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Thread: UPDATED: Strobo In March!!! 3/15 Matty Sale Announced! w/ Strobo update

  1. #301
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakko View Post
    Niiiiiiice. For the record, I am buying figures. Just not all of them. Again, you've bought into Mattel's all-or-nothing mindset.

    Also for the record, I do subscribe to DCIE and the Watchmen subs. And I don't treat the non-subbers as condescendingly as you just treated me. The way I see it, the cherry-pickers of those lines are contributing their dollars as well, and I'm not about to tell them to go take a hike or ask them what purpose they serve.
    You may have taken that as condescending, but it wasn't meant that way.

    I'm not buying into anything, I've been collecting toys for decades and this isn't my first rodeo. Mattel has stated, quite upfront, that the line is at a point where it needs guaranteed funding to move along for a years worth of figures. A cherry pickers dollars are as good as anyones, when they come in. But they can't be relied upon, therefor they can't be included in this business model. It's not personal, but if you're contributing less...
    Mattel is unwilling to sit on stock anymore, taking that a step further, they're trying to nail the amount of figures sold to the point where they only have customer service stock left over. To do this, they need an exact number every month.
    It's a risk being a cherry picker, every cherry picker knows that, you could miss out on a figure if it's sold out. How is this any different?
    They need subbers, it's a pretty black and white issue. In or out.
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  2. #302
    Heroic Warrior Gama's Avatar
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    LOL at the people that think cherry pickers dont contribute. If I told someone in my house that "some people at the org think that I'm hurting the line because I don't contribute enough" and such person took a look at my 30+ figs in my shelves that cost me $30 average plus the wind raider and a CG incoming, he or she will think that I'm absolutley NUTS hahaha

  3. #303
    Evil Collapsing Robot! Zodach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaultsofGrayskull View Post
    The business sense of a sub only model is obvious, but then so too is the sense in making figures permanently available on the website. If Mattel actually left their excess stock up for sale it might sell.
    I think Mattel already experimented with this by offering reissues but Scott has said that none of them sold well enough to be worth the investment in a second run on the figures. They still have a minimum quota they have to meet to start production on a figure again. The tooling has already been paid for, making the overall cost to Mattel cheaper, but if the figures don't sell for months they have to continue to pay the storage costs for them, further reducing the profitability of the item. Many times those reissues ended up on the holiday sales at a discounted price so they obviously weren't selling through.

  4. #304
    Heroic Warrior horseman1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gama View Post
    LOL at the people that think cherry pickers dont contribute. If I told someone in my house that "some people at the org think that I'm hurting the line because I don't contribute enough" and such person took a look at my 30+ figs in my shelves that cost me $30 average plus the wind raider and a CG incoming, he or she will think that I'm absolutley NUTS hahaha
    Of course you contribute,but when it comes to the subscription and securing the lines future skus,you do not.

    That is not a slam,just a fact. If you stop buying,they won't notice,if I as a subscriber become a cherry picker,that they will notice.

    You really are missing the point,day of sales truly mean nothing when securing the line. Sure Mattel lokes the gravy,but you need the meat. No meat, no gravy. Subscribers are the meat.
    Comedian on the matty forums.

  5. #305
    sculptor - fantastique JimPansen's Avatar
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    All those shenanigans would be obsolete, if they would offer a preorder system

  6. #306
    Door with dental plan. Jawbridge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jibernish View Post
    And anyways, your argument is based on the assumption that a for profit business can do whatever it likes because it's supposed to make money. It's a question of priorities, not of whether it's ok to make a profit. It's a question of what means do you go to to make said profit. How do you treat those you depend on for that profit (customers and employees). Some people still live in that 1950's mentality where business and money are the most important things in life, but that is not the case.
    I agree and disagree with some stuff here, but I like the overall message.

    I happen to work in advertising, and from my perspective these ~tactics~ are commonplace. From the big Apple to the localized Publix. Pointing out why a supported model is better than any alternative is the name of the game. I can also add that this is only assumed to be a tactic. Could be capitalizing on a situation. You can't seize every opportunity and remain perfectly eloquent. Reaction time is the most important thing, and Scott isn't known for being super graceful in his delivery. But all of these arguments are assumed, so for the most part they are all irrelevant.

    However, working at an independent company, I strongly agree with everything you followed up with. My company has been voted top ten places to work for years running, and they don't pay me nearly as much as other agencies have offered, but I wouldn't leave them for the world. Their support and treatment has gained my permanent loyalty, and this advocacy policy is the way many businesses are turning. So the future's looking better!

    Quote Originally Posted by horseman1981 View Post
    See what I don't get is this was told to us last year,why is everyone acting like this just came out of no where?
    Now, that's true, we were warned. I didn't believe it, but it was said. Though they do say a lot of things to cover themselves. Nothing is ever "this or that," it's always "could be this, might be that". But yeah, it was in writing, and very much discussed following SDCC last year. It was a big deal.

    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    Not being able to purchase a sub doesn't make you any less of a fan, but what purpose do you serve if you are not buying figures?
    Advocacy. Have you been on Facebook? If you like something, you support it, and tell others how cool it is, and then they support it if they like what they see. If you hate it, the opposite happens. Don't underestimate advocacy, it turns us all into living advertisements for a brand, and that moves product.
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  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by jibernish View Post
    There's a difference between making an honest profit, and then trying to make a couple extra bucks on top of that by manipulating a large portion of your customer base. Profit=good; Greed=bad. Profit and greed are not the same. I'm a corporate accountant who currently works for a large non-profit corporation, so don't presume to tell me the difference between a business and a charity.

    And anyways, your argument is based on the assumption that a for profit business can do whatever it likes because it's supposed to make money. It's a question of priorities, not of whether it's ok to make a profit. It's a question of what means do you go to to make said profit. How do you treat those you depend on for that profit (customers and employees). Some people still live in that 1950's mentality where business and money are the most important things in life, but that is not the case.

    The real product on sale here is not a hunk of plastic, but what that hunk of plastic does to us. It creates good feelings, nostalgia, wonder, childhood. And then, in some, it creates a certain level of dependence. Mattel knows that and manipulates that fact for it's own advantage. But in the end, all that manipulation will eat away at their real product, destroying those good feelings, and their customers will leave. What has all the manipulating of the fan base acheived so far? A sub that barely went through. Mattel is bleeding customers, and it would benefit their stockholders if they took a long-term approach to profit and loss rather than a "I want to make every single dollar I can right now, darn the future." Mattel is burning through their customer base. Because of their treatment of this property, there is a growing number of people who won't buy any Mattel product again.

    So in either case, a company trying to make a profit should not be employing these manipulative tactics. It harms long term profitability, and it's just wrong to manipulate people for your own gain. It's ludicrous how we give corporations the same rights as human beings, but we don't expect the same ethical behavior.
    Thank you for posting this - it's always such a relief to see more people who understand that doing anything in the name of short-term profit is not only detrimental to the intangibles like customer goodwill and perception, but actually is worse for long-term profit health and good of the line.

    Reading some of these posts from people who proclaim themselves business experts makes me feel rather dubious for any company that actually has them as employees.

  8. #308
    Heroic Warrior Gama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by horseman1981 View Post
    Of course you contribute,but when it comes to the subscription and securing the lines future skus,you do not.

    That is not a slam,just a fact. If you stop buying,they won't notice,if I as a subscriber become a cherry picker,that they will notice.

    You really are missing the point,day of sales truly mean nothing when securing the line. Sure Mattel lokes the gravy,but you need the meat. No meat, no gravy. Subscribers are the meat.
    Uh? You are missing my point, I'm talking about common sense, not "securing the line". A sane person outside of the MOTUC world will tell you that if you have invested close to a thousand dollars on a toy line you have more than done your part of contributing to such line (and then some).

    Quote Originally Posted by JimPansen View Post
    All those shenanigans would be obsolete, if they would offer a preorder system
    This like a million times!

  9. #309
    Heroic Warrior horseman1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EtherianChronicles View Post
    Thank you for posting this - it's always such a relief to see more people who understand that doing anything in the name of short-term profit is not only detrimental to the intangibles like customer goodwill and perception, but actually is worse for long-term profit health and good of the line.

    Reading some of these posts from people who proclaim themselves business experts makes me feel rather dubious for any company that actually has them as employees.
    There you go again.

    You are assuming that the majority feel like you do. You are offering opinion and no fact. Just because a few of you feel abused does not mean the majority does. We were told this is the only way we can move the line forward. The fact that Mattel offers so few of us this great line from our past is great for the future of thier business,they don't have to offer this at all,but because they do care about the brand and us they offer it. But because of it being a small line,certain models must've used.

    Again,your opinion is just that,no disrespect,be I agree with nothing you have said. In your model the line would have tanked by 2011.
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  10. #310
    Heroic Warrior He-Kal's Avatar
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    I'm a sub holder, but I can see why cherry pickers are upset about all of this. Honestly, who would have thought cherry pickers wouldn't at LEAST have a chance to buy figures on DOS? I mean, worst case scenario I thought they may have the issues we did with 5 -10 min sell outs like we did years ago, but not this So, they totally have my sympathy. I really dont like where we are going with things here.Llast month ?s were raised if we could ditch packaging to save costs which would alienate the MOC collectors (I'm a loose collector btw), and now this move which could alienate cherry pickers. Really, at this time in the Motuc line we REALLY don't need to alienate people--we need as MANY people as we can get and need to make different kinds of collectors happy--not just a niche goup.

  11. #311
    Clown Prince of Darkness Benedict Judas Hel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zodak74 View Post
    No Fang Man for the non-subscribers?

    http://news.mattycollector.com/blog/...anhattan-more/
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  12. #312
    Evil Collapsing Robot! Zodach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gama View Post
    Uh? You are missing my point, I'm talking about common sense, not "securing the line". A sane person outside of the MOTUC world will tell you that if you have invested close to a thousand dollars on a toy line you have more than done your part of contributing to such line (and then some).
    Your past purchases are irrelavant compared to a full year of guaranteed sales from a subscriber though. Those sales are locked in for every figure produced and easy to forecast and budget for. Mattel would have to somehow extrapolate from your day of purchases what figures you might buy in the future. For instance you might buy 3x Ram Man, 1x Fang Man, and 6x Mantenna, but how is Mattel supposed to figure that out for each individual customer. It's much easier and safer for them to use the subscription model instead of basing their production on estimated demand for each individual item.

  13. #313
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jawbridge View Post

    Advocacy. Have you been on Facebook? If you like something, you support it, and tell others how cool it is, and then they support it if they like what they see. If you hate it, the opposite happens. Don't underestimate advocacy, it turns us all into living advertisements for a brand, and that moves product.
    Supply and demand trumps advocacy. They're recreating why we have subs in the first place. People subbed up so they wouldn't miss any figures. People complained about missing figures back then just like they are now. They're trying to reel people back in.
    If people are complaining about something like Digital River or QC then that will scare people away. Saying that figures are becoming rare and skyrocketing on the secondary market, that brings people in.

    If Mattel were to keep stock up on their site it would wind up costing them money. They pay rent on the stock they sit on. It has to be stored somewhere, so keeping up a ton of stock so that they can trickle out sales doesn't make sense.

    Owning half the collection of course is an investment, in your collection. It still doesn't help to ensure the future of the line. Every cherry picker knows that they ran the risk of missing figures by not subbing up, now that it's happening I can understand the complaints, I just don't agree with them.
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  14. #314
    Heroic Warrior horseman1981's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Gama;3209556]Uh? You are missing my point, I'm talking about common sense, not "securing the line". A sane person outside of the MOTUC world will tell you that if you have invested close to a thousand dollars on a toy line you have more than done your part of contributing to such line (and then some).


    Again yes your money contributed,after the fact you did nothing to secure the figures being made.

    If you buy castle grayskull now,sure you helped contribute to the line,but in no way did you contribute to the castle being made.

    You could buy 50 of each figure day of on every sale day,yet you still did not make the figures happen in the first place. Only subscribers made it happen. Again this is not an attack or I am better than you thing. This is fact. I thank you for your contributions, but I thank the subscribers first,they ensured the line for the year.
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  15. #315
    Heroic Warrior Krueger's Avatar
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    The shame is that Fang-Man is just the beginning. It’s going to get progressively worse. As others have said, I really do get the feeling that 2014 will virtually be a "Subscribers Only" year. That is a shame. A real shame. This is my first year as a subscriber, but I'm still very much a "cherry picker" at heart. I'm selling a lot of stuff on this year that I just don't want. Anyway, I can see both sides of the argument here. It’s a shame there has to be an argument at all, though. Reading Scott's posts over the years, it’s always struck me how passive-aggressive he's come across when talking about "cherry pickers" either on the forums or on Roast Gooble Dinner (honestly, he has). You really do get the impression he just wants to say "*beep* off". This tactic with Fang-Man (and that's exactly what it is, make no mistakes there) is pretty much him and Mattel shouting it out again, just a little bit louder this time. As the year progresses they'll continue to shout it out even more until the Classics line is just a line for subscribers only. That's fair enough, but I really hope a lot of "cherry pickers" stick to their guns and don't subscribe for 2014 because they feel they're being forced (or bullied) to.
    Last edited by Krueger; February 13, 2013 at 01:30pm.

  16. #316
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    I think cherry pickers should sign up for 2014, not for any business reasons, but it's SUPPOSED to be all heavy hitters to finish up the line, so there shouldn't be that many people would be looking to sell. And the secondary market prices on popular characters would be ridiculous.
    I think the best thing Mattel can do is to make cherry pickers want all the cherries. LOL.
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  17. #317
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    Hah. Love that I got the subscription. Mattel is only concerned about the bottom line. They always have been. And thank god for it. It means they strive to appeal to the most people with the best products. Whatever they've done in search of a few extra dollars has given me 30 years of some frankly very awesome toys. Love.

  18. #318
    Heroic Warrior horseman1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krueger View Post
    The shame is that Fang-Man is just the beginning. It’s going to get progressively worse. As others have said, I really do get the feeling that 2014 will virtually be a "Subscribers Only" year. That is a shame. A real shame. This is my first year as a subscriber, but I'm still very much a "cherry picker" at heart. I'm selling a lot of stuff on this year that I just don't want. Anyway, I can see both sides of the argument here. It’s a shame there has to be an argument at all, though. Reading Scott's posts over the years, it’s always struck me how passive-aggressive he's always come across when talking about "cherry pickers" either on the forums or on Roast Gooble Dinner (honestly, he has). You really do get the impression he just wants to say "*beep* off". This tactic with Fang-Man (and that's exactly what it is, makes no mistakes there) is pretty much him and Mattel shouting it out again, just a little bit louder this time. As the year progresses they'll continue to shout it out even more until the Classics line is just a line for subscribers only. That's fair enough, but I really hope a lot of "cherry pickers" stick to their guns and don't subscribe for 2014 for the first time because of Mattel has and will continue to do.
    But see if the cherry pickers stick to their guns and don't subscribe and the line does go all sub,then only the cherry pickers loose. They are not hurting anyone buy not buying a sub,they only ensure the must pay high prices on the secondary or go with out their favorites.

    I do see this for next year though.
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  19. #319
    Heroic Warrior Poe Ghostal's Avatar
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    That Strobo thing - now that's a nice perk for subscribers.

  20. #320
    Heroic Warrior KUZEH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimPansen View Post
    All those shenanigans would be obsolete, if they would offer a preorder system
    Nope... people would still complain about the pre-order system anyways...
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  21. #321
    Door with dental plan. Jawbridge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    Supply and demand trumps advocacy.
    Maybe, okay, but I was just answering this question:

    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    Not being able to purchase a sub doesn't make you any less of a fan, but what purpose do you serve if you are not buying figures?
    Supply and demand isn't a purpose a non-buying fan can serve, except to other fans, when they cause more supply and less demand.

    Just sayin'. Again, I don't pretend to know Mattel's strategies in all of this, nor do I think people here have particularly knowledgable insights. I'm just speaking to what I do know. Social and digital advertising, lemme at it. Huge corporation selling toys from behind a curtain, tossing out smoke bombs... can't help you there.

    Sorry for the confusion.


    Quote Originally Posted by Poe Ghostal View Post
    That Strobo thing - now that's a nice perk for subscribers.
    YES!! Yes it is. Man I was worried about not getting him until some random date. I just recently picked up Templefied Sorceress.
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  22. #322
    Clown Prince of Darkness Benedict Judas Hel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCB View Post
    what do cherry pickers want?
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  23. #323
    Heroic Warrior enoch's Avatar
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    A preorder would not work. It did not work for the justice league. And the hover board and castle g have seen people back out. The sub is a sure thing. Sorry to those who cried wolf and said there will be a dos always even though mattel said there wouldnt be. I brought two subs so I was sure to get second head for display. And now these figures will be easy to sale. The fact is a sub is a win win situation.

  24. #324
    SUBSCRIBE OR DIE!!! mick4metal's Avatar
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    Time to chime in once again. First off I would like to know where everybody got their business degrees from because it sure seems like everyone here has one. Maybe one of those phony online schools. Next thing is the overuse of the word gravy. Its toys not supper. One last thing that grinds my gears is the word entitlement. Some are saying cherry pickers think they are entitled to these figures. Well, I got news for you... WE ARE. This is a non-retail ADULT COLLECTOR LINE!!! It was made for the fans. It is sold on a special website for the fans!!! Sold at prices only a fan would pay!!! Produced characters only a fan would buy!!! Now I'm pretty sure when something is specially catered made for you it allows you to some entitlement.
    Last edited by mick4metal; February 13, 2013 at 02:11pm.
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  25. #325
    grumpy old dragon scott metzger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    I'm not buying into anything, I've been collecting toys for decades and this isn't my first rodeo. Mattel has stated, quite upfront, that the line is at a point where it needs guaranteed funding to move along for a years worth of figures. A cherry pickers dollars are as good as anyones, when they come in. But they can't be relied upon, therefor they can't be included in this business model. It's not personal, but if you're contributing less...
    And that is a big part of why this line is winding down. "Cherry pickers" was TG's cute, condescending phrase for a population that includes NEW CUSTOMERS, without which NO toy line will continue for long. When you use this model, basically telling anyone who wants to jump on, "You can do that if you're willing to commit several hundred dollars for stuff we aren't going to tell you about yet." There's a real marketing strategy for you! For years they left no room for someone to sample the figures; only recently have they put up the "evergreen" category, and that more to get rid of 2nd runs and customer service stock than part of any well thought out strategy. And something like Fang Man might just catch the eye of a casual collector who remembers the toon, and then they go to Matty, get him, and see that there is a whole sub for just those characters.

    Your looking at the "cherry pickers" in the same narrow, shortsighted way as Mattel. They do contribute to sales, and the collector's mentality makes it more likely than in most venues that today's cherry picker will become tomorrow's subber. Mattel got lazy and started demanding the one thing no business can every count on short of an outright pre-order: guaranteed sales. If Mattel really wanted to ensure that they made what the market will bear, they'd use a simple pre-order system just as DC Direct and others have done for years. But, again, Mattel wants to make their money without putting anything into it (lazy and greedy), so the sub allows them to do whatever they want, try to pass off things like Snake Man-at-Arms as a quarterly figure, and still rake in the dough. Truthfully, the whole strategy of Mattycollector right now is something that would have any real business person laughing hysterically:

    "You mean, the only way to get the figures is to commit to a years worth of stuff (giggle) and they (guffaw) only show you a few of the figures ahead of time and you have to (chortle) trust them (snort) to make something worthwhile for the rest of the year? And people are actually going along with this? Bwahahahahahahahahahahahaha!"

    This is the sub strategy of Mattel in a nutshell. That it has succeeded in any way, shape or form is tribute to the dedication of the fans and the work of the Horsemen. Mattel and DR have, on the other hand, done almost every conceivable thing to undermine the whole shebang, and continue to do so with ever more vigor as time goes on. Their strategy is one that guarantees dwindling sales and bad relations with their customer base; in other words, there aren't many strategies I can think of that are worse.
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