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Thread: Season Three is coming August 2nd! Geena Davis As Huntara

  1. #76
    Heroic Elder Hoffrod's Avatar
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    Just finished. I still cringe at a LOT of the dialogue and acting. The story arc shows a whole heap of nods to the original, but still falls way short on the creativity level and scope. The Crimson Waste was little more than a desert with really bad cliche MAD MAX wannabes. This is an ALIEN world....so why do we have a bad sixties biker wardrobe?? Tung Lashor was put down without ONCE using his namesake....seriously? Lastly, the Horde was supposed to be shown as this great armada at the last....but just looked like a busy space station. Why didnt they use something like a pan out shot of the Horde world with a couple thousand ships around it? Too narrow of focus on character socializing and pushing dogma rather than enhancing the lore. I get that it is aimed at kids, but I think that even kids can be smarter than current Hollywood gives them credit for.
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  2. #77
    Heroic Warrior Asher Tye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoffrod View Post
    Just finished. I still cringe at a LOT of the dialogue and acting. The story arc shows a whole heap of nods to the original, but still falls way short on the creativity level and scope. The Crimson Waste was little more than a desert with really bad cliche MAD MAX wannabes. This is an ALIEN world....so why do we have a bad sixties biker wardrobe?? Tung Lashor was put down without ONCE using his namesake....seriously? Lastly, the Horde was supposed to be shown as this great armada at the last....but just looked like a busy space station. Why didnt they use something like a pan out shot of the Horde world with a couple thousand ships around it? Too narrow of focus on character socializing and pushing dogma rather than enhancing the lore. I get that it is aimed at kids, but I think that even kids can be smarter than current Hollywood gives them credit for.
    One of the shots featuring the Horde had them literally gutting a planet with their ships.
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  3. #78
    Heroic Warrior wayne-klops's Avatar
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    Just finished Season 3 and all I can say is wow...it was fantastic!!!

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  4. #79
    Heroic Warrior Stratos*Major's Avatar
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    I think it is really cool what they did with Mara.
    I mean...is it THE Mara from NA!?
    I really feel like He-Man is going to becoming into it soon...

  5. #80
    Heroic Warrior Veronica Mars's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stratos*Major View Post
    I think it is really cool what they did with Mara.
    I mean...is it THE Mara from NA!?
    I really feel like He-Man is going to becoming into it soon...
    I think it might be
    A PONY!!!

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    I really really hate BS Hordak

  6. #81
    Heroic Warrior Lord Hordak's Avatar
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    Great season!
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  7. #82
    THEIR KILLIN TEH LIEN !! uaxuctum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stratos*Major View Post
    I think it is really cool what they did with Mara.
    I mean...is it THE Mara from NA!?
    I really feel like He-Man is going to becoming into it soon...
    Quote Originally Posted by Veronica Mars View Post
    I think it might be
     
    How could there possibly remain any doubt about it any longer? I mean, she has now been explicitly revealed to be none other than the good ol' Mara we all knew from NA, with all the signature design elements of her well-known warrior version (long "flail" ponytail, distinctive forward-and-up-pointing ear-thingies, white-azure-purple-gold color scheme, etc.), even though it doesn't seem to make any sense according to the previously existing canons.

    Attachment 121005President_Pell_introduced_to_Mara.jpg

    This absolutely shocking and unexpected reveal definitely opens up very big questions about what kind of disturbingly sweeping changes this new canon has introduced with respect to the overall scheme of things, if a character from what NA established to be a descendant of Earth's far future colonization of the Tri-Solar system is now supposed to have been on Etheria's far past with respect to Adam and Adora's era, which is supposed to be more or less contemporaneous with present-day Earth.
    Last edited by uaxuctum; August 4, 2019 at 07:20pm.
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  8. #83
    Catwoman...Hear Me Roar! Mikey's Avatar
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    This is all so awesome if they bring MOTU, POP and NA all together in this amazing new series. I hope Tuskador comes into the series, he would be awesome.
    "Tell me I am beautiful - it means nothing to me. Tell me I am intellectual - well, I know it already. Tell me I am funny however, and that is the greatest compliment in the world that anyone can give me".

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  9. #84
    Council Elder Tallstar's Avatar
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    This is from a 2018 SYFY interview with Noelle:

    Are there any Easter eggs that you’re excited for fans to see in the series?

    Yeah! There are a lot of Easter eggs in there. I don’t even remember all of them. But Loo-Kee is hidden in a few places. There are a few name drops of characters and places that we don’t necessarily see, and my favorite one is one that is a little bit of a deeper cut, but it has to do with the She-Ra that came before Adora’s She-Ra, who is actually a little bit of a cameo appearance of a legacy Masters of the Universe character. So there is a lot in there, and there is a lot for Masters of the Universe fans to look for.


    As for He-Man, there are a couple of interviews with Noelle from last year where she says that He-Man won't be appearing in the series. While it's always possible that it's a ruse designed to surprise fans at a later time, I think Noelle is probably telling it like it is. More recently, a french website interviewed her while she was at Annecy Fest this past June and they asked her about He-Man. Based on the Google translation and past comments, it seems as though the producers don't want the Sony/Columbia Pictures MOTU film and She-Ra and the Princesses of Power to be connected. And that just so happens to align with the goals that the She-Ra crew had/has for the series anyway. (Keeping the focus on Adora/She-Ra)

    I could be wrong, but I think technically DreamWorks is allowed to use He-Man. At one time, I believe Noelle said that they don't want to step on any toes or future storylines. Anyhow, here are the comments from the recent interview along with the Google translation:

    FRENCH

    Allez-vous développer la relation avec Eternia et Musclor dans les prochains épisodes ?

    Nous n’avons pas les droits ni pour Musclor ni pour certains personnages des Maitres de l’Univers. Je pense que c’est à cause du film que prépare Sony, parce que les producteurs veulent que ça soit deux choses bien séparées. Ca nous va pour notre série.

    Adora vient d’une autre dimension. C’était donc bien de glisser des références à ses origines, à ses parents mais pas de s’y plonger. On a développé une mythologie plus indépendante que dans les séries originales, mais qui contient des indices pour ceux qui savent chercher.

    Beaucoup de choses arrivent et feront références aux Maitres de l’Univers sans pour autant aller sur Eternia.
    ENGLISH

    Are you going to develop the relationship with Eternia and Musclor in the next episodes?

    We do not have the rights neither for Musclor nor for certain characters of the Masters of the Universe. I think it's because of the film that Sony is preparing, because the producers want it to be two separate things. It suits us for our series.

    Adora comes from another dimension. So it was good to slip references to his origins, to his parents but not to dive into it. We have developed a more independent mythology than in the original series, but which contains clues for those who know how to search.

    Many things happen and will refer to the Masters of the Universe without going to Eternia.
    Last edited by Tallstar; August 3, 2019 at 08:26am.
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  10. #85
    Heroic Warrior Chris85's Avatar
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    Very pleased to hear again that they won't touch He-Man. There's only so much trauma I can handle.
    On a positive note, Huntara's episode was pretty good. I'm enjoying villains more than heroes in this one. Episode 3 is not bad either so far. The less screen time the princesses and especially She-Ra have, the better for me. The Hordak reveal was quite nice, although I'm a little bit disappointed that he doesn't want to replace the original with himself. Just proving that he's worthy is slightly pathetic. Usually villains don't forgive when bosses treat them like ...you know.
    Last edited by Chris85; August 3, 2019 at 09:57am.

  11. #86
    Heroic Warrior A Dalek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris85 View Post
    Very pleased to hear again that they won't touch He-Man. There's only so much trauma I can handle.
    On a positive note, Huntara's episode was pretty good. I'm enjoying villains more than heroes in this one. Episode 3 is not bad either so far. The less screen time the princesses and especially She-Ra have, the better for me. The Hordak reveal was quite nice, although I'm a little bit disappointed that he doesn't want to replace the original with himself. Just proving that he's worthy is slightly pathetic. Usually villains don't forgive when bosses treat them like ...you know.
    I think it's pretty clear that Hordak on some level believes that Hord Prime was right and that he is a defective failure and it's just as much about proving it to himself as it is proving it to Hord Prime. He also likley has some level of preprogramed loyalty.

  12. #87
    Widget Lord Exor's Avatar
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    Horde Prime better not simply be a Hordak recolor or straight-up copy. I hope they reference his cartoon or MOTUC designs instead, because this reveal raises the big problem of character differentiation. Heck, Horde Prime is even voiced by Keston John, albeit with what appears to be a British accent.

    Another issue is that Hordak's path to humanization felt abrupt and forced, even if it had the barest minimum of inspiration from the source material. Not everyone is redeemable and merely waiting for a hug to unlock their latent morality--there are some simply terrible people, and avoiding that fact entirely will see this series fall victim to the same pitfalls of Steven Universe, My Little Pony, and any other cartoons attempting to peddle such absurdity.

    TL;DR, Horde Prime should be purely evil, because Hordak is even more of a pansy now than the original '80s version.

    Moreover, this series does a rather poor job of selling us on why the Horde is as terrible as everyone says it is. We see nothing to justify their reputation, or why they need to be stopped. We aren't seeing oppressed peoples suffering under draconian cruelty, and for all the strides this show takes to modernize itself, it fails to accomplish something even an '80s cartoon managed.
    Last edited by Lord Exor; August 3, 2019 at 01:05pm.

  13. #88
    Heroic Warrior Chris85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Exor View Post
    Moreover, this series does a rather poor job of selling us on why the Horde is as terrible as everyone says it is. We see nothing to justify their reputation, or why they need to be stopped. We aren't seeing oppressed peoples suffering under draconian cruelty, and for all the strides this show takes to modernize itself, it fails to accomplish something even an '80s cartoon managed.
    Did they mention that the Evil Horde wiped out entire villages, like literally killed people? Or am I remembering it wrong?

  14. #89
    Widget Lord Exor's Avatar
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    We see how the Horde oppresses people and restricts their freedoms in many episodes, and "The Price of Freedom" shows Hordak literally attacking innocent people and bombing their villages.

  15. #90
    Heroic Warrior A Dalek's Avatar
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    I don't see humanizing villains autmaticly makes them redeemable, I mean JoJo's Bizarre Adventure humanized Kira but it sure as hell didn't make him redeemable.

    It dosn't really look like things are going down the everyone is redeemable route, since the story goes out of it's way to show that Catra is a bad person inspite of her sympathetic qaulities.

    And is they do go down that route, I think it's worth noting that Suite Precure was able to have a villain who's master plan was to end all life be redeemed, so it's not inmpossible to make that kind of thing work.
    Last edited by A Dalek; August 3, 2019 at 02:04pm.

  16. #91
    Heroic Warrior Asher Tye's Avatar
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    It honestly looks like Catra has pretty much shot any chance at redemption completely. I do recall making a WMG that she would cross the moral event horizon by either harming Entrapta or Scorpia and it looks like she's managed both.

    Of course Shadow Weaver is still on the loose as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A Dalek View Post
    I don't see humanizing villains autmaticly makes them redeemable, I mean JoJo's Bizarre Adventure humanized Kira but it sure as hell didn't make him redeemable.

    It dosn't really look like things are going down the everyone is redeemable route, since the story goes out of it's way to show that Catra is a bad person inspite of her sympathetic qaulities.

    And is they do go down that route, I think it's worth noting that Suite Precure was able to have a villain who's master plan was to end all life be redeemed, so it's not inmpossible to make that kind of thing work.
    It really depends on where you think Hordak falls between his own decisions and those he has to make to be a "good" hordesman. Given how Horde Prime kicked him to the curb, that definition of failure speech he gave makes a certain amount of sense taken from that perspective, but Entrapta seemed to be getting him to open up to the idea of failing as a learning experience over something you have to fear. Anyone suffering as many setbacks as he has with the mindset that the simple act of suffering setbacks lowers your worth would probably become much less friendly, and that's not even counting he probably started out with the mindset of a conqueror to begin with.

    Of course that being said, there's also the possibility of Redemption Equals Death coming into play, especially if he decides he doesn't really fancy Horde Prime laying waste to Etheria.

    I am still curious as to Mara's reasons FOR stranding Etheria. She seemed to think the First Ones had made the planet into a weapon.
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  17. #92
    Widget Lord Exor's Avatar
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    Humanizing villains is fine, but not ALL villainous people are capable of being redeemed OR humanized. Psychopaths and malignant narcissists are very real even in our own world, and their motives are far from sympathetic. I'm still holding out for Horde Prime giving this show some much-needed darkening up, because again, if a cartoon for girls FROM THE EIGHTIES is doing this better, that's a problem.

    I want to posit that I'm not a naysayer that's been overly critical of this show before it even released. I've been on-board with this show for a while now, but I think it's about time we see why the Horde is as bad as everyone says it is. You can call something evil all you want, but until the audience truly witnesses such evil, it doesn't register, especially if every other scene features Horde soldiers being humanized.
    Last edited by Lord Exor; August 3, 2019 at 03:13pm.

  18. #93
    Heroic Warrior A Dalek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Exor View Post
    Humanizing villains is fine, but not ALL villainous people are capable of being redeemed OR humanized. Psychopaths and malignant narcissists are very real even in our own world, and their motives are far from sympathetic. I'm still holding out for Horde Prime giving this show some much-needed darkening up, because again, if a cartoon for girls FROM THE EIGHTIES is doing this better, that's a problem.

    I want to posit that I'm not a naysayer that's been overly critical of this show before it even released. I've been on-board with this show for a while now, but I think it's about time we see why the Horde is as bad as everyone says it is. You can call something evil all you want, but until the audience truly witnesses such evil, it doesn't register, especially if every other scene features Horde soldiers being humanized.
    The thing is most bad people are more like Catra than the typical one note villain. They don't see themselves as the bad guy, in their head they're good guy they're the victim and everything bad they do is the rest of the world's fault. And they refuse to acept any responsibility for their actions.

    You want to talk about darkning things up, considering that show allready has parental abuse, boddy horror, main heroes getting killed off ect.

    Also I should point out that statisticly speaking most Phsychopaths aren't the kinds of serial killers you see in the movies. While they only care about themselves they generuly live pretty normal lives. For all you talk about these kind of things you desplay a dangarously limited understanding of them.
    Last edited by A Dalek; August 3, 2019 at 03:27pm.

  19. #94
    Widget Lord Exor's Avatar
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    I never said any villain worth taking seriously goes around proclaiming themselves as the "bad guy," nor did I ever say that ALL psychopaths (or more specifically, malignant narcissists in this case, although the disparities are vague in some instances) are evil geniuses like Palpatine/Darth Sidious. However, that doesn't preclude the fact that people resembling Palpatine on a basic level do actually exist even if they don't possess infernal powers or operate on such a grandiose scale. That being said, not even Palpatine sees himself as a villain; he does what he does because he's a narcissist that believes himself to be superior to everyone else, lacks any empathy whatsoever, and fancies himself a savior to lesser beings simply because he has control over their feeble existence. You don't even need a long-winded explanation of that, it only takes a surface level analysis to figure it out. He's also a sadist and--oh what do you know, we're checking off all the boxes for antisocial/psychopathic/malignantly narcissistic behavior. I take exception to this widespread and misbegotten belief that this kind of character is "one-note" and that there isn't any room for complexity. Likening complexity with sympathetic qualities is a false equivalence.

    I'm not saying every Horde Trooper needs to be a mini-Hitler, but the more you humanize almost every Horde soldier you see, the less we as an audience internalize them as a real threat, especially if they aren't doing anything objectively terrible outside of ostensibly conquering territory. That's why "faceless" armies are such a powerful psychological tool in both the real world and in fiction; deindividuation is a fascinating phenomenon. There's also something intrinsically horrifying about a dehumanized army of masked soldiers. Do you think Stormtroopers would be nearly as effective as an antagonistic force if we saw them hanging out with each other, playing darts, and offering consolation when LS-226 feels he's being ostracized at the lunch table? Of course not, although if that has to be done on even a small level, it can be quite effective when executed properly. Why don't we show Kyle do something horrific that he doesn't object to in the moment, but begins to slowly lose his composure over after the fact? PTSD? Overwhelming remorse? You can do this on a kids show without having to be so blunt as to depict Kyle murdering children.

    TL;DR, I never said every antagonist needs to be purely villainous, and I didn't even say that most of them should be like that. All I'm saying is that there's a time and a place for fitting both approaches to villains into a story, especially when the broad strokes of your entire plot are "evil empire vs. plucky rebellion." What makes the empire evil? We need to see more of that and less of poor Hordak feeling all fuzzy inside because no one's ever given him a hug before. And look, I get it, the very existence of Horde Prime makes it almost a necessity that Hordak be somewhat pitiful in comparison. I guess I'll just have to wait and see what happens; I just hope they have the sense not to ruin one of the big bad MOTU characters that's always been billed as the "ultimate evil dictator."

    As for potential positives, I did like the design of Horde Prime's throne room and the pipe organ music that played during his appearance. That could be encouraging I suppose.
    Last edited by Lord Exor; August 3, 2019 at 04:59pm.

  20. #95
    Heroic Warrior A Dalek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Exor View Post
    I never said any villain worth taking seriously goes around proclaiming themselves as the "bad guy," nor did I ever say that ALL psychopaths (or more specifically, malignant narcissists in this case, although the disparities are vague in some instances) are evil geniuses like Palpatine/Darth Sidious. However, that doesn't preclude the fact that people resembling Palpatine on a basic level do actually exist even if they don't possess infernal powers or operate on such a grandiose scale. That being said, not even Palpatine sees himself as a villain; he does what he does because he's a narcissist that believes himself to be superior to everyone else, lacks any empathy whatsoever, and fancies himself a savior to lesser beings simply because he has control over their feeble existence. You don't even need a long-winded explanation of that, it only takes a surface level analysis to figure it out. He's also a sadist and--oh what do you know, we're checking off all the boxes for antisocial/psychopathic/malignantly narcissistic behavior. I take exception to this widespread and misbegotten belief that this kind of character is "one-note" and that there isn't any room for complexity. Likening complexity with sympathetic qualities is a false equivalence.

    I'm not saying every Horde Trooper needs to be a mini-Hitler, but the more you humanize almost every Horde soldier you see, the less we as an audience internalize them as a real threat, especially if they aren't doing anything objectively terrible outside of ostensibly conquering territory. That's why "faceless" armies are such a powerful psychological tool in both the real world and in fiction; deindividuation is a fascinating phenomenon. There's also something intrinsically horrifying about a dehumanized army of masked soldiers. Do you think Stormtroopers would be nearly as effective as an antagonistic force if we saw them hanging out with each other, playing darts, and offering consolation when LS-226 feels he's being ostracized at the lunch table? Of course not, although if that has to be done on even a small level, it can be quite effective when executed properly. Why don't we show Kyle do something horrific that he doesn't object to in the moment, but begins to slowly lose his composure over after the fact? PTSD? Overwhelming remorse? You can do this on a kids show without having to be so blunt as to depict Kyle murdering children.

    TL;DR, I never said every antagonist needs to be purely villainous, and I didn't even say that most of them should be like that. All I'm saying is that there's a time and a place for fitting both approaches to villains into a story, especially when the broad strokes of your entire plot are "evil empire vs. plucky rebellion." What makes the empire evil? We need to see more of that and less of poor Hordak feeling all fuzzy inside because no one's ever given him a hug before.
    The problem their is that Hordak isn't really that sympathetic and while Catra kind of was it's arguable she isn't really anymore. You seem to asume that fleshing out villains and giving them motivations beyond power for powers sake, is the same as making them redeemable or sympathetic, when that isn't the case.

    I mentioned Kira from JoJo before as an example, he has lots of moments that humanize him and we understand why he is the way he is, none of that is treated as an excuse and the story makes it very clear that he's a monster who deserves what he gets in the end (for the record his head get's crushed by an amubulance and then his soul get's ripped apart and dragged to hell).

  21. #96
    Heroic Warrior Asher Tye's Avatar
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    It would seem Horde Prime is going to fill the role as an irredeemable narcissistic headcase. The guy made an army of his own clones, that's not someone who's particularly interested in others' perceptions.
    I am Imp's number one fan.

  22. #97
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    This new approach of She-ra gets better and better! I really love this new series!

  23. #98
    Ancient One zodak74's Avatar
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    Binged the six episodes last night and my immediate reaction was "Storytelling-wise, they just topped EVERYTHING any previous animated incarnation of either MOTU or PoP did in one six episode sweep!"
    While yes it would be nice to get longer seasons, I have to say I very much approve of this Quality Vs. Quantity approach. Nothing in this season felt like filler and everything seemed to push the story further and deeper along than Filmation was ever allowed to (or was interested in doing) back in the day.

    In that one expository scene with Entrapta, I loved "the explanation" for Hordak being on Etheria and his ultimate motivations. MYP back in the 200X series was a nice push in terms of character design, importance in the mythos, and giving Hordak a different role in the grander scheme of things than Filmation had. And I dug that and wish it had been further explored in a third season of THAT particular series. But, since that was never to be, I love that here, in Princesses Of Power, there's this completely different turn they've taken with Hordak and I can't wait to see how this all plays out in the remainder of the series' episodes.
    Also, and this is just personal preference here, but this version of Hordak and the Horde feels better to me than what they did with them in the recent DC comic book series.

  24. #99
    Widget Lord Exor's Avatar
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    Hordak is sympathetic; are you telling me you can't empathize with his feelings of insecurity and having to justify himself despite being labeled defective? Do those feelings not ironically mirror Catra's on some level? Did he not grow to appreciate Entrapta's company despite previously being cold and aloof? You seem to be conflating the definition of flat character with a static character. A flat character is one-dimensional and doesn't have any identifiable traits outside of their role in the story (think Unicron), while a static character is merely a character that never develops, either because there's no demand from the story, or their psychology simply doesn't allow for it. There are plenty of complete monsters that aren't flat characters, but do fall under the definition of static character, and there's nothing inherently wrong with the latter. I hate to bring up Palpatine again, but his character has far more to it than simply being the Bad Guy™.

    You're also considering a "fleshed out" character to be someone that isn't motivated purely by narcissism, megalomania, and grandiosity, despite those qualities being very real human traits. Someone not in possession of those traits isn't an intrinsically superior, more complex, or better-written character. What do you even consider to be "complex?" I'd say that as long as a character has a tangible personality, background, and motivation, they're complex enough.
    Last edited by Lord Exor; August 3, 2019 at 05:49pm.

  25. #100
    Ancient One zodak74's Avatar
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    Thank you for putting this into words!
    I would describe Hordak in this series as neither flat nor static and would argue that he's ten times more developed here than he has been in any previous media. Now, whether folks LIKE what they are doing with Hordak in this series in a matter of personal preference. But there's no denying that the writers on this show are giving most of the characters here way more development and thought and purpose than what came before.
    And, frankly, I really was not expecting that to be the case when the first promo images from this series were leaked.

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