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Thread: MOTUC at Retail Discussion/Speculation/Support Thread

  1. #326
    Widget Wrestler Mr. Shokoti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kowl View Post
    I feel your passion... I really do... BUT you are missing a key component to the puzzle.
    You have to realize, and accept, that the majority of the MOTU 80s fans have grown up and no longer care about toys.

    I love when I hear stories of new fans "discovering" the Classics line and starting their own collection, but how many toy geeks (like us all) are still out there that don't already know about MOTUC? Most toy collectors are online and involved in various toy collecting forums/websites. MOTUC has been in the "toy news" since mid-2008. You think the word would be out to all interested parties by now.

    Your examples aren't that strong either. TMNT has already had one previous failed relaunch. Thundercats isn't doing so hot. The toys are peg-warming at all the stores. Bandai has no new toys planned this year, as was proven at NYTF. Transformers/GI Joe is interesting to children because of the "blockbuster" movies.

    I know you want to think that other adults (and a new generation of children) will share your love and passion for MOTU, but the cold, hard truth is it just isn't going to happen. We are a small niche, albeit extremely vocal and faithful, collector community.

    In order to expand the current audience, the line needs a movie or a new cartoon. That would bring in a new generation of children and maybe a few new adult collectors.



    Target charges $18 for DC Classics and Wal Mart charges $16. Target charges $16 for Thundercat Classics and Wal Mart charges $15.
    Both of these lines are not as detailed as MOTUC. MOTUC would be like $20 at Target, $18 at Wal Mart, $25 at TRU.
    Since it will never happen, this really is moot though
    I agree with everything you just said(although I'm not sure even G.I. Joe toys are doing that well either).

    Those of us ensconced in the world of toys and/or comics often forget that the rest of the world may not share our passion or interest in them. Sure, a new movie or cartoon may spark some, but usually those same people go right back to "adult" things & forget about their "new found enthusiasm" a month or so later. I know some love to blame Mattel for the failure of the 2002 MOTU toyline(and sure, they didn't make it easy on fans), but the reason that line failed along with similar toylines like Bandai's Thundercats is that kids in general don't like toys. After they graduate from Fisher Price, most go on to video games, iPods, & girls(or boys depending on their case). Sure, some stick with toys, but they are the minority. For every Transformers or Bakugan, there are hundreds of failed toylines. There aren't enough adults into toys to keep a retail line going. If kids don't get into it as well, the writings on the wall.
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  2. #327
    Got Filmation? shadowfall1976's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kowl View Post
    I feel your passion... I really do... BUT you are missing a key component to the puzzle.
    You have to realize, and accept, that the majority of the MOTU 80s fans have grown up and no longer care about toys.

    I love when I hear stories of new fans "discovering" the Classics line and starting their own collection, but how many toy geeks (like us all) are still out there that don't already know about MOTUC? Most toy collectors are online and involved in various toy collecting forums/websites. MOTUC has been in the "toy news" since mid-2008. You think the word would be out to all interested parties by now.

    Your examples aren't that strong either. TMNT has already had one previous failed relaunch. Thundercats isn't doing so hot. The toys are peg-warming at all the stores. Bandai has no new toys planned this year, as was proven at NYTF. Transformers/GI Joe is interesting to children because of the "blockbuster" movies.

    I know you want to think that other adults (and a new generation of children) will share your love and passion for MOTU, but the cold, hard truth is it just isn't going to happen. We are a small niche, albeit extremely vocal and faithful, collector community.

    In order to expand the current audience, the line needs a movie or a new cartoon. That would bring in a new generation of children and maybe a few new adult collectors.



    Target charges $18 for DC Classics and Wal Mart charges $16. Target charges $16 for Thundercat Classics and Wal Mart charges $15.
    Both of these lines are not as detailed as MOTUC. MOTUC would be like $20 at Target, $18 at Wal Mart, $25 at TRU.
    Since it will never happen, this really is moot though

    The Targets around me have DC for $15 (WM same, Meijer $16, TRU $17) and The Thundercats for $14 (WM $13, Meijer doesn't have them, TRU $16), I know I have almost bought the TC's, and have looked at the DC....ANd while I know no media supports it, people still peruse the toy aisles looking for something new and different.....I also worked at Target recently, in the toy aisles, so I know what the prices are for them, and I spend so much time in the toy aisles at the other local stores.

    Also MOTUC failed at retail once....I'm not trying to make a case for them to actually do it, I'm trying to say if they do, they probably won't do too bad, at least at first, But I do admit it won't be like the hotcakes that the Collectors Classics sell like online, I don't see people buying multiples except those who do customs or make displays.


    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Adam's Dad View Post
    Shadowfall, many toy companies will price bundles for less than they would items sold individually. Cutting the 2-pack price in half and calling it a day probably isn't the most effective way of speculating on the price of an individual MOTUC retail fig.

    The closest thing to MOTUC I can think of in the toy aisles right now in terms of accessories and articulation is the Thundercats line. Target.com has the Lion-O that is larger than MOTUC at $20 (Tygra is $17), and the one that is smaller than MOTUC at $15. Walmart has them at $17 and $15. The aforementioned TRU has them at $20 and $18.

    Like I said, we're probably looking at $17-$18 in the unlikely event that MOTUC hits retail again.
    Also Retail reduces the prices on figures by mass production, otherwise if the TC's were online exclusives, they would also probably carry a $20 price tag. Transformers would have a hefty price tag if they too were online only.
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  3. #328
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    MOTUC at retail is a recipe for failure. Just off the top of my head, you would be looking at distribution issues, retail desire for core figures leading to pegwarmers and lack of new product showing due to pegwarmers. Making this line a TRU exclusive just adds to the problem. Why would you pick a retail chain that has barely thwarted bankruptcy several times and has a limited presence.

    The closest TRU for me is 30 miles. There are some in this country who's closet TRU is 200+ miles away. Plus, their website is not the most reliable way to purchase from them.

    This line has its problems but why add more problems to the line by involving retail, especially TRU?
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  4. #329
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    Mattel is launching a new Batman series of toys and it's being called an Evergreen line, meaning one without any media behind it such as tv/movies/comics.

    So why doesn't Masters have an Evergreen line? Why is the argument always "no new retail launch without new media" if they have the resources to do just that for Batman?

    I'm sure the counterpoint will be that Batman has a new movie out this year and I'm bracing myself for that exact statement but how do you justify one more new Batman line when you already have Brave and the Bold, DC Classics, left over Dark Knight product, Dark Knight Rises product coming and Batman Imaginext?

    That's quite a bit of retail space just for one character - retailers and Mattel can't find two pegs worth of space to get a few He-man figures onto?

    I know it was before Scott's time but does anyone know how Mattel got JC Penney and Wal-mart to carry Masters Commemorative back in 2000? That had to be to some degree an amount of networking and finagling on Mattels part? Anyone know the exact circumstances on that?

    On some of the RGD's, Scott references the memory of discovering new Masters figures in store long before the internet when he speaks about the current line and it's surprises. Let's really relive those memories shall we?

    Get my man He back in the stores!

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  5. #330
    Heroic Warrior J-West's Avatar
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    Just put the line in stores. It gets irritating dealing with Mattel every month especially this month knowing that far too many people are getting their shipments and ive got nothing. All subs should be sent out at the same time, no exceptions! It's starting to get to me. Just put them in a store so I can go pick them up and not have to deal with the b.s.
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  6. #331
    Evil & armed for combat TJRules's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eamon View Post
    I like my figures coming on the post.
    Totally. I think having the entire MOTU line online, NOT at retail, and NOT as a subscription would work. Kids are online all the time and I think it's great that the core characters are finally available year round. Having EVERYTHING available online all the time would do good for the line. I would buy more figs. Wouldn't you???

    That opinion may not be very popular, but think about it. Retail lines come with any number of uncalculated possibilities. Since we're in the internet age and not getting out of it any time soon, I think having the figs at as many retail online outlets as possible is never a bad thing.
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  7. #332
    SoH Supporter He-Dad's Avatar
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    I know my son prefers the simpler vintage MOTU figures to the more articulated figures currently being marketed for kids/collectors. He has a new Lion-o....just not the same. He also isn't that into all these new star wars toys either. I think for kids, they need to scale back. And now that He-Man and She-Ra are streaming on netflix I know there are ALOT of new fans. Kids are redescovering this stuff and loving it so I don't think it needs to have a new media revival to be successful.....it just needs to return to the roots. Leave the classics line out of the toy stores and to the collectors and go back to basics for the kiddies and I could see there being success.

  8. #333
    Heroic Warrior Fabulous's Avatar
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    I would totally buy the same figures again in retail if they came in different packaging like this one done by Neutro. That could make up for the fact that they'll only come with 1 accessories. It could work if they only released the original 8 back or series 1 and 2 (If and when we get a Ram Man figure)

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  9. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Dad View Post
    I know my son prefers the simpler vintage MOTU figures to the more articulated figures currently being marketed for kids/collectors. He has a new Lion-o....just not the same. He also isn't that into all these new star wars toys either. I think for kids, they need to scale back. And now that He-Man and She-Ra are streaming on netflix I know there are ALOT of new fans. Kids are redescovering this stuff and loving it so I don't think it needs to have a new media revival to be successful.....it just needs to return to the roots. Leave the classics line out of the toy stores and to the collectors and go back to basics for the kiddies and I could see there being success.
    I agree, my kids LOVE the vintage figures and are only moderately interested in the 200x figures. They seem to like the classics figures a bit better because you can trade heads, but the arm trading is what they love the most.

    If they could redo the vintage figures to have interchangeable heads, kids would LOVE them!

    Oh and my kids love the Filmation shows too. Pretty much all they want to watch.

  10. #335
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kowl View Post
    TMNT has already had one previous failed relaunch.
    Wait....when did TMNT fail? Are you talking about Last Mutation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Executioner View Post
    I agree, my kids LOVE the vintage figures and are only moderately interested in the 200x figures. They seem to like the classics figures a bit better because you can trade heads, but the arm trading is what they love the most.
    That's why I think Classics are the best because of the interchangeable options between figures and updated articulation. If only MOTUC could get all of the good 200X ideas over to Classics...
    Last edited by MegaGearMax; April 8, 2012 at 07:11am.

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  11. #336
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    My Solution to He-Man at Retail: 1 of Each Per Case!

    Okay, so Scott continues to say that MOTUC is only online right now and will continue to be so unless we get some movie support. If and when that happens and they plan to have a retail line, this is possibly the best possible solution to mitigate the fiasco with the MYP figs: each character gets 1 slot in the case per wave. Hear me out before you call for my head.
    First, we need to face a tragic reality: figures are fading away as a means of entertainment for kids. We are (sadly) in the digital age where kids want electronic interactivity and mom and dad want a baby-sitter for their children. The demand for action figures (by kids) is starting to decline. Plus, the costs for making action figures has gone up so much that they can no longer be the little rewards by parents to their kids, or a treat to shut them up while they are shopping at Wal Mart or Target. In fact, in an attempt to bring costs down, Hasbro made these smaller, less articulated Iron Man 3 figures on blister cards. They are essentially Happy Meal Toys trying to get the attention of the parents to buy that little extra something for Johnny or Jane. Everywhere I go, its adults buying the action figures with no kids present. It is also the adult collector who is willing to pay that price. Any time I have seen a parent in the action figure aisle, they balk at the price and instead decide to get that video game for 5 dollars more that the kid is sure to like or appreciate. Therefore, the quantity that would be shipped needs to be reduced.
    Second, while one of each per case would make it a bit more difficult to track down that one figure, it would reduce the back log and increase the frequency of shipments. All major retailers now have automatic ordering systems that trigger re-orders from the DC when a certain stock level is reached. Until that number is reached, the system will not update and tell the DC to ship more figures to the store. If any of you collect Star Wars, you know the headaches we went through just last year and the fiasco pretty much killed the Vintage line. If each character gets one figure in the case, we will see faster sell throughs and more frequent restocks so that eventually you will get the figures you want. Heck, it may even force retailers to order more than one or two cases at a time since they will move faster.
    Refering back to Iron Man 3 figures, Hasbro cited the sheer glut of product from previous sets of movie figures (IM, Avengers, Thor, Captain America) left retailers with a bad taste in their mouths and you can still find some of those old figures still on the shelves if they weren't already removed.
    In addition, the figures UPCs need to be individualized in stores systems so that Mattel can closely monitor sales data as to which figures are moving faster. This will help determine whether repacks would be needed in a future wave and what characters should be avoided or get a one time around. Let's face it, marketing can never get the right balance for case ratios. Again look at most of the movie toy lines that have figures just rot. Hard solid data is needed to break through the skulls of these bean counters who only think that the main character and all his variants will be the key sellers.
    To conclude, while this is not ideal, it is as close to being the happy middle that we can get. While we won't be able to quickly get that army of Horde Troopers, we will not be stuck with the same He-Man and Skeletors that clogged the pegs and doomed the MYP line.

  12. #337
    Heroic Warrior eddie3429's Avatar
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    Interesting and well presented theory but not really how retail works in the long run, can't write a proper reply know, don't give up though, i wish it was at retail to

  13. #338
    Heroic Warrior goluphi's Avatar
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    This will just lead to obscure characters clogging the shelves instead of He-Man and Skeletors like in the 200X line.

  14. #339
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    ^^^^ correct

    Retail would have to have at least two he man and two skeletors per case of twelve or retailers would never order them.

  15. #340
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    You can't have a line based on a dude and then not have the dude available. Sure, there are the Masters-but this is NOT an ensemble series. This is He-Man and...the other guys.
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  16. #341
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Who would get into a He-Man line who can't get He-Man and Skeletor day one? The core figures need to be easily accessible to ALL new collectors or they will not bother.

  17. #342
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    Quote Originally Posted by goluphi View Post
    This will just lead to obscure characters clogging the shelves instead of He-Man and Skeletors like in the 200X line.
    And yet every obscure character in almost every toy line I have ever collected gets one per case and was not the one rotting on the peg and keeping new waves from coming in. The obscure character may or may not have many fans but those who want him/her will still have a fair chance without too much worry of a clog.

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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    Who would get into a He-Man line who can't get He-Man and Skeletor day one? The core figures need to be easily accessible to ALL new collectors or they will not bother.
    Again, this is going off the logic that a movie needs to push this line. If there is one figure per case per wave, this forces retailers to order more to stock their displays. Please note how every freakin retailer over orders the first wave of movie figures so that the other waves can't get out. Why? Nine freakin Thors, ten different Iron Men,. All end up rotting and being clearanced out or sold to Ross or TJ Maxx. The one figure actually let's it sell out faster and allows more product to go through. You also need to look at the retailers perspective, slower moving inventory does not sit well with bean counters. If they see stuff continually selling out, it is considered a success and then encourage the manufacturer to expand the line.

  18. #343
    CRITAcal for MOTUC 2015!! Barezz's Avatar
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    It is not a terrible idea, not at all. However retail toy aisles tend to operate by a set of rules that want kids to be able to get popular "core characters" with ease. What hurt (my opinion) the 200X line was repaints and endless variations of He-man and Skeletor. Now if they just had He-man and Skeletor available in their core look I don't think it would have been as much of an issue. But adult collectors tend to get fed up with too many variants of one character, and I have seen parents telling their kids that "they already have a X, they don't need another one." To some parents, He-Man is He-man, doesn't matter if he is battle armoured or Thunder punching.

    Even in a line like MOTUC, if someone gets "into" the line this year say because they get excited about a new Castle Grayskull and get "hooked", the first figures they will likely look at getting will be a more core character. Unless they grew up LOVING Scareglow, they are going to probably get Skeletor first. Not everyone is strange like I am and start out collecting because of Adora

    Rather than doing 1 per case, I would suggest having core characters (He-Man, Skeletor etc) readily available (since I am trying to stay "realistic" I won't include Teela or She-ra because ewwwww cooties and stuff ). What is important is "smart" case assortments. Maybe have a couple of these figures per case, not a case of 12 that has 10 He-Man. And if you short pack a figure, maybe in a refresh case assortment, or a future case assortment include that figure there too.

    Only 1 of each figure might lead to frustration for all around, because in such low numbers you could never see certain figures in retail ever, and will only have missed them by 10 minutes.
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  19. #344
    Heroic Warrior Micro-Man's Avatar
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    The problem is that it's the retailers that want lots of core characters and influence the case ratios, not the manufacturer. Store managers would be happy to have 20 He-Man and Skeletor's stuck on the shelves and only 2 Teela's available because He-Man and Skeletor are guaranteed to move. They may sit there for months but they will be the ones kids pick up. Even case ratios only cause the pegwarmers to accumulate and kill the line faster than Digital River ever could, heheh! Just look at how badly MOTUC vs DCU sets did at even case ratios. This core-heavy formula has been tried and true for decades...That's why there are tons of Batman, Iron Man, Spider-Man, John Cena, Darth Vader, Mikey, Leo, Don, & Raph, and core characters. Retailers are in it for the long term so they want the main figures to be available all year-round.

    This is the Catch-22 of putting MOTUC back at retail; We collectors suddenly become the minority and the business decisions will cater to us even less! Variants will run rampant once again because each new wave must include a He-Man and Skeletor or else stores won't carry it. A quick sorta-related example: About two years ago, the rough WWE breakdown that the Design Team threw out in a Q&A was 95% Parents & Kids and only 5% Collectors as their target audience!

  20. #345
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    Paragraph breaks, bro. They're your friend.

    I made it about 3 lines in...
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  21. #346
    Heroic Warrior Micro-Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Waters View Post
    Paragraph breaks, bro. They're your friend.

    I made it about 3 lines in...
    Sigh...I guess this is why hardly anybody ever quotes me...

    And that was a short paragraph for me!

  22. #347
    Got Filmation? shadowfall1976's Avatar
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    Transformers ROTF & DOTM killed it for Generations and RTS back in 2010 & 2011, the stores would not clearance the old crap to get the new Generations then RTS in. Hasbro had to basically cancel RTS and send the merchandise to TJ Maxx & Big Lots just to recoup.

    And TRU is a crap ass store for hording ****, and never clearancing it. My two local TRUs both have ROTF merch from 2009 still at full price on the shelves....HELLO!....They have a few from friggin Animated from back in 2008....now come on, get rid of that **** already, and stop charging today's prices for 5 year old peg warmers. Not to mention they are ridiculous on their exclusives for the most part, I seriously hate the fact they keep getting all the MP exclusives, Wal-Mart or Target should be getting them, not TRU.

    And for MOTUC, both my TRU's still have the 2-packs with Skeletor, Mer-Man & Stratos in supply. I just don't see Masters doing well in retail, especially with nothing new to support it....it sucks, but that is the reality of things.

    I would love to see Classics, or hell the Mini Masters on store shelves, with a Mini Grayskull & Snake Mt. As well as mini vehicles....
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  23. #348
    grumpy old dragon scott metzger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micro-Man View Post
    The problem is that it's the retailers that want lots of core characters and influence the case ratios, not the manufacturer. Store managers would be happy to have 20 He-Man and Skeletor's stuck on the shelves and only 2 Teela's available because He-Man and Skeletor are guaranteed to move. They may sit there for months but they will be the ones kids pick up.
    And that is precisely the strategy that sank both MOTU 2002 and Mattle's first Batman line. SB He-Man DID NOT MOVE, because he was massively overproduced. The ratios for the 6" Batline was even worse. When ANY character is overproduced to that extent, the line will die (as we've seen Mattel do time and time again). And anything that sits for months is not in any way appealing to retailers; they want merchandise to move now, not eventually. Shelf space is a premium, and things that sell more quickly get that space. One of the things that killed the Super Powers line was that the third wave cases had 18 old figures and only 6 of the actual wave 3 figures; the old stuff piled up and retailers stopped ordering.

    The point is that, while Batman will sell the most figures, a line with ONLY Batman is not going to last because there's nothing different to buy after the first purchase. You need repeat sales, customers coming back to buy more. And the idea that kids will convince their parents to buy a dozen Batman's comes from people who obviously never asked their parents for a repeat and got the inevitable "you already have Batman" response.

    Now, you can go too far in the opposite direction, as they did with the second wave of Indiana Jones back in the original line. There was only one Indy per case, making him hard to find if you didn't already have him. That helped the line to fizzle. The trick is to find that almost impossible balance where you have enough of the core characters to bring in new customers, but also enough different characters to keep the older customers coming back. Nobody ever gets it exactly right, but Mattel has one of the worst records ever for getting it wrong.
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  24. #349
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    Plz don't take my comment in a rude way, you have put a lot of thought into how matty could go about putting MOTUC back on the shelves of B&M stores. My question to you is why do U want MOTUC on shelves in the first place? if u ask me, will i go buy MOTUC at retail? the answer is NO, i have almost 2 of every core character for myself, plus a third i bought for my kids. The only character i would consider buying is maybe another teela, fisto and scareglow. So i don't think mattel should risk relaunching MOTUC at retail, re-release all these characters most collectors already have. I understand there are plenty of new fans who started late, but i dont think its enough to relaunch the line at retail. I think the window for MOTUC at retail has long been shut, its something that probably should've been done from the get go and only then maybe. The only reason to start selling at retail is if mattel launches MOTU at a new scale with new media at a cheaper price point.
    Last edited by Romadon; March 13, 2013 at 12:28am.

  25. #350
    Heroic Warrior wundarwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadowfall1976 View Post
    Transformers ROTF & DOTM killed it for Generations and RTS back in 2010 & 2011, the stores would not clearance the old crap to get the new Generations then RTS in. Hasbro had to basically cancel RTS and send the merchandise to TJ Maxx & Big Lots just to recoup.

    And TRU is a crap ass store for hording ****, and never clearancing it. My two local TRUs both have ROTF merch from 2009 still at full price on the shelves....HELLO!....They have a few from friggin Animated from back in 2008....now come on, get rid of that **** already, and stop charging today's prices for 5 year old peg warmers. Not to mention they are ridiculous on their exclusives for the most part, I seriously hate the fact they keep getting all the MP exclusives, Wal-Mart or Target should be getting them, not TRU.

    And for MOTUC, both my TRU's still have the 2-packs with Skeletor, Mer-Man & Stratos in supply. I just don't see Masters doing well in retail, especially with nothing new to support it....it sucks, but that is the reality of things.

    I would love to see Classics, or hell the Mini Masters on store shelves, with a Mini Grayskull & Snake Mt. As well as mini vehicles....
    I think i posted this somewhere on this site but I was passing through GA and went to a TRU, and they had 3 Power of the Force figures from the 90's line. They were still full price just chilling with the new products. That was the craziest experience I've ever had in terms of stores not reducing product to just get rid of it no matter how old.

    However, wal-mart is the worst at not reducing merchandise. Their "clearance" is typically 10% off and they sit on it forever.

    I am starting to see the Batman Power Attack line building up on pegs and its the same thing that killed MOTU. Either Hasbro is better at packing their cases or they are far better selling toy lines because I can only think of a few toys from them cluttering the aisles in recent years. The one exception being the Marvel movie stuff which movie lines rarely do excellent anymore.

    When we get a retail MOTU line i hope they handle it better this time.

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