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Thread: (New 52) Teela Unappreciation thread (some spoilers)

  1. #101
    grumpy old dragon scott metzger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridureyu View Post
    If your complaints about Teela can be rephrased as:

    "Teela insulted a man! I hope she dies! Women should never disrespect men!"

    or:

    "How DARE Teela dress in a provocative way! Women need dress codes!"

    Then something is wrong, and it's not with the comic.
    What folks are trying to point out is that angry outbursts, a nasty mouth and skimpy costumes are not what usually passes for characterization (at least before the New 52 came along). They are what poor writers try to substitute in its place.

    As I've stated before, Giffen can write some good, sometimes even powerful and touching stories. But when his ego starts revving up, you sometimes get self-gratifying stuff only he seems to think is wonderous. The early issues of his funny Justice League were actually pretty good satire, but the more attention he got for it, the more it became self-parody, losing its edge and funniness in the process. Same with his early Ambush Bug stuff; there was very funny and very imaginative stuff in the early stories, but then, again, it went quickly south into ridiculousness. He's good if he's reigned in a bit by a good editor, and you can get some really good stuff. THat definitely ISN'T happening with MOTU; this is fast becoming the worst kind of Giffen's work. The first issue was a mixed bag with some potential, but that's quickly vanishing.
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  2. #102
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    I've really no issue with women dressing provocatively, but in Teela's case it seems like it's being done to fulfill some male fantasies instead of being in-line with how she was for the most part in past incarnations. Fair enough. But the annoyance for me is: It's not really happening with the guys. When are we going to see close-ups of the guys with their underwear or loincloth halfway up their butt?
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  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott metzger View Post
    What folks are trying to point out is that angry outbursts, a nasty mouth and skimpy costumes are not what usually passes for characterization (at least before the New 52 came along). They are what poor writers try to substitute in its place.

    As I've stated before, Giffen can write some good, sometimes even powerful and touching stories. But when his ego starts revving up, you sometimes get self-gratifying stuff only he seems to think is wonderous. The early issues of his funny Justice League were actually pretty good satire, but the more attention he got for it, the more it became self-parody, losing its edge and funniness in the process. Same with his early Ambush Bug stuff; there was very funny and very imaginative stuff in the early stories, but then, again, it went quickly south into ridiculousness. He's good if he's reigned in a bit by a good editor, and you can get some really good stuff. THat definitely ISN'T happening with MOTU; this is fast becoming the worst kind of Giffen's work. The first issue was a mixed bag with some potential, but that's quickly vanishing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    I've really no issue with women dressing provocatively, but in Teela's case it seems like it's being done to fulfill some male fantasies instead of being in-line with how she was for the most part in past incarnations. Fair enough. But the annoyance for me is: It's not really happening with the guys. When are we going to see close-ups of the guys with their underwear or loincloth halfway up their butt?
    Girls dressing provocatively to fulfill male fantasies - in a modern DC comic? No - surely not! Could never happen!

    As for the guys - sorry to disappoint you, but they're all being covered up - purely in the interests of equality, of course. Hence He-Man's new IronManCosplay outfit - which both DC and Mattel now seem rather keen to disown; no great wonder given the general reaction to this Eternian Eagles football kit. But - then again - failure invariably tends to end-up in the orphanage....

  4. #104
    Defender of the Underdog He-Dad's Avatar
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    Teela....what a little stinkor

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Dad View Post
    Teela....what a little stinkor
    Nice one! Fragrant she ain't!

  6. #106
    USF Bull chuc98's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    I've really no issue with women dressing provocatively, but in Teela's case it seems like it's being done to fulfill some male fantasies instead of being in-line with how she was for the most part in past incarnations. Fair enough. But the annoyance for me is: It's not really happening with the guys. When are we going to see close-ups of the guys with their underwear or loincloth halfway up their butt?
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  7. #107
    Heroic Warrior VictoryLiger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridureyu View Post
    If your complaints about Teela can be rephrased as:

    "Teela insulted a man! I hope she dies! Women should never disrespect men!"

    or:

    "How DARE Teela dress in a provocative way! Women need dress codes!"

    Then something is wrong, and it's not with the comic.
    The issues that people are having with Teela in the new comic are not the ones you seem to think they are having. Considering the fandom we are in and the female characters that are part of it, I don't see anyone having an issue with a well-written, strong female character. The problem is that this version of Teela IS NOT a well-written, strong female character. In fact, I think you could leave "female" out of it entirely. She's just not a well-written character. If Stratos or another male character were saying some of the dialog given to Teela, I truly believe the frustration over it would be just as great. Giffen seems to be writing her to be full of hate and spite just to write someone who is full of hate and spite. He's not paying any attention to the other character traits that Teela has shown in other versions of MOTU. It's like he read a character description of her and took her traditional hotheadedness to mean cruelty instead. As for the insult you mention, she all but wished that a friend and colleague would have died at the hands of the Horde. That's a pretty harsh sentiment whether directed at a male of female and not something that the Teela we have seen in the past would do. As for her costume, I'll direct you to http://thehawkeyeinitiative.com/.

  8. #108
    Heroic Warrior Ridureyu's Avatar
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    Doesn't change the fact that a lot of people in this thread want her brutally murdered because she dares to have a smart mouth and talk back to the menfolk...

  9. #109
    Heroic Master of 200X MegaGearMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridureyu View Post
    Doesn't change the fact that a lot of people in this thread want her brutally murdered because she dares to have a smart mouth and talk back to the menfolk...
    Nah, it's because Eternia was invaded by the Horde and one of her friends survives...and she talks smack about him surviving. That was in extremely bad taste. As was bickering and speaking ill of the Sorceress (who is ironically her mother) during her funeral. Then, arguably, there is the whole bloodthirsty part where she wants He-Man to kill Despara (granted, Despara is an enemy, but her attitude didn't help put her in a better light).

    These three examples make New 52 Teela quite unlikable.

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  10. #110
    Heroic Warrior wundarwarrior's Avatar
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    I don't like Teela and i never have. In every version she is somewhat rude but this one is just magnified. However, she does show concern for Roboto which shows she dislikes Mekaneck specifically. In reality soldiers do not like every soldier, teams have players who hate each other, and jobs have employees who fight. That is life. I don't particularly like how vocal she is but it's not totally unrealistic. I could see them building to something where Mek saves her and she comes to respect him. Overall as of issue 3 she is less terrible and more acceptable.

  11. #111
    Heroic Warrior illicitjedi's Avatar
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    Teela, oh Teela. Growing up with only one imaginary friend for a very short time, *might* turn someone into a $#%W^@. I still am not a fan. Maybe there can be some back story as to why she hates Mek so much.

    Plus side, baby Adora is adorable!
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  12. #112
    Heroic Warrior Blaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaGearMax View Post
    Nah, it's because Eternia was invaded by the Horde and one of her friends survives...and she talks smack about him surviving. That was in extremely bad taste. As was bickering and speaking ill of the Sorceress (who is ironically her mother) during her funeral. Then, arguably, there is the whole bloodthirsty part where she wants He-Man to kill Despara (granted, Despara is an enemy, but her attitude didn't help put her in a better light).

    These three examples make New 52 Teela quite unlikable.
    I'd love to see Adora/Despera actually tortured and beaten within an inch of her life, so on that level I'm 100% percent on Teela's side. You kill kids? I'm sorry I hope He-man or Teela dismembers her. ....and I'm a she'ra fan too.
    Strange women dressed in bird outfits guarding castles distributing swords and harnesses in no basis for a system of heroism.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaster View Post
    I'd love to see Adora/Despera actually tortured and beaten within an inch of her life, so on that level I'm 100% percent on Teela's side. You kill kids? I'm sorry I hope He-man or Teela dismembers her. ....and I'm a she'ra fan too.
    Oooh - goodness gracious! I'm rather hoping that she might get redeemed (more chance of that than with Teela....)
    But I agree that the graphic child-murder would have been better inferred than depicted as it was; there are ways of putting brutality clearly across that have no need of such juvenile attempts to go for the 'shock'n'awe' jugular.

    In any case I suspect that it is more likely to be Despara doing painful and unpleasant things to her twin brother once he is her captive. At least until he manages to convince her who she really is - and to shift her allegiance.


    And: are you suggesting that the right to wield the Sword of Power derives from a mandate from the masses, rather than some farcical subterranean ceremony....?

  14. #114
    Heroic Warrior Blaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scriptor View Post

    And: are you suggesting that the right to wield the Sword of Power derives from a mandate from the masses, rather than some farcical subterranean ceremony....?
    I'm confused, can you extrapolate your question for me? I don't understand where I indicated one or the other.

    Granted yes, I'd like to see Adora be redeemed, and yes she is "evidently" under a "spell" and even Darth Vader got a redemption before his utter demise, and he killed younglings too. But She-ra is a very personal Hero/Heroinne to me and to see her reduced to a child murderer just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. For real. It's gonna have to be one hell of a redemption for me to forgive that!!!

    Also I want to add, she's been a little to high on her horse lately, (too coin a phrase lol,) I think she really does need to be put in her place at least a little.
    Strange women dressed in bird outfits guarding castles distributing swords and harnesses in no basis for a system of heroism.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaster View Post
    I'm confused, can you extrapolate your question for me? I don't understand where I indicated one or the other.

    Granted yes, I'd like to see Adora be redeemed, and yes she is "evidently" under a "spell" and even Darth Vader got a redemption before his utter demise, and he killed younglings too. But She-ra is a very personal Hero/Heroinne to me and to see her reduced to a child murderer just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. For real. It's gonna have to be one hell of a redemption for me to forgive that!!!

    Also I want to add, she's been a little to high on her horse lately, (too coin a phrase lol,) I think she really does need to be put in her place at least a little.

    Agreed; she has been overdone (very!) and needs to be very considerably redeemed - but that appears to be the only way that Giffen knows; kill off all women or else turn them into ***** and psychopaths. Bizarre.

    And it's all so illogical, too - even for a comic. Despara gets Eternos to fall in an hour or so by killing civilians to get the Masters to withdraw. THEN she lays siege to Castle Grayskull? Why not simply go for the massacre of the innocents again to force their surrender? And THEN she teleports into the castle (in person) to seize Teela, presumably to provoke He-Man into coming out to fight or surrender (and it almost worked - and will.) And not only does the supreme commander of the Horde forces on Eternia (all ten trillion 'overkill' battalions of them - WTH..?) do this in person, but she also wants to enslave He-Man - so that she can fight him to the death. Yes; victorious generals almost always do this. Nothing at all illogical or irresponsible about it. Or plain silly.
    If it's meant to show her hubris, then it also shows a basic lack of intelligence, too. Logical inconsistency abounds.

    So, yes - she does need taking down. But I suspect that we are going to get lots more 'feisty' Despara and way too much more 'feisty' Teela before things improve (if indeed they ever do.) Has no-one told Giffen that endlessly edgy and feisty counter-heroines is just SO last decade?


    And - as the the 'Sword of Power'; I was referring to your splendid tagline/signature below. "Well, I AM king!" "Oh, king, eh? Very nice. And how did you get that, then..?" (etc.) (Sorry!)

  16. #116
    Heroic Warrior Blaster's Avatar
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    Oh ha ha, that?... It's actually not mine it was on here once before and I stole it. But in relation to that sig I must agree, because a "Sorceress" deems it so, the royal Prince and Princess get to defend the Universe? Well in one aspect yes it should be so because let's face it, those kids live the high life, not so much Adora in the past living in the dank dark Fright Zone, but now in semi-established cannon, not so much in these hack-job books, Adora is now officially anointed as Princess of Eternia, so in that right these two should earn their keep. But on the other side, they get riches, power, and now glory??? I think we are entirely sensationalizing these two a bit no?
    Strange women dressed in bird outfits guarding castles distributing swords and harnesses in no basis for a system of heroism.

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