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Thread: He-Man & The Masters of the Universe #6 - DC Comics - SPOILERS

  1. #126
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris Wildthyme View Post
    I enjoyed this and am genuinely glad that DC seem to want to take the property in a new direction (look at how fantastically IDW are running their G1-themed Transformers comics right now, with the Autobot/Decepticon war being over).
    Simon Furman aside, even those IDW TF comics took a long while to get new writers who actually cared a great deal about the source material.

    The Blonde Teela (Battleground and Alcala Teela) Thread
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  2. #127
    Heroic Warrior Durendal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspecter View Post
    I know my stance is controversial, but I stand by the prostitute comment. Evil-Lyn, the THIRD most powerful person on Eternia (after Skeletor and The Sorceress), needs to sex some guy up for a jewel? Please. She's much more cunning than that. She also gives off the aura that anyone who touches her will burn a raining death of fire (which, Nolar technically does...). Evil-Lyn has ALWAYS thought herself above people. She's very conceited and would never lower herself to such standards. She's bad as all get out, but would not use sex to get what she desires. That's below her.
    Maybe she was horny?

  3. #128
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    first off I'll go with something positive,
    Dave Wilkins cover was great,.. some of the art was ok in the book, I like Skeletors face, nice and evil looking, but second page in, he looks like a woman in a halloween outfit, the chain male looks like fluffy wool,...
    He-mans reveal was terrible, not a bad drawing, but no pressence, then theres the colourist, on the 7th page in, were He-man rides Battle cat in to battle, the front of the BCs mask is mistaken for his face and coloured green, wich makes a good picture poor, the colourist needs to concentrate, and know his sorse
    next, why are Skeletors troops Royal gaurds???,if they are brainwashed, then 'well done guys'!! for hacking up your own dads troops
    also He-man and Teelas banter, I know its a long established thing, were they back and forth with each other, but its meant to be witty and indearing, not uncomfortable and *****y,... wheres Teelas revrence for this mighty warrior,..

    'SMUG ****', now ive heard it all....no wait,...'my daddy didnt raise no collateral damage'. good lord some body get me a beer, this is He-man not family guy,...as for ORKO,.. yeah thats just ridicules, but Ive never been a fan of his anyway, it should have just been Hordak, .....

    to end on a good note,... it was nice to see Teelas unicorn,.

  4. #129
    Powerful Wizard Arvulis's Avatar
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    Overall, I really like this issue! Even if the English language used within is really complicated for me (a poor french native) lol

    About Orko at the end... Brian aka Duke thought about Gorpo! This is a very good guess in my opinon! But I just reviewed again the Trademarks and I realized that ZORKO was trademarked on 2012-05-10! So, as Zorko exists (cf. the second season series bible), it could be him also!

    What do you think guys?

  5. #130
    Heroic Warrior gbagok's Avatar
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    Zorko? He's from which series bible again?

    I just keep thinking of evil Orko from his Uncle Montork's second appearance. I remember feeling genuine suspense about getting the real Orko back. A new canon is one thing, but it's just unforgivable if they've really ruined Orko. At least the Sorceress can (and probably will) appear as a ghost like Obi Wan.
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  6. #131
    Powerful Wizard Arvulis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbagok View Post
    Zorko? He's from which series bible again?

    I just keep thinking of evil Orko from his Uncle Montork's second appearance. I remember feeling genuine suspense about getting the real Orko back. A new canon is one thing, but it's just unforgivable if they've really ruined Orko. At least the Sorceress can (and probably will) appear as a ghost like Obi Wan.
    It's just called "He-Man and the Masters of the Universe season two Series Bible".



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  7. #132
    Alcala Idolator Crusader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arvulis View Post
    It's just called "He-Man and the Masters of the Universe season two Series Bible".

    http://www.bustatoons.com/blog_image...o_trollans.jpg

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    The teeth on their scarves do remind me of the monsters at the end of issue 6. Great find, man
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  8. #133
    Rogue Warrior Shawners's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Waters View Post
    ...The story is uninspired. The characterization is 180 degrees off. The scripting and dialogue read like an angry Emo 9th-grader's fanfic. ...
    Sums it up for me.
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  9. #134
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    Finally picked up the issue and I really only have a few gripes. 1) The language. Some of it was just plain awful like the aforementioned "****" comment. 2) Orko betrayed everyone. I'm all for new canons and stuff, but seriously? Wasn't that Hordak that Skeletor kept talking to the entire issue, but at the end its someone different? Very strange. I did like that they're trying to blend *all* continuities together. I'm still on board, esp with Despara coming in the first issue of the ongoing. Hope things improve.

    PS: I totally dig that the "Power of Grayskull" has nothing to do with the castle and everything to do with Grayskull's sword and Adam.

  10. #135
    Door with dental plan. Jawbridge's Avatar
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    Teela is great guys. She's not trying to sound at all like a teenager. She's wearing the same thing as He-Man, and I don't hear the feminist complaining. The word **** as written here has evolved from ******, and only means stupid or obnoxious. Just like the term tosser has evolved. They are close friends, so they can speak openly to one another, but it's no longer referring to anything sexual at all. You should understand that before you freak out. It just needed to sound more natural than dork, and douche actually comes off way worse in literature. She can handle her own, that's been shown. So what if storming the castle was too much for her and not He-Man. That was a LOT of enemies to deal with, and she made it out just fine, in fact, the way that she was making remarks showed more control than overwhelment. You didn't want her to kill Skeletor did you?

    Evil Lynn IS powerful, but schemingly obedient, and NOT as powerful as Skeletor. He was about to showdown one-on-one with He-Man, and she's known for her passive aggressive (= annoying) insults. She wasn't needed in the one-on-one, so he silenced her. Her Noir performance was wonderful, and showed nice insight to how she escapes from her faux service of Skeletor. This isn't our world, nor our society. I'm not reading it so judgmentally.

    Skeletor needs to be taken seriously by the reader, as the Filmation Skeletor is a bumbling idiot. He has seized Grayskull, and if the writers see the Sorceresses position as guardian of Grayskull, then her character's much less useful to their story arch, but well known for being very powerful. Good choice if they needed to make a huge impact. He-Man responded with rage, so that was big as well. With all the flashbacks, time traveling, and spiritual embodiments going around, she could easily be seen again. If they're setting up Skeletor to be even more powerful, then he needs to display power for the first time ever to many new readers. Again, Filmation needed to be broken. Filmation did it to the minis, because they had there medium to work in and style to follow. Same here. We don't need PSAs any more.

    He-Man's intro was great. Lynn was acting quickly, but He-Man was too fast and at her doorstep, midway through effortlessly tossing a foe, with the rest of the masters handling business. The sword being covered with blood is just a detail, not an added shock value. Readers of comics don't just watch cartoons from the 80's. They read current books. This was very toned down compared to some material, and didn't stand out at all when I was reading it. I'm surprised that so many people are stuck on this. Have you seen Star Wars the Clone Wars recently? They're cutting down 15+ people an episode, and that's on Saturday morning. This He-Man is not on Cartoon network early Saturday.

    The chainmail looks bad, especially on Skeletor. With the art being so crude, I would expect the design to be more thought out, so it doesn't compound and stand out worse. Evil Lynn could look good, but her design looks very bad when sloppy, as do many others, but those are the top two. Again, Teela's dressed for battle just like He-Man.

    I like the connection between the digi comics skull and this one, but it really not clear what's going on. It looks similar to the Skull of Power for sure, and it being used to remake Eternia stays the path. It wasn't connected to Orko in the past, so Skeletor or Evil Lynn may have merged it with Orko impeded to make it more powerful? I'm not going to speculate, but Orko's appearance, if that is him, has changed and he seems rather corrupt. He Mitty use the term minion when talking about his own relationship with He-Man to Skeletor. As Skele would understand that, and again, Orko being tainted and all. We have no idea where this is going, so I'm not bothered by it yet. Could be great, could be terrible, it's only just been hinted at.

    All in all it's about time it picked up. The books leading to this did very little for me. I like jam packed pages that evolved, and the pace of this outpaced the first three issues by itself. If they keep that up, they have a new fan. I was ver bored until now, and a little of the last issue. The whole "what did you think" at the end made me think of wasted time in the beginning rather than this crazy ending. Any story is better than no story, and I'm along for the ride, not fortification of what I already know about MOTU.

    GOOD STUFF!!!
    Pop Culture Shock - Filmation Statues (top 5 most wanted): Sorceress, Skeletor, Man-E-Faces, Mer-Man and Two-Bad! AND, hurry up with Evil Lynn, her reveal is what got me started.

  11. #136
    Ally of the Rebellion Robin Hood's Avatar
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    Without doubt one of the most interesting comic reads I’ve had in a while. There were several surprises (e.g. Orko the betrayer, the Sorceress is no more), a number of action scenes and enough questions left unanswered to keep me intrigued and craving more.

    Questions include:
    1. How exactly did Orko betray He-Man and the Masters?
    2. Has Orko always been evil or has he only recently been controlled or impersonated by a villain?
    3. Does Skeletor have a cunning plan at work or is he just unlucky or is he really a novice as things never seem to go to plan for him?
    4. With Skeletor apparently out of the way will the Horde now invade Eternia?
    5. If the Sorceress is truly dead how will Despera find the Sword of Protection and become She-Ra?
    6. Will Teela become the new Sorceress? After all Evil-Lyn seems to think she’s already a witch and “may have scrambled my facilities”.
    7. What will stop He-Man and Despera from killing the other when they finally meet?

    So bring-on the Horde and the next series. I could do with some answers!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by DVD View Post
    Wasn't that Hordak that Skeletor kept talking to the entire issue, but at the end its someone different? Very strange.
    I'm not so sure it wasn't Hordak at the end. For one thing the final scene could be set on Etheria as there are three moons visible in the night sky and there is farmland and a city visible in the background which appear consistent with a planet with human inhabitation. While the throne like chair the villain is sitting in has an industrial feel and pipework which is reminiscent of the Horde and Hordak in particular. Add in the blue appearance of the villains skin and the patronising tone to Skeletor which is consistent with a father-son or master-novice relationship there is a good chance it is Hordak. It would also lead nicely into the next series with the Horde paying Eternia another visit.
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  12. #137
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    Sorry; I think that I may have originally posted my contribution in the wrong place....


    The new DC Comics – a critique.

    Firstly, apologies are due; as a new boy around here I really ought to be keeping quiet and learning the ropes – but I have just had time to read properly through the new DC offering and to gauge my own reactions to it – and I felt that something needed to be said. Not all will agree with me – plainly – and I apologize in advance to those who think my opinions out of place here; but I would be obliged were they to read what I offer below and accept (or reject) it in the spirit in which it is meant.

    To deal with the trivial first: I noted some poor continuity and the strangely uneven pacing of the plot – and some outright bizarre constructions. I offer some graphic detail of some of the more obvious aspects (do excuse the pun.)

    What’s wrong with this picture?

    exhibit a.jpg


    – and this?

    Exhibit b.jpg




    And again this?

    Exhibit c.jpg




    How fortunate it is that the Sword just happens to be located right under Evil-Lyn’s cauldron of fire (and set in a stone, no less; at least we were spared the line of knights awaiting their turn to give it a tug…) Skeletor can have had nor yearning nor use for it, we are led to suppose. Perhaps he was kept too busy trying to recognize his own handiwork.


    As for the lengthily picaresque plot (such as it was) Skeletor berates his minions for failing to prevent Adam working his way to becoming He-Man once more (whom the Lord of Destruction then fails to recognize – as above) on the grounds that their plans were all too elaborate. This wouldn’t be the same Skeletor who, having erased the memories of all his opponents, then carefully seeded them in various unlikely situations all over Eternia, later allowing them to come back – would it? Killing really IS too good for his enemies, apparently. And he really IS surrounded by idiots…. In which case it should come as no surprise to us that the L of D gets easily outwitted his own pet talking head.


    As for Teela the Valley girl with some serious issues over mastering basic English – well; dialogue isn’t considered a great part of this genre – and it shows.


    For the “look” of the thing, I suppose that there has to be some element of change over time; I can’t say I care for it personally – I much preferred 200x, but quot homines tot sententiae.
    Now, none of the above couldn’t be dealt with in future; it would just take some tighter artistic control – and better editing.

    But, to me, there are some much more concerning and serious issues that stem from this new approach – and, while the above is a bit of fun, this is the main thrust of my argument.


    Starting with the importance of the Sorceress, of Grayskull and of the Power, I was dismayed to learn that these things are now – apparently – consigned to the dustbin of canonical history. That the Power should reside in He-Man himself is grotesquely out of touch, not only with the original premise (which has stood the test of time) but also with the concept of who He-Man actually is – and what he represents. Surely it is not insignificant that He-Man is depicted as the servant of a higher power, rather than the source of that power himself. Remember, after all, whence the Power came; how could it ever reside, permanently, in one man – presumably mortal – however strong, however worthy? Power – even assumed for good purposes, ultimately corrupts. Remember the Shard of Darkness? The wider implication was always that He-Man could not always be He-Man – and his assuming a more suitable, ostensibly mortal and un-heroic form as Adam was a defense against not only his enemies, but also the wearing effects of wielding the Power. Removing this at a stroke is a fundamental re-alignment of the mythos – and it is hard to see where this will ultimately lead. My fear is that the desire to simplify matters (dare one use the phrase – dumb-down?) and to maximize shock-value has resulted in a hasty and ill-considered novelty that adds nothing; indeed, it is an essentially alien and negative development.


    So, He-Man as one-man superpower. Exit the Sorceress – seen by some as irrelevant. Again, I would argue that this is to fail to appreciate the subtlety implicit in having her tied irremovably to Grayskull as its chatelaine – the fair lady who serves the Power as its high priestess and human face – but who had had to pay a terrible price for that dubious privilege (the loss of her man, her daughter, her liberty) and who remains a high and remote figure for that very reason. Such is the way of duty; like the Queen on a chessboard she is both powerful and vulnerable – and therein lies the subtlety. She can sometimes act as Dea ex-Machina – but often herself has to be rescued from peril. She is wedded to her duty – and its prisoner, both rendered powerful and (in effect) crippled by it. Guarded by He-Man and his cohort, she guides and guards them herself. Unless she can be reborn or replaced (it’s possible, one supposes…) then all this has been lost; that axe (and therefore the writer) has a lot to answer for. Grayskull is an empty shell, bereft of mystery – and Skeletor is going to have to find some other fixation. One can take tabula rasa too far; much too far.


    As for Prince Adam and his dual personality; yes, it could get risible – the Filmation series was child’s play; how could anyone have failed to see what was so utterly obvious – but surely that easy dramatic irony was all part of the tongue-in-cheek fun? The 200x series managed it well, in my view; the teenaged and jejune Adam was plainly a different character – and there was a real sense that this duality was not always comfortable – and how could it be? But, to me, a great part of the point and interest of it all is the dramatic tension hinted at in being both the Hero of Eternia and the heir to the throne – and in keeping those two lives apart; and, indeed, what of Teela in this? Yes, it had occasional comic effect – but that underlying tension was ever-present and it provided both drama and depth. And now they’ve done away with it at a stroke – which in my view is a critical error – and lazy, too – in the modernist Hollywood-style nuance-crushing approach. It’s as if the audience is being judged not to be able to handle any degree of subtlety and must have everything reduced to short and simple messages, often repeated; the new comic series is veering dangerously in this direction, I fear.


    But this is not the worst aspect of it; to me the most serious error of judgment of all is the one that has set He-Man onto the downward and slippery path of becoming a blood-soaked barbarian. The entire point of He-Man is that he does not kill; robots and monsters do not count (like Tolkien’s Orcs they are created especially to be expendable without moral dilemma) but He-Man is sworn to defend all Eternians – even those who have turned aside and become evil. We have even seen him save Skeletor (not that he was grateful – but as a lord of evil that’s his job and we should respect that) and the two have even worked together on occasion (briefly – and with the bony-faced and hooded one betraying all trust – as above point). We do not need to be thinking in simplistic early-80s terms and looking for a return to the embarrassing moral messages ending those early episodes to be uncomfortable with this picture.

    exhibit d.jpg



    Perhaps EL’s loyal Mooks deserved it (even if also spell-enslaved?) but, to me, this is an essential misunderstanding of what He-Man actually IS – and what makes him different – and why he has survived for thirty years. Being a force for good is hard; it gives evil and treachery all the advantages – they don’t have to abide by the rules. They also get all the best lines. He-Man is constantly mocked by his enemies for his compassion and sentimentality; he is rendered vulnerable by the need to do the right thing, to keep his word; to show constant integrity; he cannot simply accept loss of life as an inevitable side-effect of waging war; he doesn’t do collateral damage. Just look at how often he has been shown surrendering himself to save others. Even leaving aside any overt quasi-religious overtones – isn’t that what heroism actually IS? Conan may be a barbarian – but he’s certainly not a hero (except in the eponymous sense, obviously) and He-Man most certainly is – which brings its own dilemmas and disadvantages. Just because all barbarians wear loincloths doesn’t have to mean that the syllogism extends to all loincloth-wearers being barbarians. And do we really need another blood-letting, wise-cracking barbarian let loose into this unhappy world? Or another brooding and inwardly tormented arch-perpetrator of deep moral ambiguities? Some might argue that the Dark Knight has been filling that role rather well for many a year.


    Ironically the first issue of the comics depicts an amnesiac Adam dreaming of battles as He-Man; “battles in which good always triumphed.” If things carry on along this current path, then how on earth is anyone going to tell if it actually IS good that wins; there will be precious little difference between two battling sides with arbitrary names of ‘good’ and ‘evil’ – but no actual moral distinction to differentiate them.


    I am thus deeply wary of this unwelcome new development; I can see why it’s being done – it makes it all so nice and straightforward, doesn’t it? – don’t fret about the morality – just look at all the pretty red spraying about, children! Biff! Bam! Behead! And – before anyone suggests it, I’m not crusading for moral re-armament; violence most surely has its place in the fantasy world – but not that kind of violence from He-Man, please. It’s not him – and swords have two edges.


    And I would go further and say that the bloodshed isn’t even needed; Eternia is constantly at war – and yet, while meteors land and heroes and armies battle, and while non-humans get trashed in legions, no-one actually dies. Unrealistic ? – why, yes, of course – patently. But it all rather depends on what you understand by reality, doesn’t it? Mine doesn’t actually include Eternia…. I see that world as sharing some of the characteristics of the mythos of the ancient classical pantheon, or of the Germano-Norse gods; they battle – and some are up and some are down and some are imprisoned for the good of all, exiled, or simply go – elsewhere – but no-one ever really dies. And this doesn’t diminish the dramatic impact of the stories; quite the reverse – it makes them timeless and enduring. And, while 30 years isn’t eternity, in our modern world with its constant speed-shifts, it’s a fair old start!


    Professor Tolkien – who spent a lifetime of serious study in this field and, let’s face it, was no tyro at the game – pointed out (and proved) that there are and must be certain intrinsic rules pertaining to the creation of any new world and its mythos. The scope and scale lies in the pen of the creator, in the wide realm of his imagination, but – and this is a very big but – the parameters, once set, are of stone and as unyielding. That is the only way to give a newly-created world its internal consistency; it must have rules (once drawn-up) – and it must continue to play by them, for otherwise anything – literally anything – can happen (think Imperial Storm troopers assaulting Camelot.) From the point of view of plot, that is an insupportable burden no writer needs – and tales constructed so loosely, without internal consistency, will ever fail to grip.


    Further, how many times can the USS Constitution or HMS Victory be restored without ceasing to be “original” – is grandfather’s axe still itself after three new handles and a new head? Yet the Idea remains (very Platonist!) and that is the key. So, then; how much can the world of He-Man be altered – and still actually remain He-Man?


    I am being contentious, I appreciate, when I say that this new direction is a grave error and should be checked before it drives its way clean out of the canon – or even canons; they can still be good stories (given tighter editing) but they somewhat crassly fail to appreciate certain enduring essentials about the way MOTU has evolved – and what has made it endure. I may be alone in stating that a he-man who kills without remorse and showers in the blood of his foes, whose duality as Prince Adam is known to all (and thus dramatically pointless) and who is himself the repository of the Power (rather than the servant and guardian of a higher one) is not He-Man – but I rather doubt it.


    I would argue that it really, really ought to be possible to stay broadly within the accepted canon and still come up with challenging, inspiring, new and developing tales from Eternia; nor need these tales be anodyne or childishly simplistic. I am doubly uncomfortable with the current DC approach in that it has willfully broken the commandment regarding the inner integrity of a created world – and replaced it with something that is far, far poorer and less satisfying to the extent of being gauche. Worse, in my view, its glibness and superficiality risks turning off a future generation of potential fans because there will be nothing to differentiate it from the rest of the somewhat tired gamut of one-liner-dispensing bloodslingers. And such things do not endure.



    Apologies, as I began with, for a lengthy disquisition on the Eternian cosmos – and to all those who will surely disagree with me. But I felt that I had to stick up for He-Man as hero; after all – I am absolutely certain that he would do the same for me……

  13. #138
    Alcala Idolator Crusader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scriptor View Post
    Apologies, as I began with, for a lengthy disquisition on the Eternian cosmos – and to all those who will surely disagree with me. But I felt that I had to stick up for He-Man as hero; after all – I am absolutely certain that he would do the same for me……
    While I don't agree on some of your points, I do salute the eloquence of your elaborate discours, fine sir

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  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jawbridge View Post
    Teela is great guys. She's not trying to sound at all like a teenager. She's wearing the same thing as He-Man, and I don't hear the feminist complaining.
    No, I hear this kind of thing all the time, mainly in reference to male superhero costumes/poses compared with female. Teela and He-Man both wear very skimpy costumes, yes. However, He-Man's covers up his "private parts" - for want of a better term - quite comprehensively. Teela's however, is very skimpy and tight around her breasts and pelvis in a deliberately titillating fashion. If He-Man was shown in a more sexualised way, ie perhaps leaner, perhaps his loincloth cut much higher at the sides and much lower at the front to show more of the apollo's belt. The two are NOT in equivalent costumes at all!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jawbridge View Post
    The word **** as written here has evolved from ******, and only means stupid or obnoxious. Just like the term tosser has evolved. They are close friends, so they can speak openly to one another, but it's no longer referring to anything sexual at all. You should understand that before you freak out. It just needed to sound more natural than dork, and douche actually comes off way worse in literature.
    I am not freaking out, I just find it hilarious. Maybe "****" isn't a big deal to you Americans but in the UK the word "****" LITERALLY means "**********". As in "he was having a ****", "she caught him having a ****", "to ****",etc. There is NO OTHER DEFINITION OVER HERE and the pejorative term "******" is clearly derived from this. It has NO OTHER MEANING than "something sexual" as you put it. "Dork" is a word rarely used in the UK and as for "douche"... I have heard it in US films but the only actual definition I know of is the French one. Thus Teela calling him a "smug ****" was rather more akin to an episode of The Inbetweeners than He-Man. Like I say, just made me laugh! Oh, you funny Americans!

  15. #140
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris Wildthyme View Post
    No, I hear this kind of thing all the time, mainly in reference to male superhero costumes/poses compared with female. Teela and He-Man both wear very skimpy costumes, yes. However, He-Man's covers up his "private parts" - for want of a better term - quite comprehensively. Teela's however, is very skimpy and tight around her breasts and pelvis in a deliberately titillating fashion. If He-Man was shown in a more sexualised way, ie perhaps leaner, perhaps his loincloth cut much higher at the sides and much lower at the front to show more of the apollo's belt. The two are NOT in equivalent costumes at all!
    Some people say this whenever they see a scantily clad female -- that there is no such thing as a non-sexist representation. The Battleground Teela figure was too provocative for some people.

    The Blonde Teela (Battleground and Alcala Teela) Thread
    The Cloak and Dagger Evil-Lyn (The Real 200X Evil-Lyn) Thread
    MegaGearMax's 200X/MYP Screen Grabs

    Sagitar • Cloak and Dagger Evil-Lyn • 200X Prince Adam • 200X Sorceress
    Sssqueeze • Angella • Perfuma • Evilseed (MYP)

  16. #141
    Door with dental plan. Jawbridge's Avatar
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    I totally understand the mismeaning across languages. But it wasn't meant to imply anything sexual. ****** is common for a southern "hick" often times, too, but this doesn't go that far either. It is funny though, you're right. When watching Harry Potter I had to look up tosser. Which originally meant the same thing. It's just evolved a little. And not evolved like ~became better~, just different. Lost in translation maybe. Also, "freaking out" is a figure of speech as well. No personal attacks intended to all those who had an issue with that word.

    To me, the costumes are equivalent, and more importantly, drawings. Even if they were drawn with a little more care, I wouldn't say it's anything tantalizing, but that's just me. I don't know who the target audience is, but to 25+ year olds, just another rushed drawing. Being fully covered means nothing. Comics have a long standing history of drawing nude figures then simply coloring them in as a costume, as if they painted their costumes directly on the skin. Golden age comics included, though talent and realism had evolved. These costumes don't do even that, and they are, imho, the same in concept. I'm sure this argument is heard lot's of times. But just as Power Girls boobs are ridiculously enlarged, so are the muscles on just about every male hero. Her more so than others that I can think of in DC, but most every male is in peek physical condition, and even the top five percentile of actual humans would be so lucky. Nature of the beast. I don't claim masculinism every time I can't have the body of a cartoon character. That's a whole other taboo topic though.

    People overly uncomfortable with the intro image of He-Man... I don't know what to say. If that's they way you see it, I'm not trying to change you mind. It was trying to prove a point. It had a message. And to me, no line was crossed.

    This not being the essence of He-Man isn't exactly relevant. This is yet another story, with yet another version of He-Man. He-Man was killing before most of us knew who He-Man was. Then the 80's cartoon market got censored (which is probably a great thing), and then he had a sword for no reason. Now, he's portrayed for a different audience in a different medium. The argument "adults don't need blood for the story to be intriguing" is absolutely true. I agree 1000%. But, they also don't need barbarians, skull faced villains, or people with swords in general. This story has those things. That's maybe what happens sometimes when those things are present at the same time. This is not a product of desensitization talking. One thing I hate most in movies is gore. Hate it. This isn't gore. This is a comic with drawings fighting one another. We all have different tolerance levels, so this is simply a matter of opinion. Again, not trying to change any minds here.

    The head of the Sorceress should have been the most disturbing actually, as Skeletor was trying to get a strong reaction out of He-Man (and therefore the readers). He got his reaction. I wasn't upset by, say, Game of Thrones. And this isn't too far from that genre. Honestly, I can't say it's not fitting. I don't want heads rolling every issue. That takes away the impact. But when you need to make a statement, you don't put your sword back in it's holster, hit the ground real hard after taunting "you're about to trip over those words Skeletor" and then have Skeletor fall from the tremor with a whirl sound and land with a bonk.

    You stab him. In the face if need be. You're ******. He just killed your beloved ally. Stab the ****or. (<- New Character!)

    I LOVE what people are saying about Gropo and Zorko. That would be my favorite outcome here, that I can think of. I'm trying not to look too far into it. I want no expectations here, just fresh story. An action figure to accompany this character would be insane. At that point a Dispara figure could also be more appropriate.

    Speaking of Dispara. That comic has been received as overwhelmingly positive, and compared to the whispering woods, it's about as grim as you can get. Not to get that started again. Just a stray thought.

    I also could easily see it as Hordak, but too many people seem to think it's Orko. So now I'm influenced. I guess the traitor line made that bed for him. That skull is something of it's own though, as well as being tied to the villain. Can't wait to see what it's all about. It did seem to overly imply Hordak at first. But now that origin story (just read it) has Hordak looking crazy for sure. As long as it happens in a timely fashion, I'll have fun with it.
    Last edited by Jawbridge; February 3, 2013 at 09:46pm.
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  17. #142
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    Many thanks for your welcome, Crusader - much appreciated.

    And I really wasn't expecting general agreement (!) - but I did want to advance the counter-arguments, however contentious. Change I can accept, but the sheer scale of the shift does bother me.

    (And I do like your strapline regarding knighthood; I wish it were unfailingly true!)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Your balancing of views is most statemanlike, jawbridge - and I broadly agree with you (and being familiar with both US and UK useages in terms of argot also made me smile!)

    I would just make one point, if I might, with reference to stabbing old boneface. It won't kill him, will it? And He-Man will know that.

    The point here is regarding the essentially mythological nature of Eternia and the aspects it undoubtedly shares with the classical and nordic world-picture; these heroic and evil titans essentially cancel each other out - and this goes for their weapons too; sharp swords and axes fail to bite on opponents of their own rank, and sorcery is mostly not able to effect the death of the victim - since he/she is defended by a counter power. They are effectively prevented from killing each other like their antecedents of old - probably just as well, too, or character-attrition would be pretty severe!

    I have my doubt that the Sorceress is actually dead as well - in spite of Skeletor's Tower Hill moment.

    Increased violence and bloodshed is, however, bad news for the non-titans caught between the powers - like Evil-Lyn's mooks - and just maybe they did just have it coming. I can get used to increased levels of bloodshed if I have to - but I really don't like the idea of routine mass slaughter in defense of an arbitrary "good" becoming He-Man's stock in trade. In any case, he has such power and strength that he doesn’t actually need to kill – he can disable his opponents and their machinery and still preserve a degree of integrity that makes the good side winning actually matter. Isn’t that why he was granted the Power in the first place? It’s also a lot less intellectually lazy, I believe, than the constant triumph of the greatest degree of applied violence and slaughter.

    Though I take your point about Filmation-style confrontations!

    Perhaps - as with your diplomatic assessment above, the way forward lies somewhere between the two approaches ....

  18. #143
    Illumina & Cat please! Darkspecter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jawbridge View Post
    Speaking of Dispara. That comic has been received as overwhelmingly positive, and compared to the whispering woods, it's about as grim as you can get. Not to get that started again. Just a stray thought.
    The Fright Zone was also very grim in Filmation. Some cities and towns were very grim too (like the one the Horde is invading in the comic). The Horde invaded and set some on Fire in Filmation (The Price of Freedom) and if people refused to pay the Horde, they destroyed their homes (I think that's shown in "Into Etheria"). She-Ra: Princess of Power had some very dark themes in it. The Great Rebellion was bright and colourful to contrast those themes and the characters themselves (colours, attitudes and actions) provided hope to the civilians. So far, the Despera comic follows the Filmation series, except (see spoiler below)

     
    Force Captain Adora has become Despera and she murders Flutterina (which was, in my opinion, disgusting how they treated Flutterina as a throw away character. However, it seems like all the women in this new series (except Shadow Weaver and Despera), are being treated terribly by DC.


    Mattel was HEAVILY involved with the Despera Digital Comic, apparently. I think it shows, because it paid more respect to the characters and the source material than any of the other issues. Again, in my opinion.
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  19. #144
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    Oh I totally forgot about that Zorko trademark!
    "My favorite Harry Potter movie is Troll."

  20. #145
    Heroic Warrior Tribal Spaceman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspecter View Post
    In the Despera Digital Comic, Shadow Weaver has green hands. The character sitting on the throne at the end of issue 6 has a blue hand. Also, the demonic "Trollan" army have the letter 'O' burning on their chests, in a yellowish green colour.

    EDIT: The 'O' is teeth continued down! Creepy.
    I reckon it's intentional that the teeth resemble an 'O.

    I would argue that it really, really ought to be possible to stay broadly within the accepted canon and still come up with challenging, inspiring, new and developing tales from Eternia; nor need these tales be anodyne or childishly simplistic.
    I completely agree.

    Also Skeletor should have a yellow face, not a white one.
    Last edited by Tribal Spaceman; February 4, 2013 at 06:06am.

  21. #146
    Powerful Wizard Arvulis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    Oh I totally forgot about that Zorko trademark!
    Gorpo may have been replaced by Zorko.

  22. #147
    I am that I am Heidi's Avatar
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    I'm really happy with the direction this canon is taking. I do not like every single thing in it (like Teela's characterization, King Grayskull being still part of the canon), but the overall story is great. Can't wait to read more!
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  23. #148
    CURSE YOU GIN MONKEY the_ultimate_evil's Avatar
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    you know what after re reading this countless times and checking message boards and blogs the fact that my first reaction when i read this on the way home from the comic shop wasn't shock or awe it was simply that unless the fandom praised this "twist"( and i use that lightly as twists are meant to be well thought out and intelligent) to high heaven then you will be torn apart like a lot of things now with MOTU.

    i look at some of the guys i know who were huge fans of this line who have walked away both online and in real life there has got to be some kind of common factor with this. this whole shut up and take it mentality isn't right. hell even at times in this thread peoples view was if you dont like then tough crap its all your getting so keep it shut

    i want to support these book i want to be able to go into a comic shop once a month and pick up a well written MOTU comic but truthfully like the toyline its just getting worse as it goes on, i dont think i can or want to, yeah yeah i know the one lone fan from northern ireland on here hardly a big lose but this is just my view. hell anyone who on here knows me, know i used to post a hell of a lot in the art forums be it sketches, photography or even an on going project to convert motu characters into the pc game freedom force with the idea of releasing a mod for the community and i just dont anymore because it seems to me at least unless you are a specific ideology for this brand then you are going to get ripped asunder

    I lost my job earlier this month when the company who ran it when insolvent but i budgeted my savings and knew if i cut down i could still get a select few and i really wanted an ongoing motu to be in that list, but with the low level of quality we're expected to just take i dont think i can. Look this is just a long time fans view no one else's or a dig at anyone in particular.
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  24. #149
    Heroric Drummer Brian Ozone's Avatar
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    I've said this before about Trolla and Orko being so significant in the new bios. When all along he was a comedic sidekick. Even in the 200X they didn't feature him like the Flimation did. He's a useless character that was made to keep the kiddies entertained. In a n adult line he's really not needed except for nostalgic reasons. But the powers to be and guru made him way more important then he needs to be. Then the Gorpo figure repaint was shown at the NYC at show. If in fact he is behind the violins in the new story this yet again another power trip guru is on. I wouldn't be surprised if Specter isn't introduced in the new comic. It's just so lame. I'm for some change and this and that but that's just lame. Emiliano's new blog is really good and touches apond this issue you should check it out.

    Orko is an annoying little alien that should have never been apart of the Motu universe but he is and should co time to be in the smallest role at best not the next big super villain. What happened he found his wand or his medallion and was sick of all the flack he took over the years so he turned into mega jan Brady and seeks revenge against the royal family and the masters. Stupid silly writing.
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  25. #150
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    The word **** as written here has evolved from ******, and only means stupid or obnoxious. Just like the term tosser has evolved. They are close friends, so they can speak openly to one another, but it's no longer referring to anything sexual at all.


    The word **** didn't evolve at all , it means the ' act', and ****** is what you call then ,
    And as far as it's meaning ,... stupid or obnoxious are nothing to do with the word, it means what it means, always has always will

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