Roast Gooble Dinner - Episode 002 Discussion!

[JVS3]

Now, don't take this as criticism, I just wanted to say that when you all said "Good Journey" at the end, it reminded me of Masters Cast. They pretty much established that greeting as their thing. I am not saying you should be competing - we are all one big happy family - I just noticed that.

Yeah, I can see that. But that definitely wasn't our intention.

We all love MastersCast, and I wish it was a weekly show.
But "Good Journey" is what comes natural when we say goodbye as fans. A lot of fans do this, and have done it over the years.
The genesis is the movie, and that's where we took our inspiration.

We could have said "see ya later" or "until next time", but that isn't what came natural as a proper MOTU valediction.
I guess we could have closed with a moral at the end. We might just do that on a few shows for fun, actually.

[Eamon]

I don't think there exclusivity on 'good journey'.

[JVS3]

IMO, you have the same kind of accent as Alex Winter (Bill) from Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure.

If I had place a label on it, the closest would be a Keanu Reeves-esque accent.

So I'm a California surfer???

I'm gonna bust out a "Whoa!" for the next episode.
I'll go all Cali on Faker.

[Benedict Judas Hel]

I'm gonna bust out a "Whoa!" for the next episode.

No, then we'll all get Joey from Blossom flashbacks. Try more like Neo or Buddha...

[Penny Dreadful]

I don't think there exclusivity on 'good journey'.

Exactly. The phrase originates in the film and has been used by many MOTU fans online. It has sort of become the standard MOTU way of saying "goodbye." I don't see it as exclusive to Masters Cast or any other show.

Actually, Masters Cast and Roast Gooble Dinner are two completely different programs that approach the topic of MOTU in their own ways. Both shows feature knowledgeable hosts with interesting theories and ideas about the world of MOTU, but each host show brings their own style to the table - different shows with different flavors. They are both fun AND they complement each other quite well. IMO, the more shows about He-Man the better!

As for episode 2 of Roast Gooble Dinner:

I agree with the general consensus on Demo-Man. Pixel Dan talked about how this makes it seem as if Skeletor is evil because of this demon being attached to him, and I thought the same thing. It's a much weaker story element than the embittered brother of Randor concept. I actually really like the brother of Randor/uncle of Adam aspect of Keldor. I don't think it's a Star Wars rip-off but, as Emiliano says, it draws from archetypes that pre-date Star Wars. Hamlet comes to mind for example. There's strong motivation there, and just that hint of *possible* redemption makes the character more interesting IMO.

With regards to Beast-Man, I like the idea that he is one of a kind. Or perhaps the last of his race. I too always thought of Masters as an iconic sort of title for the line which indicates that each character is the "master" of their individual power - NOT as a title for a superhero group of some kind, and certainly not something that should be uttered by the characters themselves.

Oh and alchemy, to me, is an early form of science which also employs aspects of sorcery. However, that's the conception of alchemy as generally depicted in horror films such as Dario Argento's 'Inferno' and Dan Curtis' 'The Night Strangler' - science mixed with the supernatural.

~Penny~

[Larry Koopa]

It was asked in the podcast why, if these characters have real names, do they use code names? Well, in the cases of characters with unrponouncable real names (such as Beast Man, Moss Man, and Optikk) the code names are names that their comrades can say in the heat of battle.

Slightly racist? Yes. Effective? Undoubtedly.

[Croaker]

Another great episode guys!


The only defence that I can really see for Demo-man is that it harkens back to the original mini-comics and the origin of Skeletor there - he is a demonic being from another dimension.

The Demo-man thing kind of merges this origin with his later one - Keldor.

[Larry Koopa]

My theory on the royalty of King Miro: Keldor being blue meant he wouldn't be allowed to be Prince by default. Captain Randor, second born, had to prove that he deserved the throne, so he bypassed ever being a Prince that way. Then I suppose it was more clear cut when Randor's son was born into Prince-hood.
Am I making sence?

[MegaGearMax]

It was asked in the podcast why, if these characters have real names, do they use code names? Well, in the cases of characters with unrponouncable real names (such as Beast Man, Moss Man, and Optikk) the code names are names that their comrades can say in the heat of battle.

Slightly racist? Yes. Effective? Undoubtedly.

Like G.I. Joe, the MOTU characters have real names for their non-battle interactions. The good guys probably have affectionate silly names while the villains probably use their terrifying legendary names. Trydor probably goes by Tri-Klops because of the frightening tales that are associated with that name. Sorta how Richard Kuklinski is better known as "The Iceman".

Another idea is that the good guys give the bad guys names like they did in Halo. The human UNSC forces name the aliens since they didn't know their alien foes' real names for their races. The Sangheili are called the Elites, the Unggoy are called the Grunts, etc. I could see the Masters calling R'quill R'quazz "Beast Man" after their first encounter with him. Of course, this pretty much only works for the monstrous characters. Evil-Lyn, Jitsu, Trap Jaw, Tri-Klops obviously use the legendary name idea.

The good guys might use their real names more, when not in battle. I can see something like how Man-At-Arms is called "Duncan" when not in battle and not just Man-At-Arms period, as if it's his only name, sorta how The Justice League on JLU called Martian Manhunter, "J'onn". Then again, I can see the ABC giants mockingly calling the bee warrior "Buzz-Off", instead of his given name.

[Ivan]

About real names - I don't like them at all. I just ignore them.

I don't think the question is whether or not they have real names. Of course, they do. Of course no parent in their right mind would name their child "Beast Man". But, I think it's totally beside the point.

I think the important thing is that MOTU is a fictional, toy and entertainment property. It is not a documentary about something that actually exists. Therefore, it should not seek to explain everything and give us so much info on every character. MOTU needs mystery - we need some characters to remain mysterious and not know their "real" names. I mean, why stop at real names? Why not give us their birthdays, favorite TV shows, and whether they drink Pepsi or Coke... I think the whole "real names" thing is bringing the characters down to Earth, and I don't like that.

[fireball13z]

great job guys, i downloading it through itunes and will be waiting each week for the next one. And for the people saying its too long, your crazy. at the end, i was like NO! i want to hear more MOTU stuff.

[Mr. Shokoti]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think Demo-Man is what made Keldor evil. I feel Demo-Man kept him alive after suffering a mortal wound and "it" also amped up Keldor's powers. Personally, I would have preferred Skeletor to have just been an other worldly demon without the whole merging of characters though.

As for the real names, I like most of them(Hordak's is probably the only one I really despise). I think they have the nicknames/codenames since MOTU has always been a superhero franchise set in a world where Conan meets Star wars. Codenames, powers, and outlandish costumes are all superhero tropes.

[Irian]

Actually, I am not totally opposed to the idea that Keldor got fused with some kind of demon - I just can't stand the fact that this being is called Demo-Man This is corny even for MotU. So let us forget this name and pretend it doesn't exist.

As for the fusing part: As with most things in those bios I think you can interpret the stuff in very different ways, just as you prefer. That's why I do not understand the argument "it diminishes the character". Well, it only dominishes the character if you chose to assume the worst. If instead you chose to assume that this demon is just enhancing Keldor's existing powers or that it is just responsible for keeping Skeletor alife (despite the fact that his head is a freaking floating skull) and doesn't influence Skeletor's actions - you do not have anything that diminishes the character in any way. If you chose to belief that the demon is responsible for everything bad in Skeletor or that it is Skeletor's driving force ... well, that's anther story. But why pick the one you do not like?!

[MegaGearMax]

About real names - I don't like them at all. I just ignore them.

I don't think the question is whether or not they have real names. Of course, they do. Of course no parent in their right mind would name their child "Beast Man". But, I think it's totally beside the point.

I think the important thing is that MOTU is a fictional, toy and entertainment property. It is not a documentary about something that actually exists. Therefore, it should not seek to explain everything and give us so much info on every character. MOTU needs mystery - we need some characters to remain mysterious and not know their "real" names. I mean, why stop at real names? Why not give us their birthdays, favorite TV shows, and whether they drink Pepsi or Coke... I think the whole "real names" thing is bringing the characters down to Earth, and I don't like that.

They aren't telling us everything about the characters, just revealing birth names. Hell, the bios leave us with more questions than answers.

(Okay, this isn't direct at you, Ivan, but some fans in general)

How come so many are so afraid of Mattel trying anything new with MOTU? Was it like this with fans when Filmation decided to give Man-At-Arms a real name? Or did fans flip when we saw that MYP created Trap Jaw's look before he was Trap Jaw, even going so far as giving him a real name? How dare they? All we should know about MAA is that he's a good guy, Teela is his adopted daughter and he invents stuff? Good grief.

Maybe it's because I'm a Secret Files, OHOTMU (Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe), Hasbro toy bios type of fan, but I come from, true identities are dealt with all the time. G.I. Joe characters DO have real names past their codenames. At the end of the day, Lonzo Wilkinson is still Stalker, Marvin F. Hinton is still Roadblock and Conrad Hauser is still Duke. I'll even bet when you first see those characters, you think of their codenames first. "Oh, there's Scarlett", not "Oh, there's Shana M. O'Hara". "Hey, it's Superman", not "Hey, it's Clark Joseph Kent." We always diss Mattel about not trying anything new like Hasbro, but some of the fans are the exact same way and are scared to death of any new information about their favorite characters past 1987.

I know some things are questionable from the bios (Hek-Tor-Kur, Evelyn Morgan Powers) but damn...some of you would throw the baby out with the bathwater and would not have ANY new information.

[Pixel Dan]

As for the fusing part: As with most things in those bios I think you can interpret the stuff in very different ways, just as you prefer.

This is a VERY good point, and why I'm glad to see so many differing opinions here!

But I just can't look past that with Skeletor's bio. When I first read it, my exact thought was what I said in the podcast, and it's hard for me to think otherwise. While many of you have great points, I personally just don't like the idea that Skeletor's evil might be attributed to by some demon he was merged with rather than just his jealousy/thrist for power. It just doesn't sit right with me.

But, as you said, everyone is will have their own interpretations, and there's definitely nothing wrong with that! We all have our own ideas of how the mythos should be, and probably have for the past 20+ years.

[fireball13z]

well my take, i like the idea of them have their own races, but i do think it would be better if they had something that makes them stand out of their races, like Beastman's blood line could have passed down the controlling beasts talent or like maybe Mer-Man is the only of his kind to be able to go out of water b/c of some evil mutation.

as far as demo-man, i love the fact that Mattel is trying to refer to old things, but sometimes i want my bad guy just evil.

now we dont know that demo-man made keldor more evil, but we dont know that he didnt either.

But i love the idea of making the story through all the bios.

[Ivan]

I know some things are questionable from the bios (Hek-Tor-Kur, Evelyn Morgan Powers) but damn...some of you would throw the baby out with the bathwater and would not have ANY new information.

Thanks for bringing this up - it is another dumb thing with real names. If they wanted real names it would be logical to just make up a bunch of random, weird names. Why is Evelyn's last name "Powers". Just a coincidence? And why is her entire name Anglo-Saxon?! How come Optikk can have a name in an unpronounceable alien language, but she has a boring Earth name. And why does she have a last name and a middle name, and Duncan is just Duncan? What happened to his last name? And, if Optikk has an unpronounceable name, wouldn't it be logical for Mer-Man who is an underwater creature to also have an unpronounceable name? Instead he has a name that means "King" in Latin. Wow, what a coincidence, the fish on Eternia know Earth history!

The whole thing is just a huge mess, and i don't see why they needed to deal with that...

[MegaGearMax]

Thanks for bringing this up - it is another dumb thing with real names. If they wanted real names it would be logical to just make up a bunch of random, weird names. Why is Evelyn's last name "Powers". Just a coincidence? And why is her entire name Anglo-Saxon?! How come Optikk can have a name in an unpronounceable alien language, but she has a boring Earth name. And why does she have a last name and a middle name, and Duncan is just Duncan? What happened to his last name? And, if Optikk has an unpronounceable name, wouldn't it be logical for Mer-Man who is an underwater creature to also have an unpronounceable name? Instead he has a name that means "King" in Latin. Wow, what a coincidence, the fish on Eternia know Earth history!

The whole thing is just a huge mess, and i don't see why they needed to deal with that...

Mer-Man has a name that means "Underwater Man" in English. In fact, all of the characters have these descriptive English names.

I'd imagine that Mattel wants for the MOTU characters to become CHARACTERS in their own right. Not just toys, but characters. Characters that can be written about in video games, novels, comic books, television and so forth. Not just basing characters off of simple toy descriptions like "Evil Lyn sees the evil future".

In those examples, I wasn't against the idea of real names, so much as their execution. (Let's face it...a mom isn't going to name their kid "Ram Man" or Beast Man's people aren't going to call a member of their race with a straight face "Beast Man") I've gone on record as saying that my biggest problem with the names is that they sound more Star Warsian than Eternian one-word names like how it's been established.

Am I against real names? No.
Should they sound more Eternian? Yes.

As far as Evil-Lyn, Mattel got it from old material--instead of making up a new Eternian sounding name. As with She-Ra and Demo-Man, just because it's an old idea, doesn't make it a good one.

[Mr. Shokoti]

How come so many are so afraid of Mattel trying anything new with MOTU?

Imo, it isn't always people not willing to try anything new(I love Chief Carnivus, the name Squidish Rex, and the new look for Moss Man), it's when a company changes something that a lot of us felt wasn't necessary, warranted, or even wanted. It's not like MOTU has been going non-stop for almost 30 years and they needed to spice things up(ala the Marvel & DC Universes). Considering MOTU has been dormant more often than not, why change things as soon as it's brought back?

Maybe it's because I'm a Secret Files, OHOTMU (Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe), Hasbro toy bios type of fan, but I come from, true identities are dealt with all the time.

Personally, I'm a Who's Who type of guy.

G.I. Joe characters DO have real names past their codenames. At the end of the day, Lonzo Wilkinson is still Stalker, Marvin F. Hinton is still Roadblock and Conrad Hauser is still Duke.

Heavy Duty is still Lamont A. Morris.

Breaker is still Alvin R. Kibbey.

Oh wait a minute!

I know some things are questionable from the bios (Hek-Tor-Kur, Evelyn Morgan Powers) but damn...some of you would throw the baby out with the bathwater and would not have ANY new information.

I must be the only MOTU fan that loves the name Evelyn Morgan Powers.

As far as Evil-Lyn, Mattel got it from old material--instead of making up a new Eternian sounding name. As with She-Ra and Demo-Man, just because it's an old idea, doesn't make it a good one.

I know you prefer the mini-comics and MYP over anthing else, but I don't think I ever knew you disliked She-Ra. Why man? Why?

[MegaGearMax]

Imo, it isn't always people not willing to try anything new(I love Chief Carnivus, the name Squidish Rex, and the new look for Moss Man), it's when a company changes something that a lot of us felt wasn't necessary, warranted, or even wanted. It's not like MOTU has been going non-stop for almost 30 years and they needed to spice things up(ala the Marvel & DC Universes). Considering MOTU has been dormant more often than not, why change things as soon as it's brought back?

MOTUC isn't the original MOTU and it isn't 200X either. It's a whole new continuity. So new takes on old characters aren't totally unexpected.

I must be the only MOTU fan that loves the name Evelyn Morgan Powers.

It would have worked much better if we knew something like Evil-Lyn's mom is from Earth and she gave her baby to the Faceless One for some reason. Or something like that.

I know you prefer the mini-comics and MYP over anthing else, but I don't think I ever knew you disliked She-Ra. Why man? Why?

I don't dislike She-Ra at all (besides everyone forgetting about Adora and her being He-Man's sister instead of just someone else, but that's just me)--I like the character! I meant the controversy about her strength level. While I think that she still is He-Man strong and that the bio writers simply didn't word it right, others feel as though her trademark strength has been taken away.

[gbagok]

It would have worked much better if we knew something like Evil-Lyn's mom is from Earth and she gave her baby to the Faceless One for some reason. Or something like that.

Nice idea, but why couldn't she have married the King of Zalecia/Faceless One so he's still the biological father? Makes more sense to me anyway, I sure hope they do not throw out that he's Lyn's father (or that in life he was an ally of He-Ro as seen in the MVC comics).

[Mr. Shokoti]

It would have worked much better if we knew something like Evil-Lyn's mom is from Earth and she gave her baby to the Faceless One for some reason. Or something like that.

I'm not sure why so many people feel the name Evelyn is too Earth-like when our main hero's name is Adam and Powers is too cheesy sounding for a last name when the franchise's main villain is a guy named Skeletor who has a skull for a face.

[Uki]

So in listening to the podcast, I guess I'm probably going to be in the minority in that I'm cool with the the introduction of Demo-Man. I think part of the problem is that we no nothing of Demo-Man to date. Why would Hordak choose him, and for what purpose? In my mind, it's a strong possibilty that Hordak thought he could control whatever it is that Demo-Man was by integrating him with Keldor. A plan that we see in the long run ends up backfiring.

I don't necessarily see Skeletor as diminished by the addition of Demo-Man. Maybe Keldor is still in the "drivers seat" as it were, merely receiving a signifigant power boost with his merging with Demo-Man. Maybe it's not Demo-Man's influence, but the power he receives as part of the merge that makes him more twisted and evil.

At any rate, I'm looking forward to learning more about Demo-Man. He was involved in Despondos, so perhaps more will be learned about him as we get more of She-Ra's supporting character bios.

I also like the Demo-Man angle. I wonder what his real name will be... I think it actually adds a nifty element to Keldor, as he was clearly a bit unhinged after the merging. I like the otion of DM being an enemy or threat to Hordak, and the Horde Leader fused him to his "trusty" disciple to control him... We know how that works out.

Listening to it now and I have to say, I'm squealing over the shout outs! Thanks so much guys!

So far, another great episode! I also love the length, 60-90 minutes is so fulfilling! Yummy, can't wait for more!

Thanks again!

Amen, but where's the shout-out for my Bio-Narrative?!?!

It was asked in the podcast why, if these characters have real names, do they use code names? Well, in the cases of characters with unrponouncable real names (such as Beast Man, Moss Man, and Optikk) the code names are names that their comrades can say in the heat of battle.

Slightly racist? Yes. Effective? Undoubtedly.

I like to think also that Skeletor is prone to giving people nicknames. I nickname everyone...especially those I either like a lot, or have no respect for whatsoever. (They only have to figure out which side of that coin they exist on...)

Actually, I am not totally opposed to the idea that Keldor got fused with some kind of demon - I just can't stand the fact that this being is called Demo-Man This is corny even for MotU. So let us forget this name and pretend it doesn't exist.

As for the fusing part: As with most things in those bios I think you can interpret the stuff in very different ways, just as you prefer. That's why I do not understand the argument "it diminishes the character". Well, it only dominishes the character if you chose to assume the worst. If instead you chose to assume that this demon is just enhancing Keldor's existing powers or that it is just responsible for keeping Skeletor alife (despite the fact that his head is a freaking floating skull) and doesn't influence Skeletor's actions - you do not have anything that diminishes the character in any way. If you chose to belief that the demon is responsible for everything bad in Skeletor or that it is Skeletor's driving force ... well, that's anther story. But why pick the one you do not like?!

Good post!


I loved this episode! Great job on all parts.

Personally, I am in love with the bios (despite their occassionally poor wording and awkward grammar.) (The only thing I have had a real problem with was in Tri-Klops' Bio: it is stated that Skeletor hired him before the end of the Great Unrest. The problem is that Skeletor didn't exist until after the final battle, in which Keldor was injured and required Hordak's aid. I feel as though that should have read that Keldor hired Tri-Klops.) Other than that, I'm a very happy camper in Bio-Ville.

I look forward to future episodes, gang!

[MegaGearMax]

I'm not sure why so many people feel the name Evelyn is too Earth-like when our main hero's name is Adam and Powers is too cheesy sounding for a last name when the franchise's main villain is a guy named Skeletor who has a skull for a face.

Adam gets by because in some continuities, his mom is from Earth.

[Mr. Shokoti]

Adam gets by because in some continuities, his mom is from Earth.

Great point!

I still love the name Evelyn Powers though.