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Thread: Club Eternia 2014

  1. #101
    Eternian Henchman motu77's Avatar
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    I'll get mine on the 17th. It really doesn't matter what they show, I want them all!
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  2. #102
    YES! YES! YES! Prince Adam's Dad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    In what world would trying to get as many subscribers as possible be a bad sign? McDonalds and Wal-Mart work hard to maximize their customers.....
    A world where the company changes long-standing facets of subscription time frames in the enrollment season following a year where subs struggled to meet quota.
    Sadly, you can't divorce emotion from a toyline built on nostalgia.


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  3. #103
    Heroic Horde General Canada-Man's Avatar
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    Hey Scott if you are reading..... If we are not getting the quota by the cut off point could we keep the sub open for another month and just not have a january figure and have two for february? Just curious

  4. #104
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Adam's Dad View Post
    A world where the company changes long-standing facets of subscription time frames in the enrollment season following a year where subs struggled to meet quota.
    I don't see your logic at all.

    ALL companies, if they are smart, constantly try and find ways to innovate and improve business. What's more, we have every indication that the line is in better shape now than July 2012. We have 2 subs and the CG for the second half of 2013, and the prices on the secondary market are sky-high because so many new customers discovered the line this year.

    Mark my words, the 2014 sub will go ahead easily and with better numbers than 2013 started with.

    Opening the sub period for longer is just basic common sense!

  5. #105
    Got Filmation? shadowfall1976's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    Mark my words, the 2014 sub will go ahead easily and with better numbers than 2013 started with.
    That's what they thought going into SDCC last year.... Didn't turn out so easy.... There's been a few foul ups that may not help sub time this year, and it's possible a few subscribers from last year got fed up from more sub cancellations they faced this year.... We may make it, I'm sure we will, but the point is....won't be as easy and in the bag as you think.
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  6. #106
    YES! YES! YES! Prince Adam's Dad's Avatar
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    @No-Ah

    I agree that it is common sense to widen the sub sign-up period. I just happen to have a different opinion of the motives behind it.

    I believe that the strength of the line is anyone's guess. Yes, the Filmation sub was a nice surprise. Even then, they managed to upset a lot of people with the associated Fang-Man debacle. And it could be argued that the Filmation sub might have been an attempt to strike while the iron is still (mostly) hot and profit off of a new license before the end of the line.

    Yes, the news of CG was fantastic. It did bring a lot of new people to the line. Secondary market value on many older figures is very high. But how high were those values prior to the CG announcement? I'd bet that the higher figures were pretty high to begin with. And to assume that increased interest in the secondary market will generate enough new subscribers to offset the losses of subs due to the natural erosion of interest over time (this being year five is a remarkable accomplishment for MOTUC) might be folly.

    What we didn't have in 2012 vs. 2013 was a "partial sub" buy-in at mid-year. That alone is a pretty solid indicator that more than just a few people managed to end their subscription obligation early, leaving Mattel holding an awful lot of non-accounted for sub figures.

    We also didn't have sub numbers so low that the Brand Manager had to come out and announce that the 2017 roadmap was being abandoned in favor of a "heavy hitter" lineup explicitly to drive sub sales. If your prediction of higher sub numbers in 2014 comes true, there is no doubt in my mind that THIS will be the primary driving factor.

    Getting back to "common sense". There have been plenty of opportunities over the course of this line for its architects to make "common sense" decisions. They have often chosen to bypass these opportunities. But at the end of the day, the line is closer to its end than its beginning. There is no shame in having a 5- or 6-year run wherein you produced some of the finest (and most beloved) action figures ever.
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  7. #107
    Heroic Warrior Replikor's Avatar
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    I notice its only a club eternia again... no Filmation second sub year as well.

    Oh, well... more MOTUC figures are good figures regardless...

  8. #108
    Got Filmation? shadowfall1976's Avatar
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    And don't think for a minute with the Early Access snafus and the crap they did with Fang Man, that that will help come sign up time either....This may be a loved line, but it's far from a pleasure for many any more to collect. Early Access hang-ups caused many to miss not only Strobo, but SOH as well....turning into not much of a perk.

    Common sense decisions in MOTUC....do they even exist? I know many issues that suggest anything they get right, seems to be more like a fluke than the norm.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Replikor View Post
    I notice its only a club eternia again... no Filmation second sub year as well.

    Oh, well... more MOTUC figures are good figures regardless...
    We didn't have Filmation sub at sign-up time last year either....
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  9. #109
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Adam's Dad View Post
    @No-Ah

    I agree that it is common sense to widen the sub sign-up period. I just happen to have a different opinion of the motives behind it.

    I believe that the strength of the line is anyone's guess. Yes, the Filmation sub was a nice surprise. Even then, they managed to upset a lot of people with the associated Fang-Man debacle. And it could be argued that the Filmation sub might have been an attempt to strike while the iron is still (mostly) hot and profit off of a new license before the end of the line.

    Yes, the news of CG was fantastic. It did bring a lot of new people to the line. Secondary market value on many older figures is very high. But how high were those values prior to the CG announcement? I'd bet that the higher figures were pretty high to begin with. And to assume that increased interest in the secondary market will generate enough new subscribers to offset the losses of subs due to the natural erosion of interest over time (this being year five is a remarkable accomplishment for MOTUC) might be folly.

    What we didn't have in 2012 vs. 2013 was a "partial sub" buy-in at mid-year. That alone is a pretty solid indicator that more than just a few people managed to end their subscription obligation early, leaving Mattel holding an awful lot of non-accounted for sub figures.

    We also didn't have sub numbers so low that the Brand Manager had to come out and announce that the 2017 roadmap was being abandoned in favor of a "heavy hitter" lineup explicitly to drive sub sales. If your prediction of higher sub numbers in 2014 comes true, there is no doubt in my mind that THIS will be the primary driving factor.

    Getting back to "common sense". There have been plenty of opportunities over the course of this line for its architects to make "common sense" decisions. They have often chosen to bypass these opportunities. But at the end of the day, the line is closer to its end than its beginning. There is no shame in having a 5- or 6-year run wherein you produced some of the finest (and most beloved) action figures ever.
    The prices for many figures on the secondary market were FAR lower before the CG reveal. A lot of us discovered the line only then. It's what I believe was the primary factor leading to the sub-lite. There was demand. The figures on DOS were selling out in nanoseconds.

    I will agree that part of the motivation for opening the sub-lite was as a hedge against drop-outs. May was mega-expensive and not particularly popular (I love my FFM, but dems the facts!) but I think the demand of so many new collectors was also a very real factor in the opening of the sub-lites.

    You're the second poster - only the second poster - I've seen on this forum who seems to think the line is in immanent danger of being canceled. I see all evidence pointing in the other direction. Don't underestimate the importance of sky-rocketing secondary market prices. Not only is it the surest measure of demand, but it is also a motivator to get people to sub instead of cherry-picking.

    You mention Fang-Man. He's one of MANY things Matty has done which has (rightly) ****** people off. But he's also a great motivator for subbing. Cherry-pickers were left out in the cold with him. Do you want to get left out in the cold on other figures? I think Matty has carefully set things up this year to make it look like we really do have to sub in 2014 if we want to collect the line.

    I do expect higher numbers for 2014 than they had initially for 2013. But I think they're smart to do an "A-list" heavy year, especially since there are NO A-listers left. The biggest characters still unmade are Two-Bad and Modulok. Great characters, but simply not A-list. If they want to grab people, they DO have to include some of the biggest characters which are still outstanding. Was 2013 really any different? Ram-Man, Jitsu, and Mantenna were some of the biggest character which hadn't been made then. I think they've had to be careful about how much C-level product they give us, and now that the real A-list is completely used up, they need to deliver whatever B-list they can still find.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by shadowfall1976 View Post
    That's what they thought going into SDCC last year.... Didn't turn out so easy.... There's been a few foul ups that may not help sub time this year, and it's possible a few subscribers from last year got fed up from more sub cancellations they faced this year.... We may make it, I'm sure we will, but the point is....won't be as easy and in the bag as you think.
    I think 2014 is in the bag. 2015 might be more of a struggle.

    Look at how easily and stresslessly the Filmation sub made it's numbers....
    Last edited by No-Ah; May 24, 2013 at 08:50pm.

  10. #110
    Got Filmation? shadowfall1976's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    I think 2014 is in the bag. 2015 might be more of a struggle.

    Look at how easily and stresslessly the Filmation sub made it's numbers....
    We'll see.... We thought 2013 was "in the bag" we struggled for that one....so we'll see.
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  11. #111
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadowfall1976 View Post
    We'll see.... We thought 2013 was "in the bag" we struggled for that one....so we'll see.
    Did you expect Filmation to go through so smoothly?

  12. #112
    Heroic Warrior King Tamusk's Avatar
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    Club Filmation might be considered it's own "separate" sub, kinda like Club Black Freighter was not part of Club Infinite Earths and revealed at SDCC separately. I am pretty positive their will be another add-on sub. Especially if the plan is to try and finish the vintage MOTU and PoP lines in 2 years. There is at least 21 figures remaining from both, not including oversized figures, like Modulok, and characters likely to be sold together (Twistoid and Rotar) or packaged another figure (Kowl and LooKee). With 21 vintage figures, PLUS a-List characters from Filmation, New Adventures, MYP (200X), and the Comics, they NEED an add-on sub per year...maybe more than one. I'd like it if there was one for the first two quarters, and then a 2nd on in the last two quarters.

    Filmation (Q1, Q2), PoP (Q3, Q4) or vice versa. I'd even love a vintage Comic/mini-comic Character sub!

    Whatever happens, I'd say 2013 appears to be very successful. So, I see no reason at all to fear the line coming to a close. Especially with so many great characters remaining. The new comic and Castle Grayskull brought more eyes to the brand, so now would be the time to grow, not reduce. Or, at the very least, maintain the same skus as 2013 in 2014.

    12 monthly figures
    1 sub exclusive
    4 quarterly items
    6 figure add-on sub
    1 large pre-order item
    1 traveling exclusive
    1 SDCC exclusive
    1 chase figure
    3 non-sub items (this year, we have the clamshells, the new weapons pak, and the tiered stands)

    ...and the year isn't over yet, we may get even more stuff.

  13. #113
    I love Mos Eisley Cantina BoShek's Avatar
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    I think six more Filmation figures would be great. Think of the big names that will be left to do after the first one.
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  14. #114
    YES! YES! YES! Prince Adam's Dad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    The prices for many figures on the secondary market were FAR lower before the CG reveal. A lot of us discovered the line only then. It's what I believe was the primary factor leading to the sub-lite. There was demand. The figures on DOS were selling out in nanoseconds.
    CG was announced on September 22nd of last year. Since, there have been exactly three sellouts that have come even remotely close to challenging the bad old days of 2010 in terms of "selling out in nanoseconds": Rattlor (the first original MOTU throwback after the announcement), Jitsu (another original MOTU throwback), and arguably the most anticipated figure since the line started in 2008, Ram-Man.

    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    I will agree that part of the motivation for opening the sub-lite was as a hedge against drop-outs. May was mega-expensive and not particularly popular (I love my FFM, but dems the facts!) but I think the demand of so many new collectors was also a very real factor in the opening of the sub-lites.
    They can't offer subscriptions for stock they don't have. The only way they have stock to offer is if people are bailing. With all of the concerns over lack of day-of sales and lower production numbers, how much extra product do you think they have on hand to offer to the new-found customers?

    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    You're the second poster - only the second poster - I've seen on this forum who seems to think the line is in immanent danger of being canceled. I see all evidence pointing in the other direction. Don't underestimate the importance of sky-rocketing secondary market prices. Not only is it the surest measure of demand, but it is also a motivator to get people to sub instead of cherry-picking.
    "Imminent" is a strong word. I think 2014 will happen, largely because of the abandonment of the roadmap (which I though was overly ambitious from the start, and lent itself to far too many characters and variants that could be considered "filler"). 2015? We'll see. As diehard as this fandom is, I don't rule anything out. If the line could survive strictly on the drive of the good people here on the .Org, I'd say the line would run for another 10 years. The fact remains, it can't.

    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    You mention Fang-Man. He's one of MANY things Matty has done which has (rightly) ****** people off. But he's also a great motivator for subbing. Cherry-pickers were left out in the cold with him. Do you want to left out in the cold on other figures? I think Matty has carefully set things up this year to make it look like we really do have to sub in 2014 if we want to collect the line.
    This is the same song-and-dance they have been feeding to the people who have had the good fortune of finding the line earlier on. While I can appreciate and respect your enthusiasm, it's easier to rally the troops around the line when you haven't had the misfortune of experiencing the laundry list of problems caused by Digital River. You think people were mad at Fang-Man? Ask them how it felt to BE a subscriber but to STILL miss out on Fisto.

    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    I do expect higher numbers for 2014 than they had initially for 2013. But I think they're smart to do an "A-list" heavy year, especially since there are NO A-listers left. The biggest characters still unmade are Two-Bad and Modulok. Great characters, but simply not A-list. If they want to grab people, they DO have to include some of the biggest characters which are still outstanding. Was 2013 really any different? Ram-Man, Jitsu, and Mantenna were some of the biggest character which hadn't been made then. I think they've had to be careful about how much C-level product they give us, and now that the real A-list is used up, they need to deliver whatever B-list they can still find.
    That's the thing. They ARE smart to do a heavy-hitters year. But for all the reasons I have mentioned, I see it as more of a "last hurrah" (possibly next-to-last). There will be people who adore the line and will sub no matter what. On the other side of the coin are those who are more nostalgia-driven and aren't going to be as interested in the sweet sculpts and fantastic designs for the guy standing behind the other guy standing behind Leech in that one episode of PoP. I'd bet that a lot of those people are going to choose to save their money for that stupid-kinds-of-expensive A- and B-listers that aren't in production anymore.
    Sadly, you can't divorce emotion from a toyline built on nostalgia.


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  15. #115
    Heroic Warrior Ridureyu's Avatar
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    Yeah, here's my concern:

    2013 almost didn't go through.

    So in 2013, they reopened the 2013 subs once, and now they're putting 2014 on a much wider timeframe while saying "We want more subscribers!" And the whole year, whenever somebody asks about a possible figure, they say "Well, if the line survives into next year, maybe!" So basically, it sounds like they are kind of worried about this next year, so they're pushing as hard as they can to meet the minimum.

    That said, I'm pretty sure they'll reach it just fine. This is a good marketing tactic, and something that they should have done beforehand.
    Last edited by Ridureyu; May 24, 2013 at 09:27pm.

  16. #116
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Adam's Dad View Post

    They can't offer subscriptions for stock they don't have. The only way they have stock to offer is if people are bailing. With all of the concerns over lack of day-of sales and lower production numbers, how much extra product do you think they have on hand to offer to the new-found customers?
    They sold off a chunk of the DOS stock for the sub-lites. Yes, I'm sure there were some ANTICIPATED bailers, but not before they got their King He-Man figures, which means they actually hadn't bailed before the sub-lite sale began and ended! It wouldn't have been until after May 10 that Matty had concrete numbers for people dropping out.

    Matty does a lot of annoying things. There's the Fang Man debacle, the Fisto debacle, this debacle, that debacle, but the fact seems to me to be that the line is doing better now than a year ago. I base that on the secondary market prices and the way Filmation made it's numbers without incident (and CG "crushed" it's target.) I don't know how long you've been following the line, and I'm sure dealing with DR and Matty can wear very thin after a few years. (I bought my first MOTUC figures in December.) But there is a new unexpected wave of collectors which came in with CG, and there will be more brought in by the CG reveal, and more again brought in when people actually get the castle in-hand and pictures start circulating. If CG hadn't happened, I think you would have been right. The sub would have struggled to make 2014 and probably not make 2015, but things have changed. There is a very clear shot in the arm. This isn't just my feeling, the facts which we have all point this way.

    I still think they'll have to fight for 2015 though. It looks like all C and D list characters, and the Castle Grayskull bump might have passed. I have predicted secondary market prices will probably hit their all-time peak around March/April 2014. They should do Snake Mountain. I bet it would give them an extra year.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ridureyu View Post
    Yeah, here's my concern:

    2013 almost didn't go through.

    So in 2013, they reopened the 2013 subs once, and now they're putting 2014 on a much wider timeframe while saying "We want more subscribers!" And the whole year, whenever somebody asks about a possible figure, they say "Well, if the line survives into next year, maybe!" So basically, it sounds like they are kind of worried about this next year, so they're pushing as hard as they can to meet the minimum.

    That said, I'm pretty sure they'll reach it just fine. This is a good marketing tactic, and something that they should have done beforehand. it's just that a lot of stuff lately has sort of felt like that beeping noise in Metroid when you're low on health.
    They say that because they want YOU to worry.

    Pay attention to what we KNOW. Filmation hit it's numbers without drama. CG apparently "crushed" it's target. The secondary market prices are skyrocketing, AND He-Man just got a new comic book series.

  17. #117
    Heroic Warrior Ridureyu's Avatar
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    It's just that a lot of stuff lately has sort of felt like that beeping noise in Metroid when you're low on health. The only question is, can they bomb-jump out of the lava in time? I don't subscribe to "Mattel is full of lies and conspiracies, and they're actually doing great!" Especially because, when the line finally does end, people will try to claim that it was doing just fine even if sales had tanked...


    And I appreciated Scott's response - they can't really devote all the extra resources to Snake Mountain right now when they're trying to get 2014 through, as the situation is a little different.

  18. #118
    Heroic Warrior Darth Daddy's Avatar
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    The message says that you won't want to miss anything from either brand... so... what's the other brand? The only thing mentioned in the note is Club Eternia... ?
    Say cheese!!!

  19. #119
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridureyu View Post
    It's just that a lot of stuff lately has sort of felt like that beeping noise in Metroid when you're low on health. The only question is, can they bomb-jump out of the lava in time? I don't subscribe to "Mattel is full of lies and conspiracies, and they're actually doing great!" Especially because, when the line finally does end, people will try to claim that it was doing just fine even if sales had tanked...
    A week ago you were convinced the line was already cancelled and they wouldn't finish 2013. There's nothing but your "feeling" to back up your feeling. The facts which we have all seem to back up that the line is doing better now than a year ago.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Daddy View Post
    The message says that you won't want to miss anything from either brand... so... what's the other brand? The only thing mentioned in the note is Club Eternia... ?
    I believe it's the DC line?
    Last edited by No-Ah; May 24, 2013 at 09:49pm.

  20. #120
    A Real Master Of Arms nato's Avatar
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    I'm not really sure why anybody would really want to sign up for the sub before the reveals at SDCC? What incentive is there for doing that? Your sub isn't going to ship sooner, you're not going to get a discount, so why not wait until you see a little bit of what you're going to be paying for?

    I'm definitely waiting for reveal day before I order.
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  21. #121
    Marketing Manager at Mattel Toyguru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canada-Man View Post
    Hey Scott if you are reading..... If we are not getting the quota by the cut off point could we keep the sub open for another month and just not have a january figure and have two for february? Just curious
    No. At this point if we don't hit the min for either the 2014 MOTU or the DC sub the 2014 subs will be canceled and any tool'd figures will likely be released as "day of quarterly items". With rising prices and factors beyond out control (like labor and raw materials) a min number of sub holders is needed to make 2014 happen.

  22. #122
    Heroic Warrior fisto power's Avatar
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    What vintage figure you think is the 35 dollar holiday figure that Scott mentioned on the forums.
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  23. #123
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fisto power View Post
    What vintage figure you think is the 35 dollar holiday figure that Scott mentioned on the forums.
    Christmas He-Man?

  24. #124
    Heroric Drummer Brian Ozone's Avatar
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    I'll get my 2 subs right away. I don't care what's in it.... I want it.
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  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    I still think they'll have to fight for 2015 though. It looks like all C and D list characters, and the Castle Grayskull bump might have passed. I have predicted secondary market prices will probably hit their all-time peak around March/April 2014. They should do Snake Mountain. I bet it would give them an extra year.
    Plus, if the movie hits in 2015, MOTU will get a major shot in the arm and tons of publicity which I imagine would be beneficial to the lifespan of MOTUC.

    Regardless, I'm optimistic that 2014 and 2015 will happen one way or another. After that, we'll see. I'd love to see it go well beyond 2015 of course, but that will depend on how many fans are interested in sticking around at that point.
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