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Thread: MOTUC Bios & Canon Discussion (updated as bios become available)

  1. #2176
    Color'licious! JVS3's Avatar
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    Thanks to facet for posting those bio images earlier. Here are some clearer images of the bios on the back of the MOTUC Ultimate Editions.









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  2. #2177
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    These were some interesting reads.

    And with the classics bios I have more questions than answers.



  3. #2178
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    Why is Preternia He-Ro now an ancestor of He-Man? Did Super & forget that Classics bios made them "not related"?

  4. #2179
    Lord of the Patch baronterror's Avatar
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    I love them. Not only are they fun, and great, but they further the story into a new era. I love that.

    Also they explain that the new "Ultimate" figures are not just re-paint re-releases but actual interpretations of characters after the common era. That does it's job of making me really want them now.

    It's "Ressurection" Skeletor, "Reborn" He-Man, "Council of Elders" Teela, "Emo" Faker (or "Soul Searching" Faker), and "Hyperspace" Ramman.

    I love a post Son of He-Man continuity. It's finally really growing this epic. Another era returning to the old along with the new...it's really cool.

  5. #2180
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    I really enjoyed these new bio's, I love the return to the status quo.

  6. #2181
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    Quote Originally Posted by grenadaspice View Post
    Why is Preternia He-Ro now an ancestor of He-Man? Did Super & forget that Classics bios made them "not related"?
    Presumably because of He-Ra, the child of He-Ro's son and Grayskull's daughter.

  7. #2182
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    I wonder what happens to Dare now? He-Man is back in his prime.

    And who else was resurrected as part of the Awakening?

    I'm glad that there was a return to the normal status quo. I've always been apart of the "He-Man should have continuing adventures in his prime" crowd, just like he never went away. He-Man could have new changes, new allies, new enemies, new vehicles, new playsets, new locations, etc., but I was against aging characters.

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  8. #2183
    Heroic Warrior SonOfHeMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by punisher View Post
    I really enjoyed these new bio's, I love the return to the status quo.
    The return to the status quo kind of feels like lazy writing/pandering to me. I'd rather explore the uncertain future than have everything go back to the way it was like in some sort of sitcom. It kind of cheapens everything that came before.

  9. #2184
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonOfHeMan View Post
    The return to the status quo kind of feels like lazy writing/pandering to me. I'd rather explore the uncertain future than have everything go back to the way it was like in some sort of sitcom. It kind of cheapens everything that came before.
    QFT. With these Bios, they transformed Masters Of The Universe Classics Canon into The Simpsons. It doesn't matter anything that happens or happened, next day it will be all the same. Boring :/

  10. #2185
    Heroic Warrior gbagok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    I wonder what happens to Dare now? He-Man is back in his prime.
    Ha, maybe Dare will bleach his hair and sport the Lou Scheimer He-Ro bible look (matches Kay-La's look too). Then he might take up extreme sports and reckless behavior, forcing He-Dad to have a serious conversation with him about life choices where it comes out that stabbing a Trollan in the back did some lasting psychological damage to the lad.

    On a more serious note, he did learn magic and he's also part of the Sorceress's lineage, so he's not useless without the Sword of He.
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  11. #2186
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbagok View Post
    Ha, maybe Dare will bleach his hair and sport the Lou Scheimer He-Ro bible look (matches Kay-La's look too). Then he might take up extreme sports and reckless behavior, forcing He-Dad to have a serious conversation with him about life choices where it comes out that stabbing a Trollan in the back did some lasting psychological damage to the lad.

    On a more serious note, he did learn magic and he's also part of the Sorceress's lineage, so he's not useless without the Sword of He.

  12. #2187
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonOfHeMan View Post
    The return to the status quo kind of feels like lazy writing/pandering to me. I'd rather explore the uncertain future than have everything go back to the way it was like in some sort of sitcom. It kind of cheapens everything that came before.
    I think it is a return to what the fans were yearning for plus more. I dont think it is a return to status quo, since there are now WAY more characters in the timeline to interact with and a change in the titles and responsibilities of the main characters. There is now new villains, more worlds involved, the return of main villains, more technology, and crossovers. If someone cant think up new stories in a rich environment like that.....
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  13. #2188
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbagok View Post
    Ha, maybe Dare will bleach his hair and sport the Lou Scheimer He-Ro bible look (matches Kay-La's look too). Then he might take up extreme sports and reckless behavior, forcing He-Dad to have a serious conversation with him about life choices where it comes out that stabbing a Trollan in the back did some lasting psychological damage to the lad.


    Quote Originally Posted by gbagok
    On a more serious note, he did learn magic and he's also part of the Sorceress's lineage, so he's not useless without the Sword of He.
    Agreed, 100%. Just because He-Man's youth was restored, that doesn't mean Dare is useless or irrelevant. As you pointed out, he's a powerful mage with strong ties to Grayskull.
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  14. #2189
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    Unlike the art-pieces on their fronts, about which I have only positive things to say, I have a number of critical thoughts about the bios, but I'll lead with the things I like best about them:

    (1) Attempting to undo or sidestep the weirdness of the end of the mini-comics --

    I don't think anyone likes it when Castle Grayskull is blown up (Maybe I'm wrong?) -- Grayskull is iconic in ways that other things aren't (and maybe that's why it's happened a few times, now -- it's a big, provocative target). Eternos Palace, the Hall of Wisdom, maybe even Eternia Towers, the city of Avion, and so on, can be wrecked and either rebuilt or left barren, but leaving Grayskull in ruins and so many main characters dead just didn't sit well with me or lots of others, so I applaud the decision to find a way to bring these icons back into the story (and/or "hit the reset button"). I have gripes with the way it was done, but those are below.

    (2) Exploring the sources of characters' powers and personality --

    Now, I may have made different choices, but I like what's going on here with the harmonization of so many canons to inform a fusion of both the "powers of the ancestors" and "powers of creation" in the He-man, which fits with the barbarian/sword&sorcery vibe as well as the cosmic vibe as well. The top half of Skeletor's bio also gives us some interesting insights (not news to many, but still nice to see them in focus) into his personality and his affinity for his evil warriors. Teela's as well. Exploring Ram Man's weaknessnesses with the callbacks to the minicomics and the MYP episode were great, and trying to explain why Faker is blue and how that might be useful (or not) were also, I think, good choices.

    Some of the development choices in the continuation below the formal bio section were interesting as well -- Saryn as Skeletor's mother, &c. -- how long-lived *are* the gar, anyway!?

    (3) Scrollos. Great idea to use Scrollos, a character that I've grown super fond of since trying to assemble a complete collection of the London Editions' MotU & She-Ra comics. Love seeing that signature at the bottom, it gives these bios a little "something extra." I may have preferred more citation of the "Secret Files," but I'll bracket that as my own personal preference. I'm further excited because it might fuel desire for a Scrollos figure, which would be a great addition to the line, especially for fans of the UK comics.

    ***
    Now the critique:

    I'm sensitive to the fact that these bios were in some part dream projects for folks who really love MotU, so I want to say that this comes only from a place of hoping things are better in the future, and I hope that in the spirit of professionalism, these critiques are received in the fraternal spirit in which they're being offered -- I (and many others) have a number of (I think legitimate) gripes with Super 7 over how the Ultimates turned out, but on the whole, I think they've still turned out a good product and I'm still looking forward to seeing how they do in the future.

    That said, I think these bios (as they are written) suffer from two categories of problems, the first being perhaps the most subjective, and it has to do with the employment of an overused plot device - the Cosmic Retcon (here, the ReAwakening). Some folks don't mind this at all, and just accept it, like so many other tropes we've come to accept. Others might sympathize with my explanation of why I don't like it, so I've put more details in the 'spoilers' tag.

     
    (1) Attempting to continue the Classics Canon in this way to "fix" what folks didn't like about the ending to SN's minicomics canon has let us to the "ReAwakening," which, as others have said, is trite. More than trite, this kind of resurrection has become a trope. Also as others have mentioned, if you *liked* the previous continuity, this makes certain things seem nearly pointless, another trope (Shoot the Shaggy Dog). (see also: crisis on infinite earths, flashpoint, etc.) If you *did not like* the previous continuity, this doesn't step far enough away from it, because it begins *within* that continuity and undoes its effects within the same storyline.

    While on the one hand, this might be seen as a compromise (new characters remain in the story while older / dead characters return), I would have preferred (because I think it an objectively better solution) a simple reboot for the Ultimates, taking account of the previous classics canon only as one of many pre-existing canonical iterations of MotU, alongside the DC comics, the Marvel comics, the filmation show, the minicomics, the New Adventures, and so on, and so forth. My contention would be that this would respect the new characters existing and being able to be incorporated as part of (a version of) the story, but not fall into "shooting the shaggy dog," the second trope I linked above.

    Disclaimer here: I actually liked a lot of what SN did with trying to work out every previously existing series into a Grand Narrative... some of his solutions I found really imaginative and I felt they added to the "mythology" in some really interesting ways. I essentially disliked what he was doing with mini-comics issues 5-8 and most of his attempts at real names, but onto...


    The second category is just about the technical craft of writing, and that's what I hope can be improved for future bios. These may not bother everyone; some folks might see this critique as nit-picking, but I know that others have expressed similar sentiments, and I wanted to say, "you're not crazy, I agree, and here's why," and so I give examples in the spoilers tag. In sum, I think the bio cards are trying to cover too much time and too many characters for the space allotted them, which leads to the writing feeling cramped and rushed.

     

    (2a) The name-dropping. Now, I understand certain people get super giddy over this and really love it -- I understand the glee Easter Eggs and teasers inspire (especially when Axel and Simon Soltau are putting them in their paintings, or when they show up in movies or in comic panels). In this format, however, they're wasted words, a litany serving no purpose but fan service. Exempli gratia, in He-man's bio, the mentions of Andra, the Riders of Morc, etc. -- the names show up in a sentence that basically says, "He-man met new allies and new adversaries," because the characters mentioned by name never appear again in the bio or otherwise impact the story. This kind of thing compounds the problem of:

    (2b) Pacing. This is a complaint I have about SN's mini-comics as well: it feels like there are panels missing; key details describing motivations, events, et cetera, that provide the connective tissue for storytelling are absent. These bio cards at points read more like a list of things that happened, "In the morning, He-man ate a balanced breakfast. Later, he made some friends and met some people who didn't like him. When his Uncle Keldor came over, everyone agreed to restore Grayskull." This is admittedly a caricature, but I hope it conveys the 'sense' of what I'm trying to point to -- we're covering a lot of ground from sentence to sentence, such that the sentences feel surprising and/or disconnected from one another.

    Acknowledging that "we have only so many pages," or "only so much space," to tell a story is fine, but don't bite off more than you can chew given the constraints of the medium or project. Sometimes that might mean leaving out certain aspects of the story you wanted to include (and this can be excruciating!), or telling the rest in a later installment.

    (2c) Awkward Writing. For example (and I'll just use one example here) in the phrase "Teela concurred with this assertion, as did the Spirit of He-Ro..." we have a two-fold problem, the first being the cumbersome "concurred with this assertion," which while elevated, does not in this case make for good story prose. "Teela agreed," might suffice, or we might rewrite the entire thing to emphasize the wisdom or spiritual insight that Teela possesses, and move to "Teela confirmed Keldor's warning." Something like that. The second problem is the sudden shock at the "Spirit of He-Ro" just showing up mid-sentence without first being sought or having been otherwise brought in as a character that was participating in this particular story. I imagine this spectral He-Ro popping in next to Teela like he was just off-panel saying, "Oh yeah, these guys are totally right, also, here's who I am and why I'm important to you guys... later!"

    Again, I think all of these things arise from the problem of trying to cover too much plot with too many characters and with too limited a format.



    Anyway, those are my two cents.

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  15. #2190
    Color'licious! JVS3's Avatar
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    As far the tone or context of a story is concerned, that's always subjective. But, in terms of structure of the MOTUC bios...

    Quote Originally Posted by Streamside View Post
    Again, I think all of these things arise from the problem of trying to cover too much plot with too many characters and with too limited a format.
    That's akin to disliking how the grass is green (speaking in generalities here).


    The Classics bios have always faced the challenge of fitting a lot of info into a finite space. And they've always dropped extra names as trademark refreshes. We should all be familiar with that by now, and long since come to terms with it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JVS3 View Post
    That's akin to disliking how the grass is green (speaking in generalities here).


    The Classics bios have always faced the challenge of fitting a lot of info into a finite space. And they've always dropped extra names as trademark refreshes. We should all be familiar with that by now, and long since come to terms with it.


    Ha! Well, sure, but I was speaking relative to our format, here... one would not expect the same depth from a comic that one gets in a novel. I'm not criticizing the format as such, nor the inclusion of characters for the sake of refreshing their trademarks. We want the trademarks refreshed so we don't end up with another Strong-Or or Battle-Fist situation!


  17. #2192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Streamside View Post
    We want the trademarks refreshed so we don't end up with another Strong-Or or Battle-Fist situation!

    I'm really hoping the days of Battle Fist are behind us.
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  18. #2193
    master of accessories facet's Avatar
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    lord grasp.jpg
    mc trapjaw.jpg
    plasmar.jpg
    prince adam.jpg
    stratos.jpg
    terror roar.jpg

    Alot of cool information here, Looks like Slamurai is the white ninjas name, Lord grasp is on par with Lady slither and king hiss, with his warriors ( my educated guess being Vypor, Streatch Nekk and Terr-roar, Skeletor saved Khan with his magic, they retell Trapjaws minicomic story as plot , but not quite sure where it falls in line with the the timeline, as it cant happen after the 2nd UBG (Skeletor left for the stars shortly after) yet Trapjaw still looked blue in the 2nd UBG so not sure where this can take place, prince adams bio is the weakess of them all not too much new information there, but fitting in the timeline as his early years as prince. Stratos bio follows the story of his origins the 200x comic of him discovering the city of avion and the egg of avion, i like how they threw his cosuins name in there, although they never mention his brief alliance with skeletor from the "king of castle grayskull" mini comic, but i like the mention of the tycons and all that. Terr-roar has an intreasting bio i like how they explained him as it make alot of sense, especially for this character. And its cool the the 88' good guys trio is the one that went help find his weekness. Lord Grasps is a great Bio, another powerful Lt of the Unnamed One, conspiring with Horde Prime, with his own faction on snake warriors, absolutley love this story arc, this is what i was hoping for he whole time, with the bios, so glad they used this opportunity to go this route. Plasmar is another cool bio, placing him as an ally of king heman and clamp champ, hunter of snakemen. Im glad they went with the SLL armor and explained his powers came from the gem of talmedge, very cool twist on things and made totally possible just by choosing the powers that be to make his accessories translucent red. Also good way of expalining the snake legs ( as tropheys of his hunts). Is the Xarkoran from some media somewhere im not familar with it.
    Last edited by facet; September 9, 2017 at 12:32pm.

  19. #2194
    Heroic Warrior gbagok's Avatar
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    Thanks for posting those, Facet! So cool to have new bios!

    RE Trap Jaw, is he blue in the 2nd UBG? I only see his head in one of the page spreads. His jaw and mechanical arm are normal colors, but he could have fixed those after the events in the bio too, assuming it takes place before the mini-comic.
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  20. #2195
    Warrior of Evolution 13977's Avatar
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    Packaging looks ace! I like the bios but not sure about Slamurai for the name of the heroic white ninja. I don't mind the play of words on Samurai but its the slam part I'm not keen on. Something like Samu-rai, Samu-ra, Samu-ror, might have worked better IMO. Still really hoping for a figure of heroic white ninja and two Snake Horde Troopers in the future.
    I like Lord Grasps bio the most. I'm really glad they connected Plasmar's gem to the Gem of Tamadge, and thus also to SLL. Not sure about Terr-roar taking on the physical characteristics of other warriors, I know it explains the parts reuse but I'm just not really sure if it needed explaining 'in universe'.
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  21. #2196
    master of accessories facet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbagok View Post
    Thanks for posting those, Facet! So cool to have new bios!

    RE Trap Jaw, is he blue in the 2nd UBG? I only see his head in one of the page spreads. His jaw and mechanical arm are normal colors, but he could have fixed those after the events in the bio too, assuming it takes place before the mini-comic.
    Gbabok in regards to trapjaw, i based my conculsion off that one drawing, just it i possble he was able to repair himself before. something i want to point out Lord grasp bio, as it say he and His Warriors escaped defeat from the 2nd UBG, now in fangors bio from the dark horse book it never says he was a warrior of King hiss, therefore i am making the assumption that he is one of Lord Grasps warriors (i am also making the educated guess that Terr-roar, Streatch Nekk and Vypor are as well, Quick Flick( thru Terr-roars bio) and the last mini comic seems to be under the command of King hiss), and " Accessing the technology of the cosmic key,Fang-or and several other snakemen survived the second ultimate battle ground by journeying to Trolla, where they became Lady Slithers Vassals. Fangor mobilized Slithers Snake Lair and, after years adrift, the Lair and its occupants settled on Eternia". Now according to Plasmars bio, Skeletor saved Camo Khan from the spell of sepration , these 2 now becoming motal enemies(Plasmar and Khan). Heres where things start unraveling. According to Entry in the dark horse book, which is a combo of Camo and Korba Khans bios, Kobra Khan got his powers after King hiss was decapitated by Zodak, and Skeletor took the throne of Eternos. This is when Kobra Khan created his cabal of Snake Men and called his renegade group the Diabocial Snakes. Now Orignally i was thinking that those new snake men we got would be a part of that (axel made some drawing showing those new snake men as part of them), but in light of Lord Grasps bio, it seems more likely that they part of his contingent. Now that would leave Rattlor Tung, lashor, and squeeze, (Snake Face is Stone according the unproduced 40th episode of 200x comic) which at least from the perspective of rattlors/Kobra Khan relationship, they would never work together. Although from the perspective of rattlor and tung lashor jumping sides to the Horde , and the christmas special tung lashor and Rattlor were seen working for skeletor, maybe it was a rouse to stay in the good grace of Skeletor, the most powerful being on the planet, till king hiss was fully recovered, and with kobra khan the one with the best working relationship with skeletor, him actiing as the leader is the best move in order to allow them to considered as allies till they could betray him. Now the bio also states that his power for camo khan was temporary but that is contrary to what plasmars bio states as well as the fact that his that khan was destoryed in the 2nd ubg ( and to further that there is a pic showing that him unraveling in the 3rd mini comic) but plasmars says skeletor revived him. Skeletor had no magical power( hence his terror claw armor) till he got his staff back which was after orko cast the spell of separation, which means they were both destoryed simultaneously, so literally skeletor would have to had grabbed his staff and immeaditly saved khan as his first act of business otherwise i feel it would be hard to revive him. And on top of his powers being temporary , he was supposed to be in the 3rd UBG (according to Axel) but got left out and this fight was played out in the time of king heman, which means these power were def not temporary. Graps bip states he joins forces with Lady slither but which one is really in charge? and Xarkoran is an awesome nod to Where Gorgone, the stone snake giant and Xan, here messegner are from in the brazil comic so kudos to the writer of the bios.

  22. #2197
    Heroic Warrior Streamside's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 13977 View Post
    Packaging looks ace! I like the bios but not sure about Slamurai for the name of the heroic white ninja. I don't mind the play of words on Samurai but its the slam part I'm not keen on. Something like Samu-rai, Samu-ra, Samu-ror, might have worked better IMO.
    Something like Sam- or Samu-Yūrei, since Samu- means a mindful activity, and Yurei is japanese for ghost, might have been good.

  23. #2198
    Pillar of the Community hadley's Avatar
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    Slamurai is totally 80s, so I don't mind too much. It's not what I would have called him. "Ghost" isn't the most MOTU-etic but at least it doesn't make me think of the Ninja Turtles.

    I mean, Slamurai sounds more like the slam-dunking, three-point shooting, pushing-it-in-the-paint tubular best friend of Michelangelo or something.

  24. #2199
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Slamurai sounds like a damn wrestler, brudda!

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  25. #2200
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    Glad to have more bios, I like that the Ultimate's included them and did a few new things but I am kinda in the camp that some of this compulsion to revert back to the way things were before is a cop out. I understand the desire to reset everything and bring everybody back from the dead and all that but its a little be "Dallas" for me.
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