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Thread: Season 1 talkback and discussion - *CONTAINS SPOILERS*

  1. #76
    Heroic Elder Hoffrod's Avatar
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    As a guy just on this side of 50 and a fan of the original franchises BEFORE the cartoon, I had to take time and seriously look at this thing from all angles. The cons:
    -the characters are not just badly redesigned, but rehashes of American culture cliche stereotypes. Mermista as a goth attitude teen, Perfuma as a hippie, etc.
    -The dialogue is not just childish, but dumbs down the audience almost like friggin Spongebob.
    -The individual episode plots have no real feel to the situation relevance.
    -Someone explain how humanoid beings in an impoverished rebellion have enough to have that many overweight individuals.
    -Not fond of the change of magic to some advanced tech from millenia ago....especially changing Light Hope into a dang computer program
    - the gay aspect wasnt just touched on, but lavished all through the series involving several characters. I dont mind a group wanting a little rep, but this is stupid overkill for an agenda.

    The pros:
    -The 'goddess glow' for She-ra was actually used for great effect and created an atmosphere of power about her.
    -All character powers were very well defined and given thoughtful use....even if the characters persona was screwed.
    -The environments were outstanding for the most part in design. I would like to see high detail versions.
    -The overall story arc was well thought out and executed...despite the outlandishness of certain episodes.
    -Many beloved characters made at least an easter egg debut in one way or another

    My bias: I wish we could, as a society, go back to giving kids heroes to emulate and look up to....instead of trying to give them screwed up kids they relate to. Having characters they can relate to is fine, but not as a hero type. That is like an oxymoron really. I also wish we had writers who use proper speaking scriptology that increases kids vocabulary instead of insisting on dumbing them down. The shows I watched in the 70's as a kid still talked like real adults should. Yes, they had simple ideas as scripts, but they at least didnt sound like kindergarten teacher or grade school student talk. Finally, why was it necessary to change the entire core of each character to make them unrecognizable to old school fans? I get tweaking to fit a modern demographic, but to make them TOTALLY different persons was just not needed.
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  2. #77
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    Now that I've FINALLY caught up with everything I had to do this week, I can finally relax and watch these amazing She-Ra/POP episodes I've been eagerly awaiting to see, along with several Power Rangers episodes/seasons and the new World Of Winx series/season I've seen advertised on Netflix.
    "Tell me I am beautiful - it means nothing to me. Tell me I am intellectual - well, I know it already. Tell me I am funny however, and that is the greatest compliment in the world that anyone can give me".

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  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cobrala View Post
    You know, tons of people are eager to see He-Man.

    But I think it’d be kinda cool if they detoured into He-Ro and King Hiss and just did The Powers of Grayskull as a two-parter.

    Any way you approach He-Man in this style will polarize people.

    But He-Ro is Adora’s ancestor too so you could conceivably have her connect with him without jumping straight to He-Man, Randor, Skeletor, etc.

    And I think He-Ro could be done better in this art style.
    that would be cool. and maybe we'll see of the Sword of Power or the Havoc Staff.

  4. #79
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    From what I've read so far, the only Classic POP characters who haven't either been seen or mentioned are Double Trouble and Flutterina. I hope they won't be left out, and maybe we'll see them in Season 2.

    Also, I'm hoping the POP Horde males (Grizzlor, Leech, Mantenna, Modulok, Multi-Bot, and Vultak) will be introduced, although I've always loved the female Force Captains (Catra, Scorpia, Entrapta, Shadow Weaver, and Octavia).

    I would love for Dragstor and Mosquitor to be introduced since they've never been animated before.

    I would also like to see more of the pets/animal friends/steeds like Arrow, Storm, Enchanta, Glory Bird, Loo-Kee, Clawdeen, Kowl, Crystal Moonbeam, and Crystal Sundancer.
    "Tell me I am beautiful - it means nothing to me. Tell me I am intellectual - well, I know it already. Tell me I am funny however, and that is the greatest compliment in the world that anyone can give me".

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  5. #80
    Heroic Warrior Asher Tye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey View Post
    From what I've read so far, the only Classic POP characters who haven't either been seen or mentioned are Double Trouble and Flutterina. I hope they won't be left out, and maybe we'll see them in Season 2.

    Also, I'm hoping the POP Horde males (Grizzlor, Leech, Mantenna, Modulok, Multi-Bot, and Vultak) will be introduced, although I've always loved the female Force Captains (Catra, Scorpia, Entrapta, Shadow Weaver, and Octavia).

    I would love for Dragstor and Mosquitor to be introduced since they've never been animated before.

    I would also like to see more of the pets/animal friends/steeds like Arrow, Storm, Enchanta, Glory Bird, Loo-Kee, Clawdeen, Kowl, Crystal Moonbeam, and Crystal Sundancer.
    You know its entirely possible some form these characters have been seen but have not yet reached their more recognizable forms. Kyle and Lonny could easily be the proto-forms of characters like Mantenna and Double Trouble.
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  6. #81
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asher Tye View Post
    You know its entirely possible some form these characters have been seen but have not yet reached their more recognizable forms. Kyle and Lonny could easily be the proto-forms of characters like Mantenna and Double Trouble.
    I've always felt that Lonny/Lonnie/Lohni (however it's spelled) was the precursor for Double Trouble, even in the Classic POP episode Friendship, so hopefully our favourite emerald-clad Glamorous Double Agent will be further explored in Season 2 (which I hope there will be). As for Kyle, whom I haven't seen yet, perhaps he will be further developed into one of the Horde males (I hope it will be Dragstor or Mosquitor, I've always wanted to see them animated).

    In the Classic POP mini-comic Across The Crystal Light Barrier, there was a character called Josh who was a friend of Bow and Glimmer, maybe Kyle is an updated version of Josh.

    It doesn't matter, it's all awesome.
    "Tell me I am beautiful - it means nothing to me. Tell me I am intellectual - well, I know it already. Tell me I am funny however, and that is the greatest compliment in the world that anyone can give me".

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  7. #82
    Court Magician He-NERD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JVS3 View Post
    Is there a reason they can't be gay in this new take on POP?
    exactly. Let's be real, these are characters for the 2018 audience now. And it's not like the 80's version of Bow definitely gave off conflicting signals....I'm mean, his outfit alone screamed, 'out!'

    Art style has me torn: characters look very simplistic and scream "this is for kids" (which it is!!!!!), but backgrounds and environments are AWESOME, so there is quite a bit to enjoy, visually. More than I would have guessed.
    Last edited by He-NERD; November 15, 2018 at 12:27am.
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  8. #83
    Cobra Saboteur Firefly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey View Post
    From what I've read so far, the only Classic POP characters who haven't either been seen or mentioned are Double Trouble and Flutterina. I hope they won't be left out, and maybe we'll see them in Season 2.

    Also, I'm hoping the POP Horde males (Grizzlor, Leech, Mantenna, Modulok, Multi-Bot, and Vultak) will be introduced, although I've always loved the female Force Captains (Catra, Scorpia, Entrapta, Shadow Weaver, and Octavia).

    I would love for Dragstor and Mosquitor to be introduced since they've never been animated before.

    I would also like to see more of the pets/animal friends/steeds like Arrow, Storm, Enchanta, Glory Bird, Loo-Kee, Clawdeen, Kowl, Crystal Moonbeam, and Crystal Sundancer.
    Grizzlor is briefly in an episode I watched. He has the same voice actor as Hordak. I think Horde male appearances will be just the mains ones and maybe the Filmation exclusive ones. Kowl is a stuffed animal which is a bummer. Even if he turns up later alive I doubt he'll have his same great smart aleck attitude. I didn't care for the prom episode. Too earthy and teen angst. I'm not really a fan of Sea Hawk. He is kind of like Freddie Mercury meets Coran from Voltron. I'd like to see more Hordak. He is vastly under used so far.

  9. #84
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly View Post
    Grizzlor is briefly in an episode I watched. He has the same voice actor as Hordak. I think Horde male appearances will be just the mains ones and maybe the Filmation exclusive ones. Kowl is a stuffed animal which is a bummer. Even if he turns up later alive I doubt he'll have his same great smart aleck attitude. I didn't care for the prom episode. Too earthy and teen angst. I'm not really a fan of Sea Hawk. He is kind of like Freddie Mercury meets Coran from Voltron.
    Thanks Firefly. I can't wait to see Grizzlor (he is my favourite Classic MOTU/POP Horde male) and I hope he gets more exposure in a possible Season 2. So, if Lohni is Double Trouble, then that leaves only Flutterina unaccounted for. I've always liked Flutterina (despite any negative remarks she often - unfairly - receives) because she's brave and strong, can lift people twice her size and weight. She could be used as a Rebel spy or search-and-rescue scout.
    "Tell me I am beautiful - it means nothing to me. Tell me I am intellectual - well, I know it already. Tell me I am funny however, and that is the greatest compliment in the world that anyone can give me".

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  10. #85
    Slave Girl for MOTUC! Jean's Avatar
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    After the two Filmation series, this is definitely my favorite series to watch so far. Because of the nostalgia, the number of episodes and the crossovers, nothing will likely ever beat the Filmation era for me, but this series is certainly better than New Adventures and MYP for me.

    Unlike New Adventures, I don't even have to try and like it. It managed to win me over within the first episode and I'm hooked in wanting to see more.

    And fortunately, this new series isn't overly serious like the MYP toon was. I'm just happy they avoided silencing Swift Wind like MYP did to Cringer/Battle Cat.
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  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Telkan2 View Post
    I'm glad you're enjoying it--though, I'm a bit perplexed as to where you're getting the testosterone element from?
    It's just a theory I have.
    My gut reaction to the She-Ra look was that the artist can't draw well. It looks very much when I try to draw a girl, i.e. a boy with long hair.
    But then I thought: The backgrounds look great, other characters clearly captures female features, so the androgynous look must be intentional, and the writer seems to be very lore heavy.
    Consider He-man. When he calls for Greyskull's power he becomes the paragon man. What if that is what the first ones power does? A She-Ra doped up on male hormones would grow taller, get more muscle mass and lose feminine features. I think the idea is pretty cool and would make sense. Off course I could be way off, but it's my current head canon. I haven't finished the season yet though so it might change with later revelations.

  12. #87
    Widget kmol's Avatar
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    I watched most of it now.

    It's okay as a TV series.

    But.. it's got nothing to do with She-Ra, save the character names.
    And also Glimmer is the main character in the show, Adora and Bow are her sidekicks.

    On a sidenote, while on netflix, you should really check out "The Dragon Prince", it's awesome.

  13. #88
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevenn View Post
    I watched the first 8 episodes last night, and I LOVE IT! Thanks for posting the picture of the Star Sisters. I kept pausing through the Princess Prom episode in those crowd scenes, but somehow missed those. I love their prom designs, so I can't wait to see what their regular designs will be.
    You're welcome. I am beyond thrilled that they were mentioned and briefly shown so early in the series. It's happening! -- Kids/Teens/Adults are learning of their existence. haha!

    Very curious to find out why The Star Sisters are not friends with Sweet Bee.

    I was not prepared for how FUNNY this show is.
    Same here. Mermista had me internally howling with so many of her comments. And the reaction to having to swim through the sewer system. Her personality kinda reminds me of something out of Daria.

    Entrapta and her miniature food!
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  14. #89
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    It always strikes me as funny that in no matter what movie or TV show I watch lately, the characters inevitably end up traipsing through the sewers. Am I missing something? I never knew the sewers were such a swell and popular hangout. Maybe I'll pay them a visit. Then again, I'll pass.


    It reminds me of something Raphael sarcastically said regarding the sewers in a TMNT episode, "Yeah, there's a whole line of people waitin' to move into 'em…"
    "Tell me I am beautiful - it means nothing to me. Tell me I am intellectual - well, I know it already. Tell me I am funny however, and that is the greatest compliment in the world that anyone can give me".

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  15. #90
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    Finally finished it! It's not perfect, but it's still awesome!

    Favorite moment for me was definitely Shadow Weaver vs. Catra! Wow!

    Bring on the figures already, Mattel! Have you not heard of striking while the iron is hot?!
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  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoffrod View Post
    My bias: I wish we could, as a society, go back to giving kids heroes to emulate and look up to....instead of trying to give them screwed up kids they relate to. Having characters they can relate to is fine, but not as a hero type. That is like an oxymoron really. I also wish we had writers who use proper speaking scriptology that increases kids vocabulary instead of insisting on dumbing them down.
    This feels like such a bizarre thing to say. I'm 34, so in between your generation and the one this show is for, but it seems to me that giving kids heroes who are flawed but work through interpersonal and emotional issues in realistic ways is way more aspirational than showing them some perfect adult with an affected vocabulary and saying "Hey you! Be this!"

    Like, as someone from a broken home, even at my age I found Glimmer's dealing with abandoned issues and trauma super moving, and I gotta feel like there are lots of kids watching this going through similar things who will see Glimmer working through those issues and understand they can do the same. And, let's be real, in the original Filmation series, Glimmer was clearly the product of trauma (in "Micah at Bright Moon" she almost has a psychotic break and dances herself off a cliff while daydreaming about her dad), but the writing was too inconsistent to really spend time getting to the core of her character.

    (In general I feel like Glimmer and Catra are most well-served by this reboot but that's a whole other post)
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  17. #92
    Life is good Dice's Avatar
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    I watched the first 3 episodes last night and I really enjoyed it overall! As a kid, I only watched She-ra to see my favorite Horde villains from my toy lines and mini comics. So almost all of the princesses and other male characters are "new" to me. Even so I got a lot of nostalgia from the She-ra transformations. I got a little emotional when I heard Grayskull mentioned but that might have been the whiskey

    Overall I really liked what I saw although I agree that some of the voice acting is a little weak. I'm also seeing that almost all roles of leadership or power have been women, which is fine, it's just noticeable.


    My prime complaint: Grizzlor in the 3rd episode. Was that supposed to be him? If so I'm extremely disappointed. I understand they want to keep the strong focal characters all female but you didn't have to make him a nobody with an (Australian?) accent. As much as I enjoy the show I'll really hate it if this is what my "Horde" ends up being. I don't mind different, I mind him being weaker and insignificant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly View Post
    Grizzlor is briefly in an episode I watched. He has the same voice actor as Hordak. I think Horde male appearances will be just the mains ones and maybe the Filmation exclusive ones. Kowl is a stuffed animal which is a bummer. Even if he turns up later alive I doubt he'll have his same great smart aleck attitude. I didn't care for the prom episode. Too earthy and teen angst. I'm not really a fan of Sea Hawk. He is kind of like Freddie Mercury meets Coran from Voltron. I'd like to see more Hordak. He is vastly under used so far.
    It was episode 3. I really hope that wasn't supposed to be THE Grizzlor though.
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  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dice View Post


    My prime complaint: Grizzlor in the 3rd episode. Was that supposed to be him? If so I'm extremely disappointed. I understand they want to keep the strong focal characters all female but you didn't have to make him a nobody with an (Australian?) accent. As much as I enjoy the show I'll really hate it if this is what my "Horde" ends up being. I don't mind different, I mind him being weaker and insignificant.



    It was episode 3. I really hope that wasn't supposed to be THE Grizzlor though.
    So there may be a legal reason for this... I got to interview Tim Seeley, who wrote the brand bible for She-Ra before passing it off to the new showrunners, and he mentioned that when he was working the only MOTU characters Dreamworks said they could include were Hordak and He-Man. He later was able to add the rest of the classic Horde toys, but wasn't sure how things would play out in the actual show. I suspect that's why we have a Grizzlor lookalike in episode 3... close enough to the original to be an easter egg, but not distinct enough to clearly be a character owned by another company. Same with the "Horde Troopers"... close but not exact, right? But no Mantenna, for instance... kinda harder to do a Mantenna lookalike that isn't clearly Mantenna.
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  19. #94
    Heroic Warrior A Dalek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricButRebooted View Post
    This feels like such a bizarre thing to say. I'm 34, so in between your generation and the one this show is for, but it seems to me that giving kids heroes who are flawed but work through interpersonal and emotional issues in realistic ways is way more aspirational than showing them some perfect adult with an affected vocabulary and saying "Hey you! Be this!"

    Like, as someone from a broken home, even at my age I found Glimmer's dealing with abandoned issues and trauma super moving, and I gotta feel like there are lots of kids watching this going through similar things who will see Glimmer working through those issues and understand they can do the same. And, let's be real, in the original Filmation series, Glimmer was clearly the product of trauma (in "Micah at Bright Moon" she almost has a psychotic break and dances herself off a cliff while daydreaming about her dad), but the writing was too inconsistent to really spend time getting to the core of her character.

    (In general I feel like Glimmer and Catra are most well-served by this reboot but that's a whole other post)
    To add to this the whole flawed hero who works past their shortcomings concept, isn't something that only came about in the 21st century. Literally the oldest know heroic tale in history was that kind of story.

  20. #95
    Life is good Dice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricButRebooted View Post
    So there may be a legal reason for this... I got to interview Tim Seeley, who wrote the brand bible for She-Ra before passing it off to the new showrunners, and he mentioned that when he was working the only MOTU characters Dreamworks said they could include were Hordak and He-Man. He later was able to add the rest of the classic Horde toys, but wasn't sure how things would play out in the actual show. I suspect that's why we have a Grizzlor lookalike in episode 3... close enough to the original to be an easter egg, but not distinct enough to clearly be a character owned by another company. Same with the "Horde Troopers"... close but not exact, right? But no Mantenna, for instance... kinda harder to do a Mantenna lookalike that isn't clearly Mantenna.
    I would feel better overall if this is the case. I haven't watched past episode 3 yet so if he never appears in the show again, nor the other characters, then this explanation seems solid.
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  21. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Dalek View Post
    To add to this the whole flawed hero who works past their shortcomings concept, isn't something that only came about in the 21st century. Literally the oldest know heroic tale in history was that kind of story.
    Great point! I remember my world being blown in college when my Comp Lit teacher told us that we're supposed to read Odysseus as a jerk... that the whole point of the Odyssey is him learning proper hospitality so by the time he returns to his home, he can lead his house nobly and in keeping with Grecian values.

    And typing this, I'm realizing that every traditional hero's journey is basically predicated on the hero lacking something within themselves and taking an external journey that rights their internal conflict...

    We even see this occasionally in MOTU... "Into the Abyss" is probably my favorite episode of the Filmation series, and it's predicated on Prince Adam losing his cool with Teela because he just wants to relax for once.

    But then there are writers like Frank Miller, who insist that the only valuable hero is the Alpha Male who can do no wrong and stands virtuously and one-dimensionally against the ills of society around them. No introspection needed there. Snore.
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  22. #97
    Heroic Warrior A Dalek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricButRebooted View Post
    Great point! I remember my world being blown in college when my Comp Lit teacher told us that we're supposed to read Odysseus as a jerk... that the whole point of the Odyssey is him learning proper hospitality so by the time he returns to his home, he can lead his house nobly and in keeping with Grecian values.

    And typing this, I'm realizing that every traditional hero's journey is basically predicated on the hero lacking something within themselves and taking an external journey that rights their internal conflict...

    We even see this occasionally in MOTU... "Into the Abyss" is probably my favorite episode of the Filmation series, and it's predicated on Prince Adam losing his cool with Teela because he just wants to relax for once.

    But then there are writers like Frank Miller, who insist that the only valuable hero is the Alpha Male who can do no wrong and stands virtuously and one-dimensionally against the ills of society around them. No introspection needed there. Snore.
    It actualy goes further back than that. The epic of Gilgamesh dates back to Babylonian times (I think).

    That being said there is a point of taking certain things to far. Season 1 seemed to be going a bit down Legend of Korra route with having Adora go through quite a bit of emotional stress and suffering and being down on herself over her shortcomings. While it worked fine here and I think they can (and should) go a bit further with it. I don't think taking it to the level that Korra went through would work for this kind of story, so I hope they don't take things that far in the future.

  23. #98
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    I just watched episodes 8-11 last night. I haven't seen anyone mention it, but I'm certain I saw Laa-see in the prom episode (or at least another of their species that looked almost identical)!

    I loved the episode with Adora and Catra and there memories of growing up together!

  24. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sword2Blanket View Post
    I just watched episodes 8-11 last night. I haven't seen anyone mention it, but I'm certain I saw Laa-see in the prom episode (or at least another of their species that looked almost identical)!

    I loved the episode with Adora and Catra and there memories of growing up together!
    I'll have to go back and watch.
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  25. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricButRebooted View Post
    So there may be a legal reason for this... I got to interview Tim Seeley, who wrote the brand bible for She-Ra before passing it off to the new showrunners, and he mentioned that when he was working the only MOTU characters Dreamworks said they could include were Hordak and He-Man. He later was able to add the rest of the classic Horde toys, but wasn't sure how things would play out in the actual show. I suspect that's why we have a Grizzlor lookalike in episode 3... close enough to the original to be an easter egg, but not distinct enough to clearly be a character owned by another company. Same with the "Horde Troopers"... close but not exact, right? But no Mantenna, for instance... kinda harder to do a Mantenna lookalike that isn't clearly Mantenna.
    These rights issues between POP and MOTU are just so ridiculous and need to be settled once and for all. The only major thing I've been missing in this new show are the "creature" Horde characters like Grizzlor, Mantenna, and Leech. I absolutely believed that was Grizzlor in episode 3 (I loved the voice used for him), and he also makes a brief cameo in one of the last episodes (11 or 12 I think, still have ep 13 to watch), where they are all gathered in Hordak's chambers. Just seems so silly if these characters were used in the Filmation series that they can't in this one. I know, you also have He-Man, Skeletor, Orko, etc, that appeared in She-Ra, but I mean the Horde mainstays like Leech and Mantenna.

    The absence of those characters, as well as Kowl, are really my only nitpicks. I really feel like this series hits the bullseye on its target audience, young girls. Yes, I am saying this from the perspective of a 37-year-old male, but my inner little-girl loved it . The Filmation series attempted to be a broad-appeal show, grabbing the attention of boys and girls alike. It might have worked, but when you went to the toy aisles, which were much more boy/girl separated back then, the toy lines were very clearly aimed towards different audiences. Plus, the toy line didn't mesh very well with the cartoon (which was also a problem with the MOTU line, but to a much lesser extent). The new series aligns much better with what the world the original toyline was trying create, but still with some grit to it. I think that, in this way, this new series and the accompanying toy should hopefully be more of a success.

    Love the inclusivity and diversity of the new series as well. My favorite characters have been Bow and Madame Razz. I hope Razz shows up more often, because this kooky old lady is great. I have to admit, Glimmer has grated on my nerves from time to time. She seems to be the most "typical teenage girl" and gets a little whiny sometimes. I also love Angella's characterization. Looking forward to many more seasons of this show, and the prospect of more old favorites showing up in future episodes!
    CC: 1) Lizorr, 2) Sagitar, 3) King Miro, 4) Hunga, 5) Hoove, 6) Kayo, 7) Artilla, 9) Master Sebrian, 10) MoP Demons, 11) Twiggets, 12) Raj-Jar, 13) Hans Hammerholder, 14) Staghorn, 15) Spinwit, 16) Vizar, 17) Butthead, 18) Nocturna, 19) Melaktha, 20) Vy-Por
    CG: 1) Whiplash, 2) Ram Man, 3) Leech, 4) Kobra Khan, 5) Moss Man, 6) Bow, 7) Buzz Off, 8) Multi-Bot, 9) Entrapta, 10) Webstor

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