View Poll Results: Would you like Mattel to let us have more Power and Honour catalogues ?

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  • Yes! Yes! Yes! MATTEL LET THE POWER AND HONOUR GUYS GIVE US MORE !

    163 93.68%
  • Nope Im not interested in any more Power and Honour catalogues.

    11 6.32%
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Thread: Mattel WE WANT MORE! Who wants more Power and Honour catalogues ??? Let Mattel Know!

  1. #51
    Heroic Warrior
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    I voted yes, I said I wanted more never before seen art.

    I don't know if everyone here realizes this, but the Power and Honor Foundation (P&HF) is a CHARITY. Specifically, a "non-profit federally recognized 501(c)3 public charity organization". They are beholden to fans.

    Mattel is a global corporation, they are a company and they have a right to make a profit from their properties. They are beholden to their investors, shareholders and customers.

    I can't view a reprint, or additional volume, of the P&HF book as anything as an opportunity for both organizations. It is publicity and marketing Mattel does not have to pay for.

    If Emiliano from P&HF and Scott Neitlich from Mattel are unable to work together due to a real or perceived conflict of interests - someone needs to step in from either organization to find a solution.

    Who can fans actually contact to help this happen?
    Can the P&HF just release an "unofficial" copy without Mattel?
    Last edited by Grepicon; March 22, 2014 at 06:09pm.

  2. #52
    Heroic Warrior Matthew L. Martin's Avatar
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    I'm fortunate enough to own the original catalog, and I treasure it. I'd love a second volume, perhaps containing the package art as well. (80s package art was some of the most gorgeous stuff. I've got Transformers: Legacy on preorder. ) I share some of Adam's copyright qualms, but I'm assuming that the Foundation has dealt with all of those for the first catalog and is working with Mattel on subsequent matters. (Since this was all work for hire, and since copyright typically covers "distinct likenesses", reproduction without their permission is problematic regardless of how the material was obtained. But again, I assume P&H knows this better than I do and has addressed it.)

    I'd even settle for a pamphlet or samizdat with the Powers of Grayskull outlines and pieces from Errol McCarthy. Does anyone know if more than one page of "Secrets of Grayskull Preliminary Story Outline (SECRETS2.DATA)" exists?
    Last edited by Matthew L. Martin; March 22, 2014 at 06:24pm.

  3. #53
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    I would absolutely love additional volumes of The Power and Honor catalogs. I want more! I am hoping that the P&H Foundation and Mattel can work out whatever the issues are so that we can get volumes 2,3,4, etc. Come on guys! Please make it happen!

  4. #54
    Heroic Warrior Barezz's Avatar
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    I personally don't have a ton of interest in the first book, and imagine the same holds true for subsequent volumes. My fandom just doesn't run that deep I suppose. I mean it is neat and all, but a big part of me has had enough of sketches and failed concepts that should have been tossed in the trash (I'm looking at you Son of He-Man crap).

    It would be nice if some kind of accord could be reached so that it could be available for anyone who wants it.
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  5. #55
    Heroic Warrior Captain Atkin's Avatar
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    The Power and The Honor Foundation Catalog (Volume One) is an amazing book. The team at the Foundation did a spectacular job putting that first volume together. It would be fantastic if Mattel and the Power and The Honor Foundation could work something out to produce new books, as well as reproduce the first volume for fans who were unable to get it the first time. This poll is a great poll, and it clearly shows that the vast majority of fans want to see new volumes published. The Foundation’s current collection was made possible by contributions from fans, as well as from the original creators, writers, and artists. It was collected in order to be preserved and shared with the fans, and I believe that such sharing can only strengthen the brand and increase it's popularity among fans (new and old alike).

  6. #56
    Quester JonWes's Avatar
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    Does anyone know if any more vintage concept toy art was found? To be honest, that's the stuff I'm more interested in. I know Vol. 2 was originally going to be Filmation. Which I totally would have bought, but would have been less excited about. The toy stuff was the stuff I really liked seeing.
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  7. #57
    Quester JonWes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PowerAndHonor View Post
    We have found and scanned a lot more concept toy art.
    That's fantastic! Have you guys ever thought about making a big, lovely website with the holdings of the P&H in galleries? It seems as though that might be the best way to get all this lovely material that you've amassed out there for everyone to enjoy, as I think that was the primary mission of you guys collecting everything in one large collection, IIRC. Even if/when you and Mattel work something out to publish the books, I'm sure there'd still be plenty of interest in printed volumes of the material too. But in the meantime you'd be able to fulfill the original intent of the Foundation, which seemed to preserve all the wonderful historical material and present it to the fans.
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  8. #58
    Quester JonWes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PowerAndHonor View Post
    That is not possible either and even if it was we truly believe small images on a website are not what this art deserve. We have a big appreciation for art in general and we think there are good ways and bad ways to present artwork. You don't get to browse what the Louvre has in his galleries on a website. That is not the right way to enjoy art.
    Our focus is publishing and public exhibitions where art can be seen in person. A permanent exhibition or museum would be our final goal.

    It can't also be ignored that acquiring and maintaining the art at the level we're doing (which is very different than any single private collector) has high costs.
    Publishing and exhibitions helps founding the operations which leads to the sharing of the art. It's a virtuous circle.
    Without founds, we can't maintain the operations, and we cannot share art. And if we cannot share art, we cannot fund the operations.
    That's why the idea of simply putting the art online defeats the purposes of our organization. Not mentioning that we wouldn't have the resources to maintain such galleries online either.
    I can understand your point, but hopefully it's something you'll revisit one day. Advances in web sites mean that you can reproduce art in glorious high resolution. There's no reason they have to be small. With current screen sizes and designs, you could give people the opportunity to experience the art in a way that could be MORE intimate (in ways) than seeing them reproduced in a book or on a gallery wall. Think about it, even volume 1—as beautifully put together as it was—had limitations. If nothing else the art was bound by the dimensions of the book itself. But on the web people could really zoom in and enjoy the artistry at work.

    I appreciate the notion of treating the art with the respect it deserves, but I'd also say that the notion that art is somehow less-well served online is quickly becoming antiquated. More and more museums and galleries are moving toward online offerings. Getty, Art Institute of Chicago and the Tate are just a few examples. Even the Louvre lets you explore some pieces online. There's no denying the power of getting to see some of these images for real. The texture of the surfaces. The true colors. But, there's also the reality that any physical presentation of these would also be limiting the audience that could enjoy it because not everyone will be able to travel to that location. For a brand with such a global audience, online might be a nice alternative. Just as I don't think it'd prevent people from buying any possible books, I don't think it would stop people from going to an actual exhibit. If nothing else a really well done website with nice, big images would let the fans themselves choose how they want to experience the work.

    It's true that websites aren't cheap to create or maintain, but you're a nonprofit set up to take donations. It seems like the cost of maintaining something like that might not be impossible through either a membership or initial call for donations or something. I'm just saying, it's been a few years now since the first catalog, and it sounds like scanning and restoration efforts are still ongoing. Just something to consider if your current strategy doesn't pan out. Maybe a different tactic might be worth a little more thought?
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  9. #59
    Heroic Warrior Torak's Avatar
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    Mattel is not Hasbro. Nuff Said.

    The book is one of my prize pieces of my collection. I would love to see another one.

  10. #60
    Heroic Master of Music baileyrecords's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrimmTrabb View Post
    Book 1 is one of my most prized possessions that I find to be endlessly inspirational. It also never fails to make me smile.
    I hope both parties find a way to get more of this wonderful stuff to us (specifically me! ) in the future.
    THIS! I love my copy of Vol 1. I've read through it as least two time and I've shared it with friends. I would love a sequel... even if it focused on She-Ra or NA.
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  11. #61
    Assimilate, or else!! krosfyah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PowerAndHonor View Post
    Unfortunately, a different tactict wouldn’t pan out.
    Once the art is online at high resolution, we devalue it. In theory, Mattel could just grab the art an put it in their own book. Once they have it, they wouldn’t need us anymore (as our expertise is not considered an added value at the moment) - Things are a bit more complicated than that, but we're simplifying for the sake of conversation - So they would have no reason to negotiate a license for a book with us. Then, our only real chance to generate the necessary funds to pay for the expenses, would be gone forever.

    We could disagree on many other things about the difference between online and the physical object (being the real one or a book). Maybe it’s the fact that our president is from Italy and has always lived in a family that worked in art preservation for the public. But we go back to what we said above. Just posting images online defeat the ability of generating funds, and the consequence wold be the lack of ability of continuing sharing.
    With ten of thousand pieces, scanning and restoring is indeed still going. But there are hardware costs,there have been traveling costs, our digital cloud archive is very expensive,and we keep running into new art, while we need to start worrying about storage material and long term preservation.
    All this has been done so far with the limited resources our members could contribute with, bot money-wise and time-wise But non of us is rich or can devote all his time to the Foundation. Our strategy must involve generating funds that allow the Foundation to continue operations and online galleries are simply not the best option
    (for those reading this for the first time: funds generated by donations and other initiatives remains inside the Foundation as we are a non-profit organization)

    But, bottom line, and we’ve repeated it a couple of times in this thread, that according to Mattel we can not share any of the art we own. Not in publishing and not online either. We of course don’t think that is the case and we surely never agreed to their requests, but we tried to act accordingly to prove Mattel our good faith and willingness to work with them.
    I have to add to this a bit, Eamon started a website dedicted to the art of Earl Norem, and while it's fun to look at now and again, I would MUCH rather a large sized coffee table book with that art reprinted than digital images. Earl Norem is one of my favourite artists and honestly I haven't been to that site in over a year. but having a physical book collecting those images I'd thumb through that and appreciate it more. not that I don't appreciate Eamon collecting the images and making a site, but with art there is something BETTER about having the physical copy, even if it is just a reproduction/print of it.
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  12. #62
    Heroic Warrior Sallah's Avatar
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    Would love to have more of the catalogs. The first volume is undoubtedly the greatest book ever produced on the toyline... To those who only have the Art Book put out by Mattel at SDCC- You NEED to find the first P & H catalog. It is every thing you wished that the Art Book would have been... and more.

    Sallah

  13. #63
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    I'd love to see more discovered art by the Foundation. Be it in a ctalog or any way they choose to release it for the fans.

    The "Filmation February" that showed art was fantastic and while waiting for the better times, I hope there might also be better months.
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  14. #64
    Dino Charged TheShadow's Avatar
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    Last call warning here -- let's keep this thread on topic; this is the second time it's had to be cleaned up.

    Show your support for more P&H catalogs, etc. by explaining why we as fans would love and support products like these. Let's keep the P&H/Mattel internal dealings out of it and focus on valid reasons as to why such catalogs are a benefit to the fans of MOTU/POP! Thank you all for your cooperation!


  15. #65
    Spirit of She-Ra ! Angel-T's Avatar
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    I don't care how it happens I just know I want another one of those catalogs showing the Filmation MOTU and POP development art! i am so happy I am one of the lucky fans to iwn this. Having seen certain pieces shared by the POH foundation at the Twins of Power convention in the UK last year. Any further / future projects excite me and I will support them whole heartedly!
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  16. #66
    TWIGGET ENTHUSIAST! Swifty's Avatar
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    You guys need to put out a second volume with some She-Ra material. Not sure how much you have been able to acquire to this point but I'd love to see what you do have. The early Catra sketches are fantastic!
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  17. #67
    Avenge The Fallen Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrimmTrabb View Post
    I hope both parties find a way to get more of this wonderful stuff to us (specifically me! ) in the future.
    Actually, I agree with this. Can the P&H foundation make a one-shot, one copy only, high quality Volume II Catalog and send it to TrimmTrabb?

    If he happens to make high quality scans afterwords and posts them online, the foundation didn't do it.
    ____________________________________________

  18. #68
    Dino Charged TheShadow's Avatar
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    Hi everyone,

    I've tried my best to keep this thread open and alive. Several posts were removed and/or edited where the conversation about the legal troubles of the Foundation v Mattel kept coming up, along with posts that were airing private details publicly, made accusations, contained insults, etc. No edits were made to change anyone's actual support for the Foundation releasing more catalogs. I find it to be unfortunate when certain individuals come in to rile up threads when I had hoped that this thread could show positive support for more catalogs and what the Foundation is trying to do overall for us fans.

    I personally attempted to assure the P&HF's president, Emiliano, that I am trying to keep the thread alive as he did contact me during the course of this. I went through one last overhaul of the thread this afternoon and let him know. He did not come back to me after the last overhaul for additional dialog; instead, the P&HF have made it clear they'd like the thread closed and won't be participating. So, I will honor that and put this matter to rest.

    For those who still want to show support, I suggest heading over to their Facebook page to show enthusiasm for the Foundation and their mission. Here's to hoping they can find an amicable way of working with Mattel to get the materials they have released:
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-P...93949873986035

    If anyone has any opinion they want to send me on how this thread was handled, please do not hesitate to send me a PM. I'll make sure to read each and every one and certinaly take constructive criticism or support in to account as we continue to work on the forums.

    Thanks to everyone for your understanding with this.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Hi again everyone,

    Unfortunately I feel I need to make another post in regards to this thread, just to make sure everyone understands the situation. This morning on Facebook, the Power and Honor Foundation page posted this update:

    We deep regret this morning we found out the thread was closed. Unfortunately, the closing statement by Mr. Jon Kallis saying we wanted the thread closed is false.
    All the mods here have tried to maintain this thread so it helps praise and supports requests for more projects from the Foundation, while keeping private information off this thread that may harm the Foundation's future negotiations and communication with Mattel. The Foundation can say whatever they want outside of the He-Man.Org forums. But, we have no desire for any threads on He-Man.Org to work against possible future Foundation projects. When threads become fights instead of conversations, I do not feel it is a positive reflection for anyone.

    Unfortunately, our efforts are being misrepresented. In nearly every instance, private correspondence between users and moderators remains confidential. But, this is a situation where I am posting Emiliano's request to me yesterday to show it is direct contradiction to that update:

    Quote Originally Posted by Emiliano
    Just get it closed Kallis.
    We all know you want to, so let's end the pain in the ass for you guys
    I can't see locking it to do any more damage to you guys and this site than you already did with how you handled that thread.
    *Big round of applauses"
    lock_request.jpg

    I'm sorry things have degraded to this point, but it should be no surprise that the thread was closed. Most of us hope to see new projects from the Foundation and hope they can work things out with Mattel and I still wish them the best of luck. As I stated in the post above this, you can easily find their Facebook page to show your enthusiasm for their projects and mission.

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