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Thread: Do She-Ra fans have to pay more?

  1. #1
    Searchin' My Soul DisneyBoy's Avatar
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    Do She-Ra fans have to pay more?

    I've got beef. Please, hear me out before you dog-pile me...this isn't meant as an attack on anyone.

    ...I was just reading how someone suggested that figures of Razz and Broom be used as "subscription bait for 2015". I took that to mean as a gift given away if you subscribe, like Shadow Weaver once was. I was going to write a reply right there in the thread, but it sparked such irritation within me that I felt the larger issue should be addressed:

    Why do the She-Ra fans always have to pay more?

    I'm not just talking money here - I'm talking time.

    He-Man fans got their main characters years ago - He-Man, Adam, Teela, MAA, Skeletor, Beast Man, Evil-Lyn and Battle Cat were all out in the opening months of the MOTUC line. Back when the toys were priced at 20 bucks, plus shipping. At this point in the line, He-Man fans have filled their shelves with row after row of secondary and supporting characters, one-offs and design concept figures. Meanwhile, She-Ra fans are still waiting to complete what would be considered a 1st Wave of POP figures. Heck, only now are we seeing Glimmer! And naturally, prices have gone up and will continue to, as we wait. Do folks understand how frustrating that is?

    To say that Razz should be used as "bait" is infuriating. Shadow Weaver - a major villain in the She-Ra show and a long-awaited character - was used as "bait" for this toyline which caters 75% of its efforts to He-Man fans. How fair was that? I started the Shadow Weaver Breadline Thread because so, so many of us weren't going to be able to own this figure unless we pledged hundreds of dollars to support a line that is overwhelmingly He-Man centric. If the percentage was more even and there was more POP/She-Ra stuff in there every year, then maybe I could understand the logic of offering a She-Ra character as an incentive...but as it stands, I can't. I was very proud and genuinely touched by the way so many people here at the Org stepped up to help out She-Ra fans by selling Weavers to them. It shouldn't have had to happen that like that, though, and I don't want to see it happen again with any more She-Ra characters, least of all an A-lister like Razz. To us, she isn't just some random "oh well, I suppose it would be nice to have her" figure. She's a core part of the show and the brand. We shouldn't have to jump through any more hoops to be able to someday buy her as a toy.

    To some of you, She-Ra might be little more than a spin-off of He-Man, a "girly line" and therefore secondary to all things MOTU. But in reality, she had her own show of almost 100 episodes, her own toyline and is remembered fondly by people around the world. Her universe is not some tiny little niche supported by only a few dozen POPers. Hers is a Brand, capital "B". I'm glad to see more and more He-Fans recognizing this and discovering how great her universe is...but clearly we still have a ways to go if suggestions like these keep cropping up.

    If you wouldn't want to have to buy a year's worth of Polly Pocket action figures just to get a Teela or a Man-At-Arms, please don't suggest we should have to buy a year's worth of He-Man stuff (most of which I can't even recognize) just to get a Razz.

    I have nothing against He-Man at all - really - but that is not a fair suggestion.

    ...and now, with the line "winding down" and being "in danger of cancellation!11!1", us She-Ra fans are sitting here off to the side, again wondering whether Angella or Scorpia will ever be made...and if they are, exactly how much it will cost to get them, and how difficult it will be to get them. People have been asking for "Fairness in the Factions" since day one. I don't think the line would have suffered if Hunga the Harpy had been throw in during the second year, or if Sea Hawk appeared a little sooner. But because we're She-Ra fans...well, we get to sit tight, wait and cross our fingers. And if/when Mattel makes one of our figures, well we're expected to pay whatever price is asked and be understanding.

    Let's just try to be a bit more aware of other people's situations, okay? If all I'd wanted was a small selection of core He-Man toys, I would have had my wish granted years ago.

    ...I count myself lucky I'm not some massive New Adventures fan...
    Last edited by DisneyBoy; August 8, 2013 at 07:15pm.

  2. #2
    Heroic Warrior goluphi's Avatar
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    Because She-Ra is lame.
    Hey, if you want to wallow in the negative, go nuts. Sure, things aren’t absolutely perfect, and people passionate about a property can get all keyed up about things. But I don’t collect toys to be miserable. So I’d rather think about the things that do excite me
    http://thefwoosh.com/2014/06/masters...beyond-vintage

  3. #3
    Searchin' My Soul DisneyBoy's Avatar
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    How clever.



  4. #4
    Shivering Isles resident diosoth's Avatar
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    Blame it on POP being at the tail-end of the MOTU line. MOTU ran for years on its own while POP didn't get much time compared to it. The strong dissonance between toys(brushable hair dolls with one "jealous" villain) and cartoon(oppressed people vs space Hitler) probably also left Mattel wondering which direction to really go with its inclusion here prior to getting Filmation rights.

    And Toyguru.

  5. #5
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    MOTUC covers everything related to the He-Man mythos, but He-Man and the Master of the Universe is the more popular line. She-Ra is secondary to many, probably most, people who buy these figures.

    Would She-Ra figures be able to sell well enough to support a line without He-Man and Skeletor? I don't know. I do know that He-Man and Skeletor could sell well without the She-Ra universe.

    That said, I think it's really lame that Shadow Weaver is inaccessible. I feel the same way about Teela, Beast-Man, Fisto, Whiplash, and even Scare Glow. I REALLY wish Matty would do 2.0s or a an All-Star subscription and allow us to buy these $100+ figures for a reasonable price. But it seems they LIKE that some figures are that expensive. It helps sell subs.

    Anyway, ToyGuru has said 2014 will have the most PoP figures of any year yet, so sub up! Your time is now.

  6. #6
    Heroic Warrior MsMarvel fan's Avatar
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    You do know the line is called Masters of the Universe, right?

    And thankfully, someone pushed the line to be inclusive of the giant mythos that makes up Masters of the Universe, and that includes PoP. And I love PoP. And I'm one of those people who think Razz and Broom are perfect sub exclusives to attract people to buy the subscription, so that we can continue to get awesome figures sculpted by the 4 horsemen.

    The March before they announced Shadow Weaver at SDCC, I bought my first MOTUC: Adora. And weeks went by and I started to buy others because the sculpts were awesome, and I've always been a fan of He-man and She-ra, but alone He-man wouldn't do it for me. So I decided I would sub. I was quickly finding it a hassle to be online to order things day of sale. I can sign up, have figures shipped to me and it's like a figure of the month club: I'm in; This is cool. And then they announced Shadow Weaver, and I was bummed because I wanted multiples. But I have one shadow weaver, and she's all I ever wanted in a Shadow Weaver toy, and I subbed to get her, because I was going to sub anyway.

    Ideally, Razz, Broom and the twiggets would be a SDCC exclusive. Otherwise, she's kinda like Plundor. Some people will be happy, some won't care and some will wonder why this filmation character is taking a slot that could be rio blast, or hunga the harpy (who will be more visually cool Razz). And I'm annoyed that December is two filmation figures and neither is PoP and one of them is Plundor. But I'm excited for Glimmer. I can't wait for Casta. I want to swim in a sea of Horde Troopers, but I've had to suffer through Fangman, Clamp Champ, Dekker, FFM and others so that I can have my PoP. There's plenty of people who only want MOTU and no PoP. But you're painting a picture that we're being singled out as PoP fans to suffer for what we want. I know you're not new to these boards: EVERYONE is suffering trying to collect this line.

    if it makes you feel better, tell yourself she screwed up the spell to make her toy, so we got Spector instead. "Dizzle drazzle dizzle dee, make Mighty Spector instead of Me!"

  7. #7
    Heroic Warrior KeldorTheCursed's Avatar
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    I can totally understand your point of view and sympathize. I'm not a huge POP fan (more to not being that familiar with it rather than not liking it, I like what I've seen), but I think it stinks POP fans have had to wait so long to get what they would consider just "the basics."

    Although I'm happy to have pretty much every character I want already, even I can admit that if MOTUC hadn't been so front-loaded, the line would probably be doing a lot better right now.

    Besides that, I think the POP side of the story is stronger in many ways than the He-Man side. Fighting against an oppressive force that is in control of the planet is a more interesting story than good winning against evil all of the time without as much at stake. And I say that as a HUGE He-Man fan. I just got Adora the other day and she's one of my favorites in the entire line.

    I'm not much for the extra "girly" figures (no offense), but put into the MOTUC aesthetic, I think they've all come out looking pretty awesome, Star Sisters aside (they don't fit in as we'll with the rest of the line, IMO). I want more.
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  8. #8
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No-Ah View Post
    Would She-Ra figures be able to sell well enough to support a line without He-Man and Skeletor? I don't know. I do know that He-Man and Skeletor could sell well without the She-Ra universe.
    With some entertainment backing it up, I think a line of POP figures and/or dolls could do quite well. Someone just needs to give the brand a chance. People seem to forget that Classics (and the concept of selling figures to collectors) started off as a Passion Project with no real hard data to determine its potential. MOTU the brand wasn't really in that good of a place when this line was conceived and at least half of the fan base that Mattel was targeting was still hung up on the 200X style figures. If you will recall from Scott's blogs, He-Man, Beast Man and Skeletor didn't do well at first either. The line only took off once we got to Stratos.
    Last edited by Tallstar; August 8, 2013 at 08:13pm.
    "My favorite Harry Potter movie is Troll."

  9. #9
    Heroic Warrior No-Ah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    With some entertainment backing it up, I think a line of POP figures and/or dolls could do quite well. Someone just needs to give the brand a chance. People seem to forgot that Classics (and the concept of selling figures to collectors) started off as a Passion Project with no real hard data to determine its potential. MOTU the brand wasn't really in that good of a place when this line was conceived and at least half of the fan base that Mattel was targeting was still hung up on the 200X style figures. If you will recall from Scott's blogs, He-Man, Beast Man and Skeletor didn't do well at first either. The line only took off once we got to Stratos.
    Absolutely, they could sell with entertainment to back them up. But they don't currently have that, neither does He-Man (except for the comic.) But even without the entertainment, Masters of the Universe have sold well enough to continue the line. I don't know if She-Ra figures could do that on their own, which is why they're in the back seat.

  10. #10
    Always Hungry.... Megalodon's Avatar
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    It's not just She-Ra it seems like alot of the characters that people want are not being able to be had by them because of the ploy by Mattel...I know people are going to defend them (whatever don't want to hear that)

    You could make more money selling figures that people actually want instead of "hooking" them to buy a sub....

  11. #11
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    MOTU is more popular than She-Ra. By a margin so large that it's not even worth measuring. Even if you're the biggest POP fan in the world, I can't see how you'd be so deluded as to not recognize this.

    Companies will focus their product to the majority. Even in a niche market, they will cater to the majority in that niche.

    I don't even get why these questions even need to be asked.

  12. #12
    Heroic Warrior sirsniffy's Avatar
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    I think She-Ra/Pop has always been secondary in priority aa far as Toy Guru and the 4H are concerned. As good as the POP figures have been, they always seemed to be treated very laziily by the 4H...shoddy design choices, QC issues, and in general way less care than the Masters line.

    I think that 4H and Scott, like most Masters fans favor the typical "Monsters N Muscles" mentality. If its not a monster or muscle man, it is pretty much a low priority. The females in general tend to be lowest on that chain...surprised we even got The Sorceress! To speak on the scarcity of basic POP figures, I think so muxh waste in the beginning of the line doomed many of them to be pushed waaaay down in priority. The Star Sisters, Vykron, and did we need Battleground Teela or The Fighting Foe Men? So you see, now Mattel has to play catch up at the end...and since the line may never be finished, we may indeed never see the rest of the POP line.

  13. #13
    Shivering Isles resident diosoth's Avatar
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    These figures are all built on the same buck and 95% of necessary parts have already been made. They have no excuse not to make characters beyond Toyguru not being good at his job. They could release 3 new figures a month now with very minimal tooling. But look how long it took to release Stinkor after his parts were finished.

    For his position on the line I see no love whatsoever for him anywhere. I think everyone wishes the man would go away and someone else would take over. I can not recall seeing anyone saying they like the job he's doing with no complaints.

  14. #14
    Heroic Warrior
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    What do you expect us to do? We don't decide, what figures are coming. Mattel do. So if you have a problem about the character selection, tell them. They make the rules.

    I'm in the "Monsters & Muscles" camp and of course I'm satisfied with the many vintage characters. That's what Masters if the Universe is for me. The boys line from the 80's. So I only support them with my money. And after counting my figures, I think, I've paid a lot more for the vintage characters than POP fans for their She-Ra stuff...

  15. #15
    Slave Girl for MOTUC! Jean's Avatar
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    I could see Madame Razz being used as bait for next year. Just like we're seeing either Tongue Lasher or Sssqueeze this year, I could have seen it either be Scorpia or Madame Razz for this year.
    Proud supporter of the Snake Men.

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  16. #16
    Heroic Warrior Stratos*Major's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berserker79 View Post
    What do you expect us to do? We don't decide, what figures are coming. Mattel do. So if you have a problem about the character selection, tell them. They make the rules.

    I'm in the "Monsters & Muscles" camp and of course I'm satisfied with the many vintage characters. That's what Masters if the Universe is for me. The boys line from the 80's. So I only support them with my money. And after counting my figures, I think, I've paid a lot more for the vintage characters than POP fans for their She-Ra stuff...
    Where did you read that he's asking you to do anything but TRY to understand his point of view?
    He came to the board, which is what this is for, to express his feelings on the inclusion of POP into MOTUC.

    More to the point, as he said TIME was the bigger issue. Not cost.

    So really, as you've counted your figures, you've given the exact example to which he is speaking...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    The line only took off once we got to Stratos.
    What what...cause Stratos ROCKS!!

    End of the day...it's because of STRATOS that we have a line!
    Turn Mermaid Speculation Into Mermaid Support
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  17. #17
    Heroic Warrior Lipster's Avatar
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    I don't get how you would have to pay more. The subs cost the same amount for all of us, shipping might vary but that would happen if you bought anything from anywhere.

    If you haven't figured it out yet almost one third of the sub this year (2014) is going to be POP.
    Lipster Heroic Warrior

  18. #18
    Heroic Warrior wayne-klops's Avatar
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    This argument is really kind of moot at this point. We are facing the last two years of the line, and the POP girls are going to be a part of it. This should be the time you are celebrating that your time has finally come, not being upset that a figure you want might be one more year off. If you want these POP figures to happen, now is your time to sub because proportionally they are going to be a larger part of the sub than they ever have been.

    Also, you do realize that figures like Shadow Weaver, Scorpia, Madame Razz, Sea Hawk, Hunga that Harpy, etc, couldn't have come out before 2012, because Mattel didn't have the rights to these characters before then? So they are just now starting to show up this year, and Scorpia is coming next year, and assuming the line continues, you are guaranteed to get Madame Razz by the end of 2015. How about NA fans such as myself who likely won't get all of their figures made period?

    I love POP and am excited that this next year will be more filled with these characters. I don't see this to be the time to be upset about the past. Plus we don't know, maybe there will be a mini-sub next year dedicated to POP characters? That won't happen, none of it will happen, if this sub doesn't go through. Only possibly Glimmer at a higher price, whom I do agree should have come a long time ago but am ecstatic to finally be getting her. You gotta get the He-Man fans (which I am also a member of) on board to ensure you get the POP figures you want.

    Also, don't forget that this month we get Castaspella, one of the greatest looking female figures in this entire line!

  19. #19
    Heroic Warrior CanadaClassics's Avatar
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    The NA fans would feel that they "pay" more for delays on thier figures...they are the least popular group.

    I think Mattel was also being really careful with POP figures...trying the "POP-like" figures like Adora / Bow / Shadow Weaver before really trying the "Pure-POP" ones like Frosta / Netossa / Castaspella...

    They were afraid of the girl figures not being well recieved and I think they were a little off on that, as they have been well received.
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  20. #20
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    If it weren't for the concepts that were forced down our throats we'd have all of these already.

    People thought of using Razz as a sub lure because she'd one of the strongest characters left to be made. Sub lure doesn't mean sub exclusive, it only means revealed during or before sub rush to help sell the subs.
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  21. #21
    Heroic Subscriber He-Dude's Avatar
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    I sometimes wish there was a She -Ra .Org so we wouldn't have to hear this same old song and dance. Sure the boys watched the old She-Ra show... because 1.) it had the Horde... and 2.) He-Man wasn't on. But when it came to the toys... they were girls toys! Soft goods, brushable hair and pastel colors... for girls! (or... and I risk trouble for going there... for gay boys. ...and if I can't go there in this day and age, it is a shame. ( the new versions are far less girly I will admit.... but the stigma to the buyer is still there.)) I've heard the pop fans clamor for figures, then complain when they do get them for one reason or another... I see threads where fans of one particular MOTU figure show their appreciation for a figure that they like a lot. I can't say I've seen many positive words from a pop fan.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lipster View Post
    I don't get how you would have to pay more. The subs cost the same amount for all of us, shipping might vary but that would happen if you bought anything from anywhere.

    If you haven't figured it out yet almost one third of the sub this year (2014) is going to be POP.
    You didn't read it... and you have no idea that a third of 2014 will be pop.
    Last edited by He-Dude; August 8, 2013 at 09:53pm.

  22. #22
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    It's hysterical to me that the vintage only crowd thinks Rio Blast and Ninjor are gonna sell subs at this point, over the likes of Mermista, Angella, and Razz. LOL
    Must Haves before MOTUC is complete! QUEEN ANGELLA! Mermista, Peekablue, Perfuma, Imp, Admiral Scurvy, General Sunder, Colonel Blast, Vultak, Clawdeen, Stridor, Nightstalker, Cat version of Catra METEORBS Gwildor, Saurod, Point Dread with Talon Fighter! Sagitar

  23. #23
    Heroic Warrior MrRoboto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    If it weren't for the concepts that were forced down our throats we'd have all of these already.

    People thought of using Razz as a sub lure because she'd one of the strongest characters left to be made. Sub lure doesn't mean sub exclusive, it only means revealed during or before sub rush to help sell the subs.
    I was thinking this too. I saw the comment that the OP was referring to in another thread and I interpreted it as meaning a sub lure for the whole of 2015 (if indeed she is coming then and not next year) rather than being the actual sub-exclusive.
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  24. #24
    Heroic Warrior Dayvid's Avatar
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    I grew up with both. I do have a soft spot for the She-Ra characters. Some of them became my overall favorites! (Huntara, Scorpia - To name a few!) And yes, i do feel it's a shame that we will most likely never get to see the likes of Sweet Bee or Perfuma etc in MOTUC. A shame... but not a big deal for me. Those characters, to me, didn't stand out much.

    It's
    Angella, Huntara, Entrapta and Mermista that seem to me, should be created in the next 1-2 years. Especially Angella! Come on....

    Sweet-Bee, Peekablue, Perfuma, Spinerella, Fluterina or even Double Trouble are probably unlikely to all make the cut.

    With Glimmer and Scorpia on their way... i'm excited! I just hope i'm proven wrong and the next 1-2 years are going to be great for those who actually enjoy the PoP figures as well as the MOTU figures.

  25. #25
    Heroic Warrior
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    That second post by Goluphi made me laugh my ass off, sorry pop fans but funnys funny

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