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Thread: Do She-Ra fans have to pay more?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post
    Not a single fashion in any of those lines.
    How could you forget April O'Neil the Ravising Reporter from TMNT:

    http://www.tmnttoys.com/92figures/basics/5281.htm

    - - - Updated - - -

    I think PoP should have had a greater presence in MOTUC prior to 2014.

    While I think there have been some ... errors in judgement along the way, including the release of the Star Sisters before so many more important and fan-demanded PoP characters, there's no reason that PoP couldn't and shouldn't have had a greater presence in MOTUC. In fact, IF PoP had been included on a more regular basis and IF Mattel had released some of the more creature-based designs such as Angella, Sweet-Bee, Mermista and Flutterina, then I think there would have been a wider and greater appreciation for PoP in MOTUC.

    In general, Adora, Bow, She-Ra, Catra, BP She-Ra and Swift-wind all appeared to be widely well received. The issues with the Star Sisters, Frosta and Netossa are well known and with the exception of the Star Sisters were due to Mattel's handling and decisions in respect of those figures. Castaspella looks like she will also be near universally well received.

    The fact that it will have taken until 2014 to complete the core trio of PoP with the release of Glimmer speaks volumes. I can only imagine the outcry if the release of Teela or Man-at-Arms had been delayed until 2014. Not only have there been issues with the production quality of some of the PoP figures, but the character choices have also been confounding given it is now late 2013 and there are still so many A-Listers which haven't even been confirmed for a release, including Queen Angella, Mermista and Madame Razz.

  2. #52
    Heroic Warrior mac&cheesier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goluphi View Post
    Because She-Ra is lame.
    No she-ra is cool! I love both shows motu and she-ra!

  3. #53
    Historian of Eternia LORD FALLEN ELDOR's Avatar
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    "Monsters & Muscles" needs to get TMed quickly!

    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post
    Because every gay male is a flamboyant drag queen who fantasizes about being a woman and dressing like a woman or using pastels ?
    I think they are afraid the glitter is going to rub off on them

    Quote Originally Posted by Bri-Man View Post
    for straight boys without that particular insecurity.
    Why do we even have to defend our heterosexuality? Why in 2013 is this even a thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by diosoth View Post
    Blame it on POP being at the tail-end of the MOTU line. MOTU ran for years on its own while POP didn't get much time compared to it.
    That is not true. MOTU came out in 1982, POP in 1985 both ended in 1987.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaClassics View Post
    The NA fans would feel that they "pay" more for delays on thier figures...they are the least popular group.

    I think Mattel was also being really careful with POP figures...trying the "POP-like" figures like Adora / Bow / Shadow Weaver before really trying the "Pure-POP" ones like Frosta / Netossa / Castaspella...

    They were afraid of the girl figures not being well recieved and I think they were a little off on that, as they have been well received.
    I'd argue against your definitions of "pop like" and "pure pop", but I take your meaning and mostly agree. Early on this would certainly be the case, but all these years later it should not be! It's a clear bias from Mattel and ignoring of what the market wants. The list that bcrduke posted is ludicrously small. I'd bet the concept and original stuff is larger list. If 2013 is it Mattel and She-haters are gonna blame PoP like they always do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clawful Ofit View Post
    I didn't jump in as I knew where we'd end up, but I wanted to prove your point about not posting. It does become physically exhausting just reading it, being in the thick of it is worse. Recently I just avoided the entire topic, sent a PM to state my thoughts and didn't have to hear it(I fully understand not liking something, I don't understand not letting others enjoy it in peace). Made my opinion known, the member replyed & both our days were easier as he appreciated it & I didn't have to defend my stance. I rarely post opinions about POP, just mostly wish lists & little stuff. I mean Glimmer is my number 1 most wanted from POP, I love her. SHE made SDCC for me. I NEEDED her. I bet I have 4-6 posts in her thread. So to my fellow She-Ravers your numbers are larger than they appear, some of us are just tired of sounding off. NA too.

    For the record I'm a straight, die hard She-Ra fan, who is totally cool with girls being girly, or guys liking girly girls& I love 95% of the MOTUverse, She-Ra ranks pretty damn high in my book, but I hardly ever say it... and that is a shame that the people who like something are silent because its just simpler to be that way. I don't expect fair treatment in a toyline, but in life, as a human, it sure as **** would be nice. She-Ra FTW.
    it's faster to type this sentence then google an image of joker clapping slowly!
    Last edited by LORD FALLEN ELDOR; August 9, 2013 at 04:23am.
    http://kotaku.com/why-fanboys-act-like-jerks-1563379006

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  4. #54
    Heroic Subscriber He-Dude's Avatar
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    Well... I for one am glad they did it the way they did. I mean who better than those that make these toys is there to decide? Bravo Mattel and Scott and the 4-H... Thank you for bringing such an awesome toy line this far along. Despite all the "mistakes" you apparently make.

  5. #55
    Supreme Fudge Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    I personally hope that we get Maddam Razz and Broom in 2014. They are rather high on my want list, and I don't want to wait until 2015 to get them.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    It's hysterical to me that the vintage only crowd thinks Rio Blast and Ninjor are gonna sell subs at this point, over the likes of Mermista, Angella, and Razz. LOL
    I actually find this funny as well. Most of what is left of vintage MOTU are the figures that came at the tail end of the line when interest was waning, it was dying off, and most of them didn't get the chance to even appear in any kind of media outside of maybe the mini comic included with the figure. And while these characters have their respective fans, the idea that Rio Blast, Ninjor, Extendar, etc. are "major lures" is a farce to me. Don't even get me started on Rotar and Twistoid.

    I actually found ToyGuru's recent video about the 2014 subs to be funny when he used the term "A-List" characters and started referencing some of those characters and other akin to them. Just because something was simply in the vintage MOTU line does not mean that it is by default "A-list" or "most wanted." That would be like saying any and all Filmation characters are by default "A-list" or "extremely wanted," including some random background villager. Honestly I think it's more important to get the main POP characters out rather than the characters from late in the vintage MOTU line that many fans didn't even have or want back then.

    Everyone's opinions will vary. Heck, even my feelings on POP are mixed. I am a fan of the Filmation toon (particularly the SOTS movie), so I'm glad that the figures have largely leaned in favor of the cartoon look rather than the toy looks (though it's fine adding in toy details like they did for BP She-Ra). I also do think the POP characters that are going to be the toughest sell going forward (and admitedly the ones that I have less interest in than others) will be those that seem to have 'girly' names/themes like "Perfuma."

    But core characters like Glimmer and Angela, and even core POP Filmation characters like Scorpia and Maddam Razz (in addition to ones that we've already gotten like Adora, She-Ra, Bow, Frosta, and Catra) are all character desired by many and absolutely should be in this line. As a kid I did have a small handful of the POP figures. I was never really a fan of that line in-and-of itself.... I just begrudingly had those versions to use with my MOTU figures for lack of any alternate toy representation of the characters. Having a line that not only makes the characters from both in a consistent figure form, but also uses the more familiar cartoon designs for those main characters is a dream come true for me! And for the record, I am straight and married (not that it matters, but just clarifying).

    I mean really, after Two-Bad and Modulock, and maybe the remaining Snake Men (and even they are pushing it), most of the remaining figures really fall into a category of obscurity given that they were towards the end of the line, had almost no media representation except for the movie characters, and honestly being that the people behind the scenes making the line changed so much, it seems the direction of the line changed as well. The combination of the designs themselves and the move to have less reuse of parts (which one would think would be a good thing) actually resulted in a lot of figures that felt like they just belonged in another toyline altogether, possibly several different toylines. Even Ninjor who did reuse parts still feels WAY too out of place given the end result of his look. I actually am looking forward to Gwildor if we get him, but aside from him, Two-Bad, Modulock, and maybe the remaining Snakemen, I can't think of any other vintage character offhand that I "really" want or would be upset over if they didn't get made before the line ends.

    But I do want the core POP characters from the toon and toyline (but still in favor of the 'toon designs when there is a difference beyond just details).

    To be honest though, I don't know how necessary including NA in the line is. In polls with large volumes of voting, it often ranks way down on the overall importance of being included in the line. Some of the NA figures have turned out to be cool looking, but honestly aside from NA versions of He-Man and Skeletor, even the "top-tier" NA characters are pretty much on about the same overall scale as the aforementioned late-line vintage MOTU figures.

    That's just the way I see it anyway.
    Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; August 10, 2013 at 12:23am.
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  6. #56
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    Honestly, if I had one wish for this line, it would be that people wouldn't see factions anymore, but see one huge awesome line that could give Star Wars a run for its money if the fan base weren't so divided. I prefer to go with the 'more the merrier' mentality.
    I'd barely heard of Goat Man before SDCC, and he's one of the reveals I'm looking forward to most. I didn't like NA until we got Flipshot, and I fell in love with the faction. The MOTU cartoon was dying for me until it was reinvigorated by She-Ra. Not because it was girly, which the cartoon wasn't particularly girly at all, but because it was a fun story that gave life back into a franchise that was no longer doing it for me.
    What's cool about MOTU vintage, is that they have these lame gimmicks and powers and do awesome things with them, Clamp Champ, Fisto, Stinkor, come on! That's awesome, but equally awesome is Frosta's power over cold, or finally having a mermaid in the line with Mermista. Perfuma going head to head with Evilseed, or Angella teaching Sorceress how to use magic without passing out every five minutes! LOL
    I can see why some people are put off by characters they don't know, THAT I get. But get to know the characters, see if you like them.

    I didn't see the 200x series until a few months ago, LOL, yet I've been collecting the line in total for five years...
    Examples of characters that I didn't know who they were, and instead of voting against them, got to know them and actually like them...
    Goat Man
    Garn (Filmation)
    Admiral Scurvy
    Shokoti
    Masque
    Granamyr
    Lord Dactys
    Evil Seed
    Marzo
    Veena
    Parvus (sp?)
    Faceless One
    There's plenty more...
    Must Haves before MOTUC is complete! QUEEN ANGELLA! Mermista, Peekablue, Perfuma, Imp, Admiral Scurvy, General Sunder, Colonel Blast, Vultak, Clawdeen, Stridor, Nightstalker, Cat version of Catra METEORBS Gwildor, Saurod, Point Dread with Talon Fighter! Sagitar

  7. #57
    Plundor Promoter He-Dad's Avatar
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    I'd say NA fans actually pay the most but there are only like 5 of them..lol. Actually if you are a PoP only fan and a subber you make out like a bandit since resale on all the vintage will pay for them AND your PoP figures..so I say no. And if you're keeping the others anyway than definately not since subbing saves you money.....unless you only collect figures that sell below cost.....which isn't many....or the big lots ones....also not many....

  8. #58
    Heroic Master of Sleep Lay Ze-Man's Avatar
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    While the enthusiasm is admirable, a lot of thoughts in this thread are built on a faulty premise.

    Ultimately, there is a disconnect between ACTION FIGURE characters and CARTOON characters that you have to understand.

    He-Man, Skeletor, Beast Man... all action figure characters who happened to show up in a cartoon.

    All the PoP and Filmation characters... cartoon characters who happened to show up in an action figure line.

    As diehard, all-encompassing, everything MotU and PoP fans, people want to lump them all in the same category and weigh their significance equally. (Except of course when decrying NA, 200x, concept, or latter-wave vintage as unworthy inclusions above favored PoP/Filmation characters...)

    But action figure collectors don't see it that way. They won't see Madame Razz and be happy that an "important to the mythos" character is made. They'll say "Sorry, no interest on a cartoony witch" and move on.

    If you're predominantly a fan of the cartoons, it's easy to tick off all the "important" characters and be mad when they don't show up, but this isn't like a movie franchise where the main characters are cut and dry and it's the dominant (or sole) source of exposure for people. This is an action figure line based on multiple sources where one of the most popular characters can be Scare Glow, a guy who never showed up in anything aside from a few panels in a mini comic 25 years ago.

  9. #59
    Supreme Fudge Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lay Ze-Man View Post
    While the enthusiasm is admirable, a lot of thoughts in this thread are built on a faulty premise.

    Ultimately, there is a disconnect between ACTION FIGURE characters and CARTOON characters that you have to understand.

    He-Man, Skeletor, Beast Man... all action figure characters who happened to show up in a cartoon.

    All the PoP and Filmation characters... cartoon characters who happened to show up in an action figure line.

    As diehard, all-encompassing, everything MotU and PoP fans, people want to lump them all in the same category and weigh their significance equally. (Except of course when decrying NA, 200x, concept, or latter-wave vintage as unworthy inclusions above favored PoP/Filmation characters...)

    But action figure collectors don't see it that way. They won't see Madame Razz and be happy that an "important to the mythos" character is made. They'll say "Sorry, no interest on a cartoony witch" and move on.

    If you're predominantly a fan of the cartoons, it's easy to tick off all the "important" characters and be mad when they don't show up, but this isn't like a movie franchise where the main characters are cut and dry and it's the dominant (or sole) source of exposure for people. This is an action figure line based on multiple sources where one of the most popular characters can be Scare Glow, a guy who never showed up in anything aside from a few panels in a mini comic 25 years ago.
    While I see your point, I think you are trivializing the cartoons a bit too much. Even though He-Man, Skeletor, and Beastman were conceived as action figures first and then a little while later were put in a cartoon, it was the 'toon that accelerated their popularity.

    And having something like the theatrical release of SOTS helping bridge MOTU into the POP, cartoon as well as the further crossovers with He-Man on POP, it helped cement the idea of He-Man and She-Ra together and bridged fans of one over to the other. I know that there are some fans that never cared for Filmation at all, let alone any incarnation of POP, preferring the likes of the mini comics (particularly the early ones). But still, Maddam Razz was a main character of a cartoon series that aired every weekday afternoon, exposing kids everywhere to this character regularly, regardless of whether or not they even had any of the toys. By contrast, a character from late in the vintage MOTU line who only appeared in a few panels of a mini comic that you would only get by buying that particular figure doesn't have the same level of recognizability.
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  10. #60
    Heroic Warrior retcon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post
    Those people may have a point in not replying.
    No, maybe some of us just have other things to do than continually check message boards.

    I will say again that I would rather the line have been completely vintage. Yes, sure we may burned through them all and the line would be over - but at least I'd have got all the figures I wanted by now rather than sweating out on important figures like Two Bad, Mantenna and the Snake Men. The fact I may get an extra from Fantasia over a snake man really burns me up.

  11. #61
    Heroic Warrior Slave2Evil_Lyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Dude View Post
    I sometimes wish there was a She -Ra .Org so we wouldn't have to hear this same old song and dance. Sure the boys watched the old She-Ra show... because 1.) it had the Horde... and 2.) He-Man wasn't on. But when it came to the toys... they were girls toys! Soft goods, brushable hair and pastel colors... for girls! (or... and I risk trouble for going there... for gay boys. ...and if I can't go there in this day and age, it is a shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post
    Because every gay male is a flamboyant drag queen who fantasizes about being a woman and dressing like a woman or using pastels ?

    I liked pop. I did NOT like Jem or Barbie or even Golden Girl. How do you explain that? I'm serious. Explain why I didn't like those other toy lines, and why I did, along with pop, like MOTU, Star Wars, GI JOE, Transformers, Captain Power, TMNT, etc.

    Not a single fashion in any of those lines.

    It's a good thing that, unlike the rest of the animal kingdom, and unlike during the Renaissance, males are the plainer of the sexes. I don't know that most people here who apparently STILL have a problem with pop figures from 30 years ago being too "girly" (our brand manager included) could deal with that reality. LoL!!
    Very wells said Brian, and I totally agree.

    I'm also gay, and while I love the POP characters it has nothing to do with the vintage toys. I like the characters themselves based on the Filmation cartoon I watch as a kid. In fact I flat out hated the vintage figures as a kid because they didn't match the cartoon and were so different in style compared to Teela, Evil-Lyn, and The Sorceress. Not all POP fans are fans because of the vintage rooted hair, soft good wearing figures.

    I had no POP figures as a child, none. I played with G.I. Joe, MOTU, Star Wars, Transfomers, Super Friends, Go Bots, M.A.S.K., TMNT, etc. Yes I will admit I my favorite characters were Scarlett, Baroness, Teela, Evil-Lyn, Princess Leia, Acres, Wonder Woman, Crasher (and Scooter), Manta with Vanessa, April O'Neil, etc. But it had noting to do with them brushing their hair or wearing pretty clothes, it was because they were strong independent character who could hold their own (except maybe April) with the other characters.

    It's not hard to look past the rooted hair and fabulous fashions of the 80's and see the characters for what they are. She-ra is everything He-Man is plus more, she has the ability to heal and commune with animals, two things He-Man could not do. Queen Angella was a ruler who fought along side her people to see that they didn't fall under the heel of the Horde empire.



    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post
    You're wrong.

    Without the people buying for ALL the factions, you'd have NO figures.
    In other words, if it had been made clear from the get-go that no She-Ra characters would be included, hardly any of the pop fans would have bought ANY figures. Why? Because they'd have been angry.

    And I'm sorry, but most of the pop fans but multiple subs. Many people who complain about pop (and NA) haven't even subscribed ONCE. yet they continue to complain, while the pop fans they disrespect subsidize the line.
    It was the promise of getting characters from POP and hopefully Filmation that got me into MOTUC in the first place. Had the line not included POP who I'd been wanting Filmation based figures since 1985 I would have only bought Teela and Evil-Lyn and called it day. After the vintage and 200x lines I didn't need more figures of the same old characters again, besides my 2 favorite characters.

    Quote Originally Posted by retcon View Post
    No, maybe some of us just have other things to do than continually check message boards.

    I will say again that I would rather the line have been completely vintage. Yes, sure we may burned through them all and the line would be over - but at least I'd have got all the figures I wanted by now rather than sweating out on important figures like Two Bad, Mantenna and the Snake Men. The fact I may get an extra from Fantasia over a snake man really burns me up.
    That's a very selfish view of the things. I also find it funny that you're such a vintage fan yet your avatar is of Spector, a fan created character that is less vintage than Perfuma and Loo-Kee. A character who's arguable caused more strife and backlash than any of the POP figures, even the Star Sister.



    It comes down to this, either we pull together as a fandom or the line ends.

    I'm not excited about Modulok, Hydron, Goat Man, or possible figures like Dragstor, Blast Attack, or Rotar but I'm willing to support the line and give these figures chance. There have been several figures I did not like or want but once I got them in hand that changed. Life is to short to only look on the negative side of things, especially if that thing is toy collecting.
    Last edited by Slave2Evil_Lyn; August 10, 2013 at 12:37am.
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  12. #62
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lay Ze-Man View Post
    While the enthusiasm is admirable, a lot of thoughts in this thread are built on a faulty premise.

    Ultimately, there is a disconnect between ACTION FIGURE characters and CARTOON characters that you have to understand.

    He-Man, Skeletor, Beast Man... all action figure characters who happened to show up in a cartoon.

    All the PoP and Filmation characters... cartoon characters who happened to show up in an action figure line.

    As diehard, all-encompassing, everything MotU and PoP fans, people want to lump them all in the same category and weigh their significance equally. (Except of course when decrying NA, 200x, concept, or latter-wave vintage as unworthy inclusions above favored PoP/Filmation characters...)

    But action figure collectors don't see it that way. They won't see Madame Razz and be happy that an "important to the mythos" character is made. They'll say "Sorry, no interest on a cartoony witch" and move on.

    If you're predominantly a fan of the cartoons, it's easy to tick off all the "important" characters and be mad when they don't show up, but this isn't like a movie franchise where the main characters are cut and dry and it's the dominant (or sole) source of exposure for people. This is an action figure line based on multiple sources where one of the most popular characters can be Scare Glow, a guy who never showed up in anything aside from a few panels in a mini comic 25 years ago.
    I'm an action figure collector that's been around the block, collecting MOTU, Thundercats, Super Powers, GI Joe, Transformers, Go Bots, Voltron, Mego pocket heroes, Secret Wars, Remco Universal Movie Monster figures, Star Wars, and more. I think I can differentiate. But it's also been over twenty years and the mythos has evolved and become more cohesive. While I can't fault someone for liking Scareglow who has never appeared in the cartoon, you also shouldn't fault someone for liking characters that did appear in the cartoons.

    And for the record, He-Man, Skeletor, and Beast man didn't happen to show up in the cartoon. LOL They were the cartoon! You make them sound like guest stars.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by retcon View Post
    No, maybe some of us just have other things to do than continually check message boards.

    I will say again that I would rather the line have been completely vintage. Yes, sure we may burned through them all and the line would be over - but at least I'd have got all the figures I wanted by now rather than sweating out on important figures like Two Bad, Mantenna and the Snake Men. The fact I may get an extra from Fantasia over a snake man really burns me up.
    Because the line is all about you. LOL If anyone understands about wanting to complete factions, believe me, it's me. It's not like I haven't suffered through Dragon Blaster/Thunderpunch gimmick junk. With all of the lines I collect, there are always some figures I just don't care for, heck there are some horrible figures of great characters, which is sometimes worse, but get them or not, I don't begrudge them being made, not if it's someone else's favorite. At least we're all on the same page with the concept and 30th anniversary stuff, that I can see, but to say a whole faction shouldn't be made because you yourself, or a fraction of the market only want vintage made and screw everyone else, is just rude.
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  13. #63
    Heroic Warrior Slave2Evil_Lyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lay Ze-Man View Post
    While the enthusiasm is admirable, a lot of thoughts in this thread are built on a faulty premise.

    Ultimately, there is a disconnect between ACTION FIGURE characters and CARTOON characters that you have to understand.

    He-Man, Skeletor, Beast Man... all action figure characters who happened to show up in a cartoon.

    All the PoP and Filmation characters... cartoon characters who happened to show up in an action figure line.

    As diehard, all-encompassing, everything MotU and PoP fans, people want to lump them all in the same category and weigh their significance equally. (Except of course when decrying NA, 200x, concept, or latter-wave vintage as unworthy inclusions above favored PoP/Filmation characters...)

    But action figure collectors don't see it that way. They won't see Madame Razz and be happy that an "important to the mythos" character is made. They'll say "Sorry, no interest on a cartoony witch" and move on.

    If you're predominantly a fan of the cartoons, it's easy to tick off all the "important" characters and be mad when they don't show up, but this isn't like a movie franchise where the main characters are cut and dry and it's the dominant (or sole) source of exposure for people. This is an action figure line based on multiple sources where one of the most popular characters can be Scare Glow, a guy who never showed up in anything aside from a few panels in a mini comic 25 years ago.
    You can hate on Filmation all you want, but had that cartoon not existed you would never have gotten your Scar Glow figure.


    By your criteria "action figure collectors" should not be interested in Star Wars or Batman because they came from other media and didn't start our as an action figure.
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  14. #64
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post
    I'd also like to make this point:

    For every post that says pop is bad, there are two or more to counter that position.

    Also, the org main-page polls this past year provide evidence that pop and filmation are the main interests of the majority at this point in the line.

    Those are FACTS, not my opinion.

    I would argue that many people who love ALL things motu (vintage motu, pop, NA, 200X, Filmation, etc.) are just tired of explaining their perspective to those here who must, repeatedly, declare their disdain for anything but the original 12 back lol.
    This! But unlike them, instead of wishing they don't get their figures and I get mine, I wish we'd all get what we wanted. I wouldn't put their needs behind my own. I'm not saying Angella deserves to be made in place of Tung Lashor, just in addition to. I'd be fighting just as hard for Tung Lashor if the roles were reversed. What's offensive is that they're wishing half of my collection into limbo, LOL.
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  15. #65
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    With me, every vintage figure is preferred simply for being in the vintage line, even that late series like Rio Blast, Extendar, Ninjor, etc. The vintage toys were my favorites, not the cartoons but the actual toys. I've waited 30 years for articulated, proportional, updated versions of these and I want the vintage line complete. I never had a Roton as a kid (still don't in my adult MOC collection) but I really want the MOTUC version because, he was in the vintage toy line, and that's all it takes for me. I have liked many of the additions from validated source material like DemoMan, Vikor, GyGor and He-Ro and also love the FILMation sub. However, PoP and NA do nothing for me so I sell those off, sometimes breaking even, sometimes losing money. Vintage MOTU has to carry the other lines in this all-Eras model, just the way it is.

    If the early 2014 reveals had been Two Bad, Modulok, Rio Blast, Extendar, and Ninjor, then I would have bought 3 subs instead of 1.

    That said, I have subbed since day one to support the entire line and all the other MOTU fans who enjoy PoP or NA like I enjoy vintage. I do wish the lines had separate subs (and I believe more of them would survive than people think) but that isn't the world we live in. Mattel decided to bind all the eras together so we need to all keep rowing together or the boat will sink!

    I hope PoP fans get their own sub next year, they deserve it!
    Angella - Blast Attak - Buzzsaw Hordak - Dragstor - ELDOR! - ENTRAPTA! - FLUTTERINA! - Flying Fists He-Man - GWILDOR!
    Lazer Light He-Man - Lazer Light Skeletor - MERMISTA! - MultiBot - NINJOR! - Peekablue - Perfuma - RIO BLAST! - Rotar
    Saurod - SPINNERELLA! - Sssqueeze - SWEET BEE! - Terror Claws Skeletor - TUNG LASHOR! - Twistoid

  16. #66
    Heroic Warrior retcon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slave2Evil_Lyn View Post
    That's a very selfish view of the things. I also find it funny that you're such a vintage fan yet your avatar is of Spector, a fan created character that is less vintage than Perfuma and Loo-Kee. A character who's arguable caused more strife and backlash than any of the POP figures, even the Star Sister.
    My Avatar is Deadpool - an obvious "inspiration" for Toy"Guru"s (heh) original character - but I can see where the confusion lies.

    And yeah - It is selfish - so what? I am not collecting these to help anyone else out.

  17. #67
    Sorcerer of Zalesia bcrduke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retcon View Post
    No, maybe some of us just have other things to do than continually check message boards.
    You're posting on a motu fan board. It's probably a silly idea to mock others who spend time reading and posting here.

    That kind of talk has never gone down well here, and it makes little sense to lob insults like that at fellow nerds.

    And you actually missed the point of my comment.

    I wasn't talking about you. You make your point of you clear often enough.

    I was talking about people who have grown tired of interacting with members like you, who seem to shut down if someone disagrees, and who makes it loud and clear, often enough, that unless you dislike pop or NA, you might just deserve an insult every now and then.

    That's not fun. I know for a fact that many pop fans, for example, no longer bother engaging with comments like yours because they're tired of it.
    Last edited by bcrduke; August 10, 2013 at 01:37am.
    A Want List of Sorts: Eldor, Sweet Bee, Arrow, Spinnerella, NA She-Ra, Mermista, Gwildor, Hover-Bots, Tung Lasher, Angella, Ninjor, Huntara, Oo-Larr, Lizard Man, Sssqueeze, Peekablue... and all the other POP & NA characters.
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  18. #68
    Heroic Warrior jzachery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bcrduke View Post

    I know for a fact that many pop fans, for example, no longer bother engaging with comments like yours because they're tired of it.
    Brian and I know a lot of the same people on multiple message boards dedicated to MOTUC, and I can attest to this statement.
    Must Haves before MOTUC is complete! QUEEN ANGELLA! Mermista, Peekablue, Perfuma, Imp, Admiral Scurvy, General Sunder, Colonel Blast, Vultak, Clawdeen, Stridor, Nightstalker, Cat version of Catra METEORBS Gwildor, Saurod, Point Dread with Talon Fighter! Sagitar

  19. #69
    Plundor Promoter He-Dad's Avatar
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    I still hope we get Razz and Mermista next year. PoP has a place in the main line and IS vintage...lets face it....they fought the Horde a hellova lot more than He-Man did. They fit in pretty well as well. I don't get all the hate honestly....while I will sell offf Perfuma and Peekablue...I'd never wish them not be made. I do think the next mini sub should be PoP though. I don't see another way to get all the vintage figures out to the she-ravers and I think a lot of He-man vintage purists would appreciate it.

  20. #70
    Heroic Warrior SpiritOfTeela's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Dude View Post
    ( the new versions are far less girly I will admit.... but the stigma to the buyer is still there.)
    A "stigma" in their heads.

    Who cares what the vintage characters look like. These new figures are hot babes.

    It's 2013 - and while not everyone has to like everything, I would think that the "boys" who are grown now and presumably if they feel a "stigma" about "girls" toys they like ladies, and these are mighty pretty ladies. I would think guys like that would actually like some females in the line so they aren't looking at overly muscled, nearly-nude men in loincloths exclusively on their shelves.

    Quote Originally Posted by He-Dude View Post
    I've heard the pop fans clamor for figures, then complain when they do get them for one reason or another... I see threads where fans of one particular MOTU figure show their appreciation for a figure that they like a lot. I can't say I've seen many positive words from a pop fan.
    I see that in all the factions, to be honest.

    With PoP, I think you find some fans get disappointed when up until now we got so few figures, and when we did they were usually given the short end of the stick. Less accessories, poor color design, etc. Personally, I've liked them all - but it will irk me until the end of time that Frosta was frickin' grey, LOL. But even that, I can overlook just to have her. Most of us are just grateful to have them - and kind of tired of the hard knocks people give PoP when I can tell you I own every MOTUC item, am a subscriber, and if it weren't for PoP I wouldn't have bought anything. We financed all the figures that have come out so far, and I for one am going to enjoy the increase in output of PoP because frankly we deserve it.


    Quote Originally Posted by He-Dude View Post
    and you have no idea that a third of 2014 will be pop.
    Well, yeah, we kinda do.

    Scott has been very careful in his explanation, "Vintage MOTU and PoP will be completed" if we get 2014-2015. Mathematically, that has to be at least a third, because you are talking over a dozen slots (because, in addition to the 10 unreleased PoP, we also know Scorpia is likely coming, and Madame Razz is a shoo-in).

    So 17 SKU in 2013 and 2014 (presuming it stays the same) is 34 slots. 12 out of that is (someone double check my math) somewhere around 35% of those slots are PoP.

    Of course, some here and there could be non-sub items, but the more specific Scott is, it seems the subs themselves contain these figures.

    So yeah, 1/3 is a pretty good estimate.

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by retcon View Post
    No, maybe some of us just have other things to do than continually check message boards.

    I will say again that I would rather the line have been completely vintage. Yes, sure we may burned through them all and the line would be over - but at least I'd have got all the figures I wanted by now rather than sweating out on important figures like Two Bad, Mantenna and the Snake Men. The fact I may get an extra from Fantasia over a snake man really burns me up.
    I have around 30 of my favorite vintage characters and I'm fine when it comes to an end. Tung Lashor & Sssqueeze would be the last figures to complete my Snakemen faction, but the Heroics are completed and the Evil Warriors and Horde will be completed for me with Two Bad & Modulok next year. With Jitsu , Snake Face, Geldor, Mantenna and the Troopers I have a very relaxed and cheap 2013. I have to say that the concept of Classics didn't changed my view on Masters of the Universe, it's still the 80's vintage stuff I love the most.

  22. #72
    Shera's secret heartthrob oulala's Avatar
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    I concur reg. POP fans not bothering anymore to argue with anti-POP people.

    I've been on HE-MAN.ORG since the 200X revival. I've seen a myriad threads with the same basic discussion and I personally engaged in countless arguments with people over the years - from debunking the myth that the Horde was really invented for the He-man cartoon to arguying that She-ra is indeed far more recognized by the regular masses than Teela or any other female character of the MOTU mythos -

    Yet, despite giving evidence for each argument, the same tired stereotypes always come back. So I'm done arguying here with people that consistently seem to rally for this all-inclusive toyline to drop the factions and be a vintage-only toyline.

    Instead, I'm part of a couple FACEBOOK groups where I don't have to deal with that attitude and those same stereotypes about girly toys and gay men, I still love the .org though, and to make sure coming here remains an enjoyable experience, I've BLOCKED a lot of you that are currently posting on this very thread so I don't have to read your posts anymore. Not because I disrespect your arguments - you may dislike She-ra as much as you want - but because I'm way past caring about what you may think or say on that topic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emiliano View Post
    The harsh reality is that the Horde were originally intended for POP, and they have always been intended for POP. Filmation developed the characters for the POP cartoon. It's a fact.

  23. #73
    Heroic Master of Sleep Lay Ze-Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    While I see your point, I think you are trivializing the cartoons a bit too much. Even though He-Man, Skeletor, and Beastman were conceived as action figures first and then a little while later were put in a cartoon, it was the 'toon that accelerated their popularity.
    I'm not personally trying to trivialize the cartoons, but it seems like diehard fans refuse to accept that there are a LOT out there who do find them trivial, which is what IMO leads to most of this hand-wringing and feeling like the cartoon characters have gotten the short end the stick unfairly.

    And having something like the theatrical release of SOTS helping bridge MOTU into the POP, cartoon as well as the further crossovers with He-Man on POP, it helped cement the idea of He-Man and She-Ra together and bridged fans of one over to the other. I know that there are some fans that never cared for Filmation at all, let alone any incarnation of POP, preferring the likes of the mini comics (particularly the early ones). But still, Maddam Razz was a main character of a cartoon series that aired every weekday afternoon, exposing kids everywhere to this character regularly, regardless of whether or not they even had any of the toys. By contrast, a character from late in the vintage MOTU line who only appeared in a few panels of a mini comic that you would only get by buying that particular figure doesn't have the same level of recognizability.
    But it's clear that "recognizability" is not the be all factor here. Madame Razz indeed has had much more exposure than Scare Glow, but that's irrelevant in an action figure line where action figure collectors by and large find a Madame Razz figure uninteresting.

    I just don't think people can separate themselves from their fandom very well, and accept that "major characters" in certain canons can have little to no bearing on popularity or ability to translate into actual sales. I'm one of Gwildor's biggest fans, and yet I acknowledge he's not a character most action figure collectors would be interested in, because he's a short, odd-looking troll-like guy who isn't a warrior and was in a movie that by and large is considered terrible by the general public.

    So just because I personally have been requesting a Gwildor update since the 200x line doesn't mean I have any delusions that he'd be a popular seller, even if he was a "major character" in the movie. And by the same token a "major character" from Filmation doesn't translate to high sales either, otherwise we wouldn't be struggling with Glimmer, Scorpia, Angella, Madame Razz and other such major characters promised to be on the way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slave2Evil_Lyn View Post
    It's not hard to look past the rooted hair and fabulous fashions of the 80's and see the characters for what they are.
    But it is, in fact, exceedingly hard for action figure collectors with no prior knowledge of the character to look past those features.


    Quote Originally Posted by jzachery View Post
    But it's also been over twenty years and the mythos has evolved and become more cohesive. While I can't fault someone for liking Scareglow who has never appeared in the cartoon, you also shouldn't fault someone for liking characters that did appear in the cartoons.
    How has the mythos evolved to become more cohesive. Surely you don't mean the MOTUC bios?

    And nowhere am I faulting anyone for liking any character in particular. I fault them for assuming they should have equally widespread acceptance and popularity.

    And for the record, He-Man, Skeletor, and Beast man didn't happen to show up in the cartoon. LOL They were the cartoon! You make them sound like guest stars.
    The fact is these characters were created with no plans whatsoever of ever being part of a kid's cartoon show.

    The Filmation-created characters and PoP characters are the exact opposite, which is part of the explanation for why they don't work as well as action figures in the minds of some collectors.


    Quote Originally Posted by Slave2Evil_Lyn View Post
    You can hate on Filmation all you want, but had that cartoon not existed you would never have gotten your Scar Glow figure.
    Nowhere in my post am I hating on anything, but that's an impossible argument to make anyway.

    We have no way of knowing what would or wouldn't have happened without the Filmation show, as the toy line itself was already a top seller on its own.

    I could just as easily make a hypothetical argument that instead of Filmation, what if a live action movie had been made that was more faithful to the original vision of MotU (a la the first TMNT movie), had been a huge worldwide hit, and allowed the vintage line to keep going longer than it did. We could do hypotheticals all day long, but they serve little purpose.

    By your criteria "action figure collectors" should not be interested in Star Wars or Batman because they came from other media and didn't start our as an action figure.
    That's not my strict criteria that applies to anything ever made into an action figure. It's an explanation for why, under the MotU umbrella, not every character design is created equal and translates into a desired action figure.

    But it's also not a coincidence that some of the most popular action figure characters are those that did start life as an action figure: Snake Eyes, Optimus Prime, etc.

    If we were talking about something that was and is mega-popular I wouldn't have an argument, but MotU at its best is still niche, and PoP is then a niche within that niche.

  24. #74
    Eternian Arashikage King Kahn's Avatar
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    To respond to the original post. I am a fan of NA... sorry if I don't share your sympathy of getting the short end of the stick. NA fans would KILL for any end of the stick lol lol.
    I want NA Skeletor and Rio Blast and I want them now!

  25. #75
    Heroic Warrior MsMarvel fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space-Man View Post
    PoP is awesome. I grew up with the He-Man cartoon and MOTU toys. I watched the She-Ra cartoon too, but I wasn't into the toys. It's come up itt more than once, so I'll just say I'm as straight as they come. I love the PoP Classics in my collection. The vintage line was pretty girly, but in the Classic line, I see them as bad ass female warriors. Why would I only want dudes on my shelf, you gotta have some ladies around.
    I'm pretty sure people as gay as they come don't want all dudes on their shelf either: that's boring.

    I want to make badges for cons "I love POP! no ****, bro." they can be pink with glitter. and one that says "I love POP, totes ****."

    then we can further marginalize ourselves as PoP fans based on sexuality (then some of us can hook-up if we want, and not accidentally hit on our straight She-rAllies (see what i did there )).


    edit: I was totes censored. it rhymes with momo. (fun killers).

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