Toyguru Mattycollector.com MOTUC news thread August 2011

[bcrduke]

We actually were going to look into this but now that sub sales have dropped compared to 2010 and 2011 we may have to hold off on any line explansions at this time. Maybe one day!

The brand is going GREAT, and we are hitting the min number of baseline fan we need. But the lower overall sub sales for 2012 (compared to 2010 and 2011)have caused us to drop a few as yet announced non-sub items we were exploring for late 2012. Additionally the lower 2012 sub sales have caused us to reevaluate how many skus we will include in the sub for 2013. With the baseline going down signifigantly, it is a bit harder to justify to management any additional line explansions.

Well, I guess the rumors I'd heard about Castle Grayskull being shown at a Con are now put to rest.

This response makes me so angry.

So now we lose out because people are hesitant to buy a subscription from a company who still, after 2.5 years or more, can't get things running smoothly between quality control, customer service, and even distribution (on other lines they manage).

The tone is typical of Toyguru when something goes awry. IT'S NEVER HIS FAULT.

Subscription sales were down because BULK Secondary-Market sellers didn't buy as much (because there IS a subscription available, and by now everyone knows it, so why buy from the secondary market at all?) AND because a LOT of casual collectors left the line due to poor quality control and bad customer service. The former reason was bound to happen, and that's no one's fault. The latter reason? That's the brand manager's team's fault.

Between the credit card change problems, shipping issues, and address-change snafus Mattel is lucky they got ANY subscribers... and all of that is the responsibility of the Brand Manager and his team.

Yet he's still trying to scare everyone into buying a second subscription.

Guess what?! No. Sorry, Toyguru, your scare tactic backfired.

HONESTLY, I was considering buying a second one. Last night, I was reviewing the DC Sub, and realized that they would actually be selling the sub figures each month outside of the sub... BIG mistake, if you ask me, because they lost the sale the moment I saw that piece of info. I had not, up until then, realized they would be following the model. At the DC Panel at SDCC, FanGirl said "you will only be able to get these figures if you purchase a subcription." I'm sure she meant, "you will only be able to guarantee your purchasing..." but I still thought that they would not be offering these outside of the sub.

ANYWAY, my point is that I started to think, "well, I might want to get the second MOTUC sub after all."

Today, I read Toyguru's comments (pasted above). Now he makes it sound like we are being punished for not buying enough subs, even though Mattel's poor handling of the line, with regard to quality control and its continued use of Digital River, has driven away countless casual buyers.

So what difference does it make?

Do they honestly think that less subscriptions means less sales of a Castle Grayskull playset???? If anything, it means that if they properly advertise, they might be able to sell a significant amount of those sets to people who ddin't buy a sub and have a few extra dollars as a result.

I think the line will still do great. Just less people can afford the sub, or multiple subs. We still don't know how well each figure will do next month, and I'm kinda surprised by how Mattel seems committed to only one business model and seems to not even care about the regular sales anymore.
What if most of the time the regular sales will make up for the missing subs? But of course they expect less buyers in general, so the lowered the numbers. Maybe if we go back to 5 minutes sell-outs, they'll notice they got something wrong...

All of this just proves that Mattel, as usual, is using MOTU as its 'ho' and it has no real interest in the longevity of the line OR Mattycollector.com

If it does, then it needs a new person managing the lines that are the life-blood of that website/venture.

I don't understand why Mattel seems disinterested in mattycollector.

Though, this may all be a bunch of bull, and they are just trying to squeeze as many sub purchases out of us as they can.

It's all smarmy

[fball13z]

Ok now even I am starting to get depressed with the stuff that TG is saying

No, additional items have nothing to so with how the Windraider sells. We base line explansions (abovce and beyond sub items) on the baseline of subscribers we get knowing how many total fans are "all in".

Now that the number of subs for 2012 looks to be our lowest "all in" yet we will need to reconsider how many non sub items we do in 2012 as well as how many sub items we do in 2013. We've heard a lot of fans saying they backed out of the sub due to too many offerings and the total price tag on the sub. Much like other collector lines, fans vote with their purchase and the fewer "all in" baseline fans, the fewer items in total we can produce.

[Berserker79]

It is clearly what emotions are raised up by this brand with its potential and its problems.

I agree, that this "scare tactics" are a bad method to motivate consumers buying subs.

[Jun-Yor]

For the sake of speculation, which I normally hate to do, I would bet that the total number of PEOPLE that have ordered subs for 2012 has stayed about the same. I think the possible "fall off" is from the larger e-tailers not ordering so many total subs becuase a lot of them still have stock of figures from this past year, and even 2010.

Those stores probably have a better handle on what the after market actually is after a couple of years. I think Mattel is discovering that too. The first year or two of any line that is planned to go for several years are always the biggest sellers, but those numbers are inflated in terms of the long-term. There is always natural evening out, usually from the hype coming back down to Earth.

I am positive that MOTUC is in great shape and we will see it go for a long time to come. I think we will see a lot of new things as well, but the structure and timing just shifts a bit. I am still very optimistic for somthing like Grayskull, but they might need a new way of doing it. Pre-Orders with required minimums (like what is happening with the DC sub) might be a reality for some items in this line that we would never see any other way. I think Grayskull can do it.

All lines are organic, it will ultimately help this one grow even stronger.

Took the words outta my mouth. Heaven forbid a toy stays online at Matty for 4 days after start of sale. Matty went up and up and up with order quantities until the resellers realized they weren't making 40-50 bucks a toy anymore, and stopped overordering so many. The sweet spot is still being found, and an ebb and flow will naturally occur. They need the numbers down to keep the line hot and illustrate to TPTB that the line is still a sell-out. That is good for us. If you have a sub, you are golden. If you don't...best of luck each month. The line will continue. The sky is not falling.

[Jean]

It's sad to hear that the subscriptions are having an impact on a potential Castle Grayskull. I can only imagine how awesome it would be to have a big 4H sculpted playset to display all of our equally awesome action figures.

[bcrduke]

We've heard a lot of fans saying they backed out of the sub due to too many offerings and the total price tag on the sub. Much like other collector lines, fans vote with their purchase and the fewer "all in" baseline fans, the fewer items in total we can produce.

Is he KIDDING!?!?

PEOPLE BACKED OUT OF THE SUB BECAUSE IT'S CHEAPER TO ORDER EACH ITEM (SUB and NON-SUB) TOGETHER EACH MONTH, than it is to order a sub, and then pay separate shipping and tax on another order of non-sub, and extraneous non-MOTUC lines.

THIS IS THE BRAND MANAGER & MATTEL'S FAULT.

I'm sorry for the caps, but apparently he just doesn't get that.

Here's an example:

I have a subscription. For November of 2011, I will receive:

Snout Spout (x2): $40.00
Battleground Evil-Lyn (x2): $40.00
Swiftwind (x2): $60.00
----------------------------------------
$140.00
Shipping (approx): $ 14.00 (I still have UPS)
TAX (on items AND Shipping): $ 13.67 (8.875%)
----------------------------------------
$167.67




THEN, I want at least TWO "Bubble Power She-Ra" figures:

Bubble Power She-Ra (x2): $40.00
Shipping (approx): $13.15 (based on 2x Clawful shipping)
Tax: $ 4.73 (8.875%)
---------------------------------------
$57.88



Now, based on how UPS does its shipping, if they had allowed me the opportunity to add-in the 2 BP She-Ra figures, I would have saved the extra $13.15, and whatever tax on that.

So instead of $225.55 (167.67 + 57.88), I would have paid, $208.00 ($208 is worst case scenario... the shipping on the entire order might still be $12... I upped it to $14 to be conservative).

I'm basing this on my JULY and AUGUST 2011 invoices (I still don't know why I paid $1 more for shipping 2 Clawfuls than I am paying to ship 2 Megators and 2 MEF figures).

But my point is that if you Subscribe, you are going to pay more. And Mattel STILL can't guarantee that the ADD-IN Sub for the 30th Anniversary figures will happen. They've said that they can't guarantee that until late September at the earliest.

That is ridiculous not only because it will cost subscribers a ton if they don't make it happen, but also because they are now trying to GUILT customers into buying more subscriptions, even though those customers have been loyal to this brand and company through thick and thin.

It's ridiculous.

[Thrawn29]

PEOPLE BACKED OUT OF THE SUB BECAUSE IT'S CHEAPER TO ORDER EACH ITEM (SUB and NON-SUB) TOGETHER EACH MONTH, than it is to order a sub, and then pay separate shipping and tax on another order of non-sub, and extraneous non-MOTUC lines.

This is another factor I forgot to mention as well. Why have multiple subs when I still have to go onto that unholy website every other month to order items not included in the sub?

[Dark Sorceress]

i only got 1 sub thanks to the crap customer service and BG Evil-Lyn. more fig's in the sub had NOTHING to do with it

[tumalu]

I'm so depressed after reading those answers..

But, honestly, I can't be mad at Mattel..they did a great job at Comic Con this year, it was the best since the start of the line..filmation, anniversary figures, cac contest, amazing new sculpts, I really do feel all the efforts they put to support the line, and i think they would have deserved to see their expectations repaid through an increase of subscriptions sold.

I also understand Toyguru's reasons, no matter what we say Mattel has to follow a business model and manage commercial risk, they're not willing to risk resources for the line if they're not ensured a minimum revenue through subscripions.

I can't get mad at cherry pickers either, they do have their rightful reasons if they decide not to buy a subscription, high costs in primis.

Nontheless, I'm so sad...things were just going so great

[Jun-Yor]

Is he KIDDING!?!?

PEOPLE BACKED OUT OF THE SUB BECAUSE IT'S CHEAPER TO ORDER EACH ITEM (SUB and NON-SUB) TOGETHER EACH MONTH, than it is to order a sub, and then pay separate shipping and tax on another order of non-sub, and extraneous non-MOTUC lines.

Reading comprehension. Too many offerings is obviously referring to the extra variants, beasts, and other figures people did not want in a sub. Some folks JUST wanted He-Man and MOTU. Folks didn't want shadow beasts or Gygor, or even Tytus.

Some would rather take their chances and spend $100 on the guys they want than go all-in for $300+ when they don't want it all. That is less money for the non-sub buyer. That's what he meant.

[RyanSD]

Based on the lower then expected sales of the 2012 MOTUC sub (though still well above the min we needed), we are actually reviewing all of 2013 in terms of how many skus will be included now. A lot is in flux now that sub sales were signifigantly lower compared to 2010 and 2011 subs. With a lower "baseline" we have to reevaluate the 2013 line up. It was heavily reliant on what our baseline was of fans buying "anything".

'Signifigantly' lower...

See, that's the problem. the baseline of fans weren't buying just 'anything'. Most purchased the sub to avoid the headache of dealing with their awful site and non-existant sale times. People weren't clamoring for all the c and d-list characters that have been coming out, a lot of people just wanted their vintage figures remade and were happy to get the occasional c-lister, but not 4 or 5 a year. They've tried to artificially extend the life of this line by adding figures and characters that weren't needed. They changed their business model to rely on a notion that 'most fans bought the sub' which simply wasn't true. They can't possibly think that there are as many people who want Optikk as they do a Trap-Jaw.

Then they drove just as many people away with the fact that unless they had a sub, they couldn't get the figures. They've done nothing to try to get new fans into the line. They've just done everything they could to drive away everyone but the hardcore fans. They ran this line like it wasn't going to end, when in reality it always had an end date. To think the line was going to sell as well and be as hot as it was in February 2010 was just stupid.

*Edit* Jun-Yor said it well. Instead of releasing Grayskull at the line's peak, we got Gygor, and Shadow Beasts, and Star Sisters instead - which, unfortunately to some, most fans just didn't want. Believe it or not, I would think that the majority of fans JUST wanted He-Man and MOTU. They were fine going along with the line when we still needed a sizable portion of the vintage figures, but now they see they'll only get 5 or 6 a year, if that, and most people aren't going to commit $500+ just to get the few remaining vintage figures they want. The line is built on nostalgia, especially with no new media to complement the line.

[MegaGearMax]

3 new answers are up!

[Count Marzo]

Not everyone can afford or be handcuffed to what they call an "all-in" sub.

I'm one of those people. I buy just as much IF NOT MORE than I would if I ever had a sub. I mean I appreciate the subscribers since they are the foundation of their set up here, but I bet there are a lot of buyers like me that don't believe in what they call an "all-in subscription" so I don't like how they base what they can and cant sell on the subscribers alone.

I'd rather buy everything myself on their terrible website each month. What if I want an extra figure? Tax and shipping costs more than half the regular price of a figure and I'm definitely not gettin ripped on that nonsense.

[bcrduke]

Reading comprehension. Too many offerings is obviously referring to the extra variants, beasts, and other figures people did not want in a sub. Some folks JUST wanted He-Man and MOTU. Folks didn't want shadow beasts or Gygor, or even Tytus.

Some would rather take their chances and spend $100 on the guys they want than go all-in for $300+ when they don't want it all. That is less money for the non-sub buyer. That's what he meant.

"Reading Comprehension?" I hope you're not knocking my intelligence there...

I KNOW that what he may have meant was what you speak of... and that is definitely a component... but I'd bet that more people avoided subscriptions this year because they know it will be cheaper to order individually each month (MOTU items are no longer selling out in minutes... if you are on the day they go on sale, you're fine), than did people who don't want variants/beasts/etc.

I'd rather buy everything myself on their terrible website each month. What if I want an extra figure? Tax and shipping costs more than half the regular price of a figure and I'm definitely not gettin ripped on that nonsense.

Exactly! This is an ongoing glitch.

[Hordak]

Wow so they are now basing the sales on subscriptions to determine certain releases. This is awful. If they want to sell subscriptions then they need to handle them like a first class flight. Many of us are waiting on our August subs to ship still when others who purchased the toys manually on sale day already have shipped items.

This is not encouraging me to want to continue to subscribe. I have already purchased a sub for next year but why should that have any effect on certain items not being released? Especially Castle Greyskull which is something many would buy just because it is such an icon of the toyline.

I see greed in Mattel and it is really putting a foul mood over a great toyline. To hear that they were thinking of Castle Greyskull but decided against it based on sub sales is just sad and I agree with bcrduke. This seems like a scare tactic to try and sell subs while still offering sub par customer service and quality control.

Hey Mattel. If your toys are selling out that is a good thing! Make the toys we all want and don't let this line end earlier than it should have.

[RyanSD]

The ironic thing is that this line was started based solely on day of sales. The whole sub idea was only put in to place to help their terrible website handle traffic better.

The moment they said 'We figured everyone who wanted these figures bought a sub' was the moment this line was put on a timer. The very fact that they assume everyone is going to jump in feet first and blindly commit to 12 months worth of product is laughable at best. They got lucky that it worked for 2 years as well as it did.

MOTUC - Great figures and terrific designs marred by terrible production methods and extremely flawed management.

[markatisu]

The ironic thing is that this line was started based solely on day of sales. The whole sub idea was only put in to place to help their terrible website handle traffic better.

The moment they said 'We figured everyone who wanted these figures bought a sub' was the moment this line was put on a timer. The very fact that they assume everyone is going to jump in feet first and blindly commit to 12 months worth of product is laughable at best. They got lucky that it worked for 2 years as well as it did.

MOTUC - Great figures and terrific designs marred by terrible production methods and extremely flawed management.

Wow you and some others here are going to be best friends now, you all apparently know everything there is to know about how the line runs.

The sub allows for them to have a baseline, its not the best guide but it does not make overall production easier. The way they are using it is not the best, MOTUC fans have been used to prop up all the other lines for 2 years now. Its almost deplorable that we buy whatever they put up but the other lines crash and burn...yet its somehow our fault for not buying more

The line can support 12 figures blindly with ease, you are talking about $240. I can guarantee you despite the complaining and such that if it was just a straight 12 fig sub it would be at 2010 and 2011 levels.

[bcrduke]

Agreed.

I think the cost is a big factor, especially with Mattel selling other subscriptions that may have lured buyers away from buying two, or maybe even one MOTUC subscription.


We can all get along though.

None of us knows exactly how this line works, because we aren't privy to the numbers... but we all have a decent idea of what the results might be of different decisions that are made. Many of us have been collecting toys for a long time and have seen ups and downs in the toy-collecting market, and the market-at-large, as well as what has worked for companies and what hasn't.

I just try to take a common-sense approach. I never try to assert that I am necessarily right... I just try to ask questions. They might not be questions Mattel wants to hear

[Scorpia]

Existing fans have pockets that are only so deep. I'd be interested to know how many subs have been sold to international fans vs previous years. I dropped mine after last year and I know other UK-based peeps who haven't bought this year.

Mattel need to be concentrating on bringing new fans to MOTUC and the partnership with Classic Media could help them do this IF done properly.

[Darkspecter]

I think sales of subs would be better if they offered the TIERED subs people have been asking for!

12 figures
12 + 4 variants
12 + 4 + beasts/oversized figures
All in

I'm sure if they did that, the same completists would buy the "All in" sub still and maybe an additional 12 figure sub. The ones who are NOT buying the sub, would get either the 12 figure or 12 + 4 figure sub because it's more affordable.

I truly believe they would have more sales if they did this.

It's sad hearing TG's comments. It sounds like the end of the line is coming soon.

[RyanSD]

Wow you and some others here are going to be best friends now, you all apparently know everything there is to know about how the line runs.

The sub allows for them to have a baseline, its not the best guide but it does not make overall production easier. The way they are using it is not the best, MOTUC fans have been used to prop up all the other lines for 2 years now. Its almost deplorable that we buy whatever they put up but the other lines crash and burn...yet its somehow our fault for not buying more

The line can support 12 figures blindly with ease, you are talking about $240. I can guarantee you despite the complaining and such that if it was just a straight 12 fig sub it would be at 2010 and 2011 levels.

I didn't say I know how the line runs, just commented on what happened in the past.

I would assume that if it was just the basic 12 figures in the sub then sub numbers would be higher. But as of now, that's not how the sub is, and subs are significantly lower. And as such, they are modifying 2013's line-up based on that.

[markatisu]

I think sales of subs would be better if they offered the TIERED subs people have been asking for!

12 figures
12 + 4 variants
12 + 4 + beasts/oversized figures
All in

I'm sure if they did that, the same completists would buy the "All in" sub still and maybe an additional 12 figure sub. The ones who are NOT buying the sub, would get either the 12 figure or 12 + 4 figure sub because it's more affordable.

I truly believe they would have more sales if they did this.

It's sad hearing TG's comments. It sounds like the end of the line is coming soon.

No it does not sound like the end is coming soon, it just sounds like they need to streamline.

The end is coming soon when there is not enough subs to meet the min

Nobody has yet wanted to realize the min number needed is for ALL the stuff they announced. You realize how much stuff we are getting in 2012??

I try not to lose my temper often but I swear sometimes around here it gets mighty hard. Emotions build and people don't see the forest for the trees, they assume the worst and pray for the mediocre.

The line is not dead, the line is not dying, the line is moving along. When we get to pre 2009 figures every month and that is it then do the sky is falling routine.

Also wanting tiered subs? Digital River can barely handle orders you make on sales day and you want them to manage like 4 sub options? We are having to wait while they figure out if they can add-on the 30th so that should tell you how realistic tiered subbing is.

I didn't say I know how the line runs, just commented on what happened in the past.

I would assume that if it was just the basic 12 figures in the sub then sub numbers would be higher. But as of now, that's not how the sub is, and subs are significantly lower. And as such, they are modifying 2013's line-up based on that.

Yes a sub that includes more stuff than any of the previous 2, I am sorry the entire world did not opt in for everything but the way Scott is making it sound we are on the level of JLU fans which is FAR from the case

[RyanSD]

No it does not sound like the end is coming soon, it just sounds like they need to streamline.

The end is coming soon when there is not enough subs to meet the min

Nobody has yet wanted to realize the min number needed is for ALL the stuff they announced. You realize how much stuff we are getting in 2012??

I try not to lose my temper often but I swear sometimes around here it gets mighty hard. Emotions build and people don't see the forest for the trees, they assume the worst and pray for the mediocre.

The line is not dead, the line is not dying, the line is moving along. When we get to pre 2009 figures every month and that is it then do the sky is falling routine.

Also wanting tiered subs? Digital River can barely handle orders you make on sales day and you want them to manage like 4 sub options? We are having to wait while they figure out if they can add-on the 30th so that should tell you how realistic tiered subbing is.

You're absolutely right. And I'm as much to blame as anyone. It just really peeved me that the idea of a Grayskull was in the works, but is now not in the cards because of the 2012 sub sales.

Call me a pessimist, but I'm still a bit gun shy about Mattel's lines since 200x. Its easy as a MOTU fan to jump the gun on these things. Like someone posted, we kind of have that battered fan mentality. The first time Mattel waves their fist, we cower thinking the worst.

[Darkspecter]

I don't know, Mark. Dropping planned product is never a good sign.

[markatisu]

I just wish everyone would breath, right now this is the reaction to everything Scott posts



The other thing that gets me is where is the smack talk of GB, those figures never move during sale day but yet not one peep out about their sub being lower/etc. I guess the variant train of all 4 GB in different suits is the key

I don't know, Mark. Dropping planned product is never a good sign.

Dropping planned product 1 1/2 years in advance from a company that says they cannot comment 2-3 months in advance?

I can tell you all the grand plans I have for stuff I have not done yet as well