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Thread: *PROTECTED* King Hsss's snake form needs to be improved urgently !

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    *PROTECTED* King Hsss's snake form needs to be improved urgently !

    PROTECTED THREAD !

    General discussion thread for this topic

    Protected Thread Rules

    From what was revealed last night at SDCC, King Hsss, one of the last faction leaders and an A-list character, is coming in March 2010. The Hsss we saw is probably just a prototype, but there are things to discuss already.

    While the “human” King Hsss seems awesome to me (well articulated, amazing “vintage inspired” face but with a slightly grim and deceiving smile), while his accessories (shield and staff) look great, I’m greatly concerned about his “hydra” part.

    From what I saw, it’s like we’re going to get only a “half King Hsss” ! In other words, I have the feeling that King Hsss was done quickly, and was a little bit “botched”. Of course, this is not a good thing, especially when we consider the fact that Hsss is an A-list character !

    So, what does bother me in the “hydra part” that was shown ? Well, all in all, it seems very STATIC. And personally, I collect MOTUC figures because they are ARTICULATED ACTION figures, NOT stactions !

    First, there is no articulated, hingeable jaw. While it is true that vintage Hsss didn’t have an articulated hydra jaw, I want to stress and to underline the fact that this is Master od the Universe CLASSICS, a line that is famous, among other things, for its POINTS OF ARTICULATION.

    The fact that Hsss’s hydra form doesn’t have hingeable jaws is also a bad omen for what will come next: it would mean that Rattlor and Kobra Khan wouldn’t have any hingeable jaw either ! Personally, I’d like my Snakemen to be able to “bite”, to have their mouth opened or closed. 200x Hsss was really crappy in my opinion, BUT nevertheless, there was ONE thing I really liked about him : the fact that his “hydra” snake part was able to open and close the jaws (main head AND arms). This was a trait I really liked in 200x Kobra Khan and General Rattlor too (hingeable jaws).

    The MOTUC line is supposed to have better articulations, so I don’t understand why MOTUC King Hsss snake form wouldn’t get great articulations. Plus, Trap Jaw had hingeable jaws. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever that King Hsss, Kobra Khan and Rattlor wouldn’t have hingeable jaws too !

    Second, Hsss's general hydra appearance seems a bit “off” to me. The snakes that are used as his “arms” are different from the vintage Hsss, and also from 200x Hsss. They seem to sprout directly from… his belly, which is totally odd. Hsss’s snake form seems to be very “empty”, there is a lot of air and not very many snakes !

    Third, the snake “arms” seem like they’re not even articulated ! In the pictures we saw, there was no indication that there was any articulation at all ! This is totally unacceptable, I think. Even the vintage 80's Hiss and 200x Hsss had articulated arms and snake arms !


    That is why I ask to the fans that they will request for Mattel to reconsider the way King Hsss hydra part was conceived. We need a King Hsss snake form that is ARTICULATED. Articulated jaw, articulated arms, and with a “fuller” abdomen.

    King Hsss’s release is scheduled for March 2011 (in 8 months). This leaves enough time for Mattel and the 4 Horsemen to work again on Hsss’s hydra part.
    Last edited by Spectror; July 24, 2010 at 07:54am.

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    No Rio? We Riot! TheFallen's Avatar
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    I don't agree with you often but I agree with you here. I really don't like the Snake form. The Human form has been done so well only to be let down by the snake form

    I understand it follows the vintage look but they could have at least taken some liberties like they have for other figures

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    Heroic Warrior RocketPunch's Avatar
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    I do agree that his snake form could have looked better.

    However, I suspect the reason they made him look so much like the vintage version is because they're planning on releasing a 200X style King Hsss later on.

    The snake bodies could be compatible between the two, meaning that you could put the 200X snake body on the vintage versions legs and vice versa.

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    However, I suspect the reason they made him look so much like the vintage version is because they're planning on releasing a 200X style King Hsss later on.

    I'm sorry, but the MOTUC hydra part of Hsss isn't even close to the vintage 80's version ! The vintage, at least, could move its snake arms ! Even the terribly impaired 200x version had great snake articulations (it was the human shell that was totally static and uncool) !


    It seems like Mattel tries to do the contrary of what happened in 200X
    :

    - 200X Hsss : terrible human upper part, with no articulations whatsoever, but with cool snake form (articulated arms, hingeable main jaw, and even articulated jaws for the "hand snakes" !)

    - MOTUC Hsss : awesome articulated human upper part, but static, almost unarticulated snake part !

    When will these aggravations stop !?

    I don't care that they plan to release (MAYBE !) another snake version od Hsss "later" ! "Later" might never come ! They should be able to make a DEFINITE, WELL THOUGHT and DECENT figure right away !

    And I add that, personally, I don't want and certainly don't have to buy King Hsss twice and spend twice as much money just because Mattel was incompetent and unable to release a complete and decent Hsss from the start !

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    No Rio? We Riot! TheFallen's Avatar
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    Wouldn't that be Hyper Anime Detail?

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    Heroic Warrior ADPriceless's Avatar
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    I too was underwhelmed by the snake form, too short in my opinion.

    In terms of articulation - at the Matty panel they said that the snake arms are 'bendy' and able to be posed rather than normal articulation.

    I agree that the human form is top notch though.

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    Wouldn't that be Hyper Anime Detail?
    I know you meant that as a joke, but come on ! Trap Jaw had articulated jaws ! Why couldn't other figures have articulated jaws ? And let's be honest, that has NOTHING to do with "hyper anime detail" !

    Decent arms articulations for Hsss's snake part are CERTAINLY not an unreasonable request ! ALL MOTUC figures have decent, articulated arms ! Even the articulations limited Tytus has at least SOME arms articulations ! Even the 80's Hiss had articulated snake arms !

    Why does Mattel try to go cheap on one of the A-list figures again ? She-Ra hadn't the quality she deserved, and now it's Hsss ! I guess they plan to release the main characters again and again. But sorry, I WON'T fall into this spending trap ! Make decent figures right away, or you'll kill the line and make a lot of angry fans !


    In terms of articulation - at the Matty panel they said that the snake arms are 'bendy' and able to be posed rather than normal articulation.
    What the heck !? "Bendy" arms ? You mean, with metal wires in them ? How awful is that ? This does hardly make a decent articulation ! Plus, metal wires break ! No. "Bendy snake arms" just seem another CHEAP option that will result in us spending a bunch of money for a crappy, badly articulated hydra Hsss !

    GIVE US DECENT, NORMAL, TRADITIONAL MOTUC ARTICULATIONS FOR THE SNAKE ARMS TOO !
    Last edited by Spectror; July 24, 2010 at 08:21am.

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    Heroic Warrior kk2's Avatar
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    True the human part is amazing, while the snake part kinda well ya know.

    I understand that this might be done to keep costs low. So I would suggest
    to split the figure into two. First we get this amazing human Hsss and later on we get a awesome, well articulated snake form Hsss.

    This way Mattel makes more money and we'll be happier. Win-win-situation

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    All Era-Warrior Barnster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectror View Post
    So, what does bother me in the “hydra part” that was shown ? Well, all in all, it seems very STATIC. And personally, I collect MOTUC figures because they are ARTICULATED ACTION figures, NOT stactions !
    It has already been said by Toyguru his snake form will be bendable, which means he IS fully articulated.
    Maybe Marzo as an archenemy was the biggest thing to happen to Mekaneck, but as far as Marzo was concerned...it was Tuesday.

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    I understand that this might be done to keep costs low. So I would suggest to split the figure into two. First we get this amazing human Hsss and later on we get a awesome, well articulated snake form Hsss.

    No. It hasn't been made "to keep the costs low". Come on ! MOTUC is the hottest property sold on Mattycollector, and they know it !

    The truth is : it has been made like a halfway, Quasimodo Hsss figure !

    Why can't they release the "RIGHT" version right away, from the start, the first time ?

    I think they hope that they MIGHT (and when I say "MIGHT", that's IF the line doesn't crash down before !) release a second Hsss some time down the line, so people will actually spend more money to finally have a decent figure. I think this is not only greedy, that is taking the fans as hostages, and that is dishonest tactics !

    We saw the very same thing with Tytus : first, they release an limited (articulation-wise) figure... for $40 ! THEN, they say "oh yeah, by the way, if you want a better articulate Tytus and/or Megator, you'll have to spit out 100 bucks" ! Sorry, but in all honesty, that is a method that is used by swindlers all over the planet. The word might seem harsh, but that is the appropriate word for that kind of situation !

    It has already been said by Toyguru his snake form will be bendable, which means he IS fully articulated.

    "Bendable" is NOT a valid, nor a suitable solution ! Bendable arms means arms that BREAK easily ! And NO, it is NOT "fully articulated", since there is no shoudler articulation, no elbow articulation and no wrist/hand articulation either !

    More cheap, inane so-called "solution" ! And on an A-list character !

    This Hsss's snake part is by far the WORST ever produced so far (just like Hsss's 200x human part was the worst ever produced) ! 80's version had at least the simple shoulder joint that was characteristic of that era. 200x snake part had articulations too ! WHY SHOULD WE ACCEPT A STACTION SNAKE PART FOR THE MOTUC FIG, WHO IS SUPPOSED TO HAVE "BETTER ARTICULATIONS" ???

    Bendy arms doesn't mean "better articulations to me". On the contrary. It just screams "crappy choice" !
    Last edited by Spectror; July 24, 2010 at 08:49am. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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    Punish-Or jerec350's Avatar
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    I'm in FULL agreement here. I was hoping for a Hsss with a bonus 200X head and an interchangeable menacing snake torso. The human form looks great but the snake form looks extremely lame and weak. A proper King Hssss would probably be better off as a $30 "beast" figure.
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    Warrior of Evolution 13977's Avatar
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    I must admit I don't like the snake form anywhere near as much as the human form but honestly by this point I'm sure it's already way to late to change it.
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    but honestly by this point I'm sure it's already way to late to change it
    WRONG ! Toyguru said that, when they have SIX MONTHS OR LESS, they can't change a thing anymore.

    In this particular case, they still have 8 MONTHS to work on Hsss and improve his snake part !

    So PLEASE don't give up ! There is STILL some possibility to get a decent Hsss by March 2010 !

    Look : Moss Man was flocked thanks to fan demands, and his ears were even deflocked thanks to the fans. So don't give up : it is still possible to get better results with Hisss's snake part !

  14. #14
    Heroic Warrior Swanmarsh's Avatar
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    I agree with Spectror on this one! More work is urgently needed on King Hiss' hydra form.

    He should be a 'seething mass of snakes' with the heads all poking out of a writhing mess of entangled snake bodies - not just 4 snakes popping out of King Hiss' pants like a MOTUC-pornstar 200x Hsss got the seething mass angle right!

    Vintage King Hiss had a total of 6 snake heads - not 5.

    The bendy arms is a nice new angle on this figure, but for such an A-list character and faction leader, I do think the 4H could have designed Hiss similar to Plastic Man where fans have a choice of plug in snake-arms, either bendy or articulated. Oh yeah, I agree that the central snake head and articulated arm snakes should preferably come with hinged jaws.

    EDIT: a leg broke off my vintage King Hiss (the rubber band snapped) while I was trying to remove him from my Tyrantisaurus Rex so I could look at his hydra form in posting this message... Other than Saurod's lever, this is the first MOTU figure I ever broke. Off to ebay I guess ...
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    Supreme Fudge Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    I do (more or less) agree. I don't necessarily have a problem with the Snakes being bendable, but the whole look seems TOO simplistic (even for a line like MOTUC which is going back to the "simpler" look of the 80s line). And it would be nice if there were hinged jaws.

    About 5 years ago, a forum member known as J-Sun made a 200X custom that he called "Ultimate King Hsss", in which he made the upper torso swappable (this is still one of the best customs that I've ever seen). He made a separate snake-form torso. The snakes were bendable (I believe that they were mainly made from the tales from several 200X Rattlor figures), but also had hinged jaws, and overall the snake form looked better than it does here.

    While I know that I'm referencing a 200X custom and this line is not about "hyper anime detail", I still think something more along the lines of what J-Sun pulled off would have been better. In reality, the upper half of his custom King Hsss's body isn't that much more detailed than the one that was just revealed at the con (both seem to have roughly the same amount of detail in the snakes' skin/scales), it was just executed better, IMO.

    Here is the link to the original customs thread:

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...d.php?t=130473


    And here are some pics:

































    Comparison pic of his custom to the regular release 200X figure:







    Links to more specific posts with pics from the above linked thread (they are spread throughout that thread, so this makes is easier to go right to them):

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...9&postcount=73

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...9&postcount=89

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...8&postcount=97

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...0&postcount=99

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...&postcount=104

    http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...&postcount=115

    Quote Originally Posted by Spectror View Post
    BY THE WAY, it seems that some guys here still didn't understand what a PROTECTED THREAD IS.
    In all fairness, you did label this a protected thread, but from my experience in the Tar Swamp, in addition to labeling a thread as protected, people usually spell out some specific rules as to the extent of the protection.

    Do you not want opposing opinions posted at all? Is it okay if people respectfully post that they simply disagree and move on? I understand that the issue isn't up for "debate" (and I mostly agree with you on this, so it wouldn't be me debating you anyway on this), but it does help if this sort of thing is spelled out a bit more specifically to avoid any confusion. Plus, while you may not want a heated debate, since the point of this thread is to gauge if people feel the same way that you do, and since the idea is to push for a change in the figure, it does seem only fair that people at least be able to post if they disagree and why, even if it doesn't go beyond that into any kind of debate (but if you don't want that in your protected thread, that is your choice). It just seems that if it were to turn out that most people don't agree (even though I do agree with you), that it would make sense to see if most of the fan population overall agrees or not and whether this is something worth really pushing a change on.
    Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; July 24, 2010 at 09:51am. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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    The Original! guitargod694's Avatar
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    Just a reminder here, folks... this is a protected thread, which means the topic is not up for debate.
    Just discussion of what improvements you would like to see on the snake form of King Hsss.

    If you think it is fine as is... great.
    But in that case, please just ignore this thread.
    There is still a general King Hsss discussion thread where those opinions can be posted.

    If you haven't read this yet, please do: More info on protected threads.
    Bill :: guitargod694

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    Heroic Warrior
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    Wow ! J-Sun sure worked a lot on that "Ultimate King Hsss" ! Nice result, especially when the original was so lame !

    J-Sun's Hsss "hydra" form doesn't look too bad, and the hinged jaws of the hydra makes it look much better, in my opinion.

    Still, I'm sure it would be possible to have better articulations than just the "bendable" option. A "bendable" figure is not a durable one if you bend it often...

    I'm not even asking for very sophisticated articulations for the snakes : just a "shoulder" articulations for the snake arms, maybe an elbow articulation (just like any standard MOTUC figure... really, my request is not unreasonable !), and hinged jaws to all the snake heads, or at least to the main head and the "arms' heads".

    I would prefer a complete, awesome and articulated Hsss than a "quickly made", poorly designed one !

  18. #18
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    Iīm totally with you, as is my husband, which already makes two additional voices

    The snakeform is executed very poorly. Since it is a separate interchangeable piece, there doesnīt need to be a limitaion whatsoever regarding to size and bulkyness of the "disguise actionfeature". The snakes can and should be longer and bigger. There could even be more snakes, to make a nice appearance of a snake mass, as mentioned earlier in this thread.
    And they should indeed have articulated jaws. I donīt get why that wouldnīt be possible in MOTUC, but in 200x figures that were even smaller than MOTUC figures it was possible. As for the overall articulation, it may be flexible rubber with metal inside. Thatīs okay, as it makes for the most realistic looking surface, without having to cut the snakearms every inch for another hinge.

    Furthermore, the shape of the human lower body and the upper snake body should blend in, the snakes could "morph" out of the lower body, and instantly it would look much better. If this was too far off the original King Hiss design and therefore not applicable, how about some remnants of human skin then? The snakes could rip through the human shell and some cloth- or skinrags could be left, to hide the line where the two interchangeable pieces meet. That way it would hide the mock-up of an actionfeature. What do you think?
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  19. #19
    Master of Dreams Sandman's Avatar
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    I heartily agree with you on this one! I am a big snake man fan ever since their original toys, and I was very stoked when I saw Hiss/Hsss announced.

    However, I think that a snake torso that is entirely non-articulated is unacceptable. It doesn't look that cool either, more like a sculpture than a living mass of snakes.

    I for one would have been really happy paying $25 for a Hiss with a more elaborate sculpt.

  20. #20
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    Dear Flitzi,

    I agree with almost everything you and your husband just stated !

    The only thing that irks me is the bendable option, which is too fragile...I'd prefer some articulation, even if it's not a very sophisticated one. After all, 80's Hiss, even though he was simplistic in the vintage style kind of way, was efficient without too many articulations !

    And I agree, hingeable jaws are definitely a MUST !


    I for one would have been really happy paying $25 for a Hiss with a more elaborate sculpt.
    Personally, Sandman, I always thought that in order for Hsss to be done properly, he would have to be just a bit more expensive than the other figures...

    I also want you all to notice that King Hsss is the first figure that gets swappable parts (other than the head or one arm, like Trap Jaw, for example)... If he's not able to be produced properly and decently, I barely dare imagine what the result will be with Modulok, Multibot, or even Mekanek (neck "add-ons") or Extendar !
    Last edited by Spectror; July 24, 2010 at 11:03am.

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    Evil Warrior Soulfly's Avatar
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    Big yawn on the way the snake form looks. Boring and just bad looking.

    That said, I highly doubt they do anything about it.

  22. #22
    Powers of Grayskull Lord Snake Hunter's Avatar
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    Im agree- Human form is perfect, but snake one is very static. Articulated jaw is necesary and must be more menacing look.
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  23. #23
    Heroic Warrior WDWFreak53's Avatar
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    I don't usually agree with Spectror's views...but in this case, I do see his point.

    Human Form: A++++ Amazing
    Snake/Hydra Form: C-

    It only got a C- because it looks like the vintage Hsss...if it didn't, it would've scored lower. I don't mind the bendy snakes because having points of articulation on a snake seems silly because they bend fluidly...not like a joint.

    The "look" of the body seems off though. I want more snakes...articulated jaws (like Spectror stated)...at LEAST the main one! I think they should've put two more snake heads on it.

    I'll pose him in his human form...but a figure like this should be posed in the hydra/snake form.

  24. #24
    Heroic Warrior cayman shen's Avatar
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    The snake form is tiny and static...no flair at all. The snakes need to be bigger, in more dynamic poses, and have hinged jaws, at the least. I wouldn't buy this figure as is. The snake form is really, really blah.

  25. #25
    #1 Extendar Fan! JonWes's Avatar
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    I have to say I agree in general. The human form is phenomenal. I don't mind the bendy arms ( although those don't seem to hold up well over time.. But the snake form looks pretty goofy when it could be so cool! Freed of the constraints of an action feature it could be more dynamic. However, I could overlook that somewhat if his jaw was hinged. To me the open mouth just looks a bit weird. I wonder if they had to sacrifice that to wake the bendy arms work? Maybe the whole thing is made of flexible plastic?

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