
    technically anyone can say anything they feel like saying and call it true too. I can stand here and tell you Liver and onions is the worst food in the world, but someone in the world will tell me otherwise. now if the majority that weigh in agree with me then we get a sense of how most of the food consuming public feels, still doesn't make liver and onions technically the worst food inthe world BUT it does make it unpopular.
    All we see from the extremely anti-sony camp is that the Cell is too complicated or not as powerfull as people think (make up yer minds!), that blu-ray is crap and doesn't serve a purpose (keeping in mind that Resistance needed 16Gb's of disc space) and how nobody wants flashy graphics and that's all the PS3 is about.
    the thing is that those big numbers and such is what Sony and it's biggest supporters were touting, the bottom line is if you don't enjoy a game/system then the number don't matter at all. I LOVE great graphics, but if the game sucks then it doesn't matter. PS1 example Toshinden was at the time a GREAT looking game, but it REALLY did stink. anyway My friend who has a PS3 and says he loves it absolutely HATED resistance fall of man even though right now that is THE game to rally behind for the PS3 which leads me back to my liver and onions argument and to your following experience...
    A friend has one (Wii), which I got to play on Tuesday evening and...hate me if you want, but what's all the hype about?

    Twighlight Princess is an absolutely AWFUL game, and I was really looking forward to it! It feels like it's been severely rushed and just didn't grab me like Windwaker did.

    I didn't enjoy playing Wii Sports or Red Steel either. The feedback/motion from the wiimote just seemed really clunky and didn't respond to acceleration properly (but that's probably just the games and not the hardware). Honestly guys, I REALLY tried to give the thing a fair go again, even with my issues with the hardware and even after messing about with the wii controller a few months ago on a GC dev-kit.

    I just hope that they don't screw up Pilotwings.
    Zelda was probably somewhat rushed, it was GC developed, a true Wii game is in the works now so it will probably feel better than TP.
    If it didn't click with you then the system isn't for you and though it's inexpensive would be a big waste of money for yout o purchase. as of now though the general public at large disagrees and loves the Wii. non gamers and gamers alike have been raving about it, but there is nothing that will satisfy 100% of the time. plain and simple.

    The average consumer doesn't care about that crap though, and Nintendo really have pulled off something of a success with the Wii.
    because the average consumer is just like the average movie goer IMO - for video games they want to be able to play without having to learn entire instruction manuals. video games as of late have become somewhat elitist, great graphics and elaborate control schemes. this puts off the average consumer. they want to jump in and be able to play it without having to constantly ask what's this button etc. the Wii has so far been a success because their plan and naming worked Wii - took the elite out of the equation and made it welcoming to those who wrote off video gaming long ago.

    sorry i rearranged a bit of your post as I typed I saw I wanted to add here and there and i didn't want to retype what I already did so it was easier to just cut and paste this in a different spot.
    Last edited by The Cimmerian; January 18, 2007 at 04:28pm.

  8. #1308
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronAvatar View Post
    Twighlight Princess is an absolutely AWFUL game, and I was really looking forward to it! It feels like it's been severely rushed and just didn't grab me like Windwaker did.
    .
    What did you not like about it? I was the complete opposite. I'm a huge fan of the zelda series, but I hated the windwaker. I spent countless hours sailing from one point to another. I would start sailing, fix food and come back and still be sailing. Even though I hate the way the link looked in the windwaker, I think the shaded cell graphics were better than the engine that they used for the Wii. As fun as the Wii is, I'm still turned off by the lack of graphics for the "next gen" console.

    How much of the game did you play? When I started playing it, it seemed boring and slow but I think they made it that way to get you used to the remote/controls. By the time I played the first dungeon I was very impressed with the game. The way they incorporated link being a wolf and some of the escort/chase missions were some of the funnest I've ever done. Don't get me wrong, if you don't like it, you don't like it...I'm just wondering why?
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  9. #1309
    He-Man's PR: No Comment hemanrep's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronAvatar View Post
    Twighlight Princess is an absolutely AWFUL game, and I was really looking forward to it! It feels like it's been severely rushed and just didn't grab me like Windwaker did.
    Now you've made a REALLY bold statement and you have to back your opinion up.

    For a game that has been in development for over 3 years, the game feels severely rushed? See you didn't just say rushed...you put an adjective in front of the word that already seems a bit extreme.

    Although if you meant the CONTROLS were rushed, then I might understand where you are coming from, but you just said the game itself, which I will severely object to.

    You want to know a game that was rushed? Wind Waker. 5 dungeons and an annoying find the Triforce pieces quest with a vast ocean with nothing to do...now that is what I would call rush -- and Nintendo admitted it.

    Twilight Princess? Not so much. With all the things you can do in the game I can somewhat see the last two dungeons being dropped in just so it can top Ocarina of Time's 7 dungeons, but the gameplay, the story, the graphics (it's for the GC, just remember that when you argue), and the overall presentation was amazing.

    I'm assuming you played at LEAST 10 hours of the game when you say it's AWFUL because the first 2-4 hours the player is stuck in one area trying to learn everything.

    Now if you've completed the game and you still think it's awful and rushed, then great...I can see your opinion from a different perspective...but I know that most people who have negative things to say about TP usually only played 1 or 2 hours at the most.

    TP IMO, doesn't beat Ocarina of Time, but it's pretty close. TP is FAR from being an awful game, and the reason I'm making a big deal out of it is simply for the fact that it's a bold statement to make.

  10. #1310
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    Does anyone get gameinformer magazine? I get it free because I got the discount card at EB Games, anyway it came in today and they talked alot about Wii vs. PS3, and why people prefer each, and stuff of that sort. Really too much for me to type, but you might be able to find some of it at gameinformer.com, or if you get a chance, pick up the magazine and take a look. There is an interview with Jack Tretton, President and CEO of Sony Computer Entertainment of America which was pretty interesting. They also did a scorecard of looks and design/materials used (basically) PS3 and Xbox both got a 7/10 and the Wii with it's simplistic, yet iPODish design got 8/10. From interviews with people who own a Wii, a PS3 and a Wii/PS3 combo, there were mixed reviews to different questions. Some would say that the Wii was much better to play and the PS3 was an overpriced dvd player, others said it depended on what you wanted to play (nintendo party "fun" games or hardcore FPS games) Basically what I, and my room mate got from reading the magazine, is that people prefer the Wii, and sony has screwed themselves.

    What I don't understand is that the battle now seems to be between the Wii and PS3 and people are forgetting about the xbox. I feel like I'm voting independent here because I really like the xbox. (Don't blast me, I own a Wii, and I like it, I just prefer my xbox...keep that in mind). I want to find a trustworthy source that owns both a xbox and a ps3, who has played them both extensivly and see what they say about it.
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  11. #1311
    All you need is Spidey's Avatar
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    Gotta admit that I didn't really believe the ps3 deal where someone mentioned them collecting dust on the shelves! Today I saw them by myself at target!

    And no wiis


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  12. #1312
    Tri-Solar Lord Oceanwalker's Avatar
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    The big thing to remember is that until the PS3 expands its library (see Fall 2007), we really wont have a real good idea of what to expect. Right now, the PS3 is wait and see. Nintendo has always been the party platform tho'.

    And Spidey, that's 2 machines, probably 20gbs. We already know you can find a PS3 and that the Wii is incognito.

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    Even on my college myspace homepage messageboard....geeze that's a mouthful, people are advertising to sell their PS3s new in the box like crazy and apparently can't. I have a feeling that they either A) maxed out their credit cards before christmas break and tried to sell it for 2.5x as much to make money and couldn't and are now trying to break even or B) They got one for christmas from their parents and they just want the cash.
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  14. #1314
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeologyMule View Post
    Even on my college myspace homepage messageboard....geeze that's a mouthful, people are advertising to sell their PS3s new in the box like crazy and apparently can't. I have a feeling that they either A) maxed out their credit cards before christmas break and tried to sell it for 2.5x as much to make money and couldn't and are now trying to break even or B) They got one for christmas from their parents and they just want the cash.
    Alot of it from people I have heard from has to do with stores only giving store credit if they used cash, I would have never bought a PS3 to resell with cash for that very reason.

    I saw a few tonight but thats nothing new here, its the library of games I think. For the price its too bad the PS3 did not offer some pack in like the Wii did (outside Ricky Bobby lol), I think that might have helped move some more units as well.

    I was telling my wife tonight if Walmart still had layaway I would have probably bought one since I would have had 90- days to pay it off rather than spend the $$$ upfront, you can get a decent 32" HDTV for that price these days (LCD anyway, not plasma)
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    Hakujin discosupafly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spidey View Post
    Gotta admit that I didn't really believe the ps3 deal where someone mentioned them collecting dust on the shelves! Today I saw them by myself at target!

    And no wiis
    Yeah, same old story here too. Found another shop. Found another 3x 20GB models and 2x 60GB models.

    ... And no Wii (or DS)

  16. #1316
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeologyMule View Post
    Some would say that the Wii was much better to play and the PS3 was an overpriced dvd player, others said it depended on what you wanted to play (nintendo party "fun" games or hardcore FPS games)
    Can someone explain to me how the hell First Person Shooters became the end all-be all of what defines a 'hardcore' gamer? Who deemed this to be superior to all other forms and genres of gaming?

    This, in no way, is an attack against you, GeologyMule. You were just refering to the article that you read

    But it's just that this is the stereotype that I've seen developing more and more and more and more and more.

    Anytime I hear about casual gamers and hardcore gamers being compared, it seems like at least 99% of the time they associate hardcore gamers with First Person Shooters. I don't get it.

    I'm not trying to knock those kinds of games, but they are just one single type of game amongst many.


    For me, they are okay. I've played a few. Goldeneye on N64 was cool back in the day. I have both Halo games for Xbox, though I haven't played them very thouroughly.

    As for games like the Call of Duty series and other war games... I'm sure they are fine games and all.
    But for me, back when I was in school, history and learning about wars was always one of the most boring subjects to me. I studied and did well in it as I did most of my classes in the interest of passing, but I really hated the subject (and I mean no disrespect for anyone who fought in those wars and I appreciate what they did for our country... I just found reading about it to be very boring). So, given my lack of interest in the subject matter, I really have no desire at all to play first person shooter games based on said subject matter. (I'm also not much of a sports fan, so sports video games generally hold little interest for me as well).

    The thing is that I consider myself to be a pretty hardcore gamer. Granted, I'm sure that there are others out there who could be considered more hardcore (and Not because they may play FPS games). But, I have well over a dozen systems from over the years and many games to go with them. Video gaming has been one of my main interests and hobbies for pretty much most of my life.

    So, while I know it's not directly a knock against me, personally, when I keep hearing things like FPS games being associated with hardcore gamers, I kind of get a little insulted, since I feel like my gaming interest is being belittled based on my lack of interest in one particular genre of gaming.

    It's just stupid, IMO.

    What I don't understand is that the battle now seems to be between the Wii and PS3 and people are forgetting about the xbox. I feel like I'm voting independent here because I really like the xbox. (Don't blast me, I own a Wii, and I like it, I just prefer my xbox...keep that in mind). I want to find a trustworthy source that owns both a xbox and a ps3, who has played them both extensivly and see what they say about it.
    I think the reason why PS3 and Wii are getting so much attention is becuase both just came out within the last few months, while Xbox 360 has been out for well over a year.

    They are the new kids on the block (and I don't mean the band), so they are the ones that are the ones people want to know more about (since we already know a lot about the 360).

    Plus, with the Wii selling through the roof (which a Nintendo console system hasn't done in quite sometime), and with PS3 not selling quite as well as expected (after about a decade of the PS systems being #1), it's just been big news to a lot of people.


    Xbox 360 is still doing very well. If I am not mistaken, it actually sold more units this past Holiday season than the Wii did (though, to be fair, the 360 has been out for over a year and had more than enough stock to meet the demand, while every single Wii completely sold out.... if more Wii's had been available, that might have panned out differently).

    I personally have the 360 and the Wii and I am happy with that combination. I think it's a great combo to have, and the total cost of buying both systems with diverse gaming experiences (thus giving the user more variety) is only $50 more than the cost of the PS3. Honestly, I have no major plans to get a PS3 until when/if they release something exclusive to it that I DEPERATELY want (the only game that I can predict doing that would be Kingdom Hearts 3... but if PS3 sales continue to be lack luster compared to the competition, then that game may not end up staying PS exclusive anyway in the interest of generating more sales).

    So, the 360 is still out there, it's got a huge following, and is doing well. But there was nothing really surprising about how it is doing that people didn't already pretty much expect, so it's not the talk of the town as a result.
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  17. #1317
    Etherian 626 gnewton34's Avatar
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    Did you all see the guy who played Wii Sports for 30 minutes every day for six weeks and lost 2% of his body fat? Nintendo so needs to market some fitness games for the Wii. That would help kids get exercise and be another great selling point for lots of other people as well.
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  18. #1318
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gnewton34 View Post
    Did you all see the guy who played Wii Sports for 30 minutes every day for six weeks and lost 2% of his body fat? Nintendo so needs to market some fitness games for the Wii. That would help kids get exercise and be another great selling point for lots of other people as well.
    I thought the exact same thing after we played it for 1hr when we got it, Nintendo could have had the same success marketing their DDR game as my wife lost 15lbs using that for 1hr a night 3 nights a week the last 2 months!

    Can someone explain to me how the hell First Person Shooters became the end all-be all of what defines a 'hardcore' gamer? Who deemed this to be superior to all other forms and genres of gaming?
    I would like to know this as well, I was having a conversation with my wife about games before we got the Wii and she made the comment "I dont like the shooting games so I dont want a 360 or PS3" and I felt the same way "When did FPS become the definition of next-gen?" but there it is backed up by Gears of War for the 360, Halo for the Xbox, and Resistance Fall of Man for the PS3.
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  19. #1319
    Supreme Fudge Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markatisu View Post
    I would like to know this as well, I was having a conversation with my wife about games before we got the Wii and she made the comment "I dont like the shooting games so I dont want a 360 or PS3" and I felt the same way "When did FPS become the definition of next-gen?" but there it is backed up by Gears of War for the 360, Halo for the Xbox, and Resistance Fall of Man for the PS3.
    Well, it is backed up in the sense that those are popular games and I am not denying their popularity.

    However, there are plenty of other popular games that are not shooter games, so I don't get why this one type of game suddenly defines hardcore vs. casual.
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  20. #1320
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    Well, it is backed up in the sense that those are popular games and I am not denying their popularity.

    However, there are plenty of other popular games that are not shooter games, so I don't get why this one type of game suddenly defines hardcore vs. casual.
    I agree, I was just merely stating that the press seems to get behind that sterotype as well since if you were to do word association for games most times you would get those games listed.

    Its kind of like how you say Nintendo and you think either Gameboy or Mario/Zelda and how the Gamecube was considered "Kiddie" even though it was the one that finally did the Resident Evil saga justice with Resident Evil 0, 1 and 4

    I remember having a discussion with one of my friends a few years back over the "lack of mature content" on the Gamecube and he kept pointing to the fact that the GC did not have Halo, Killzone, Doom or Half Life or as he put it any "violent" games" in which he was obviously referring to the FPS.
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  21. #1321
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    ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH!!!!

    Toys r us, best buy AND future shop all got Wii's in today - everytime I got to a store they told me they just sold out! ARGH!!!

  22. #1322
    Super Powered Mod! markatisu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cimmerian View Post
    ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH!!!!

    Toys r us, best buy AND future shop all got Wii's in today - everytime I got to a store they told me they just sold out! ARGH!!!
    I have learned in my hunt that "just sold out" means the employees had them in the back to sell on ebay or keep for themselves I actually confirmed this at our 2 local Toys R Us when one guy I know got one and they had 3 and I walked in right after him (The store was DEAD) and they had "sold out" in under 1min with nobody around

    But I have been hearing this weekend and next week the Wii's will be in somewhat larger availability so keep plugging away if you want one!
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  23. #1323
    Heroic Warrior
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    Quote Originally Posted by gnewton34 View Post
    Did you all see the guy who played Wii Sports for 30 minutes every day for six weeks and lost 2% of his body fat? Nintendo so needs to market some fitness games for the Wii. That would help kids get exercise and be another great selling point for lots of other people as well.
    that's another thing i really like about the Wii - not sure if they intended this or not but it is a GREAT way to combat childhood obesity and nintendo would be wise to get some health experts and such in their camp to promote these benefits. (it is a good way to get the parents to buy the system for themselves as well)

    Quote Originally Posted by markatisu View Post
    I have learned in my hunt that "just sold out" means the employees had them in the back to sell on ebay or keep for themselves I actually confirmed this at our 2 local Toys R Us when one guy I know got one and they had 3 and I walked in right after him (The store was DEAD) and they had "sold out" in under 1min with nobody around

    But I have been hearing this weekend and next week the Wii's will be in somewhat larger availability so keep plugging away if you want one!
    the thing is I SAW the wii's behind the counter and there was a big lineup but everyone in the line had a ticket (except me) so I asked if you need a ticket they said yes I asked if they had more tickets they said no we sold them all. that's what stung the most - i SAW the systems!!! I saw the people leaving the store with them - heart breaking!!

    I'll try next week again! keeping my head up!! haha
    Last edited by The Cimmerian; January 20, 2007 at 11:18am.

  24. #1324
    Etherian 626 gnewton34's Avatar
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    I personally hate FPS games. They bore me to death. The only shooting game that I ever loved was Duck Hunt They can be okay if you're playing with some friends but they still get boring to me after a while. I much prefer RPG's like Kingdom Hearts that have great, engrossing stories. I guess I prefer having to think about a storyline rather than just blasting stuff
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  25. #1325
    Drinking Innocence TheDeviot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    Can someone explain to me how the hell First Person Shooters became the end all-be all of what defines a 'hardcore' gamer? Who deemed this to be superior to all other forms and genres of gaming?



    But it's just that this is the stereotype that I've seen developing more and more and more and more and more.

    Anytime I hear about casual gamers and hardcore gamers being compared, it seems like at least 99% of the time they associate hardcore gamers with First Person Shooters. I don't get it.
    FPS gaming got the "Hardcore" title because a number of them have either been very competitive. So competitive in fact that novices get turned off when they can't frag anybody within 3 minutes, then leave the server. This has happened in Tribes, Unreal Tournament 2004, Quake II MP, Quake III, Painkiller, on the PC side, with Console games like Halo, and Socom giving similar scenarios.
    To make it more complex, Tactical Shooters like Rainbow Six, Ghost Recon, Battlefield, and the like were also once considered the hardcore playground. It was a different experience, You had to be good because there was no armor, and one hit from a terrorist meant certain doom. Casual gamers wanting a FPS to build off of started playing a lot of the well known Counterstrike, which became the most popular in the subgenre, because while not as realistic as the first three r6 games, still bridged the gap between tactical shooter, and competitive run, and gunnery. In fact BF1942, the Onslaught mode in UT2k4, and the upcoming Quake Wars are all examples of answers to that.
    Also helping the casual gamer is the fact that some games started catering to them more, and the eat sleep breathe gamer less. Look at all of the online forums for R6 vegas, and GRAW, and you'll see people griping that these newer interations have been "nerfed", and it's actually turning some of the hardcore away from these titles. Which is really a mistake in some cases, as some retain their fun. As a longtime fan of the Unreal Tournament series I can tell you there are people who consider themselves hardcore, who are turned off by the idea that double jumping is gone, and the acrobatic clay pigeon movement has been toned down according to epic.
    All of that said though The FPS is still considered by many average gamers to be "Too difficult" or "Too complicated" to get into. Whether managing controls like going prone, picking the right guns for the right map, or figuring out how to call an airstrike in a tactical game, or dying twenty seven times in a fragfest without squeezing off a round, they can't get into it.
    It's not like the other genres don't suffer from the same learning curves however. A casual gamer who will only play if they can "Get it right away" may be slightly more inclined to play an RPG, but when they get in front off all of that micromanagement in WoW, EQII, COH, or UO their heads will spin.
    What about Fighting? Fighting games are one of the most competitive "Hardcore" genres around. Street Fighter, Tekken, Virtua Fighter, DOA, and Soul Calibur are still around, but do you see a lot of average people playing them?

    Street fighting aside though, I think the hardcore vs average player debate can't be boiled down to genres. I agree with you in that pigeonholing "FPS, Fighters, and MMO's" are Hardcore, "Sports, Platformers, Adventure games" are for the average dude is just stupid.

    The reason people think that way is there's a sterotype that says people who have games as their primary hobby have no problem learning these complex control schemes in minutes, and average players only want simple fare.
    This again is stupid. Because here one is saying if you eat sleep breathe games you're never going to play a simpler game. Which just isn't true.

    But I will say the industry does have a point in saying that there is a sector of casual games. I just don't think it's all middle aged office workers, and girlfriends playing them. Casual games appeal to everyone cause anyone can get into it, which is why the Wii is doing well, and vendors like WildTangent keep bringing up impressive numbers to suits by offering clones of old school, games, and puzzle games like Bookworm.

    And speaking of old school, shouldn't the old schooler really get the hardcore title? In other creative hobbies we do that. Music fans who have been around the longest or have obscure, and large collection get that title at trade shows, We hear Hardcore sports fan. It really just sounds cooler than devoted. And who more devoted than the guy who started with pong, and never stopped playing?
    Last edited by TheDeviot; January 20, 2007 at 01:02pm.
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