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Thread: Toyguru Update on 2013 Subscriptions

  1. #1076
    Illumina & Cat please! Darkspecter's Avatar
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    Dynamo of Eternia...I don't even know where to start with everything you said. I will try to keep it very brief though. From your reply, it's quite evident you are only speaking for yourself and it's kind of hard to judge PoP by one movie and a handful of episodes. I mean, you have the entire series, but have only watched a handful of episodes, which says a whole lot right there.

    Regarding the Star Sisters vs. He-Ro, they were shown in quite a few things I noted in a previous post you may have missed or didn't read. He-Ro was a shadowy image in a mini-comic, on the box of a few beasts, a toy prototype in a magazine and on a knitting pattern. The Star Sisters got all that (minus the knitting pattern), but a full story in the MOTU magazine (with illustrations), another full story with illustrations and a fold-out poster in the PoP magazine with Starla on the cover, various other magazines and were in the Filmation cartoon. It's perfectly fine if you prefer He-Ro to the Star Sisters, but to write them off like they're nothing when they were HEAVILY advertised as opposed to the much lower amount of advertising of He-Ro is kind of insulting.

    Tallstar and I both did quite a lot of research regarding the MOTUC Star Sisters, who wanted them, didn't want them, which versions were liked the best, who didn't buy a sub because of them, etc. There were people who did not like them at all (any versions), but more people liked the Star Sisters. Some people who REALLY wanted the Star Sisters hated the versions that were released and refused to buy them. Others bought additional subs BECAUSE of the Star Sisters. It's all quite interesting data. I forget which thread it's all compiled in.

    You may brush off the Star Sisters, but they were desired by fans and the versions that were wanted, were not released. The toy prototypes had more accessories, action features and details. A LOT of love went into those creations. They are the STAR Sisters and each had different translucent, glitter-infused body parts showing their relation to each other, while making them look special and from space. In MOTUC, we pretty much just have the yellow one, pink one and the fashion disaster. They lost their accessories, details and everything that made them special. This is one of the reasons some people DO hate them.

    Now, about She-Ra as a whole...it could totally make a comeback. Look at Monster High, for crying out loud. It had webisodes and specials, a nearly all girl line, names the character LIKE She-Ra and Cleo has black hair, is extremely jealous and it sometimes causes her to do bad things. Catra, much? Monster High is also a juggernaut seller for Mattel. It's 1000 times more successful than MOTUC and is sort of like She-Ra in high school, if you will. I love all eras of MOTU (including NA). Will MOTU ever be popular with kids again? It's hard to say. I'm not sure if they're interested in Barbarians that much any more. Kind of like how kids loved cowboys and astronauts before. I think She-Ra, however, could be pretty damn successful again, if given the chance based on the success of Monster High, Sailor Moon and WinX. The key is to do it like Filmation did (and pretty much the other mainly girl-targeted toys I mentioned). The cartoons have to appeal to EVERYONE, but mainly target girls for the toys. That's the formula for success. Just because the toys are mainly aimed at girls doesn't mean guys won't like them too. Guys are buying a LOT of Monster High dolls....and then there's Brony (guys who like My Little Pony). I don't know much about them, but I hear it's a thing.
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  2. #1077
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    Toy Guru - ABSOLUTE MUST READ - The future of the line depends on it!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Garthantula View Post
    ToyGuru, what's the product you're trying to sell here? Is it the subscription or the toys? Your acting as though Mattel is a subscription manufacturer instead of a toy manufacturer, and if demand isn't high enough you're not going manufacture any subs.

    Remember, the toys are your product. The toys, not the subscriptions. Selling subscriptions is merely a distribution method for your product, and as the 2012 and 2013 sales demonstrate they are not very effective when focused on exclusively.

    There are three great benefits to subscriptions: (1) They provide convenience to customers who want the entire product line; (2) they provide incentive to people who would buy most of a product run to go ahead and buy the entire product line; and (3) they provide manufacturers the assurance of guaranteed sales. Because of these benefits, subscriptions can be a valuable supplement to other distribution methods.

    However, when relied upon as an exclusive method of distribution, subscriptions have some crippling disadvantages.

    (1) They guarantee that supply will be insufficient to meet demand. Customers are forced into an artificial "buy everything or buy nothing" dilemma, and the sales that are gained by those who move up to "buy everything" are a mere fraction of the sales that are lost by those who move down to "buy nothing." The revenue lost is not insignificant.

    (2) They dissuade new customers. Very few people become so instantly enamored by their first exposure to a new product that they commit to the entire product line. Whether its toys, magazines, or cosmetics, that type of consumer loyalty is built gradually, one product at a time. The subscriptions so restrict access to the very products they are intended to promote that a potential new customer has almost no opportunity to build loyalty before deciding between "buy everything or buy nothing".

    (3) They prevent growth of your product. Even if a significant number of new customers want to subscribe to a line, production numbers are fixed and cannot respond to the increase in demand.

    (4) They enhance customer dissatisfaction with niche items. Because customers have to get everything in order to get anything, customers expect that most product offerings will appeal to their taste. Because these customers don't have the choice of simply not buying products that do not appeal to them, their only recourse if too many of these offering are presented is to stop being a customer.

    When looked at side by side, the negatives of a subscription-only sales model far outweigh the positives, and adoption of such a model will inevitably lead to a decline in overall sales. It's the only possible outcome. You cannot grow your sales when you adopt a model which deliberately produces beneath demand and alienates customers substantially easier than it attracts them.

    I want to know why Matty doggedly insists on basing production off of subscription sales rather than actual demand. Surely enough sales data has been collected since 2008 that a competent analyst could reasonably predict how much to produce without even factoring subs in.

    Matty, your subscription is much less marketable than your action figures. Regardless of their love for the toys, your subscription has many features and limitations that consumer just don't like. Stop equating dissatisfaction with subscriptions with disinterest in your real product, the toys. Make enough to meet demand, and have confidence that your product will sell. That's the only way to keep any of your lines alive, much less see them grow and prosper.
    This is the single best post I have seen all year. This is information Mattel needs to reflect upon and absorb. Fan interest is there, but it is the subscription only model that is absolutely KILLING THE LINE!

    WAKE UP MATTEL!!!

  3. #1078
    "No Lashor, We Bash Ya!" Robzy's Avatar
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    Although I'm not one, I'm happy for POP fans, in regard to the news from Scott. Hope everything works out and you all get the figures you want!
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  4. #1079
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    I don't see how they would truly get everything they're saying out by 2014. If every monthly slot from April 2013 - 2014 was vintage MOTU, you'd just barely have enough slots for the 21 remaining figures. When you add that there will be at least 3 more POP and 4 more NA, plus likely several more Filmation in 2013 and some in 2014, AND probably some 200x in 2014, I don't see how they would possibly get to all of those by the end of 2014.

    Besides, a lot of the remaining figures require a lot of tooling. I don't see how they'd make that work either for a line that's "dying".
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  5. #1080
    Heroic Warrior Replikor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super He-Man View Post
    I don't see how they would truly get everything they're saying out by 2014. If every monthly slot from April 2013 - 2014 was vintage MOTU, you'd just barely have enough slots for the 21 remaining figures. When you add that there will be at least 3 more POP and 4 more NA, plus likely several more Filmation in 2013 and some in 2014, AND probably some 200x in 2014, I don't see how they would possibly get to all of those by the end of 2014.

    Besides, a lot of the remaining figures require a lot of tooling. I don't see how they'd make that work either for a line that's "dying".
    ...well Toy Guru has stated that they want to "go out with a bang" in 2014 as it will be worked as the "possible" last year... SO... about the only way they could is to do 3-4 figure a month......

  6. #1081
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super He-Man View Post
    I don't see how they would truly get everything they're saying out by 2014. If every monthly slot from April 2013 - 2014 was vintage MOTU, you'd just barely have enough slots for the 21 remaining figures. When you add that there will be at least 3 more POP and 4 more NA, plus likely several more Filmation in 2013 and some in 2014, AND probably some 200x in 2014, I don't see how they would possibly get to all of those by the end of 2014.

    Besides, a lot of the remaining figures require a lot of tooling. I don't see how they'd make that work either for a line that's "dying".
    Not everyone is leaving the Titanic.

    Out of the 20 remaining figures (Snake Face's shield has been revealed), some vintage and NA figures aren't monthly slots such as Horde Trooper (2 pack), Modulok, Multibot and Sagitar (deluxe figures or large scale bests). We probably won't get to Multibot after Modulok comes out.

    I'll bet that some of the vintage line's most obscure characters are expendable. I don't think we'll see Rotar and Twistoid. The transforming Rock People, Gwildor, Blade and Saurod (I could understand Gwildor, but why haven't we seen Blade and Saurod yet?) might be written off for 2014 too.

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  7. #1082
    Heroic Warrior I, Harbinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garthantula View Post
    ToyGuru, what's the product you're trying to sell here? Is it the subscription or the toys? Your acting as though Mattel is a subscription manufacturer instead of a toy manufacturer, and if demand isn't high enough you're not going manufacture any subs.

    Remember, the toys are your product. The toys, not the subscriptions. Selling subscriptions is merely a distribution method for your product, and as the 2012 and 2013 sales demonstrate they are not very effective when focused on exclusively.

    There are three great benefits to subscriptions: (1) They provide convenience to customers who want the entire product line; (2) they provide incentive to people who would buy most of a product run to go ahead and buy the entire product line; and (3) they provide manufacturers the assurance of guaranteed sales. Because of these benefits, subscriptions can be a valuable supplement to other distribution methods.

    However, when relied upon as an exclusive method of distribution, subscriptions have some crippling disadvantages.

    (1) They guarantee that supply will be insufficient to meet demand. Customers are forced into an artificial "buy everything or buy nothing" dilemma, and the sales that are gained by those who move up to "buy everything" are a mere fraction of the sales that are lost by those who move down to "buy nothing." The revenue lost is not insignificant.

    (2) They dissuade new customers. Very few people become so instantly enamored by their first exposure to a new product that they commit to the entire product line. Whether its toys, magazines, or cosmetics, that type of consumer loyalty is built gradually, one product at a time. The subscriptions so restrict access to the very products they are intended to promote that a potential new customer has almost no opportunity to build loyalty before deciding between "buy everything or buy nothing".

    (3) They prevent growth of your product. Even if a significant number of new customers want to subscribe to a line, production numbers are fixed and cannot respond to the increase in demand.

    (4) They enhance customer dissatisfaction with niche items. Because customers have to get everything in order to get anything, customers expect that most product offerings will appeal to their taste. Because these customers don't have the choice of simply not buying products that do not appeal to them, their only recourse if too many of these offering are presented is to stop being a customer.

    When looked at side by side, the negatives of a subscription-only sales model far outweigh the positives, and adoption of such a model will inevitably lead to a decline in overall sales. It's the only possible outcome. You cannot grow your sales when you adopt a model which deliberately produces beneath demand and alienates customers substantially easier than it attracts them.

    I want to know why Matty doggedly insists on basing production off of subscription sales rather than actual demand. Surely enough sales data has been collected since 2008 that a competent analyst could reasonably predict how much to produce without even factoring subs in.

    Matty, your subscription is much less marketable than your action figures. Regardless of their love for the toys, your subscription has many features and limitations that consumer just don't like. Stop equating dissatisfaction with subscriptions with disinterest in your real product, the toys. Make enough to meet demand, and have confidence that your product will sell. That's the only way to keep any of your lines alive, much less see them grow and prosper.
    I don't disagree with any of this. However, I don't think attracting new customers to MOTUC is a priority for Mattel any longer, considering where we are in the life of this line (most vintage MOTU characters have been released and we're winding down with POP, Filmation and NA characters being the biggest draws). I've been trying to understand the sub-only shift the past few days, and I think Mattel just knows it isn't going to recreate the numbers of 2010 and 2011 at this point, so Mattycollector needs to run differently moving forward, locking in sales with a sub to secure numbers and limit surplus inventory. I understand that, I just don't have the funds to commit to that model unfortunately, like many others I suspect, based on lack of sub sales. The simple fact is that as production costs increase and MOTUC interest/character selection decreases, Matty and the fanbase (and their wallets) are moving in two different directions. And I think that's evident by the anger, worry and disappointment on these very passionate forums, and the scrambling Scott and Co. are doing trying to adjust to that reality to keep MOTUC going in some way moving forward. For the sake of MOTUC and everyone on both sides who loves the brand so much...I hope for the best.

  8. #1083
    Master of Time & Space Jedi_Master_Jeremy's Avatar
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    Just a thought here people as I jumped on the forums this evening and saw that the info for Club Eternia Subs had fallen out of the main scroll bar and down into the past events area I couldn't help but see 2013 + going down their with it. Not that keeping it in the main scroll menu will change everything but it would at least maintain awareness and keep this issue on the front burner until the deadline and maybe it gets us some more subs who knows...just don't want the issue to be out of site, out of mind.
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  9. #1084
    Eternian Arashikage King Kahn's Avatar
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    They need guaranteed sales on all figures across the board which is why subs are important. Subs provide a base number for the line and help subsidize the cost of all figures.

    Example, a less, widely liked figure such as Spector or the Star Sisters may not entice 100 people to buy a sub but the sorceress WOULD prob entice 100 people to buy a sub. However, they need to sell the same minimum amount of each and every figure to make the line make money.

    They can not depend on day of sales, which could fluctuate wildly based on what the figure is and the demand of that figure.
    I want NA Skeletor and Rio Blast and I want them now!

  10. #1085
    Heroic Warrior Replikor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Not everyone is leaving the Titanic.

    Out of the 20 remaining figures (Snake Face's shield has been revealed), some vintage and NA figures aren't monthly slots such as Horde Trooper (2 pack), Modulok, Multibot and Sagitar (deluxe figures or large scale bests). We probably won't get to Multibot after Modulok comes out.

    I'll bet that some of the vintage line's most obscure characters are expendable. I don't think we'll see Rotar and Twistoid. The transforming Rock People, Gwildor, Blade and Saurod (I could understand Gwildor, but why haven't we seen Blade and Saurod yet?) might be written off for 2014 too.
    ...there are always those noble souls that will stay behind an play the music to calm those who wont survive with them... [salutes those poor souls goin down with the ship]

  11. #1086
    film noir warrior maltesefalcon's Avatar
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    been away from home for a couple of weeks so just got my sub today even voted! (for illumina even though i was dissapointed by the reuse of the teela dress again!) chose dhl for my shipping because i live in scotland and it sounds like a much better option than the international post everyone seems to be wanting. quicker shipping? definetly the one i want!

    im a multifan because allthough my main connection to motu is filmation na movie and 200x (not really the toys as i only got about 5) the designs and this site have given me interest in the next character to be revealed. the star sisters? never heard of them until tallstars crazy campaigns! he-ro whos that! even vykron i owe my interest in to this site.

    all in all i love the line it being the first real motu line i have seriously collected and i hope it continues it is still cheaper for me to get a sub so untill crackers the clown is made make mine motuc!
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  12. #1087
    Inappropriate Tree Hugger The.Idea.of.Evil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bskcase View Post
    Toy Guru is not giving a scare tactic. I don't know if there is a way to convince you, but I believe TG. I sincerely believe him and like I said before in other posts, its time to give MOTUC another chance. Yes, we have had issues. I've had the same issues with Roboto and Snout Spout. I just recently bought another Roboto because of it. But, I've also loved my Trap Jaw, Man-E-Faces, He-man, Skeletor, Star Sisters, and Battle Ground Teela.

    For these figures, I'm very happy the classics line is here. For these guys, I say to give Mattel a chance. Let them finish the line. We will get all our figures in time. A complete MOTUC line with all the characters you have wanted.

    If these characters ever meant something to you. Then stand with them. Support them. Your heroes don't give up. Don't leave because you had a bad experience. Stay because of the good figures that will be coming. Do it for the love of MOTU. If this line is saved and it continues. It wasn't because TG lied. It was because we (the fans) put in and got a subscription. We pulled together and saved the line.
    You're focusing on an argument I'm not making, and you're actually focusing on the argument that supporters of this line think that the non-supporters are only arguing about.

    It's not that I'm looking to know what figure comes out for the sake of cherry picking; I'm not looking out for myself and only wanting the characters I like before anyone else is made. What I want is the ability to know what's coming in advance, to be able to tell Mattel "Hey, don't release this character with that paint scheme and that buck, and make sure to have this detail on them," and I don't want to have to be forced to shell out the premium price's they're asking for for the figures I don't want before I even know what they are.

    Years ago, when Adora was first being released, there were two guys (and I was one of them) that brought up the fact that her sword of power was a clone of He-Man's, yet her sword was being released in one single silver color while He-Man's was two toned. Scott read this, said he ran down to try and get it adjusted for Adora's release, but it was too late. This "corrected sword" was released in a weapons pack later on AND She-Ra's gold sword was adjusted to have a two tone gold effect. It's the stuff like that that's been lost over the years, where instead of Scott saying "It's too late" or "It was the 4Horsemen's design" that really made the line exciting and fun. To hear all the passive excuses as to why the toys have terrible designs and/or flaws doesn't make me want to support the line at all. The design of the Sorceress' wings was so bad that I didn't bother buying her, yet she was #1 on my most wanted list. Was I supposed to brush it off and say "It's good enough and here's my money so that you will never change and will never aim for a higher standard."? No!

    The point I'm making is that Mattel needs to follow a new business model of not hiding toys from the fans, not denying the "adult collector market" the respect to ask and receive designs and paint schemes that they want (we know 200X is retired, we just want the paint scheme!), and to slow things down and not demand that we have to buy everything from them in advance so that the line won't die in an unforeseen future.

  13. #1088
    Illumina & Cat please! Darkspecter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The.Idea.of.Evil View Post
    Years ago, when Adora was first being released, there were two guys (and I was one of them) that brought up the fact that her sword of power was a clone of He-Man's, yet her sword was being released in one single silver color while He-Man's was two toned. Scott read this, said he ran down to try and get it adjusted for Adora's release, but it was too late.
    This is totally off-topic, but I just wanted to mention I bought MULTIPLE Adora's when Toyguru said future She-Ra swords would be two-toned because I LOVE Adora's sword and think it's perfect. :sgrin: Not a big fan of the two-toned She-Ra sword.

    Totally agree on the Sorceress though. I wanted 3 of the Sorceress, but only got one because of the big shoulder drums.
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  14. #1089
    Heroic Warrior Poe Ghostal's Avatar
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    Can I just point out that if the line ends in 2014 (or even 2013) that it would have been a pretty great run for an action figure line in the 21st century? We have literally dozens of figures! Beasts! Even a vehicle!

    Meanwhile, poor Thundercats fans will likely never see another Classic figure, and I'll be mildly surprised if the TMNT Retro Collection continues past the four main Turtles (I hope it does, though - the world needs at least one super-articulated Shredder). I think some collectors tend to compare MOTU solely to carefully managed evergreen properties like G.I. Joe and Transformers (and then, get a bit jealous )

    I don't think I'm generally perceived as a pro-Mattel voice around here, but I've always striven to be fair in my assessments. Mistakes have definitely been made; quality control problems being the most egregious, then customer service, and finally Mattel's reluctance to officially engage with the collector community (via polls and such) so as to properly gauge interest in particular characters and manage character selection. All that said - this is still a great toy line that has had what I think pretty much anyone in the industry would call a good run.

    Tallstar (the board member), I love ya, but I think it's very possible the Star Sisters had a negative effect on the 2013 sub numbers. BBTS can't even move them on clearance.

    I wonder if a separate POP sub would have been a good idea. It would have allowed Mattel to better gauge interest and determine exactly how many they could sell. Non-POP fans who just wanted a Scorpia or a Catra for their collections could buy them from the day-of sales.

    Full disclosure: I haven't subscribed to 2013 yet. Still considering.
    Last edited by Poe Ghostal; July 23, 2012 at 01:22am.

  15. #1090
    Heroic Warrior Stratos*Major's Avatar
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    I gotta give a HUGE thank you for the transparency in the responses.

    I love to hear the names. Not in order, not their scuplt, but to know those are the ones I will be signing up for!

    THIS has made me feel AMAZING about getting a sub.!

    I truly hope this helps increase subscriptions.

    Clarity can never be a bad thing!

  16. #1091
    Supreme Fudge Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspecter View Post
    Dynamo of Eternia...I don't even know where to start with everything you said. I will try to keep it very brief though. From your reply, it's quite evident you are only speaking for yourself and it's kind of hard to judge PoP by one movie and a handful of episodes. I mean, you have the entire series, but have only watched a handful of episodes, which says a whole lot right there.
    Actually it doesn't say what you think it does at all. Perhaps you should understand the context of the situation before jumping to conclusions.

    I've only seen the movie and a handful of episodes in recent years. I watched it a lot as a kid, but its been so long that I don't remember a lot of the specific individual episodes.

    The same is also true for 80s Filmation MOTU. Even though I have the DVDs of that (a couple of times over... I have the BCI releases of He-Man and She-Ra and the newer Mill Creek/Classic Media releases), I've only seen a handful of episodes in recent years. I also have the NA series, but have watched much less of it than the other 2 series.

    But the larger context here is that my wife and I simply own A LOT of DVDs and Blu-Rays, a huge part of which (particularly on the DVD side of things) is made up of TV series/season box sets. We have over 1,000 DVDs (and in the cases of TV season sets, that's counting each set as 1 DVD.... so the actual number of discs is WAY more), and over 400 Blu-Rays (some of which are also season sets, though not as large of a percentage). There are many cartoon shows and live action series that we have the complete series of, or at least all of the seasons that have been released for some shows that haven't had the full series released. We actually have a walk-in closet which I put shelves all around for the collection (I call it our "By The Power of Grayskull" closet, inspired by the film Hot Fuzz in which Simon Pegg says that line upon seeing Nick Frosts's closet full of DVDs), and we are actually running out of room in there and have some DVDs on some racks elsewhere.

    The point being is that we have so much content that we tend to collect it faster than we can watch it... but with stuff going out of print, etc with little or no warning, I don't want to run the risk of waiting and not being able to get it later. And with that much TV content in particular , there are many shows that I haven't watched in full on DVD yet but intend to at some point in time or another. However, there are very few shows that I've bought more than once in different editions , but She-Ra is one of the few. I have the BCI seasons, the Classic Media complete series, the Best of, the limited edition WWC/he-man.org best of, the single disc SOTS release, and the classic media Season 1 Volume 1 release. Most shows I wouldn't even bother doing that with... I'd get one release and be done with it, regardless of how many editions there are (and some shows have had more than 1 release) So THAT should tell you something right there!

    Regarding the Star Sisters vs. He-Ro, they were shown in quite a few things I noted in a previous post you may have missed or didn't read. He-Ro was a shadowy image in a mini-comic, on the box of a few beasts, a toy prototype in a magazine and on a knitting pattern. The Star Sisters got all that (minus the knitting pattern), but a full story in the MOTU magazine (with illustrations), another full story with illustrations and a fold-out poster in the PoP magazine with Starla on the cover, various other magazines and were in the Filmation cartoon. It's perfectly fine if you prefer He-Ro to the Star Sisters, but to write them off like they're nothing when they were HEAVILY advertised as opposed to the much lower amount of advertising of He-Ro is kind of insulting.
    Be all of that as it may (and those are some fair points), I think a bigger part of the interest in He-Ro (and to a MUCH lesser extent, the Star Sisters) has largely been due to the exposure of them on fan sites like this one over the years. I honestly didn't know anything about He-Ro until seeing his picture and hearing about him meany years ago on this very message board. I found it quite interesting to see where the line was going to go, as I imagine many MOTU fans did. I had never heard of the Star Sisters at all until Tallstar mentioned them a couple of times and at one point PMed a bunch of people, myself included, asking for people to petition Mattle or something to produce the figures as they would have apeared in the classic POP line. And even then I was like "Who?!!" and had no real interest in looking further into it. The people who tend to care most about them are those who take a particular interest in the 80s POP toy line in and of itself., And they tend to be in the minority. It is what it is. It goes hand-in-hand with what I was saying earlier... for anyone who looked upon the POP toy line as the only means by which to get the characters from the cartoon that they absolutely wanted (but would have preferred something more similar to and compatible with vintage MOTU figures), the future plans for the POP toy line in-and-of itself were and largely still are of little interest or consequence to them.

    And are you really suggesting that if the Star Sisters had been released as a non-sub item, in the same quantity that was in total produced of them, that they would have sold out just fine and Mattel wouldn't be sitting on them like they have been Gygors and Mo-larr sets? Even if they were to have sold somewhat better than those other 2 examples, there still most certainly would have been a large excess of unsold stock (and I do not mean the stock that is held back for customer service issues).


    Tallstar and I both did quite a lot of research regarding the MOTUC Star Sisters, who wanted them, didn't want them, which versions were liked the best, who didn't buy a sub because of them, etc. There were people who did not like them at all (any versions), but more people liked the Star Sisters. Some people who REALLY wanted the Star Sisters hated the versions that were released and refused to buy them. Others bought additional subs BECAUSE of the Star Sisters. It's all quite interesting data. I forget which thread it's all compiled in.
    And I'm sure that SOME people did prefer the toy versions (and that was their reason for not liking these) and some bought subs because of them. Are they the majority? no. Also, your research, while a lot of work went into it and I applaud the effort, was made up by way of you cobbling together statements that people made in various different threads... some of which may have been vary obvious about the person's prefereance, but others of whihc could have been and probably were taken out of context (for an example of you taking things out of context what you think you know for certain, see above where you jumped to the conclusions about the amount of POP on DVD that I have watched)... and none of which was filtered by way of an overall poll or some kind of standard measure. It was all "well, Joe-Bob said this over here, and Mary-Sue said that over there!". Then the poll that was conducted here on he-man.org showed that a very substantial amount of people not looking forward to the star sisters, and then in another thread somewhere around here I seem to recall you trying to dispute the accuracy of those results and the results of polls in general, saying how it only reflects the views of the people who voted and not necessarily everyone out there.... which I admit can be true to a certain extent, but when you get enough of a sampling, (which that poll did) you get enough of a rough idea that it is fairly accurate within a certain margin of error. It's just funny how you will find ways to spin something like that and say how a straight forward, specific and to the point, centralized poll "could" be inaccurate, but then you still use your research, which (while commendable for the effort put into it) was basically a lot of scattered statements that random people made all over the place in varying contexts which you essentially patched and duct taped together, as defense for the Star Sisters. Delusions of grandeur, indeed. No offense, but I'll trust the poll over that.
    Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; July 23, 2012 at 03:31am.
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  17. #1092
    Heroic Warrior Stratos*Major's Avatar
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    I have to say we have to move beyond the scare tacticts thing(s).

    I for one am. If I can get a clear idead of he characters I can expect (in some kind of time frame). Not needing exact dates of figure reveals!

    Hopefully this really will inspire new subscribers to join, POP & NA fans have got to be happy, I only hope that outweighs any fear and allows us to move on to the TRUE inclusion of POP & NA into the MOTUC universe!

    Freaking MERMISTA!!!!!

    Just knowing she can be mine by 2014 has me wanting to but the 2014 sub. already. Mermista is my #1 and always will be when I have her...but would love to see other characters released! SCROPIA!?!? Awesome...Madame Razz & Brrom...come on!!!!

  18. #1093
    Fighting Foe Fan Whiplash7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Tons of Toyguru answers....I've updated the front of the thread with this information too.
    Holy **** that's a lot. Thanks for posting it all, max.

    He answered my question about changing the shipping options. While "ideally" is not a full "yes", it has gone a long way towards convincing me to maybe buy a sub.

    However he keeps saying that sub-holders are completists and want everything. That's not true for a lot of them. How many of them are resellers? Or have subscribed to avoid the sale date and fast sell-outs, only to sell things off they don't want? Just look at the marketplace! Maybe they're tired of trying, and a few revealed names might convince them they don't have to try and sell off a figure nobody wants.

  19. #1094
    Supreme Fudge Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PPC View Post
    Best post ever. This is everything in a nutshell that is wrong with numbers on this line. I really wish Scott would read and seriously consider the points in this post. This line could survive if Mattel would just restructure the way they sell and market this line. I won't hold my breath though. Scott and Mattel have demonstrated their stubbornness and refusal to listen to reason in the last four years and that's why the line is in trouble.
    Part of what gets me is this (IMO) nonsense about how 2013 is "locked-in" and changes can't be made at this point. Scott has said that if they don't get enough subs, that the line is effectively canceled, but they will still release any figures that have already been tooled by the time that is determined. So, this is what gets me.... if they can just go ahead and call it quits to any and all 2013 figures that haven't gone into the tooling stage yet, then why can't they replan what figures to release?

    Even if that takes time and they don't have the time now, why not start working on a plan B?

    The price increase obviously hasn't helped, but I do think that having obscure characters in the mix like the Fighting Foe Men, and to a lesser extent Nestossa (she's not quite as well known of a POP character) is probably what is keeping people from subscribing more than anything. I honestly do think that more people would sign up if they had more "meat and potatoes" characters in the announced line up.

    So, if not enough people sign up for the sub, instead of just canceling the line, why not take some time, go back, and replan things a bit. Scrap the FFM (if their tooling hasn't already been done), and come up with a plan that only includes major characters, but that still also allows for the cost of the tooling for a figure like Ram-Man (reusing parts for other figures that will come out as much as possible). Then maybe create a new sub or whatever that will perhaps only encompass the last half of 2013 or even from maybe April through the end of the year (depending on how much leed time is needed), announce most if not all of the planned characters, and then put up a sub based on that criteria? While I certainly hope that the sub in it's current form does go through, why not start planning something like this as a back-up plan?

    I'm more than certain that even with the price increase, people will buy the major characters... it's just the "filler" that is going to be an even harder sell at these new prices. While I fully understand wanting to get people to sign up with the sub as-is, to me it is asinine that it has to be this or nothing. There are some very obvious alternatives here that would likely work and should be explored. I really hope Mattel reconsiders in the event that not enough people sign up, but I'm not holding my breath.
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  20. #1095
    Heroic Warrior Arm-Ore's Avatar
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    I love this line with all my heart, and I so very much want to provide the same level of support as I did in the past.
    I understand and appreciate the points that Toyguru's been trying to communicate with us.
    I also understand the reasoning behind the price increase on individual items or even on services.
    The harsh reality is that I simply don't have enough money to keep it up.
    In the past I spent at least $48 every month on two subs. Getting two 2013 subs would cost me at least $63 a month.
    On top of that, we don't know what items we will be getting outside the sub next year.
    Those special items will surely costs more than they were in the past.
    That is just too much for me to handle financially.

    Honestly speaking, if the total cost of 2013 sub were still in the price range of what it was originally (in 2010 or 2011), I would certainly get my 2 subs in a heartbeat regardless the character choices and even the number of items included in the sub.
    Seriously, if the total cost for the sub remains affordable to me, I don't mind getting less figures each year because that is all I can afford.

    I still want to support the line and support MOTU with all my heart.
    It is the total cost for 2013 sub that I cannot afford. My pocket simply isn't that deep.

    Well, that is my story. Hopefully Mattel can find a clever way to lower the total cost of 2014 sub without sacrificing the quality of products and services.
    Toyguru, I am counting on you.

  21. #1096
    Heroic Warrior bianchi5's Avatar
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    Maybe I'm wrong, but if I have to guess I would say that every "nothing to announce right now, but stay tuned" is a strong hint for 2013, so Double Trouble and Stridor!
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  22. #1097
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    Quote Originally Posted by blogjammer View Post
    Why would I buy a sub? If I bought one for 2012 I would have been left with star sisters,draego man, shadow weaver, photog, slush head, spector, Griffin, vykron, sir laser lot, cy chop, dekker, procrustus, frosta, king randor & the snake men 2 pack - none of which I could care less about.

    Already for 2013 I know I dont want King He-Man, Netossa, Fang Man, Strobo & the fighting foe men. 5 out of the 7 releases revealed so far!

    Why would I want to pay not only for all these figures that I don't want AS WELL as the shipping & customer charges to Australia.

    It'll probably cost a little more to get them elsewhere from a retailer who has subs but they'll be shipped faster & arrive sooner & will still cost less than the cost incurred for a bunch of stuff that I dont want.

    No sub for me.
    Umm yeah.... All of the 30th Anniversary figures you listed were in their own seperate sub? And how in the world would you get them faster from a reseller than from Mattel? 1st the reseller would need to receive them from Mattel before shipping them?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaClassics View Post
    With the news of the revamped 2014 sub that will have all A-LIST figures...This is what we have all wanted !!!

    Every figure in 2014 will be an A-LIST figure. BUY A SUB !!!!!
    While a lot of core characters remain, none of them are A-Listers, this term gets thrown about way too much.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheFallen View Post
    I have bought a 3rd subscription in the faith that Toyguru is being honest and that we will get more Killer and no Filler now.

    That better mean no more lazy figures like SMAA and no shoehorned in Mighty Spector-types
    There won't be any new characters not shown in some form or another somewhere previously, the 30th anniversary line was a special case of 5 new characters and Photog.

    Quote Originally Posted by Berserker79 View Post
    MOTUC has expanded too much, imo it needs to shrink down and Mattel should release only stuff, most fans want. No Vykron, Chief Carnivous, Tytus, Fearless Photog. Put those aside.

    Just bring highly fan demanded characters like Glimmer, Hydron, Flogg, Castaspella and the rest of the vintage fan faves. Those figures keep the line going. THAN you can think about obscure stuff for 75$.
    Fan demanded is subject to opinion, I certainly want to see Snake Armor He-Man, Prahvus, Lord Dacytus, Lizzor, Calix, etc. But with the revelation that 2014 will be the year of all vintage figures the probability these will be produced is diminshed.

    Quote Originally Posted by PPC View Post
    Best post ever. This is everything in a nutshell that is wrong with numbers on this line. I really wish Scott would read and seriously consider the points in this post. This line could survive if Mattel would just restructure the way they sell and market this line. I won't hold my breath though. Scott and Mattel have demonstrated their stubbornness and refusal to listen to reason in the last four years and that's why the line is in trouble.
    This line has been spectactular, maybe things could be different? But this the business model moving forward, they need to guarantee all the figures sell and costs are spread out between highly tool'd figures and figures with lots of reuse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspecter View Post
    You may brush off the Star Sisters, but they were desired by fans and the versions that were wanted, were not released. The toy prototypes had more accessories, action features and details. A LOT of love went into those creations. They are the STAR Sisters and each had different translucent, glitter-infused body parts showing their relation to each other, while making them look special and from space. In MOTUC, we pretty much just have the yellow one, pink one and the fashion disaster. They lost their accessories, details and everything that made them special. This is one of the reasons some people DO hate them.
    They are so desired they sell for half price on the secondary market. And yes I know 12 of you want the Toy versions because they were so much more requested. When in reality if these would have never been produced most fans would'nt have cared.

    Quote Originally Posted by Replikor View Post
    ...well Toy Guru has stated that they want to "go out with a bang" in 2014 as it will be worked as the "possible" last year... SO... about the only way they could is to do 3-4 figure a month......
    Seriously??? You think they will put 3-4 figures a month, when they are having a hard time getting subscribers at scaled back year this year? No way are they going to produce a $1200 sub before shipping next year
    Last edited by cbomb23; July 23, 2012 at 04:37am.

  23. #1098
    Court Magician blogjammer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbomb23 View Post
    Umm yeah.... All of the 30th Anniversary figures you listed were in their own seperate sub? And how in the world would you get them faster from a reseller than from Mattel? 1st the reseller would need to receive them from Mattel before shipping them?
    I live in Australia. It takes 5-7 weeks to recieve each order once it has been shipped unless I want to pay almost $50 just for shipping. Resellers from the US who recieve their product much sooner may offer better shipping options.
    shipping.JPG
    Last edited by blogjammer; July 23, 2012 at 03:57am.

  24. #1099
    Fighting Foe Fan Whiplash7's Avatar
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    I live in Canada and it takes longer for matty to ship, than for resellers to get their orders and then ship them to us. It's just a fact, DR is terrible. The average is 3-4 weeks--which is insanely bad--but there have been some really bad cases, like Scareglow (two months to reach Canadian soil).
    If it wasn't for the possibility of having to replace a defective figure, I would buy from resellers more than from matty.

  25. #1100
    "No Lashor, We Bash Ya!" Robzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blogjammer View Post
    I live in Australia. It takes 5-7 weeks to recieve each order once it has been shipped unless I want to pay almost $50 just for shipping. Resellers from the US who recieve their product much sooner may offer better shipping options.
    shipping.JPG
    A big +1 on this!

    This year has been the worst ever... it's another issue a lot "non-international" customers are unaware of. My figures are taking well over 5 weeks to arrive... sometimes 2 months! Resellers are much faster than direct from Matty!!
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