QFT..wel except the Stonedar and Rokkon reference as I personally have no interest in them but I aint going to complain about them if they show up. I don't see Stinkor on the cover either and yet you don't see me saying "Oh no, no Stinkor on the cover. That must mean Mattel are trying to phase him out and replace him with...Extendar (or whoever else is on the cover).Originally Posted by danielsan52
Also I have to point out that BG Teela can't be cheaping or trying to replace Teela...she is Teela. Is Buzz Saw Hordak cheaping Hordak, or Thunder Punch He-Man cheaping He-Man? It is just a variant and considering this one is the 2nd ultimate BATTLEGROUND, BG Teela fits the story more.
A-T you know I respect you but just because She-Ra is not on EVERYTHING doesn't mean Mattel have forgotten about her or stopped caring she just may not be in this story as danielsan52 says
My guess is its an easter egg referencing where in the vintage Ultimate Battleground mini-comic both Skeletor and King Hiss wield the Havok Staff together to raise the Three Towers from the ground.
Sorry to disappoint but vintage He-Man and Skeletor (not their Flying Fist/Terror Claw variants) were fighting on the front cover of the vintage UB mini-comic. These variants were featured on the back cover however in the cross sell!
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I like the cover, very vintage, I got a cool 80's vibe from it...
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But Vikor is now an official variant and actual first time figure, just like BG Teela. Vikor was also the original concept of He-Man, much like you are rightly stating that blonde Teela was the original concept for Teela. I should point out that you failed to mention Teela was also red during this two year time frame also, due to her toy having red hair.
Yes she was Blonde in a few mini comics and some DC comics & a few books, However, fans of the classic toys as well as the Filmation faithful who didn't have any of the Mini comics, DC comics or story books that showed her as blonde) would arguably have been just as unfamilure by Blonde Teela as each other. BG Teela does not have anywhere near the level of recognition, brand media or acceptability as NA He-Man IMO. So I do think my anaology between her and Vikor is still a better comparasion.
I respect you too fella! But She-Ra has no relevence to you, so you would probably find it hard to see the She-Raver perspective here. The best responce I can give to you is to quote Darkspector's final point in his last post.
"I know it may seem like one of those "my favourite character wasn't on the cover, so I'm going to freak out!" nerd rage things, but that's not the case. It's the deeper issue of how Mattel seems to handle/view She-Ra and the Great Rebellion...like they aren't very important (ex. Teela and She-Ra being used interchangeably when they are two very different characters). That's why there's being push back (in my opinion)".
This is more than the POP fans having a hissey fit because our faviourate character isn't there on the cover and people in this thread have tried to point that out. It's much bigger than that. Sadly again people don't seem to be reading what is actually being written from the She-Raver perspective. No one hates BG Teela, just what Mattel are trying to do with her at the moment. If expressing concerns over this is "bringing out the matches and gasoline" so be it. I feel the reaction is totally justified.
The only reason Mattel gave She-Ra a 2.0 figure is because they completely dropped the ball on her first figure. They had to address the multiple issues on that figure or She-Ra would not have been able to sit on swift Wind, so it was a necessity. With the gratest of respect, using this as evdience to argue that Mattel are not keeping She-Ra out of the lime light when we have seen Mattel do just that with Battle Ground Teela (three times over the last year since SDCC) is a bit of a week argument from where I'm sitting. I don't mean any of this to come across as an attack, it's just how I and other fans see it.
Last edited by Angel-T; July 8, 2012 at 01:47pm.
PRO CLASSIC POP TOY DESIGN ELEMENTS BEING USED IN MOTUC TO COMPLEMENT THE FILMATION DESIGNS!!!!
I FULLY SUPPORT THE INCLUSION OF ILLUMINA IN MOTUC!!!!!
IF YOUR SICK OF WAITING FOR A LIGHT TO APPEAR AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL, STRIDE DOWN THERE AND LIGHT THE BLOODY THING YOURSELF!!!!!!!
Not arguing with you on this point, but I wonder do you think they would have given her this treatment had they not made the mistake of making the first version incapable of riding Swiftwind and the other question is how in 2.0 different from a variant? If they had made her the same with the same accessories as 1.0 just a little filligre (sp?) on her bracers & boots and hiked up her skirt I'd say 2.0, but with the whole BubblePower thing to me it's just another way of saying variant. I guess it's just semantics.
BTW--I like the look of the cover and how it reminds me of the old minicomics.
Last edited by rhea; July 8, 2012 at 08:26pm.
Holding out for Castaspella, Angella, Double Trouble and Entrapta!!!
This cover argument is kind of pointless. There are too many characters to have everyone on there and She-Ra is not as integral in this battle as she is against Horde Prime. I feel kind of bad because she is neglected from the Classics canon quite a bit, but this is basically He-Man's show. I think of her as Robin and that she is only needed when necessary. Robin isn't in every story but he is still important. And like She-Ra, Robin runs his own show but when he is with Batman he is the sidekick. She-Ra is not equal to He-Man in everyone's mind and in this canon it appears that He-Man is much more prominent than she is. Like Luke and Leia, Luke had to do the majority of the fighting, but they were both integral to the story.
The cover is also not indicative of the inside of a comic as everyone knows. Most likely it will be much, much different inside. I still think that a mini-comic is not the ideal place for this epic battle but it will have to do.
I have been waiting to see if someone else commented on the article. It says "new versions of vintage heroes and villains, as well as those of the Filmation 1980s cartoon series and the 2002 anniversary toys, will be on display at Comic-Con next week starting on Wednesday at the annual "Preview Night." So I am taking this out of context or will there e 2002 anniversary toys? The new subscription I was hoping for would be a vehicle, 2002, or she-ra subsciption to get some of the figures out faster. Considering 2013 would be a prime year it seems they would want to get them out there since there is so many figures left that have not been done. Just a thought.
Personally, I don't care for BG Teela and dislike that the abandoned her iconic look, but the BG look has been around since the original version, so I don't let it bother me. As for Teela being pushed in the limelight ahead of She-Ra, the way I see it, Teela is the main female character of MOTU period. Sure you can make the argument that She-Ra should be ahead of Teela because she has her own spin-off and she is He-Man's twin sister. I guess that all depends on perspective. Is Cleavland a more important and popular character than Quagmire because he got the Family Guy spin-off? Should Supergirl be pushed as the top female in the DC Universe over Wonder woman because the top male, Superman, is her cousin?
Wait a second,... Is that possibly Hawke behind Stratos???!
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Well spoted...I thought that as well. I would love to get a figure of Hawk & Delora from the UK ladybird books....she would defo be one we didn't see coming if she was revealed at SDCC! :0)
PRO CLASSIC POP TOY DESIGN ELEMENTS BEING USED IN MOTUC TO COMPLEMENT THE FILMATION DESIGNS!!!!
I FULLY SUPPORT THE INCLUSION OF ILLUMINA IN MOTUC!!!!!
IF YOUR SICK OF WAITING FOR A LIGHT TO APPEAR AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL, STRIDE DOWN THERE AND LIGHT THE BLOODY THING YOURSELF!!!!!!!
This is not the case at all. If it were, I would be freaking out because Spinnerella or Scareglow aren't on the cover.It's the He-Man and She-Ra story. I would be "freaking out" just as much if He-Man weren't on the cover. Both he and She-Ra deserve to be there, in my opinion.
To be fair...even though she was called "She-Ra 2.0" for about a year, she was revealed to be Bubble Power She-Ra: a proper She-Ra variant. That's no different than Battle Armour He-Man/Skeletor/Faker, Thunder Punch He-Man, Preternia Disguise He-Man, Dragon Blaster Skeletor, Hurricane Hordak, Battleground Evil-Lyn/Teela. The ONLY difference is that all the character variants (except for sub exclusives and the SDCC BA Faker) were included in the subscription, but Bubble Power She-Ra was NOT. That's also not treating She-Ra equally.She-Ra is the only figure to be given a 2.0 treatment out of all the characters we have gotten so far so you can't say Mattel is keeping he out of the "limelight".She was a proper variant and made harder (and $9 more expensive for extra shipping) to get.
I prefer red headed, iconic Teela...but have no problem with BG Teela. I do, however, feel she is being pushed/forced upon us now. Toyguru even said a quote about BG Teela and wanting to make her the "Slave Leia" of Masters of the Universe...and having everyone dress up as her as SDCC, etc. I know he answered saying he liked the red head more, but he said the Slave Leia thing later. There's an agenda afoot!Just because you and a couple others don't like BG Teela doesn't mean many more Of us feel the same. I was delighted to see her back to blonde like in the original mini comics. I prefer Teela in the cobra armor and that is never used for her anymore.
If Extendar had smell lines on the cover, was coloured like Stinkor and was fighting Perfuma...I would say that was a good example.
I have a challenge for you (and everyone, really): besides the special SDCC Polly Pocket set, name one thing She-Ra was on in MOTUC. I'm not talking about IN (her two panels in the first mini with no dialogue), but ON.A-T you know I respect you but just because She-Ra is not on EVERYTHING doesn't mean Mattel have forgotten about her or stopped caring she just may not be in this story as danielsan52 says
Also, She-Ra is part of the "Renegade Masters" as per the bios. If she isn't in the story at all (when she was shown in the first mini-comic)...I think that's a VERY good indication they forgot about her/don't care!
Well colour me red!I looked at that yesterday and swore they were on the comic cover too! Well...they were on the poster and box at least!
I'm also confused as to what that means. I THINK it just means MYP and MVC characters are being included in the line. In She-Ra's 20th Anniversary press release, it said something very similar.
That's what I was thinking.
Last edited by Darkspecter; July 8, 2012 at 04:09pm.
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As beautiful as this cover is, the message that it gives is: "Only vintage MOTU matters." This might be perfectly fine for those who prefer vintage MOTU, which is why they take the stance they have taken. But MOTUC was and is marketed as an all-encompassing mythos - which absorbs GR/POP, 200x, and NA into the core MOTU story. It makes sense that NA is not featured in this story - that comes later. But why the total lack of She-Ra? According to the bios, she should be prominent at this time. To make this cover more cohesive, it might have been better to have included She-Ra, Carnivus (or another upcoming 200x character), and perhaps even Draego-Man. These few character changes would speak volumes not only to the fans, but to the idea that MOTUC has expanded BEYOND the vintage roster.
The REAL issue is that collectors are TOLD that MOTUC is an all-encompassing line. But thus far, this mini comic series has failed at being all-encompassing. If you don't want to be all-encompassing, then don't say otherwise to "placate the masses" - that'll just make way for a whole lot of torches and pitchforks. Actions speak louder than words. This mini comic should have been marketed differently, as I believe we were led to believe that we would see things that we haven't. And if She-Ra and her Great Rebellion pals show up in the 3rd mini comic, that'll make up for a lot, but I'm suspecting that this late in the game they won't (I'll happily say how wrong I am, if I end up being wrong).
The purpose of ANY cover is to relay a message to the audience, a message that tells them what the content is about, and what the reader can expect. Covers deliver powerful messages, which is why a lot is invested in them.
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The main thing I dislike about these sort of discussions, is the predictability of being painted as hysterical POP fans who create baseless conspiracy theories and reasons to be upset, thereby ruining the party for the privileged fans. Do folks actually think this is our idea of a good time? heh Short of a signed confession from Mattel, it seems any attempts to draw parallels, to compare and contrast years-worth of experiences and use intincts and common sense to highlight a problem is likely going to be met with derision and simply dismissed. From my point-of-view there are - what seem to be - multiple attempts to pull focus from the problems and shut down the discussion because it's challenging the status quo.
I hate to say it, but this is kind of typical of the type of priviledged fans who prioritizes their own opinions and desires over the real-lived experiences of those who are actually being marginalized and outright ignored. Instead of conceding that we're possibly a bit more in-tune with and knowledgable of these matters because they're always at surface level for us, and that putting ourselves in the other person's shoes is a way of life for some of us, we get talked down to. And the worst part is that the barbed lectures only ever seem to come when it's POP fans who take issue with something.
Thank you for reading.
lol, I'm just not a fan of the latter half of the vintage line. I don't care if they are in art/stories etc, though.
That is exactly how I feel. There's no denying it was a cool toy, but the concept itself is not something I care for, for the reason you mentioned. It still makes for a great backdrop in artwork though.I really LOVE the Eternia playset and how it looks...but I do not like how it makes Castle Grayskull...pointless. I mean, if the bad guys just need to take over Central Tower to control the Universe...what's the point of Castle Grayskull?
I just do not see that happening. Teela isn't one of the twins of power, she's the Sorceress. I can understand feeling like one's part of the brand is being made to not be important, but this is BG Teela's first media appearance in MOTUC. It's not like this is the only Teela figure released, or that there have been minicomics from the beginning of the line featuring only this version.
So in all this, you don't see exclusionary behaviour from filmation fans who bash on blonde Teela, despite the fact that many of us grew up with her? Since she was revealed a number of filmation fans have tried to paint her as equivalent to Vikor, despite the fact that this is a canonical look for Teela, and Vikor is a concept figure based on artwork that was never seen by anyone in any media. With the ways they always try to diminish her as someone who should be some naughty dead girl that ran with Vikor, and how they just don't want her to have a multiple hair colours, I see these kinds of arguments as fans of cartoon looks trying to be exclusionary to things that other people grew up with. Just food for thought.
It's not only POP's problem. POP and 200X have these really outspoken fans to champion those eras, you and I among them. I think the problem is that if we constantly complaining about some perceived wrong that POP or 200X is suffering too regularly, we tend to get marginalized and ignored by the general fandom who aren't hardcore 200X or POP fans that would see our points and agree with us. Instead of our complaints being some legitimate concern or insight, it's "Tallstar or MegaGearMax isn't satisfied again?". Our notoriety and reputations work against us. I'm not at all saying that anyone should keep silent if they find something is amiss, just stop "crying injustice" so much. It's something I struggle with at times, as people have noticed.
I can see the focus on Battleground Teela. She-Ra didn't make the cover, as did many characters, but then the Second Ultimate Battleground is probably moreso of a Teela/MOTU story (her father dies and she depowers her archenemy) than a She-Ra tale, considering what we know Teela is supposed to do during that battle. It's probably not some conspiracy, since this is a Masters of the Universe/Vintage toyline-centric universe. She-Ra probably will take center stage during POP/Etheria-centric plots, such as Horde Prime. Hell, She-Ra and company are in New Adventures now, so Mattel IS using her. We might see some more POP storylines if they reveal any POP figures or bios during SDCC on Friday.
The only era that doesn't have that stigma is NA, because quite frankly, everyone is well-aware that it's being slighted. 3 characters in almost 5 years?
Last edited by MegaGearMax; July 8, 2012 at 06:10pm.
Yes us diehard NA fans don't need to imply or hint to being shafted, its common knowledge
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Flipshot might make an appearance at the end of the comic! I know it's not much, but it's something.Yes us diehard NA fans don't need to imply or hint to being shafted, its common knowledgeI'm not sure how much time takes place between Ultimate Battleground 2 and NA though.
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In my collection she is Teela-Na. I just like the idea of the sorceress kicking butt before she takes on the responsibilities of Castle Grayskull. I mean she is Teela's mom. But that's just me.
I'm going to weigh in very briefly on the issues related to exclusion (real or imagined) of certain eras/aspects of MOTU.
To preface this, I grew up a fan of the old motu stuff, having watched filmation motu and collected the original toys. As an adult, I do not like the old toons and only like 200x. As a matter of fact, when it comes to sculpting, the only MOTU line I like at all is 200x (neither vintage nor motuc appeal to me). I am saying this because I don't want people to think that I am a person who is getting what he wants in MOTU, because I am not.
Anyhow... there is no such thing as fairness. Fairness and motu media DO NOT go hand in hand. What goes hand in hand with MOTU media? Firstly, money. I don't care what people think of the eras that they champion. At the end of the day, Mattel will focus on the stuff they think will sell. Maybe people disagree with Mattel and they have every right to do so. Maybe Mattel is even wrong about what will sell. But at the end of the day, fairness is a non-point. Mattel will produce and sell what it thinks will make them money. If that doesn't include an era that one likes, that is a shame. But don't think that fairness means that anything is owed.
The other thing is that to a smaller extent, power will affect things. Geoff Jones is a well known creator, so his ideas are going to more of a spotlight than some other things that one might like. Not everyone will like that, but at the end of the day, that's just how it is. It is how the world works. At the end of the day, it will not cause Mattel to lose money (SLL will still sell out, other characters will still be made, etc) and while he will be worked into the mythos and even get a little solo comic, he will still never be the focus on the series. He-Man has, is and will always be the primary focus of MOTU. The others around him may change somewhat, but at the end of the day, it will be his story and I do not envision that ever changing.
Edit: I want to make it clear that my post references character inclusion in any sort of media, not just this specific mini-comic.
Last edited by Darth Latveria; July 8, 2012 at 06:33pm.
If Mattel HAD to keep using red-haired Teela as the mordern version, I think that would have been a nice way to introduce the blonde version and stay somewhat faithful to the Pre-Filmation canon, while keeping the Vintage/Filmation/MYP storyline as present day.
30 years ago, Oo-Larr, Teela-Na, a young moustache-less Duncan, a young, fur-less Stratos and the Goddess fought Skeletor, a younger Beast Man and Mer-Man (maybe their fur/scales changed color with age or through power-ups).
Here is an idea, and this is directed to EVERYONE (not just POP or 200x fans)
If you don't like a story, or a bio, or a particular canon...whatever
Ignore it.
Nobody says you have to accept these new mini comics or DC comics or any other comic, cartoon, storybook or whatever as THE canon.
Pick one you do like, mix and match, make up your own.
Last edited by wolfsfang; July 8, 2012 at 06:48pm.
People don't want to ignore the stories, Wolf. It's the opposite... fans want their favorite character or favorite version of a character in those stories.
Totally agree. I'm loving it as well.
Even if it does have Teela instead of She-Ra fighting the Horde Troopers. So what.
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So....what do you guys think about the possible Final Fate of the Snake Men™?
Will someone kill King Hsss in battle? Will he get beaten and get sent back to the Void? Will we see the LAST APPEARANCE of the Snake Men? Toyguru isn't shy about killing major characters like The Sorceress and Man-At-Arms, so all six Snake Men might be taking the ultimate dirt nap.
I think Teela will use the spell of separation to do whatever it is it's supposed to do to defeat the snake men permanently. Which is just fine since she lost both her parents to them. He-man can defeat Skeletor and she-ra has/will defeat Hordak. Teela deserves the honor of taking out Hiss!
My MOTUC top 10 wants (POST NYTF):
Madame Razz & Broom - Scorpia - Glimmer - Modulock - Queen Angella - Horde-Troopers - Hunga the Harpy - Peekablue - Entrapta -Mermista
Filmation Sub top 5 wants: Sea Hawk - Huntara - Red Knight - Vultak - Dylamug
Small creatures that need to happen: Kowl - Imp - Lookee - 3 main twiggets
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