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Thread: Has Filmation's version of POP not helped interest for MOTUC POP figures?

  1. #1
    Human... Robot... Maniac Spacedust's Avatar
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    Has Filmation's version of POP not helped interest for MOTUC POP figures?

    Just as theory to bounce around on a Sunday afternoon.
    Pretty much as the title says.

    In terms of the original 'Masters of the Universe', we had many other media where we knew the characters from, so even if the Filmation cartoon was incredibly silly and childish at times (and I speak as a Filmation fan btw), there were enough other 'versions' of the franchise, some with darker elements, for people to get into.

    But with POP, although there were comics, storybooks, etc., the line arguably wasn't as widely known - many people's sole experience with POP was through the Filmation cartoon.
    Now while a detailed debate of the Filmation MOTU & POP pros and cons is for another thread, one might argue that by the end of POP, Filmation's "Universe" was very over-young-child friendly, being very sappy and goofy and just plain silly much of the time.

    ...Do you think this has influenced some people's lack of interest for POP in the Classics line? As I say, with MOTU, there are enough other "versions" for people to take to (such as the wonderful pre-Filmation mini-comics, my personal favourite). But with POP, many people will just remember the sappy cartoons, which might be putting them off of any new POP figures?

    I dunno, just bouncing an idea around here. Comments?
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  2. #2
    Stridor in MOTUC! RockinHard's Avatar
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    Alongside the orignal toy line, it influenced me not to like POP even more.

    With that said, Secret of the Sword and the cartoon is far better than the original toy line.
    Last edited by RockinHard; October 24, 2010 at 11:05am.
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    Heroic Warrior DO4M's Avatar
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    The Problem with PoP is that the ONLY PoP that wasn't aimed towards young Girls was Filmation's. The toys were for all its purposes "Barbarian Barbies" (Rooted hair, excessive use of the color pink, etc.).

    The lack of interest in other eras is not PoP exclusive. There is also a lack of interest in NA, and 200X as well. (The so called Classics = Vintage MOTU part deux.) Just by looking at the No females thread, complaints about Optikk, Marzo, Keldor and Carnivus being released. Posts expressing joy that there are going to be no more 200X heads, etc.

    That said we cannot ignore the huge popularity of the Original MOTU over the other eras. No other era will be able to compare to the original MOTU (in popularity).

    So Yes I think that Filmation being the "only" source for PoP is part of the "lack of interest". (It may have helped some people to like PoP, but it also has driven off some people)

    This post is not meant as an Us vs Them attack.
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  4. #4
    Leader of the Evil Horde Hordak's Avatar
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    I would think the cartoon helped. The designs of the toys and the cartoon versions were drastically different at times making them not even seem like the same characters. I also just think that the overall theme needs to lose some of its glam. Less pretty princess with combs and more fantasy/barbarian women is what I would have liked. As a boy the Horde was the only thing that kept me mildly interested in POP and that was thanks to the cartoon. I also hate the color pink which finds its way into POP at times and the character tag lines such as "Jealous Beauty".

    At the same time POP had mini comics, storybooks, coloring books, stickers and clothing just like MOTU did. I can't really see how Filmation was any worse than the other media it had. I actually see modern MOTU as more gender neutral than POP in terms of female portrayal. They just needed more females in that line besides Teela, Evil-Lyn and The Sorceress. With the new MOTUC toys we will hopefully see some more Eternian woman soon.
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  5. #5
    Heroic Warrior kagamigod's Avatar
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    Filmation POP is what got me interested in POP in the first place. DO4M is correct there is a definite disdain for anything not vintage with this line even though it has been explained over and over again. I welcome all aspects, but Carnivus in particular never did anything for me. I have him but I don't care for his figure at all. At the same time, I didn't get nor will I ever get Webstor.

  6. #6
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    If anything, the cartoon HELPED POP be more than Barbies with swords.

    The Blonde Teela (Battleground and Alcala Teela) Thread
    The Cloak and Dagger Evil-Lyn (The Real 200X Evil-Lyn) Thread
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  7. #7
    Master of Dreams Sandman's Avatar
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    Yeah, I gotta agree. The Filmation version of PoP is the only one that isn't just fluff. Kind of the opposite of MOTU.

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    Heroic Warrior
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    No offense to POP-Fans, but for me there isn`t any possibility to present the ladies, even in MOTUC, to motivate me showing them side by side to my monster warriors...

    I don`t count Catra or the other female Horde members, because they have an awesome sexy evil looking design, but heroic females...I don`t know, even She-Ra is a little bit too girlish for me.

    Teela/Green Goddess have a much better barbarian design

  9. #9
    Heroic Warrior
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    I enjoy all things Filmation (MotU wise), and the only reason I like PoP is because of the show. And quite contrary to others' opinions, I think the Filmation cartoon was never sappy and only for children. Both shows were well written, and by the time that PoP came along, the writing was incredible. I think they created a good balance of mature storytelling while keeping it a show that children could really enjoy. And the animation was beautiful.

    When the DVD sets first came out, I was only going to buy them for nostalgia (pretty much why I still buy the figures today). Not having seen the shows in about twenty years, I thought that they would be a bit childish. When I did watch them again, I was shocked at how much I liked them and how much I still loved the beautiful art in those shows. I actually like those shows better now than when I was a kid!

    As for the original post, I disagree. At least for me, without the Filmation show, I would have no interest in MotUC PoP figures.

  10. #10
    Stridor in MOTUC! RockinHard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berserker79 View Post
    No offense to POP-Fans, but for me there isn`t any possibility to present the ladies, even in MOTUC, to motivate me showing them side by side to my monster warriors...

    I don`t count Catra or the other female Horde members, because they have an awesome sexy evil looking design, but heroic females...I don`t know, even She-Ra is a little bit too girlish for me.

    Teela/Green Goddess have a much better barbarian design
    I agree. Teela and Evil-Lyn look like they would wipe the floor with She-Ra. Catra is a good-looking evil character as well. With that said, I'm not saying that She-Ra isn't hot--just out of line with the warriors. I feel Bow and He-Ro look out of place as well.
    My seller/trader/buyer feedback:
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    MOTUC Most Wanted: 1) Stridor 2) Night Stalker 3) Squeeeze 4) Roton 5) Multi-Bot 6) Dragstor 7) Saurod 8) Blast-Attak 9) Karg 10) Lodar 11) Mask of Power Demons 12) TC Skeletor 13) FF He-Man 14) Talon Fighter/Point Dread 15) Road Ripper 16) Lord Masque 17) Filmation Teela

  11. #11
    Gimme Granita! Scorpia's Avatar
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    It's no secret that the She-Ra cartoon is what cemented my fandom. When I got on the internet and started looking into She-Ra again in 1998, I had no intention of looking for anything He-Man - for the cartoons, He-Man was always my brother's interest and I was into She-Ra.

    However, as far as the toys went, I was more into MOTU as a child. But the Filmation She-Ra cartoon wins out every day of the week. I could never understand why the toys didn't look like the cartoon versions (despite knowing the POP figures came first, the cartoon was far more present and often accessible than the toys in the UK - the two seemed so far removed from each other, they could often be mistaken for completely different properties). We never got Season Two in the UK (apart from a few random episodes on home video), so all I could relate to was the fact that Catra, Castaspella, Angella and Glimmer looked entirely different, Double Trouble was never in the cartoon and my favourite characters Scorpia and Shadow Weaver weren't made by the toy company. Honestly, I feel there was something amiss in Mattel's business planning because Filmation seemed to be advertising a product that didn't even exist...

    So, for me, Filmation has made me into a He-Fan or a She-Raver, whichever way you want to look at it and so I'm over the moon that we have a cartoon-accurate Adora figure after 25 years and that, although rights are an issue, Mattel acknowledge the huge significance of the Filmation series as being the largest library of stories and, in She-Ra's case, the most influential for popularity of the Princess of Power characters.

    I understand that some people don't like POP and those that don't tend not to like the figures or the cartoon. There are some who prefer the dolls over the cartoon's image and characterisation (particularly for those whose designs are different), but they seem in general to at least like the cartoon. It seems quite balanced, but the Filmation She-Ra series has brought an additional base of fans to MOTUC. I can't imagine it has driven many (any?) away because you can choose to collect what you want.

    Time will tell as the POP characters are revealed by Mattel. I believe the 4HM will blow people away with their designs - I've seen many people fall on their swords and admit that Bow looks cool and I hope they can work their magic on the female POP characters too.


    Quote Originally Posted by Berserker79 View Post
    No offense to POP-Fans, but for me there isn`t any possibility to present the ladies, even in MOTUC, to motivate me showing them side by side to my monster warriors...

    I don`t count Catra or the other female Horde members, because they have an awesome sexy evil looking design, but heroic females...I don`t know, even She-Ra is a little bit too girlish for me.

    Teela/Green Goddess have a much better barbarian design
    This is an area where the Filmation cartoon can offer a lot of excitement to MOTU's pre-Filmation fans, in my opinion. Not only have we got a female Rock Warrior in Granita (admittedly, the Rock Warriors came when the MOTU cartoon was in full swing, but she'd fit in perfectly), there are also non-Horde female characters like Huntara - who is portrayed as a hired assassin with dangerous fighting skills and a vast selection of weapons - along with Hunga - a vicious, screeching harpy warrior - and the Melog - a mud-creature that took a female-form and absorbed She-Ra's strength. I'd love to see Teela take on Harpy-Queen Hunga.

    I'd recommend you check them out Berserker79 and hope you'll be pleasantly surprised!

    Personally, I think both Filmation series add enormous possibilities for MOTUC and I'm pleased there are a lot of people who are open to these.
    Last edited by Scorpia; October 24, 2010 at 12:27pm.
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  12. #12
    Heroic Warrior Flor2099's Avatar
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    If not for the cartoon, I would not even recognize POP as part of MOTU as a whole.

  13. #13
    Heroic Warrior Rodster6's Avatar
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    The filmation cartoon is what got me into She-ra. Never liked the old toys as they were to girls for me and the hair was a pain always getting messy and knotted and in the way. I like having more females in MOTU though as it doesn't seem real to just have two or three.

  14. #14
    Illumina & Cat please! Darkspecter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spacedust View Post
    But with POP, many people will just remember the sappy cartoons, which might be putting them off of any new POP figures?
    ........

    What cartoon were you watching?

    The PoP cartoon was about an entire planet enslaved by an evil tyrant. The series dealt with slavery, hopelessness, living in fear, fighting to st
    ay alive, the true costs of war, etc. There were episodes that were pretty dark for an 80's Saturday morning cartoon series.

    This isn't aimed at Spacedust: Just because a show's main cast is female, doesn't make the show girly or corny. PoP wasn't about shopping, boys and if Sea Hawk circled "I like you" on the note She-Ra passed him. It's a story of salvation, redemption and what the human spirit can accomplish in its darkest hour.

    Filmation MOTU was almost Care Bears in comparison. Everyone lives in the fancy kingdom, except Skeletor who needs to learn his lesson about sharing.

    I'm being jokey-sarcastic with that comment, but PoP was a much more serious, planned, well-thought out and written series. If they produced PoP first and THEN MOTU, I know the Filmation MOTU series would have higher production, probably an origin story and maybe would have been more serious.

    I do love both shows, but I can't believe anyone who has ever watched PoP can say some of the things I read them say. I think those people just see girls and the colours of Whispering Woods and call it a half hour tea party.

    Quote Originally Posted by RockinHard View Post
    I agree. Teela and Evil-Lyn look like they would wipe the floor with She-Ra. Catra is a good-looking evil character as well. With that said, I'm not saying that She-Ra isn't hot--just out of line with the warriors. I feel Bow and He-Ro look out of place as well.
    Matter of opinion. Eamon, basically the poster child for those who don't like PoP has even said She-Ra looks like a Valkyrie...which she does, and they are fierce warriors...which she is.





    I do love them, but Teela nor Evil-Lyn would stand a chance against She-Ra. Teela frequently gets beaten by villain of the week characters...as has Evil-Lyn. She-Ra takes on battalions of Horde Troopers and villains daily. She's also as strong as He-Man with a magically transforming sword.
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    Stridor in MOTUC! RockinHard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspecter View Post
    ........


    Matter of opinion. Eamon, basically the poster child for those who don't like PoP has even said She-Ra looks like a Valkyrie...which she does, and they are fierce warriors...which she is.

    http://thecrookedpath.net/images/Valkyrie.jpg

    http://www.modernvespa.com/pix/uploads/valkyrie_191.jpg

    I do love them, but Teela nor Evil-Lyn would stand a chance against She-Ra. Teela frequently gets beaten by villain of the week characters...as has Evil-Lyn. She-Ra takes on battalions of Horde Troopers and villains daily. She's also as strong as He-Man with a magically transforming sword.
    She-Ra resembles those pictures but the differences are also glaring. Those in the picture look much more warrior-like. And, we're talking about appearance--and Teela and Evil Lyn look like warriors. She-Ra looks like something I'd want one of my girlfriends to dress up as during "play time."
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  16. #16
    Illumina & Cat please! Darkspecter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockinHard View Post
    She-Ra resembles those pictures but the differences are also glaring. Those in the picture look much more warrior-like. And, we're talking about appearance--and Teela and Evil Lyn look like warriors. She-Ra looks like something I'd want one of my girlfriends to dress up as during "play time."
    Ummm...in the second picture I posted, both Valkyries are wearing barely there bikinis. In the first picture, the Valkyrie, again, is wearing much less than She-Ra.

    She-Ra has armour and her outfit is much more modest and functional so she doesn't have a "Slave Leia" feel, which is a plus. She-Ra isn't designed to be sexually objectified, unlike a lot of other females in comic books and sci-fi genre.

    Her outfit, is right in line with Wonder Woman and Xena, both fierce warriors:







    Xena's first outfit on Hercules (shows up as text when I do the img link for some reason, so I have to post it as a link. lol):

    http://api.ning.com/files/drG3LB8pwZ...M/old_xena.jpg

    Xena's regular outfit:



    Anyway...the same "sexy dress-up" comment can be made for He-Man...who's essentially a naked, greased up man with a furry loincloth and a sword which is a phallic symbol.
    Last edited by Darkspecter; October 24, 2010 at 02:18pm.
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  17. #17
    Gimme Granita! Scorpia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockinHard View Post
    And, we're talking about appearance--and Teela and Evil Lyn look like warriors.
    So let me get this straight. Teela and Evil-Lyn look well 'ard whereas She-Ra needs none of that pretence and can kick butt better in a skirt.

    Know who I'm siding with!
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  18. #18
    Stridor in MOTUC! RockinHard's Avatar
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    Wonder Woman looks like a fantasy. Xena looks a little better, but not by a landslide. The MOTUC/Filmation She-Ra looks like a "play time" girl. Teela and Evil Lyn look more ferocious and deadly, though "play time" is not out of the question with them, either.
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  19. #19
    Heroic Warrior RocketPunch's Avatar
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    For me the Filmation cartoon had the opposite effect; it increased my interest in the Princess of Power characters.

    If all that existed was the minicomics and toyline i'd be far less excited about getting PoP figs in MOTUC.

  20. #20
    Heroic Warrior DO4M's Avatar
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    After staring at MOTUC Adora, She-Ra and Teela, the old "Styleguide" lack of detail makes them seem a bit off thoughts came to mind. (Which is further reinforced with the pics of the "Hyperdetailed" MOTUC Bow)

    That may be one of the factors that could draw some people away from PoP based MOTUC figs. (And one reason why I want a Hybrid look for PoP figs... like the 4H did with Bow)
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  21. #21
    Co-Creator of the NV
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    I think that Filmation's portrayal of PoP has overall helped the interest in MOTUC PoP figures.

    I suspect that a large portion of the PoP fanbase is comprised of people who were introduced to it through the cartoon or in some cases possibly only watched it without having a corresponding interest in the figures. Consequently I believe that a large portion of the fanbase might not exist at all without the influence of the Filmation cartoon. This isn't to say that there wouldn't be toy-only fans, but I think that the toon possibly reacher a wider audience and likely better served to incorporate PoP into the MOTU mythos.

    However, I have no opinion as to whether it would be better if the MOTUC PoP toys themselves were more strongly based on the toon designs or the toys other than the fact that with my limited PoP exposure that I'd likely recognize toon based figures more easily than toy-based ones. Once again, that's just a personal observation and I fully admit that I am likely not representative of the masses in that regard.

  22. #22
    Ravage ThunderCat blackiecats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kagamigod View Post
    At the same time, I didn't get nor will I ever get Webstor.
    Ditto. Not until they remove those stupid extra arms will I buy his figure! God only knows why they didn't make them removable....

    As for Filmation and POP.... without the Filmation cartoon series, I would not have been interested in collecting the POP figures in the classics line at all.

    and the way folks go on about wanting Shadow Weaver (a Filmation created character) then I'd say Filmation helps sell POP in MOTUC rather than hinder interest!

  23. #23
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockinHard View Post
    Wonder Woman looks like a fantasy. Xena looks a little better, but not by a landslide. The MOTUC/Filmation She-Ra looks like a "play time" girl. Teela and Evil Lyn look more ferocious and deadly, though "play time" is not out of the question with them, either.
    So you're basically talking about the lack of detail on the POP women, compared to the overly detailed and intricate leotards, furry boots and bracelets on the MOTU females?

    The Blonde Teela (Battleground and Alcala Teela) Thread
    The Cloak and Dagger Evil-Lyn (The Real 200X Evil-Lyn) Thread
    MegaGearMax's 200X/MYP Screen Grabs

    Sagitar • Cloak and Dagger Evil-Lyn • 200X Prince Adam • 200X Sorceress
    Sssqueeze • Angella • Perfuma • Evilseed (MYP)

  24. #24
    Starchild needs some love Morningstar's Avatar
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    Filmation POP is what i love. I´m interest in POP because of the cartoon.

  25. #25
    Illumina & Cat please! Darkspecter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockinHard View Post
    Wonder Woman looks like a fantasy. Xena looks a little better, but not by a landslide. The MOTUC/Filmation She-Ra looks like a "play time" girl. Teela and Evil Lyn look more ferocious and deadly, though "play time" is not out of the question with them, either.
    Do you mean the bathing suit/pinup girl Teela or the 200X version made to look like She-Ra, Teela?

    http://www.cliffchiang.com/2008/07/1...er-than-bombs/



    Seriously though, I guess if one wants to see super heroines as "play time girls" that's what one sees. However, Wonder Woman and Xena would chop the heads off of guys that view them like that. She-Ra wouldn't. She's nicer. She would just push them off a small hill or into a river.

    ...because they're all about justice and saving people. They're not Marilyn Monroe, Betty Boop or a Playboy bunny.

    EDIT: What's the difference between 200X Teela and Xena design-wise? A pony tail and colouring.
    Last edited by Darkspecter; October 24, 2010 at 04:22pm.
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