He-Ro and He-Ro, II are the same guy?

[13977]

Well this is a cool idea but my thoughts are that since Adam is King He-Man maybe Dare takes the name He-Ro to pay homage to the fallen legend.

Sure why not, now SLL is in the future and training Dare I'm sure he's told him all about the original He-Ro.

[Gojira101]

Having He-Ro being the same two People is lame. They should be indepent of each other. Enough with the constant going backwards. Start fresh with Dare as He-Ro II.

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Well this is a cool idea but my thoughts are that since Adam is King He-Man maybe Dare takes the name He-Ro to pay homage to the fallen legend.

Now this I can get behind.

[He-Dad]

During "Chapter 1", Dare SHARES the Power Sword with Adam. This is based on the SOHM cartoon bible. When he is recruited as a Cosmic Enforcer in "Chapter 2", he leaves the Power Sword with Adam. During his training, and fighting with Horde Supreme, he is lost to the distant past. It is here that the Trollans bestow him with the original Sword of He.

Thanks for clarifying that....K, I'm totally on board with Grey/Dare/He-ro all being one and the same. I blame TMS

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TG can even write Mer-man is the son of Evil Lyn but that doesnt mean is logical.

Gray and Dare doesn´t have the same physical appareance, brown hair vs blond. One became the Most powerful wizard of the Universe, the other share the power of Grayskull with He-Man. They are not the same person even they share the name...

I was blonde till I hit my teens and now my hair is brown....it naturally darkend over time...it happens.

[Snake Hunter]

I was blonde till I hit my teens and now my hair is brown....it naturally darkend over time...it happens.

Then you are right: Dare and Gray are the same character...

[He-Dad]

Then you are reight: Dare and Gray are the same character...

LOL, wasn't a matter of right or wrong. I think that's the beauty of MOTU, we can all have our own cannons and no one is right or wrong. Even the "official" cannon has been changed so many times that it doesn't really matter. I can honestly see them doing this in the bios though. I would love to have a blonde Dare SOH figure though. They could use the teen buck they so desperately need.

[guy-dude]

I think it will turn out to be a closed time loop. I've been thinking this for a while now as well, and with all of the time jumping that's been going on, I think everything will be circular and going in to the past to prevent X will actually be the cause of it.

[He-Dad]

I think it will turn out to be a closed time loop. I've been thinking this for a while now as well, and with all of the time jumping that's been going on, I think everything will be circular and going in to the past to prevent X will actually be the cause of it.

That's what I'm thinking too.....in the end they could break the loop with having TMS go back in time...er...into the future...er you know what I mean - and kill TMS before he goes on the leap that causes the loop, thus allowing time to progress.

[zodak74]

I like the idea of just about everything in the first post!

[guy-dude]

That's what I'm thinking too.....in the end they could break the loop with having TMS go back in time...er...into the future...er you know what I mean - and kill TMS before he goes on the leap that causes the loop, thus allowing time to progress.

but I really do think that it'll be something like Terminator, where the humans were winning because of John Connor, and [Terminator 1 movie] thus causing John Connor to be born.

So He-Man and She-Ra will finally be wiping out all the evil in the 5 galaxies, and Big Baddie will send someone to the past to prevent it from happening, and He-Ro II will go back, be mind-wiped, and become He-Ro.

I think that the prophecy is "proof" of this theory. He-Ro's past is everyone else's future, so he gives everyone the hope by telling them of the twin warriors.

[DreamTripper]

I don't like the idea of both He-Roes being the same person. This brings into play the cyclical time-travel paradoxes that I hate so much. The line of Grayskull received the power bt way of Ro/Gray He-Ro, but if they are the same, then he wouldn't have the power if he himself didn't give it to the family? What is wrong with two characters in different generations sharing a name? How many of us share names with hundreds of other people alive at the exact same time? I know that I'm only one of many guys named Jason Weaver in the world. I hate time travel.

[Telkan2]

If we have to have the 'Son of He-Man' era included in MOTUC (I'm not personally a fan, though I respect those who are), then this would be the way to go from my perspective. I like it a lot, mykan!

And as for the differing haircolors: if Teela and BG Teela can be the same character with no explanation given for their different hair colorings, then why can't the same be said for Dare / He-Ro?

[guy-dude]

I don't like the idea of both He-Roes being the same person. This brings into play the cyclical time-travel paradoxes that I hate so much. The line of Grayskull received the power bt way of Ro/Gray He-Ro, but if they are the same, then he wouldn't have the power if he himself didn't give it to the family? What is wrong with two characters in different generations sharing a name? How many of us share names with hundreds of other people alive at the exact same time? I know that I'm only one of many guys named Jason Weaver in the world. I hate time travel.

My Oldest daughter is the only one in the world with her name (but you said different generations. Still pretty sure she's the only one, but I can't say in history)

By keeping it a closed time loop it does raise some questions (where did the power come from originally?), but it keeps other and, I feel, bigger problems at bay (why can't they just go back and kill Skeletor as a baby?). And it also keeps out the grandfather paradox, which is, again imho, even more frustrating in time-travel stories.

[maltesefalcon]

dont the holders of the sword of he become known as he-man? i thought it had been established in the bios that whether there real name is vikor oo-lar adam or dare they are known as he-man such as veena, kudok ungal, teela-na, and teela as the sorceress.

the only snag i can see to that is adam he-man is around at the same time so dare may take on a different codename however for branding purposes i dont see our matty masters agreeing to two people with the same name (unless they are a misspelt sdcc exclusive)

[mykan]

I'm lovin' ALL the discussion on this topic, guys!

Just so you know, this whole idea unfolded simply because of trends I've been seeing in the MOTUC continuity - TMS, SLL, the POG story itself, elements of the MOTUC mini comics. I am perfectly fine with POG He-Ro and SOHM He-Ro being two separate characters. In fact, I had thought for a long time that Dare basically become one of many warriors that took the name "He-Ro". I have long thought that She-Ra herself (Dare's mother) was one of these warriors - her name being the female version of He-Ro. She-Ra's progeny would take the name "He-Ro/She-Ra" and He-Man's progeny would take the name "He-Man or...I haven't thought of a female version of that...haha

In regards to He-Ro's appearance from blonde to brunette - there are 2 things to explains this:
1) Many blonde people experience their hair darkening to brown/brunette as they get older - Luke Skywalker anyone?
2) He-Ro IS the most powerful wizard in the universe, so he can easily change his appearance in an effort to not affect history. It's a cool way to justify 2 different figures of the same character - a variant.
3) Dare could simply take the name Gray Ro or Ro Gray when he ends up in the past to avoid affecting history. He essentially creates a new persona that won't be recognized by future probers, or even other time travelers.

The Power most likely comes from a place "outside of time" where the Trollan Overlords reside. With the luxury of existing outside of time, the Overlords can view past, present, future, and ALL temporal possibilities at once.

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dont the holders of the sword of he become known as he-man? i thought it had been established in the bios that whether there real name is vikor oo-lar adam or dare they are known as he-man such as veena, kudok ungal, teela-na, and teela as the sorceress.

the only snag i can see to that is adam he-man is around at the same time so dare may take on a different codename however for branding purposes i dont see our matty masters agreeing to two people with the same name (unless they are a misspelt sdcc exclusive)

Remember that He-Ro was the original owner of the Sword of He. So it doesn't necessarily have to be He-Man, though that becomes the tradition after the passing of Grayskull. Surely not ALL of the elements of the Son of He-Man story bible will become absorbed into MOTUC, but one of the important elements is that Adam and Dare SHARE the Sword of Power to make their transformation. Likely, Adam is busy running the kingdom most of the time, leaving Dare to become He-Ro. When times are dire, He-Man joins the fray.

Another possibility is that Dare becomes the owner of the Sword of Protection in She-Ra's absence.

[baronterror]

thats awesome, and im down if that ends up the case, but no, i dont see that being the case and am happy for it not to be.

[kylun flac]

Different guy. Same ultra ego/tile name.

[GigaMach]

Here's my post from February 2012:

http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...20#post2961620

Well, my theory is that when he was fighting the Horde and succumbed to the techno-organic virus and flung through a "vortex" to Eternia, the vortex was a time-displacement wormhole that flung him to Pre-Ternia. Here is the Bio:

Given the sword of He by the Overlords of the Timeless Dimension on Trolla™, Ro was told to “go forth and combat evil." During one such epic battle, he was infected by a techno-organic virus by Horde Supreme and sent through a vortex to the magic planet of Eternia®. Once there, he was healed by Eldor in a mystical pool which absorbed his virus. In gratitude, He-Ro™ swore to help free Eternia® from the Snake Men™ and Horde Invaders. He defended the free people alongside the great King Grayskull™, eventually bequeathing his sword to the King upon his heroic death.

So, at some point, the timeless Trollans got the sword of He from...whoever the final He-Man was, and then gave it to He-Ro, knowing that he would be sent back in time after his final battle with Horde Prime, and ultimately pass it to Grayskull, and thus his descendents. It doesn't say, but I believe Horde Prime was destroyed by He-Ro, and that the destruction caused the vortex. Essentially, this makes the "Conflict of He" circular, which may somehow imbue the sword with the power to actually destroy the ultimate evil, Horde Prime, as seen by the Trollans, who exist OUTSIDE of time. In this way, He-Ro is actually in the bloodline of Grayskull as well, though indirectly, through Miro's union with the Gar, which might be seen as a kind of Ishmael/Isaac analogy. This also ultimately redeems Keldor, too. I dunno. That's MY take.

In a meta-way, I also think this is true BECAUSE of The Mighty Spector's existence, and the fact that TMS is ToyGuru. While I don't think TMS plays a direct role in the events, Toy-Guru, existing outside the MOTUC universe, yet controlling it in a way, has the ULTIMATE power over the timeline, like any writer has over his own fictional universe. And since TG has said he really likes He-Ro, I venture to guess that He-Ro plays a pivotal role in the whole MOTUC story...as in, bigger than even HE understands.

Also, it makes sense that he'd be Keldor and Evil-Lynn's son. He's a wizard AND a warrior!

[mykan]

Here's my post from February 2012:

http://www.he-man.org/forums/boards/...20#post2961620

Well, my theory is that when he was fighting the Horde and succumbed to the techno-organic virus and flung through a "vortex" to Eternia, the vortex was a time-displacement wormhole that flung him to Pre-Ternia. Here is the Bio:

Given the sword of He by the Overlords of the Timeless Dimension on Trolla™, Ro was told to “go forth and combat evil." During one such epic battle, he was infected by a techno-organic virus by Horde Supreme and sent through a vortex to the magic planet of Eternia®. Once there, he was healed by Eldor in a mystical pool which absorbed his virus. In gratitude, He-Ro™ swore to help free Eternia® from the Snake Men™ and Horde Invaders. He defended the free people alongside the great King Grayskull™, eventually bequeathing his sword to the King upon his heroic death.

So, at some point, the timeless Trollans got the sword of He from...whoever the final He-Man was, and then gave it to He-Ro, knowing that he would be sent back in time after his final battle with Horde Prime, and ultimately pass it to Grayskull, and thus his descendents. It doesn't say, but I believe Horde Prime was destroyed by He-Ro, and that the destruction caused the vortex. Essentially, this makes the "Conflict of He" circular, which may somehow imbue the sword with the power to actually destroy the ultimate evil, Horde Prime, as seen by the Trollans, who exist OUTSIDE of time. In this way, He-Ro is actually in the bloodline of Grayskull as well, though indirectly, through Miro's union with the Gar, which might be seen as a kind of Ishmael/Isaac analogy. This also ultimately redeems Keldor, too. I dunno. That's MY take.

In a meta-way, I also think this is true BECAUSE of The Mighty Spector's existence, and the fact that TMS is ToyGuru. While I don't think TMS plays a direct role in the events, Toy-Guru, existing outside the MOTUC universe, yet controlling it in a way, has the ULTIMATE power over the timeline, like any writer has over his own fictional universe. And since TG has said he really likes He-Ro, I venture to guess that He-Ro plays a pivotal role in the whole MOTUC story...as in, bigger than even HE understands.

Also, it makes sense that he'd be Keldor and Evil-Lynn's son. He's a wizard AND a warrior!

Good stuff, GigaMach. Great minds think alike haha. I don't think the Trollans have to get the Sword of He from a previous He-Man though. Especially since they're timeless. I believe they fashion a portion of the Power into the sword, and it is He-Ro who bears the sword first. As for Keldor and Evil-Lynn's kid? I always thought he would grow up to be a villain, BUT it would be an interesting twist if it turned out to be He-Ro.

[vertigoink]

Except the current canon dictates that He-Man and She-Ra are who ultimately destroy Horde Prime, so that doesn't exactly work.

[GigaMach]

Except the current canon dictates that He-Man and She-Ra are who ultimately destroy Horde Prime, so that doesn't exactly work.

Yeah, that's true. I also realized I was not making a distinction between Horde Prime and Horde Supreme before. Perhaps He-Ro destroy's Horde Supreme and is cast back. But yeah - as new info emerges, it clarifies things, but also raises more questions.

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Good stuff, GigaMach. Great minds think alike haha. I don't think the Trollans have to get the Sword of He from a previous He-Man though. Especially since they're timeless. I believe they fashion a portion of the Power into the sword, and it is He-Ro who bears the sword first. As for Keldor and Evil-Lynn's kid? I always thought he would grow up to be a villain, BUT it would be an interesting twist if it turned out to be He-Ro.

Indeed! And you're right - the Sword of He could be the catalyst that can break the cycle of the time paradox.

[mykan]

Except the current canon dictates that He-Man and She-Ra are who ultimately destroy Horde Prime, so that doesn't exactly work.

He-Man and She-Ra CAN STILL be the ones who destroy Horde Prime. The Horde Empire falls, and peace reigns throughout the galaxy. Eventually, a lowly and mysterious Horde descendant or sympathizer hatches the plot to change history so that the Horde is not destroyed. This sympathizer goes on to designate himself as Horde Supreme. As he plays with temporal mechanics, he likely causes Adora and Seahawk to become lost to time accidentally...

Years go by (as an adolescent Dare is found by King He-Man, and goes on to become He-Ro and have adventures on Eternia). The elusive Horde Supreme eventually perfects his art of temporal manipulation, and it is then that Dare becomes enlisted by the Cosmic Enforcers to stop him. Horde Supreme causes a temporal storm that causes himself and He-Ro/Dare to be flung into the past at random points in time. Believing He-Ro to be dead, Horde Supreme - realizes that he HIMSELF must bring the Horde Empire into being. He solidifies his power on a world that would come to be known as Horde World.

In one of his many experiments (a primordial Spell of Separation), an accident causes Supreme to be split into two divergent beings - Horde Prime and Hordak. Horde Prime values the expansion of the galactic empire with the use of techno-sorcery and technology. Hordak comes to value pure sorcery. Though the two value power, they are polar opposites of the same coin, with the dominant Horde Prime becoming threatened by his "brother's" growing influence.

He-Ro does eventually discover the threat of the growing Horde Empire, and spends years combating the Horde with his growing band of allies and the Cosmic Enforcers. He is bequeathed the Sword of He in this time, and becomes a major thorn in Horde Prime and Hordak's sides.

[vertigoink]

He-Man and She-Ra CAN STILL be the ones who destroy Horde Prime. The Horde Empire falls, and peace reigns throughout the galaxy. Eventually, a lowly and mysterious Horde descendant or sympathizer hatches the plot to change history so that the Horde is not destroyed. This sympathizer goes on to designate himself as Horde Supreme. As he plays with temporal mechanics, he likely causes Adora and Seahawk to become lost to time accidentally...

Years go by (as an adolescent Dare is found by King He-Man, and goes on to become He-Ro and have adventures on Eternia). The elusive Horde Supreme eventually perfects his art of temporal manipulation, and it is then that Dare becomes enlisted by the Cosmic Enforcers to stop him. Horde Supreme causes a temporal storm that causes himself and He-Ro/Dare to be flung into the past at random points in time. Believing He-Ro to be dead, Horde Supreme - realizes that he HIMSELF must bring the Horde Empire into being. He solidifies his power on a world that would come to be known as Horde World.

In one of his many experiments (a primordial Spell of Separation), an accident causes Supreme to be split into two divergent beings - Horde Prime and Hordak. Horde Prime values the expansion of the galactic empire with the use of techno-sorcery and technology. Hordak comes to value pure sorcery. Though the two value power, they are polar opposites of the same coin, with the dominant Horde Prime becoming threatened by his "brother's" growing influence.

He-Ro does eventually discover the threat of the growing Horde Empire, and spends years combating the Horde with his growing band of allies and the Cosmic Enforcers. He is bequeathed the Sword of He in this time, and becomes a major thorn in Horde Prime and Hordak's sides.

Now this is just falling into fan-fiction though.

[Adam_Prince of Eternia]

That Gray and Dare are completely separate characters aside, this would make He-Ro both the ancestor and the son of Adora. That is nonsense, no thanks.

[mykan]

Time will tell the tale. The speculation was fun while it lasted though

And as far as fan fiction is concerned, isn't that all the MOTUC continuity is? Ironically, I'm not a big fan of temporal paradox stories, unless the story itself is a time travel story, i.e. Back to the Future or Terminator. POG and NA were tricky pills to swallow back in the day, but MOTUC is potentially getting carried away with the grandfather paradox elements.

IS Sir-Laser-Lot actually Man-At-Arms in disguise? Why DID King He-Man have to save him from the past? Does TMS limit how much he interferes with the flow of time?

POG He-Ro being SOHM He-Ro, as ridiculous as it may sound, COULD happen what with all the other strange temporal "unfoldings" in MOTUC lately.

[DreamTripper]

The more I read of this thread, the more I realize that TG/Matty may actually do this. As big a mistake as I feel that is, I will accept it simply because there are many bits of the current canon I ignore. I, along with many others, have my own MOTU history and mythos. I use all versions of MOTU as inspiration, and some parts I keep fully intact. But there are no time travel paradoxes in my universe. Not sure I want time travel at all.