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Thread: Toyguru Mattycollector.com MOTUC News Thread August 2012

  1. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by fball13z View Post
    find this very odd, Im sorry if those are new parts, its a waste of tooling, b/c most of the arms and legs look just like MOTUC and if they were willing to share the tooling for the shoulders, why not the rest?
    Because they need tooling for the waist, the bat symbols and without nipples anyway. For me the more part they can share between different lines the better. More shared parts means lower cost to produce. Didn't anyone realize Mattel is aligning MOTUC, WWE, and DCU into same scale (~7") didn't anyone realize new DCU sculpt are all taller now.

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    Heroic Warrior fireball13z's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightcraw View Post
    Because they need tooling for the waist, the bat symbols and without nipples anyway. For me the more part they can share between different lines the better. More shared parts means lower cost to produce. Didn't anyone realize Mattel is aligning MOTUC, WWE, and DCU into same scale (~7") didn't anyone realize new DCU sculpt are all taller now.
    I guess you dont have the New 52 bats and superman lol, b/c those are shorter then a lot of DCUC figs.

    But something a friend pointed out to me, we went through this same debate with Gy-Gor vs Grodd, we all "knew" they were the same figure, which they turned out not to be the same.

    He pointed out that b/c they are sculpted by the same artists they are going to look the same. Just some food for thought.
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  3. #278
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prahvus View Post
    I just hope we'll get PLENTY of vintage figures in 2013 too, and that these will have quite a lot of new tooling. 2014 doesn't seem like it's gonna be stellar, unlike Toyguru first announced in order to sell more subs...

    Yes, Toyguru apologizes, but it's a little late now, isn't it ? Now that the subs have sold, we suddenly see loads of backpedaling... It has become a sad trend for Mattel, once they got what they wanted, to modify - or at least to downsize - the promises they made initially.
    Despite the size of the 2014 sub, at least the fans ULTIMATELY got what they wanted: instead of intermingling concepts and obscures with original characters, Classics is back to making straight original characters, so now people have some idea of what is coming. Some people are overlooking this.

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    I am glad that 2014 is scaling back... do you realize just how much sep.-dec is going to be this year? 10-12 figs for 2014 will be great, I seriously doubt they will do less than that. If it's economically reasonable, plus loaded with vintage must haves, subs should rise significantly.
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  5. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Despite the size of the 2014 sub, at least the fans ULTIMATELY got what they wanted: instead of intermingling concepts and obscures with original characters, Classics is back to making straight original characters, so now people have some idea of what is coming. Some people are overlooking this.
    I agree MGM. 2014 should pump out some much wanted and anticipated figs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Despite the size of the 2014 sub, at least the fans ULTIMATELY got what they wanted: instead of intermingling concepts and obscures with original characters, Classics is back to making straight original characters, so now people have some idea of what is coming. Some people are overlooking this.
    I'm glad we will be getting more figures but isn't Classics meant to tie all of MOTU together? I think there are a lot of fans who do want the concept characters, I know I do. And by doing only the vintage figures how will they be able to put any type of ending to their bios canon? None of the vintage characters left are really vital to the conclusion and it has been the concept and variant figures who have really pushed the story forward. By deviating from the roadmap we will most likely be left with a huge hole in the story and our collection. So I personally am not overjoyed about 2014 being whatever Scott can get approved. It is being painted as a mediocre year where we may or may not get more than 6 figures. I am not complaining just wish that we were not given this dismal information so soon after we pushed the sub through. Scott should've waited until he knew more about 2014 before he made any indication about what it will hold. Now we will be arguing about this until this time next year. I just wanna focus on 13 as much as possible.

  7. #282
    Heroic Warrior Stygian360's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Despite the size of the 2014 sub, at least the fans ULTIMATELY got what they wanted: instead of intermingling concepts and obscures with original characters, Classics is back to making straight original characters
    When you say "original characters" I assume you mean characters specific to the existing lore, correct (i.e., Modulok, Glimmer, et. al.)? Some (obviously in this case me) might interpret this to mean the new 30th characters or possibly even characters introduced from the recent mini-comics and related media.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wundarwarrior View Post
    I'm glad we will be getting more figures but isn't Classics meant to tie all of MOTU together? I think there are a lot of fans who do want the concept characters, I know I do. And by doing only the vintage figures how will they be able to put any type of ending to their bios canon? None of the vintage characters left are really vital to the conclusion and it has been the concept and variant figures who have really pushed the story forward. By deviating from the roadmap we will most likely be left with a huge hole in the story and our collection. So I personally am not overjoyed about 2014 being whatever Scott can get approved. It is being painted as a mediocre year where we may or may not get more than 6 figures. I am not complaining just wish that we were not given this dismal information so soon after we pushed the sub through. Scott should've waited until he knew more about 2014 before he made any indication about what it will hold. Now we will be arguing about this until this time next year. I just wanna focus on 13 as much as possible.
    TG can reveal what happens if the figures were to end since he has the story all written out since Stratos.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stygian360 View Post
    When you say "original characters" I assume you mean characters specific to the existing lore, correct (i.e., Modulok, Glimmer, et. al.)? Some (obviously in this case me) might interpret this to mean the new 30th characters or possibly even characters introduced from the recent mini-comics and related media.
    By "original", I mean characters who had figures in the 80's. TG has said that this includes the major Filmation characters too. I'm not sure about pre-existing characters such as Eldor, who never came out or Oo-Larr from the mini-comics.

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  9. #284
    Heroic Warrior Stygian360's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wundarwarrior View Post
    I'm glad we will be getting more figures but isn't Classics meant to tie all of MOTU together? I think there are a lot of fans who do want the concept characters, I know I do. And by doing only the vintage figures how will they be able to put any type of ending to their bios canon? None of the vintage characters left are really vital to the conclusion and it has been the concept and variant figures who have really pushed the story forward. By deviating from the road map we will most likely be left with a huge hole in the story and our collection. So I personally am not overjoyed about 2014 being whatever Scott can get approved. It is being painted as a mediocre year where we may or may not get more than 6 figures. I am not complaining just wish that we were not given this dismal information so soon after we pushed the sub through. Scott should've waited until he knew more about 2014 before he made any indication about what it will hold. Now we will be arguing about this until this time next year. I just wanna focus on 13 as much as possible.
    This is a great point Wundar. Scott tends to refer to people who buy subs as "all in" completists, but I prefer to think of us as collectors who want everything of course, but mostly as people who like not only the 'original' 80's toys updated, but also the obscure mini-comic and/or concept figures.
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  10. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stygian360 View Post
    This is a great point Wundar. Scott tends to refer to people who buy subs as "all in" completists, but I prefer to think of us as collectors who want everything of course, but mostly as people who like not only the 'original' 80's toys updated, but also the obscure mini-comic and/or concept figures.
    unfortunately there aren't enough you to sustain the line.

    When the vast majority is saying yes... we want everything and anything you stamp the MOTU label on... then they can focus on the 'all in' guys.... but if they want the MOST buyers.. they have to focus on the 'established' characters.

    I also debate the idea of Classics tieing in ALL of MOTU together... It DID specifically advertise 'All your favorites from the world of He-man and She-ra'...

    I'm pretty sure Vykron and sir laser-lot were NOBODY''s 'Favorites'.... unreleased, and unknown characters by definition COULDN'T be 'Favorites'....

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    unfortunately there aren't enough you to sustain the line.

    When the vast majority is saying yes... we want everything and anything you stamp the MOTU label on... then they can focus on the 'all in' guys.... but if they want the MOST buyers.. they have to focus on the 'established' characters.

    I also debate the idea of Classics tieing in ALL of MOTU together... It DID specifically advertise 'All your favorites from the world of He-man and She-ra'...

    I'm pretty sure Vykron and sir laser-lot were NOBODY''s 'Favorites'.... unreleased, and unknown characters by definition COULDN'T be 'Favorites'....
    The problem is I don't think it's actually ever been sustained how many "all-in" versus "only this or that faction" customers there are in MOTUC. Everyone is just guessing. There are many reasons people didn't resub for next year so you can't really point to lower subs as proof either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JonWes View Post
    The problem is I don't think it's actually ever been sustained how many "all-in" versus "only this or that faction" customers there are in MOTUC. Everyone is just guessing. There are many reasons people didn't resub for next year so you can't really point to lower subs as proof either.
    I agree....I'm not an "all-in" collector but I subbed this year with the "sub or die" looming over our heads. That being said, a big draw to me is the variety and the fact that we are getting figures we wanted as kids from the cartoons and never got as well as updated preexisting characters. I don't even mind some of the new ones. The thing is there is always going to be a couple of characters that you could do with out in any line. Even the vintage MOTU had guys that I didn't care for as a kid (I thought TC Skeletor and FF He-man were ridiculous...Skeletor looked like he borrowed Evil Lyn's sports bra) That being said, I just hope we do get a full line of favorites for 2014 and that the line bounces back and is able to expand into son of He-man and beyond!

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    Quote Originally Posted by fball13z View Post
    I guess you dont have the New 52 bats and superman lol, b/c those are shorter then a lot of DCUC figs.
    Actually those are the right size because they could be using retooled existing parts, its the other figures that are growing in size. take a look the entire arkham city batman in the Batman Legacy series. All new sculpts, all 7" (batman, robin, joker, Catwoman, Nightwing, Harely Quinn). Even Red Robin and Super Boy Prime seem to be over sized.
    Last edited by nightcraw; August 14, 2012 at 03:24pm.

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    That doesn't make sense though, since Red Robin and Superboy re-use more parts than New 52 Batman and Superman. Batman and Superman are on new bodies with detailing. RR and Superboy use old bodies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JonWes View Post
    The problem is I don't think it's actually ever been sustained how many "all-in" versus "only this or that faction" customers there are in MOTUC. Everyone is just guessing. There are many reasons people didn't resub for next year so you can't really point to lower subs as proof either.
    Agree with this^. I sincerely doubt the majority who walked away from the line in 2013 were "all in" collectors, leaving only the cherry pickers and non-completists to carry the 135% load. In fact I'd say the majority who DID stick around are those who support the line regardless... in other words completists and people who love everything MOTUC. Those who DID walk away are more than likely the casuals, cherry pickers, and people who've by this point completed the collections they wanted to complete- all original 80's toys are not. Confusing all iners/completists and their desire for obsurce characters with OG's who desire only the old stuff is I feel a misunderstanding of the issue.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoffman View Post
    That doesn't make sense though, since Red Robin and Superboy re-use more parts than New 52 Batman and Superman. Batman and Superman are on new bodies with detailing. RR and Superboy use old bodies.
    Even on the same buck, length can change a little. size of head, wear "skirt" around the waist. and length of lower legs can make up the 1/2 inches quite easily.

    There is a side by side picture at Cool Toy Review Site
    Last edited by nightcraw; August 14, 2012 at 03:01pm.

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    No I know. But you said that Batman and Superman were still smaller because they used old bodies. Which isn't true. They made almost brand new figures that DON'T fit your "new scale" theory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoffman View Post
    No I know. But you said that Batman and Superman were still smaller because they used old bodies. Which isn't true. They made almost brand new figures that DON'T fit your "new scale" theory.
    You got me there. Maybe Mattel will wait for the fans to cry for a proper scaled batman and Superman after the rest of lines had gone too big.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RyDell View Post
    I am glad that 2014 is scaling back... do you realize just how much sep.-dec is going to be this year? 10-12 figs for 2014 will be great, I seriously doubt they will do less than that. If it's economically reasonable, plus loaded with vintage must haves, subs should rise significantly.
    I wish 2013 was more scaled back (12 to 14 figs plus exclusive) and I am an "all in" collector. I want 2014 to be scaled back as well but 6 to 8 is just TO FEW. Make 2014 12 HEAVY HITTERS and male Two Badd the Sub exclusive. Then TG and the Mattel big wigs can expect a HUGE year (aka CHA-CHING!)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stygian360 View Post
    Agree with this^. I sincerely doubt the majority who walked away from the line in 2013 were "all in" collectors, leaving only the cherry pickers and non-completists to carry the 135% load. In fact I'd say the majority who DID stick around are those who support the line regardless... in other words completists and people who love everything MOTUC. Those who DID walk away are more than likely the casuals, cherry pickers, and people who've by this point completed the collections they wanted to complete- all original 80's toys are not. Confusing all iners/completists and their desire for obsurce characters with OG's who desire only the old stuff is I feel a misunderstanding of the issue.

    Oh, I agree with that. I think that a LOT of the drop off was the casual fan who was tired of star sisters and other random things leaving only the 'all in' fans.

    the problem was that THOSE fans who were supporting anything and everything weren't ENOUGH. The call went out and the cherry pickers were begged, pleaded, and threatened to come back for the sub.

    That was my point. There were a lot of fans who like obscure crazy wacky stuff, and they were first in line to buy the sub... but they weren't enough this time around

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    Quote Originally Posted by scott metzger View Post
    And I'm sure you and others would have said the same about Optikk and Slushhead, which turned out fine with a good amount of re-used parts. Admittedly, Rio would need a lot, but more than just the biceps could be reused. A second front piece to a chestarmor made to look like his top could give the "flip down" guns and allow a regular torso to be used. For Mantenna, Existing legs with a new crotch piece and maybe feet (although the original figure didn't establish much in the line of feet, so existing ones might work), chest armor and maybe new hands along with the head is no more than some standard figures get. Modulock is problematic for re-use, admittedly, but not beyond possibility, depending on the look, toy or Filmation. The latter wouldn't really require the interchangeability (although I can see a lot of folks being majorly let down without something of that feature surviving).

    I admit, I initially felt that some of the figures you mention would be off the table last week, but more time to think has made me soften that stance. Some creativity (which the Fab Four have plenty of) might do more with re-use than we think is possible right now and still give us outstanding figures.
    For Rio - even if a new torso is created with an open compartment, it could be used again for Buzz-Saw Hordak, which might justify it. As for the arms, look at what they did with clip-around hoses on Slushhead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JonWes View Post
    The problem is I don't think it's actually ever been sustained how many "all-in" versus "only this or that faction" customers there are in MOTUC. Everyone is just guessing. There are many reasons people didn't resub for next year so you can't really point to lower subs as proof either.
    agreed.

    i didn't re-sub for next year because i only want few figs of what they've shown us.

    if 2014 does indeed include a lot of the key missing figs, i'll probably sub.

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    Heroic Warrior Stygian360's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    Oh, I agree with that. I think that a LOT of the drop off was the casual fan who was tired of star sisters and other random things leaving only the 'all in' fans.

    the problem was that THOSE fans who were supporting anything and everything weren't ENOUGH. The call went out and the cherry pickers were begged, pleaded, and threatened to come back for the sub.

    That was my point. There were a lot of fans who like obscure crazy wacky stuff, and they were first in line to buy the sub... but they weren't enough this time around
    But (and with all due respect) your argument that the majority of current sub holders now consists of cherry pickers and those who only want 'original' characters kinda falls apart in light of the fact that those who subbed up (and many of us many times more than we would normally) are those self-same completists. In fact if anything those who Mattel should be catering to are completists, as cherry pickers and look-ee-lou's took off this year. I think that's the piece collectors and perhaps even Mattel doesn't quite realize. Yes, some casual collectors did come back to help save the line and support the fandom, but actually somewhat of a flip-flop has now occurred in that I'd wager most (if not over 90%) of sub holders are really dyed in the wool completists. Again, the very same people who don't really care if the line changes to all original 80's mainstays or not. We just want the line to continue period. So given that, can you still say that the line is still majority supported by the OG's?
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    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    Oh, I agree with that. I think that a LOT of the drop off was the casual fan who was tired of star sisters and other random things leaving only the 'all in' fans.

    the problem was that THOSE fans who were supporting anything and everything weren't ENOUGH. The call went out and the cherry pickers were begged, pleaded, and threatened to come back for the sub.

    That was my point. There were a lot of fans who like obscure crazy wacky stuff, and they were first in line to buy the sub... but they weren't enough this time around
    I agree. This time the completionists and resellers weren't enough, as their numbers were driven off by obscure characters that they wouldn't move, higher prices, international shipping, terrible QC or responses to such and Digital River. Mattel had to cater to the casual fans who ordinarily wouldn't have brought a sub, creating a shift in priorities.

    Now, instead of Classics catering to the completionist, it caters to the cherry picker.

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    Fighting Foe Fan Whiplash7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Now, instead of Classics catering to the completionist, it caters to the cherry picker.
    With DOS being mostly axed, and with higher prices when available, they aren't catering to us (er, them) at all. Catering in the 2014 sub maybe, but 'cherry picker' shouldn't be an umbrella term for people who only want vintage figures. There are all different types of collectors. There are actually very few vintage figures left that I would want.

    I think character selection has a lot less to do with the lower number of subs than cost, QC, DR, etc. There have always been complaints about the majority of figures being included, regardless of their vintage status or era. This 'concept figures are killing teh lien' thing is just a myth.

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