Who's Collection is Complete? I want killer, no more filler!

[Prahvus]

You only want all the vintage characters right now so you can abandon the line ASAP.

No. Not at all ! That's the stupidest accusation I've heard, really.

So far, I ALSO bought non-vintage characters such as Icarius, Vikor, Demo-Man, Bow, Gygor etc., AND I'd be happy to buy also characters such as Prahvus, Scorpia, Frosta, Madam Razz, Lodar, Sagitar, Darius, Batros, Shokoti, Lord Dactys... just to name a few !

And for your info, I have a vintage collection of classic MOTU, NA and 200x.

I really hate the way citizens_X deformed my words, and gave them a totally different meaning. That's just vile demagogy.

I only said "if the line goes on afterwards" because with Mattel's mismanagement and with the current trend (less subs sold, problems with the economy etc. ), the future is really uncertain.

Now, let's suppose for a minute that the very worst happens, and that Mattel - for one reason or another - has to pull the plug on MOTUC and fails to release all the vintage figs. THEN, I can promise you that the **** will hit the fan, and that the fans' anger will burn unchained !

[citizens_X]

I really hate the way citizens_X deformed my words, and gave them a totally different meaning. That's just vile demagogy.

I only said "if the line goes on afterwards" because with Mattel's mismanagement and with the current trend (less subs sold, problems with the economy etc. ), the future is really uncertain.

Now, let's suppose for a minute that the very worst happens, and that Mattel - for one reason or another - has to pull the plug on MOTUC and fails to release all the vintage figs. THEN, I can promise you that the **** will hit the fan, and that the fans' anger will burn unchained !

I hope this doesn't happen, when I got into this line it was just to to get my beloved vintage motu figures, I wasn't interested in the other factions but they all grew on me and I'm super excited bout everything now. I hope that the spreading out of the figures doesn't leave me without a MOTU Classics Spikor in the end. While I feel that spacing the vintage figures out is good for the longevity of the line, i'd prefer my vintage figures sooner than later.

[SCB]

So should they handle the line like its going to die any day now and get it over with while hoping people don't abandon ship when they release nothing but C listers after?

[Benedict Judas Hel]

No one is making you get a sub, though. If you get a sub, you are doing so knowing full well what it entails. If you only want the "core" characters, you have the option to cherry pick.

This is absolutely correct. This is why I decided not to renew my subscription for 2012. I had the choice/option not to buy anything I did not want to in order to get something I did want.

And although it is true that Mattel is not forcing anyone to get a sub, they are doing many decisions to make the subscription the only viable option to get a certain character (higher prices for non-subscribers, limiting production, limited sale time, limited place of purchase, sub-par ordering site/delivery system). I'm not saying any of these choices are right or wrong, just that they all point towards the subscription as the optimum solution.

This is a toy line, not food. None of us *need* these, we just want them.

Again, absolutely correct. That's why I didn't use food for my analogy. I used soda water which, to my knowledge, is not necessary for human existence. It's a consumer luxury preference.

[MegaGearMax]

Fan bias? Isn't it just consumer choice? That's like saying Coca-Cola buyers have bias when they buy Coca-Cola instead of Tab. So, in order to increase their profits, the Coca-Cola company makes a customer buy a can of Tab when they buy a 6-pack of Coca-Cola. This way, the Coca-Cola company can avoid the customer bias that would prevent them from making money otherwise.

That's a way of looking at it, but were talking MOTU fans here. Some fans HATE POP, 200X or NA on general principal.

It's really semantics. Like your iron-clad contracts for souls and the fine print.

[Death Weed]

Fan bias? Isn't it just consumer choice? That's like saying Coca-Cola buyers have bias when they buy Coca-Cola instead of Tab. So, in order to increase their profits, the Coca-Cola company makes a customer buy a can of Tab when they buy a 6-pack of Coca-Cola. This way, the Coca-Cola company can avoid the customer bias that would prevent them from making money otherwise.

Fan bias is the people who try to say that Optikk doesn't fit in with the rest of the figures, yet Man-E-Faces (who's the same exact figure but with a different head and armor) very clearly does. No, he fits exactly the same since this line has no theme. NA is too sci-fi, but Roboto isn't. Superheros don't fit in the line, but cyborg cowboys, demon ninjas do and robots with wheels on their chests do. No, Roboto is more sci-fi, they just hate Flipshot because they're biased against NA and try to make up some random excuse instead of just saying it.

[citizens_X]

Fan bias is the people who try to say that Optikk doesn't fit in with the rest of the figures, yet Man-E-Faces (who's the same exact figure but with a different head and armor) very clearly does. No, he fits exactly the same since this line has no theme. NA is too sci-fi, but Roboto isn't. Superheros don't fit in the line, but cyborg cowboys, demon ninjas do and robots with wheels on their chests do. No, Roboto is more sci-fi, they just hate Flipshot because they're biased against NA and try to make up some random excuse instead of just saying it.

I think that Optikk fits in just fine myself, when i first saw Optikk I thought he was a vintage figure that I had somehow missed. I did a little research and found out that he was a NA character. I didn't realize at the time that the line was putting out not only MOTU but POP, NA, 200x as well.. at first I was interested in just vintage motu exclusively but I've come to love it all. There's such a variety of different characters in this line, I can't imagine any one not fitting.

[bcrduke]

I think that Optikk fits in just fine myself, when i first saw Optikk I thought he was a vintage figure that I had somehow missed. I did a little research and found out that he was a NA character. I didn't realize at the time that the line was putting out not only MOTU but POP, NA, 200x as well.. at first I was interested in just vintage motu exclusively but I've come to love it all. There's such a variety of different characters in this line, I can't imagine any one not fitting.

This is awesome!! It speaks to my question about whether fans can just forget about the origins of different characters, and just enjoy them in the context of MOTUC

The all-inclusive nature of the line is exciting. Frankly, ANY reboot of MOTU would have had the potential to include all of these subsets of characters. That's why I don't understand disliking a character based solely on principle. Many here would claim they don't do that, but pointing out that some people can love MEF but hate Optikk is a good example of the limitation some collectors place on their own perception of the line.

I mean, should every reboot of MOTU only ever be limited to just vintage MOTU??

[EldestSon]

I think that Optikk fits in just fine myself, when i first saw Optikk I thought he was a vintage figure that I had somehow missed. I did a little research and found out that he was a NA character. I didn't realize at the time that the line was putting out not only MOTU but POP, NA, 200x as well.. at first I was interested in just vintage motu exclusively but I've come to love it all. There's such a variety of different characters in this line, I can't imagine any one not fitting.

i had the same experience with this fig. i didn't know what the heck NA when optikk was shown, but when i saw him, i thought he was really cool and totally fit as a motu figure.

[Ibentmyman-thing]

I'm interested in building a Universe. That's the name of the line. Universe. With a "Masters of" in front of it. And a "The". Masters of the Universe. I want as much diversity and bizarreness that can be crammed into it. To me that means there's room for Elephant-headed men, frilly pink women, science fiction amalgams, purple-suited superheroish people, Barbarians, humanoids with cameras on their heads, and Errol Flynn type guys with hearts on their aristocratic chest armor. I also want the chance to have sentient bunnies and badass black guys with mohawks wielding axes. I want one toyline that isn't held back by test-groups and marketing ideas and anal-retentive suits and is perfectly willing to toss every wild thing in there and is it's own cocktail of frickin' awesomeness. My imagination can caulk the gaps between what on the surface may seem not to fit, like it did when I was a kid. So there is no filler to me, it's all a big hodgepodge that builds the universe. If that means I have to wait a bit to get some of the original toys remade, then I can do that.

[shadowfall1976]

POP has grown on me, but I never had a bias against POP at all anyway, other than the vintage toys were dolls...I just originally wanted my vintage used to haves...but now I'll buy whatever looks good to me...I do admit I don't like 200X or NA at all...I don't hide that fact...I don't like the original 200X figures or animation...but if I knew more story wise, at least that I could have a chance to like...but to me NA & He-Man don't mix..it's a whole different direction I don't like that He-Man took, and to me I don't like it..but it's perfectly OK if someone else does, I can totally disregard that aspect of MOTU myself....and so far none of the figures of either 200X or NA in Classics do I like except maybe Carnivus & Grayskull....but to be completely fair...I don't like Classics Clawful, Whiplash, Snout Spout, Tytus, Megator...etc..either, and they are vintage based. To me the figure has to look right and cool to me, otherwise I won't buy it no matter which subline of MOTU it came from.

[Berserker79]

This is awesome!! It speaks to my question about whether fans can just forget about the origins of different characters, and just enjoy them in the context of MOTUC

The all-inclusive nature of the line is exciting. Frankly, ANY reboot of MOTU would have had the potential to include all of these subsets of characters. That's why I don't understand disliking a character based solely on principle. Many here would claim they don't do that, but pointing out that some people can love MEF but hate Optikk is a good example of the limitation some collectors place on their own perception of the line.

I mean, should every reboot of MOTU only ever be limited to just vintage MOTU??

I wouldn`t mind that...

[bcrduke]

I wouldn`t mind that...

I think at this point you're just trying to bust me.

You'd rather MOTU be severely limited and never grow? no new characters? No expansion of the universe the characters inhabit?

There would be so much lost potential if such parameters were placed on the property.

Fortunately, I think you're in the minority.

[Swanmarsh]

Fan bias is the people who try to say that Optikk doesn't fit in with the rest of the figures, yet Man-E-Faces (who's the same exact figure but with a different head and armor) very clearly does. No, he fits exactly the same since this line has no theme. NA is too sci-fi, but Roboto isn't. Superheros don't fit in the line, but cyborg cowboys, demon ninjas do and robots with wheels on their chests do. No, Roboto is more sci-fi, they just hate Flipshot because they're biased against NA and try to make up some random excuse instead of just saying it.

Speaking as someone who is not a fan of NA (I've hated the series for 20 years now) I think you have created a flawed straw man to pose an argument.

I don't think there are many fans against NA because its 'too sci-fi'. I think some fans hate NA because it ba$tardi$ed He-Man into a buck rogers character, the power sword into a light saber, Skeletor into a crazed cyborg loon, the Sorceress into a computer bug, transferred the Power of Grayskull out of the castle and into a Space Ship and ditched Eternia and every other MOTU character except He-Man and Skeletor (and as far as I'm concerned them in name only!).

Likewise, I don't think the Flipshot haters make up some excuse, usually they just say honestly they are not interested in NA in their collection. I bought him with the sub but there's no way in Despondos he's escaping his mailer box. A similar fate will befall all the heroic NA figures.

I think Optikk is in a different category. I can look at Optikk, and Slushhead, and some of the other mutants in a similar vein to Sticky Fingers or the Slavemaster or Aramesh. If these Filmation space pirates have a place in MOTU, then I can see a place for marauding space mutants in my MOTUC collection and even for them to team up with the original (but not NA) Skeletor.

[MegaGearMax]

Speaking as someone who is not a fan of NA (I've hated the series for 20 years now) I think you have created a flawed straw man to pose an argument.

I don't think there are many fans against NA because its 'too sci-fi'. I think some fans hate NA because it ba$tardi$ed He-Man into a buck rogers character, the power sword into a light saber, Skeletor into a crazed cyborg loon, the Sorceress into a computer bug, transferred the Power of Grayskull out of the castle and into a Space Ship and ditched Eternia and every other MOTU character except He-Man and Skeletor (and as far as I'm concerned them in name only!).

I think many NA haters never reached the mini-comics that were inside the package to know that. They either saw the cartoon and hated it because it wasn't Filmation or they saw the figures weren't the squat, beefy bodybuilders of the MOTU line.

It's all about what NA wasn't, not what it was.

[Benedict Judas Hel]

I think many NA haters never reached the mini-comics that were inside the package to know that. They either saw the cartoon and hated it because it wasn't Filmation or they saw the figures weren't the squat, beefy bodybuilders of the MOTU line.

It's all about what NA wasn't, not what it was.

Well, although I have never seen the Jetlag NA cartoon, I hear the general consensus in these parts is that it wasn't very good. Not because it wasn't Filmation but because it just wasn't good. So, that's a pretty broad generalization you're painting there about non-NA fans, MGM.

[fball13z]

Man I thought we all could move past this MOTU vs POP vs NA vs 200X, when I look at these figures I see MOTUC, thats it.

Before MOTUC, I was mostly a MOTU/200X only fan, but has I started to see more figures from POP & NA, I started to dig them. I wanted to learn more about them, where they came from, what stories they were part of.


Im sorry Bow is still one of my fav figures so far lol, and Catra is a sexy little vixen lol.

[citizens_X]

Well, although I have never seen the Jetlag NA cartoon, I hear the general consensus in these parts is that it wasn't very good. Not because it wasn't Filmation but because it just wasn't good. So, that's a pretty broad generalization you're painting there about non-NA fans, MGM.

I saw the cartoon when i was a kid and was disappointed with it, i don't remember much bout it actually, i hated that the cartoon only had He-Man and Skeletor though, and featured none of the other characters i loved and was familiar with, gonna pick it up off ebay and revisit it. i'm not going to dismiss the NA Classics figures because i didn't like the cartoon, i like the Classics Optikk figure and Slush-Head looks awesome!!! i still might not like the cartoon after checking it out again but i'll be more familiar with the characters anyway.
NA did give us lots of cool characters, i can't wait to see them in the Classics line.

[MegaGearMax]

Well, although I have never seen the Jetlag NA cartoon, I hear the general consensus in these parts is that it wasn't very good. Not because it wasn't Filmation but because it just wasn't good. So, that's a pretty broad generalization you're painting there about non-NA fans, MGM.

It is pretty broad. I don't think most fans can be that fair and objective with NA, especially when they were just coming off watching Filmation cartoons back then.

Man I thought we all could move past this MOTU vs POP vs NA vs 200X, when I look at these figures I see MOTUC, thats it.

Some fans aren't here to get them all. Only their favorite eras.

[EtherianChronicles]

I think many NA haters never reached the mini-comics that were inside the package to know that. They either saw the cartoon and hated it because it wasn't Filmation or they saw the figures weren't the squat, beefy bodybuilders of the MOTU line.

It's all about what NA wasn't, not what it was.

If people just don't care for something, it doesn't make them "haters".

And I don't fit in either of your categories, either. By the time NA came out I was a pre-teen, and still buying action figures. But I can't recall ever even flipping the channel and seeing the show, much less liking or disliking it because it was or was not Filmation. It was not nearly as successfully syndicated as He-man or She-ra was (it never hit the critical mass they did), and it didn't hang around very long, either. While He-man and She-ra continued to run for many years after they ceased production, NA really didn't.

My only memories of it are seeing the toys in the store and thinking, "yuck, so basically they took the personality out of the characters (bland'd them up) and made them look like every other generic action figure out there. And that's all I really know of it.

Interestingly enough, I finally got the DVDs last week so I can finally finish my BCI spine mural. I'll give the show a try. I think the 200x toys are for the most part unattractive, but I enjoy the show, so who knows. I'm willing to give it a try.

Personally I am fine with some NA releases in the line, but I think the reason we don't see more is simple math. It's the opposite of the PoP situation. They blew through the big MOTU figures so quickly they are trying to drag out the Glimmers, etc., but all indicators are that PoP characters are a) well-received and b) sell well. I mean, how many MOTU fans who two years ago said, "I ain't buyin' girls toys!" now proudly have a large white and pink foot and a half wide unicorn with rainbow wings in their collection?

With NA figures, I think people are more blase (not biased, blase - nonchalant, etc.) because there are far less of us even familiar with the line or the characters, and it's drastic departure from all the other MOTU eras (which feature a more primitive society with some technology as opposed to a technological society with more primitive social features). I have every figure in the line except for the NA ones, but now that I am trying to complete my collection I am finally picking them up, slowly. I'll even get Slush-Head, even though I don't particularly find him very evocative of MOTU (he feels more like another line, but I can't put my finger on which one).

But I think the overall reason we haven't seen more is that there isn't the overwhelming demand for them. Sure, one can find threads about any part of MOTU here because this is the place people go to discuss all MOTU, but for example on MattyCollector - it's rare to see someone post about them. It happens, just not nearly as often as people post about Vintage, or even Mini-Comics/Pre-Eternia/PoP. I will say, though, I am surprised they haven't at least done an NA-influenced He-man yet, but then again things like Slush-head are probably more interesting to non-NA fans than a He-man re-do. I'm interested when I check out the show to see if any characters jump out that I'd really like to see as figures as I'm really not familiar with any of them.

[Benedict Judas Hel]

Man I thought we all could move past this MOTU vs POP vs NA vs 200X, when I look at these figures I see MOTUC, thats it.

Before MOTUC, I was mostly a MOTU/200X only fan, but has I started to see more figures from POP & NA, I started to dig them. I wanted to learn more about them, where they came from, what stories they were part of.


Im sorry Bow is still one of my fav figures so far lol, and Catra is a sexy little vixen lol.

I fully stand behind everything you wrote except the last thing. You should never apologize about who your favorite figure is. That's your choice, your preference, and your right. The only time you would need to apologize is when you start telling other people that Bow should be their favorite figure as well.

It is pretty broad. I don't think most fans can be that fair and objective with NA, especially when they were just coming off watching Filmation cartoons back then.

Really? Why not? Do you think they lack the mental faculties to do so? Would you classify the NA cartoon as an excellent or even good cartoon? If so, why? I would like to know what are the variables that you consider the contributing factors for making a show "good"? Character development? Story lines? Animation quality? Voice characterizations? Humor? Story arcs?
And I know the term "good" is subjective in itself since this is a cartoon for children and we are adults (physically at least). And as such, we cannot fully appreciate the magnitude of "good" from the eyes of a child.

Some fans aren't here to get them all. Only their favorite eras.

And I would say there is nothing wrong with that...

[bizzysim3]

That's what sucks about liking only one brand.i feel the same way about na. Aside from slush head, I'm not interested in the series. But it's what you have to endure because the other brands help finance the line too. Just cast your vote by not buying the figures you don't like. If enought people aren't buying a certain series, I'm sure Matty will adjust their releases accordingly. good journey.

[MegaGearMax]

I
Really? Why not? Do you think they lack the mental faculties to do so? Would you classify the NA cartoon as an excellent or even good cartoon? If so, why? I would like to know what are the variables that you consider the contributing factors for making a show "good"? Character development? Story lines? Animation quality? Voice characterizations? Humor? Story arcs?
And I know the term "good" is subjective in itself since this is a cartoon for children and we are adults (physically at least). And as such, we cannot fully appreciate the magnitude of "good" from the eyes of a child.

It's not mental faculties. Some fans didn't like NA's cartoon because it wasn't Filmation, which is what they are used to. They don't usually judge the NA cartoon on it's own merits.

NA is usually judged and crucified on what it isn't--namely vintage MOTU.

[Rakashian Calamari]

Late to the post, but to address the original prompt, I'm inclined to side with the original argument. I like it that all people get what they want today in MOTUC, however, I don't feel everyone should be on the hook to support something that isn't as in-demand. Mattel knows this and the hardcore fans of XYZ character knows this. Without the sub numbers, Perfuma will never get made. (which I'm okay with, not to be a douche) Ram-Man, Two-Bad, Frosta, Glimmer, Rokkon, Stonedar, all deserve figures before some of the "filler" we've been given. I don't see not wanting EVERY MOTU associated character as hating the property or wanting to throw up roadblocks to people who want stuff, but you have to admit certain people are core to the franchise and need to be issued without the gimmick of sub sales or being a sub exclusive. I think it's a devious business tactic and dissension is bound to grow in the ranks. If Demo-Man is any indication of how well a pre-order system could work, I think they should throw out a poll and gauge the temperature of the market. I mean really get to know what people want to see in the line. Give everyone who orders a chance to vote on a 3rd party polling site, something not affiliated with Mattel/Matty or the .ORG. If it meets a certain threshold then it gets made. I'm not wanting to be inflammatory to anyone's personal wishlist but some characters don't need to be issued if there are only a few who want them. Vikor, Illumina, etc...while neat nuances to the line are rather obscure, and not for everyone. Sharp drop offs in sales will indicate where the line should not go, but I don't want to miss out on Ram-Man for example just to get a figure of the guy in the yellow jump suit playing tug of war and have him sell poorly enough that it contributes to Mattel's logistical mumbo jumbo.

[Benedict Judas Hel]

I think many NA haters never reached the mini-comics that were inside the package to know that. They either saw the cartoon and hated it because it wasn't Filmation or they saw the figures weren't the squat, beefy bodybuilders of the MOTU line.

Some fans didn't like NA's cartoon because it wasn't Filmation, which is what they are used to. They don't usually judge the NA cartoon on it's own merits.

So you've gone from many fans to some fans. Which is it?

NA is usually judged and crucified on what it isn't--namely vintage MOTU.

Really? Where is this information located where you base this broad and sweeping finding of yours on?