Fisto - Re-released ?

[d*r*j*]

Funny thing is that Fisto is one of the best figures in the line. He was never a favorite character but the classics version is so very close to the perfect motuc. A fan favorite for sure. Shadow Weaver, Sorceress, Fisto... Some of the best figures of the year are the most rare, better than actually having a real balanced view on production.

[He-Dad]

Back on topic:

This is a BRILLIANT idea. I would be more than happy to get an extra Fisto figure along with Stridor - even at an extra expense. As Jon says, he could easily come without the 200X extras that the original did, and while there may be complaints, I think the overwhelming majority would be extremely happy (especially those who didn't get him the first time around...)

This is a great idea. And those who don't want the extra Fisto should have no problem selling or trading him off either. I have no need for another Fisto, but I wouldn't be opposed to those who missed out getting one for a reasonable price. I lucked out and got one for cost plus shipping from a fellow orger but I know ALOT of people want $50 or more for the guy. Besides, I'm sure a lot of vintage purists wouldn't mind not having that hole in his back for that sword holder.

[Megalodon]

I know ALOT of people want $50 or more for the guy.

It shouldn't be though....That's just the problem with this line they started off with high production numbers then as popularity gained they cut production because they wanted faster sell outs...What???

Thye could make more figures but I don't think that will happen any time soon and since Mosquitor sold out how long before we see him go up to $50-60 or more....

Some people here are worried about trivial stuff that won't change but it should bother them that Mattel is Purposely limiting these for so if you can't get in in the 2-3 hours it's on sale then they don't care that you have to sepdn $50 for a normal figure....And I don't want to hear about other toys that are sold this way MOTUC is not like this it's online only but only lately has it become a "limited" product and only because some body in Mattel though it was a "good" idea....

[Barnster]

Some people here are worried about trivial stuff that won't change but it should bother them that Mattel is Purposely limiting these for so if you can't get in in the 2-3 hours it's on sale then they don't care that you have to sepdn $50 for a normal figure....

Just for the record, international buyers, including myself, already pay 40-50 Dollars for a normal figure, thanks to shipping and taxes. But you won't hear me complain about it, because shipping and taxes are not Mattel's fault.

And I don't want to hear about other toys that are sold this way MOTUC is not like this it's online only but only lately has it become a "limited" product and only because some body in Mattel though it was a "good" idea....

Just because you don't want to hear it, it doesn't change the fact that every toyline has it's rarities and those rarities keep the secondary market alive for both, "Scal-Por the evil" or, for example, "BBTS the toy dealer" and in the end, they help to keep this line up and running also for those who buy directly from Matty. It worked pretty well for the last 4 1/2 years.

I'm still trying to get for my son the essential characters form Disney Pixar's Cars 1&2 (diecast, 1:55 scale) and some are sold at ridiculously high prices (reminder: it's a retail product). Some of them so high, I simply have to wait to get them loose in the best possible condition. Chasing down these items is part of the fun for me and totally worth the wait when I can see the smile on my kid's face when he finally got his "Red the fire engine" for christmas.

You may not like the way the game is played, but you can't change the rules, no matter how bad you want them to change.

[He-Dad]

It shouldn't be though....That's just the problem with this line they started off with high production numbers then as popularity gained they cut production because they wanted faster sell outs...What???

Thye could make more figures but I don't think that will happen any time soon and since Mosquitor sold out how long before we see him go up to $50-60 or more....

Some people here are worried about trivial stuff that won't change but it should bother them that Mattel is Purposely limiting these for so if you can't get in in the 2-3 hours it's on sale then they don't care that you have to sepdn $50 for a normal figure....And I don't want to hear about other toys that are sold this way MOTUC is not like this it's online only but only lately has it become a "limited" product and only because some body in Mattel though it was a "good" idea....

Well, honestly it wasn't that long ago that my local comic shop was selling Count Marzo for $54. People charge what people are willing to pay. Your right, they are purposely limiting the figures.....but I think they prefer to error on the side of caution rather than sit on a million unsold figures......even limited it seems that they had that issue earlier in the line with certain figures so by limiting them all they don't sit on unsold inventory. Granted that sucks for some of us as collectors, both subbers and non subbers alike (as seen with Fisto) but I think that it's only going to get more limited as less subs are sold. (Not suprising honestly as there are only a couple figures I'm really excited about even though I subbed for the first time this year.)

[Megalodon]

Well, honestly it wasn't that long ago that my local comic shop was selling Count Marzo for $54. People charge what people are willing to pay. Your right, they are purposely limiting the figures.....but I think they prefer to error on the side of caution rather than sit on a million unsold figures......even limited it seems that they had that issue earlier in the line with certain figures so by limiting them all they don't sit on unsold inventory. Granted that sucks for some of us as collectors, both subbers and non subbers alike (as seen with Fisto) but I think that it's only going to get more limited as less subs are sold. (Not suprising honestly as there are only a couple figures I'm really excited about even though I subbed for the first time this year.)

At least some people get it self imposed "rare" items are what Mattel does and it's not "Rare" because they were limited by scarcity,case count etc. production was held up on purpose going back to what I said dozens of times before (No one seemed to notice)that Mattel is so scared of overproduction that they rarther "under" produce that make a little more to make money and make more of the fans that want them to get them...And I don't care about what the prices are overseas because I live in the US so I am concerned about items available in the US..Some people will always throw out their personal stories that have nothing ot do with anyone else except the people in that demo so please stop...I know ALOT of people in other contries that are paying premiums but not for new items that are underproduced....

This is Mattel's way to FORCE you to buy a sub.....

[chuc98]

OK, let me simplify this for you.
Get it?

Thank you for simplifying it so us less edumuh–cated folk understand.

[Barnster]

And I don't care about what the prices are overseas because I live in the US so I am concerned about items available in the US..Some people will always throw out their personal stories that have nothing ot do with anyone else except the people in that demo so please stop...I know ALOT of people in other contries that are paying premiums but not for new items that are underproduced....

I wonder how you will react when all the guys form overseas dump MOTUC because of the price they have to pay, causing the line to end, with zero chance to complete your collection the way you wanted to? To care only for your own stuff is short sighted.

This is Mattel's way to FORCE you to buy a sub.....

I have said it once, and I say it again: "No one can force people into subs but the people alone."

I did not sub again for 2013, because the Fighting Foe Men are really not my cup of tea and, because of their price. I gladly pay a little more on characters I want and have full control over my finances instead of having to take everything that comes down the road. I'm starting to run out of space but I don't want to keep my figures packed somewhere in the basement, not even the ones I do not like.

The Fisto fiasco, and it really is a fiasco for subbers who did not get what they paid for, is unique. Mattel owes them an BIG apology. DOS buyers on the other hand, knew the risk to possibly miss Fisto out on Matty directly. He is an expensive figure now, but the prices would drop down, if no one is willing to pay these, sadly ppl DO pay these prices. And again we are back at the "rules of the market" that can not be changed.

Mattel said there won't be any re-releases and this particular statement I believe them.

[Megalodon]

I wonder how you will react when all the guys form overseas dump MOTUC because of the price they have to pay, causing the line to end, with zero chance to complete your collection the way you wanted to? To care only for your own stuff is short sighted.

See once again can I help it Mattel's HQ is in CA? No but I buy stuff from Japan (Bandai stuff for example) and those prices are not as bad as Mattel's product because they keep raising the prices of the figures then the secondary get a higher mark up then people with too much money throw too much money at certain figures that make it crazy for normal people to buy it..

Case in point I bought 2 months after she was made available (Shadow Weaver) I got her for $60 on E-Bay because I KNEW that she was RARE figure now looking at she goes for $100 or more I'm glad I did it when I did most people can justify spending money on a rare figure that is truly rare not rare by a bungle bonehead move done on purpose by the Manufacturer....That's bad business....

[Barnster]

That's bad business....

Don't forget it's still Mattel™ we are talking about.

[Megalodon]

Don't forget it's still Mattel™ we are talking about.

Yea I keep forgetting about that.....

[Skystalker]

Guys, I just have to say again that what we are dealing with here is simple economics. Does Mattel want people to buy the sub? Of course. But the fact remains is that if they knew they would have enough day of sale sales to produce vast quantities of figures so that there were no quick sellouts and still make it worth their while, they would. But this line is over 4 years old. They know about what to expect, especially from lower tier characters. Mattel is not intentionally screwing people when they know they can make money. The company doesn't always make the best decisions, and there's been problems with the marketing of this line, but they've got plenty of bean counters to tell them how much they need to sell to make it worth their while to turn the machines on. There's no conspiracy here. If Mattel could have sold thousands of more Fistos than it did, then it would have made thousands of more Fistos, or they would turn on the machines now. It is a raw deal that some subbers did not get Fisto, and Mattel should offer them some kind of super incentive to make it up to them. But they would have not have sold the number of Fistos they needed to in order to make the extra production worthwhile. They weigh the number they would sell vs. the vast inventory they would have to sit on, and it's not worth it to them to sit on the inventory. It really just as simple as that.

That said, I'm in favor of making the line entirely or mostly pre-order based.

[Count Marzo]

Don't forget it's still Mattel™ we are talking about.

I think you mean Mattel® not Mattel™.

[King Kahn]

[shadowfall1976]

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...Dead_horse.gif

And yet, no one cares....

[Megalodon]

And yet, no one cares....

Yea no one does going back to "I got mine so who cares if you didn't get yours"

You can add these to the list as well of one's that sold out and will not get another release:

Castle Grayskull Man
Mosquitor

I'd hate to be a sub holder and didn't get my figures because of this...

[He-Dad]

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...Dead_horse.gif

LOL....Yes, I think that's the exact two pack they're requesting.

[Lich Leech]

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...Dead_horse.gif

Brilliant!

[Haradrel]

Here's a dumb question...Why is it when alot of people can't get him because of crazy circumstances (or any other figure) alot of fans that have the sub act likes snobs because "If you had a sub you would have had him" Really???

Because if you had a sub you would be promoting the brand as a whole and not have to run the gauntlet on sales day nor visit secondary markets. It's really simple.
This line when it took off was never meant to have to many cherry pickers. Matty is looking at the line as a sale model not a figure per figure deal, in those regards they will more then likely lose a lot of money on it. Thus the sub is the best way for them to get what they want, which is more money.
People not getting subs are hurting the brand, so that might explain some of the snobbery, but it is also the initial thought of "why can't this line be tailored to me specifically" that probably irks the most people. You might call them snobs, but then again that makes you a spoiled brat if you want to look at it that way.

We did toy collecting become a dog eat dog everyman for himself???

Well it's always been like that, look at any exclusives or collectibles. There are sub groups that do a lot of dealing with each other, but as an international I find most of these groups to be extremely closed off and based in the countries were the toys originate. I have however met people who breaks that mold as well, so it goes both ways, but my general impression is that collecting is a private affair and only the "closed groups" will do any kind of dealing with one another properly.

It's like they only care about what they get and screw everyone else...What happened??

Which is precisely what you are doing as well with not getting a sub. That's what I was talking about with the whole picture here. Also what I said in the previous statement goes.

It shouldn't be though....That's just the problem with this line they started off with high production numbers then as popularity gained they cut production because they wanted faster sell outs...What???

This makes perfect business sense. They don't want left over stock sitting in warehouses, that generates a lot of lost income. With subs they can stock up what they need and remove it all from the warehouses. With day of sales they actually lose money in the end if an item doesn't sell out quick. You do have to realize that they are in this to make money and not to cater to fans 100%. The things they do for the fans are actually very impressive if you take into account lots of other companies that sell toys. It's not perfect however, and no company ever will be.

This is Mattel's way to FORCE you to buy a sub.....

No. They can't force you to do anything. But if you really want an item, the easiest way is to sub, this also promotes the longevity of the brand as well as add more stock for day of sale.
It's the same as the secondary marked. They can't force you to pay $60 for a $20 figure, but you will because you want it. That's how retail works, supply and demand. If supply goes down and demand goes up, so does prices. We as consumers set the prices. Knowing that a figure will be worth a lot more later even gives the hint that you know how the marked works, which should in turn make your decision to either go the easy way (sub) the harder way (day of sale) or the expensive way (secondary market) a lot more prominent.

Do you really believe that if subs were non existent that day of sales figures would not be produced a lot more? We set the marked. And though their quotas for various figures might differ quite a lot, they still make their projected sales if they sell out quickly.

All of this just comes down to personal choice for me. I like less hassle, so a sub it is. Other people might not want all the figures, nor want to sell off the ones they get extra in a sub, I can understand that - but with this sales model which you already know quite well, that comes with a price of maybe not getting the items you want, or having to pay a premium for them in the secondary market. That's just the way things are, and how they have been for a very long time. I don't understand why people (especially people who understand the market well enough to gauge price increases on certain figures) can't understand this or treat it like a surprise.

[darkmoon766]

Because if you had a sub you would be promoting the brand as a whole and not have to run the gauntlet on sales day nor visit secondary markets. It's really simple....


No. They can't force you to do anything. But if you really want an item, the easiest way is to sub....

Those are all valid points. But there is a flaw in this particular case. Many people who had a sub STILL did not receive a Fisto because Digital River and Matty together are the most inept online seller possible. Many people received a Sorceress in a Fisto mailer, and they did not have enough stock left over for customer service. In this case, Mattel should have gone out of their way to purchase Fistos from the secondary market or to refund more than the retail price to the customer (or some agreed upon resolution per customer case) as not receiving a figure when you do sub to "lock it in" is terrible PR for any type of campaign to encourage sub sales again. I did not see one instance of anyone pleading with Scott or Matty to resolve this particular issue with a good outcome. I don't think it could have been more than a couple hundred people this happened to, the resolution to which would have saved them tenfold for the reputation of the Matty subscription product, but ALL of these people have seemed to be left hanging. Even if a customer did have this happen and didn't post that there issue was resolved with an out of the box resolution, it should have happened and been reported to us via a Matty rep such as Scott, and that never happened either. Since Matty and DR still continue to be so poor at providing every aspect of their service, what would encourage anyone's blind faith into having a sub and receiving a non defective figure the first time or through customer service hell? Just look at all the people who have had so many problems they pre-order through the secondary market or are willing to just buy through e-bay because all secondary markets have better customer service and a guarantee of receiving a decent figure from them? Matty is to blame for the Fisto fiasco, just like all of their other fiascos.

[iron_pride]

Myself, I wish they could all be re-released, but I understand why they don't/won't. Past sales of re-releases being the reason (i.e. Stratos, Mer-Man and Buzz Off that we are all getting as free gifts). I think Mer-Man and Stratos would have sold much better had they not been included in the DC two packs....yeah I know they are different but the economy today sometimes dictates purchasses. Yes, this is a collector line, so I doubt many mom's are buying for little Jimmy or little Susie, but still. I never got the regular Stratos until the freebie becasue I had the DC version. Sorry for goina bit stray there. We really need a good movie to happen so maybe we can get some of these back out there.....It would be cool if they could find a way to re-release some of these wanted characters, even with different accessories or whatever to keep the originals original.

[Megalodon]

This makes perfect business sense. They don't want left over stock sitting in warehouses, that generates a lot of lost income. With subs they can stock up what they need and remove it all from the warehouses. With day of sales they actually lose money in the end if an item doesn't sell out quick. You do have to realize that they are in this to make money and not to cater to fans 100%. The things they do for the fans are actually very impressive if you take into account lots of other companies that sell toys. It's not perfect however, and no company ever will be.

You miss the point....(I love it how people quote someone but instead of arguing the point) they keep beating us over the head with what is written because they don't want to deviate from the same old same old...When this line started Mattel was going to increase production to meet demand now they are limiting the product even though demand is their and don't give me that BS about the numbers from a sub because ALOT of people buy on day of and if adequate stock was available they would sell more...really

They are just too scared to pull the trigger because of the influx of Vintage figures and 2002 Smash Blade He-Man's & Spin Blade Skeletor's were out there in their time that flooded the market you mean to tell me that someone doesn't have enough brains to figure out how to up production without going overboard??? I find that hard to believe these guys get paid good money to figure this out..(People keep forgetting about this part)
Castle Greyskull was a pre-order and it got thru to it being made next year now saying that if Mattel (By those pre-order numbers) gets orders for 500 CG just from that alone that's all they are going to make???

No that doesn't make any sense if they order 500 make a little more for defects (Which we know are going to happen) and some extra stock for the matty site..Funny thing is that you spend all of this money on making the molds, paying the 4H to sculpt it,packaging expense etc. and you only make one run of that??? If your going to do a one and done you should have made this known in 2008 not 2012-13 and on...They want them to sell out in 1-2 hours and if it's up for 6-7 days my god it's a failure!!! (Even though all of those figurers sold out too) it's an excuse and I would be ****** off at Mattel if I had a sub because if this is the case then alot of people are going to get screwed down the line when this happens again....

[darkmoon766]

You miss the point....(I love it how people quote someone but instead of arguing the point) they keep beating us over the head with what is written because they don't want to deviate from the same old same old...When this line started Mattel was going to increase production to meet demand now they are limiting the product even though demand is their and don't give me that BS about the numbers from a sub because ALOT of people buy on day of and if adequate stock was available they would sell more...really

Did you notice that EVERY subscriber received a Mer-man, Stratos, or Syklone? I agree with you that Matty should be able to gauge demand better to maximize profit, but the reality is that the DR matty machine is incompetent and the fine line of overproduction and being able to sell off warehoused stock is a real problem for them. With underproduction Fisto was the worst case as even sub holders did not receive them. A discounted sub and a higher priced pre-order on a per figure basis probably would have eliminated these problems. But DR and matty still can't change CC info reliably. The my sub page will not be up in time for the Jan sub figures to bill and ship out. Until matty deep sixes DR I don't see any improvement on anything. DR gives matty all of their sales data. QC, customer service, supply to demand, etc. I am going to blame more and more on DR as it is matty's brain and input source for all info on the line, and the results from this are far too obvious.

[Megalodon]

Did you notice that EVERY subscriber received a Mer-man, Stratos, or Syklone? I agree with you that Matty should be able to gauge demand better to maximize profit, but the reality is that the DR matty machine is incompetent and the fine line of overproduction and being able to sell off warehoused stock is a real problem for them. With underproduction Fisto was the worst case as even sub holders did not receive them. A discounted sub and a higher priced pre-order on a per figure basis probably would have eliminated these problems. But DR and matty still can't change CC info reliably. The my sub page will not be up in time for the Jan sub figures to bill and ship out. Until matty deep sixes DR I don't see any improvement on anything. DR gives matty all of their sales data. QC, customer service, supply to demand, etc. I am going to blame more and more on DR as it is matty's brain and input source for all info on the line, and the results from this are far too obvious.

Well that's the point this has been going on with DR for 3-4 years now cut the ties and gets someone else that with changing the thinking about production and it will be better.....

[Skystalker]

They are just too scared to pull the trigger because of the influx of Vintage figures and 2002 Smash Blade He-Man's & Spin Blade Skeletor's were out there in their time that flooded the market you mean to tell me that someone doesn't have enough brains to figure out how to up production without going overboard??? I find that hard to believe these guys get paid good money to figure this out..(People keep forgetting about this part)

I think we really need to question this belief, even though it is widely quoted around here. Granted, Matty's production ratios are a bit off at times, but are they worse than other companies and other lines. Think of all the Batman figures that clog the shelf whenever a Batman line is being sold, yet new Batman lines keep getting introduced. What about Transformers? Every few months, when I go to Walmart and Toys R Us and Target, all they have are Optimus Prime variants. Yet Transformers chugs along.

The fact is that when a line is truly popular and doing well, the main characters are the ones that sell. 200x did not die because of He-Man and Skeletor variants flooded the shelf, as much as they might have annoyed us. Sure, they kept some adult collectors from jumping in, but we're not enough to carry a normal retail line. If 200x had been popular—if He-Man had been popular—all those variants would have sold and the line would have continued.

We might not understand all of what Mattel does, but they must have done something right if they are the largest toy company in the world. All subscribers to 2012 should get a Fisto, and there really is no excuse that some did not. But we are fooling ourselves to think that reruns of these secondary characters will generate a ton of money for Mattel. Clearly, they won't. Scott has said again and again that only He-Man has sold anywhere near the quantity needed. And many of the reruns have been core characters that should have sold a ton. They didn't because no one wants them, or at least not enough people. If people do not buy enough MAA or Trap-Jaw redos, they won't buy enough Fistos. Until there is a major, popular, media push (200x did not succeed in that), things are going to remain as is.