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Thread: Spider-Man Out Of The MCU (Thanks To Sony) - Now Back In

  1. #26
    Heroic Warrior Krueger's Avatar
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    Umm, Disney owns FOX now. No such issues there. The X-Men and Fantastic Four are there to stay.

  2. #27
    Heroic Warrior Riddle of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonehead View Post
    Going from a 5% take to a 50% take is ludicrous, even for Disney. Don't get me wrong, Marvel Studios having complete creative control on the joint films is the reason they were so good. I don't deny it. Sony's Spider-Man films have been abysmal since Raimi left and Feige has been the best thing to happen to Spidey on the big screen.

    Just cause Marvel owns Spider-Man doesn't mean Sony should just roll over and do what Disney wants. They have rights. Remember, it was Sony and Fox who bailed out Marvel back in the 90's when they were almost bankrupt and in real danger of going out of business. Sony acquiring those rights helped save Marvel. If anything people should be grateful to Sony, and FOX, for what they did.
    I agree. Disney didn't even get involved and buy what was left until 2009 AFTER seeing the potential in these franchises on the big screen. Sony and Fox took the gamble even though those amounts paid are peanuts today. They invested, gambled and it paid off. Kudos to them. That's how it works.

    Let's not forget that Disney also paid peanuts for the rest of Marvel and Star Wars when you look back at it. Equally, they pulled those deals off so kudos to them.

    There's no denying that Disney's success shot Spider-Man's worth through the roof even before he was incorporated, but it is what it is. Disney has the money, if they really want the character make a better offer. At this juncture I'm willing to bet that it's more then a pride issue more then anything. Disney certainly isn't use to being in this position.

  3. #28
    Angast's #1 fan Bonehead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    But as a fan I could care less about Disney or Sony I just want him to come HOME why do you think the titles of the last two films were a little shot at Sony...I know Marvel is owned by Disney I just want them back at Marvel I felt this way since 2008 when it was just Marvel

    What you care about doesn't really matter. Sorry but it's true. You asked why people are defending Sony and I gave you a fact based answer.

    Marvel sold the rights to Sony to essentially save the company. Deal with it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Krueger View Post
    Umm, Disney owns FOX now. No such issues there. The X-Men and Fantastic Four are there to stay.
    Who said they didn't own them, as of today?

  4. #29
    Heroic Warrior Krueger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonehead View Post
    Who said they didn't own them, as of today?
    I can't recall who, but someone on the previous page seemed to imply that Disney’s agreement with using the X-Men and the Fantastic Four is similar to Sony's agreement with using Spider-Man. Obviously, as Disney owns FOX, its not. They can wait for as ever long as they want between films, and they still don’t have to worry about rights reverting back.

    And now its official: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/he...r_breakingnews
    Last edited by Krueger; August 21, 2019 at 10:46am.

  5. #30
    Heroic Warrior Lich Leech's Avatar
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    I really hope they go back to the table on this.

  6. #31
    Loco Motu Vato ehenyo's Avatar
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    Can the title of this thread be updated now so as to not blame Sony?
    "I wouldn't be surprised if this movie has Adam as a skinny nerd from Earth battling another skinny nerd-hacker from Earth that used an alias of Keldor. They then enter Tron-style to a cyber world called Eternia, where they control muscle-bound avatars to battle (called He-Man and Skeletor). And these same avatars come to life and continue to battle in present-day Earth." - VZX

  7. #32
    Heroic Warrior Krueger's Avatar
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    I still think something could be worked out, eventually. Still, Sony were being yanked very hard (50/50 split is quite ridiculous, IMO), so I'm really not surprised they decided to walk away. Venom 2 and Morbius just got all the more interesting.

  8. #33
    Heroic Warrior wyldman11's Avatar
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    https://io9.gizmodo.com/spider-man-s...men-1837438904
    more news with sony clarifying somethings.
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  9. #34
    The First Avenger Megalodon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ehenyo View Post
    Can the title of this thread be updated now so as to not blame Sony?
    No because it is mainly Sony trying to keep it from Disney even though Marvel Studios would benefit they don't want to sell even though in the past this came up and there are still rumblings about it:

    https://nypost.com/2019/04/08/hedgie...ment-division/

    If this is true they should sell Spider-Man back to Disney/Marvel because if a sale happens Marvel/Disney would get it back free or charge now why if you can make something out of nothing would you not SELL????

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/markhug.../#5a281e9e6b50

    And READ this to all of the people this is TRUTH and it makes sense...if you can't see this then I can't help you...

  10. #35
    Heroic Warrior wyldman11's Avatar
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    Maybe our lord and saviour can save us all from this fiasco

    https://www.instagram.com/p/B1biFn3DDyh/

    And as a preform rebuttal, I have a Jane Foster Thor figure and have read the series and liked it.
    One Gum Drop to rule them all, One Gum Drop to find them,
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    -Tag line for the Candy Land Movie Adaptation

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  11. #36
    The First Avenger Megalodon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wyldman11 View Post
    Maybe our lord and saviour can save us all from this fiasco

    https://www.instagram.com/p/B1biFn3DDyh/

    And as a preform rebuttal, I have a Jane Foster Thor figure and have read the series and liked it.
    Awesome!

  12. #37
    Heroic Warrior PantherCult's Avatar
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    What's interesting about this whole thing is that Marvel Studios/Disney really gave Sony the leverage to play hard ball on this. After Amazing Spider-Man 2 was a dud, Sony was adrift about what to do with the Spider-Man property. There was a real chance that the character could suffer ever diminishing returns on their movie attempts and endless reboots - exactly like what happened with Fantastic Four at Fox. Had Disney simply let Sony squirm with that - they probably could have come in with a cash offer to buy back the movie rights to the character and convinced Sony to do it. Instead, they struck a deal that completely revitalized Spider-Man in the eyes of the movie going public and increased the value of the character rights so significantly that Sony can thumb their nose at Marvel.

    Yes, into the Spiderverse was a big hit and a great movie... but I'm not sure Sony has the confidence to release it without the success of the MCU Spider-Man efforts.

    The impasse they have here is disappointing for fans of the connected MCU. Having Spider-Man appear in other movies in the franchise would have been fun. But it's not like the MCU needs Spider-Man - they did fine before they had him and they have access to a bunch of other characters now with the X-Men and FF back in the fold.

    What will be really interesting is watching to see if Sony is able to keep the live action Spider-Man movies as popular without the ties to the MCU.

    Eventually Disney is likely to flex enough muscle or flash enough cash to get the rights to one of their flagship characters back. But they'll probably see if Sony shoots themselves in the foot with some disappointing movies first.

  13. #38
    The First Avenger Megalodon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PantherCult View Post
    What's interesting about this whole thing is that Marvel Studios/Disney really gave Sony the leverage to play hard ball on this. After Amazing Spider-Man 2 was a dud, Sony was adrift about what to do with the Spider-Man property. There was a real chance that the character could suffer ever diminishing returns on their movie attempts and endless reboots - exactly like what happened with Fantastic Four at Fox. Had Disney simply let Sony squirm with that - they probably could have come in with a cash offer to buy back the movie rights to the character and convinced Sony to do it. Instead, they struck a deal that completely revitalized Spider-Man in the eyes of the movie going public and increased the value of the character rights so significantly that Sony can thumb their nose at Marvel.

    Yes, into the Spiderverse was a big hit and a great movie... but I'm not sure Sony has the confidence to release it without the success of the MCU Spider-Man efforts.

    The impasse they have here is disappointing for fans of the connected MCU. Having Spider-Man appear in other movies in the franchise would have been fun. But it's not like the MCU needs Spider-Man - they did fine before they had him and they have access to a bunch of other characters now with the X-Men and FF back in the fold.

    What will be really interesting is watching to see if Sony is able to keep the live action Spider-Man movies as popular without the ties to the MCU.

    Eventually Disney is likely to flex enough muscle or flash enough cash to get the rights to one of their flagship characters back. But they'll probably see if Sony shoots themselves in the foot with some disappointing movies first.
    See this is what I mean Marvel should have ALL of their characters rights back just like DC (Warner Brothers) has all of theirs it makes sense they created them but what I am hearing is that maybe DC is going away?

    https://boundingintocomics.com/2019/...dia-under-att/

    Now I don't want Disney to buy DC give it to another Studio but what will happen is this does go down?
    Last edited by Megalodon; August 21, 2019 at 06:15pm.

  14. #39
    Heroic Warrior wyldman11's Avatar
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    What saved marvel at the theatres was a group of individuals that realized much like John Lassiter that you can make entertainment for kids while still entertaining for adults.

    Warner is still trying to make DC movies for adults. They got lucky people liked Wonder Woman, Aquaman and to some extent Suicide Squad. Those movies while good could have been far better if they had been handled like the current MCU movies, aside from making Wonder Woman into Captain Marvel. Not sure how well received Shazam was, it had the right concept but still felt too dark in it's filming and handing over various things.

    Marvel and Disney as a whole does need to watch where they are going with one issue, but that's been discussed elsewhere and I probably should have been careful with the jab about that earlier.

    Some counter points, from my understanding Sony isn't getting much in the way of profit from the figures etc that are being produced where as Disney gets (what does go to hasbro) most of the money from that. Also props to Sony coming out and clarifying some of what went down. That isn't not that things are splitting Feige probably won't be as hands on with Spider-man products in the future. Which is a big difference from no more Spidey in marvel movies.
    One Gum Drop to rule them all, One Gum Drop to find them,
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  15. #40
    The First Avenger Megalodon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wyldman11 View Post
    What saved marvel at the theatres was a group of individuals that realized much like John Lassiter that you can make entertainment for kids while still entertaining for adults.

    Warner is still trying to make DC movies for adults. They got lucky people liked Wonder Woman, Aquaman and to some extent Suicide Squad. Those movies while good could have been far better if they had been handled like the current MCU movies, aside from making Wonder Woman into Captain Marvel. Not sure how well received Shazam was, it had the right concept but still felt too dark in it's filming and handing over various things.

    Marvel and Disney as a whole does need to watch where they are going with one issue, but that's been discussed elsewhere and I probably should have been careful with the jab about that earlier.

    Some counter points, from my understanding Sony isn't getting much in the way of profit from the figures etc that are being produced where as Disney gets (what does go to hasbro) most of the money from that. Also props to Sony coming out and clarifying some of what went down. That isn't not that things are splitting Feige probably won't be as hands on with Spider-man products in the future. Which is a big difference from no more Spidey in marvel movies.
    Marvel and Disney as a whole does need to watch where they are going with one issue, but that's been discussed elsewhere and I probably should have been careful with the jab about that earlier.
    What was it?

    And Disney/Marvel owns 100% of the toy royalties....

  16. #41
    Angast's #1 fan Bonehead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lich Leech View Post
    I really hope they go back to the table on this.
    They will. I don't think Sony really wants to screw up something this good.


    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    No because it is mainly Sony trying to keep it from Disney even though Marvel Studios would benefit they don't want to sell even though in the past this came up and there are still rumblings about it:
    No it's Marvel being extremely greedy. Sony in good faith bought the rights years ago and helped bail Marvel out of bankruptcy. The deal proposed by Disney is ludicrous. If you wanna blame anyone blame Marvel Entertainment Group/Toy Biz for selling the rights to Sony for only $7 million dollars. Marvel got the $7 million dollars they asked for the rights. Sony did nothing wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by wyldman11 View Post
    Maybe our lord and saviour can save us all from this fiasco
    God I hate her. I really did enjoy Captain Marvel and she was great in it but she's just so annoying in real life.



    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    See this is what I mean Marvel should have ALL of their characters rights back just like DC (Warner Brothers) has all of theirs it makes sense they created them ...
    Well Marvel screwed up and sold them. It's their own fault. They needed money to help keep the company from going under. Selling the rights was one of the few things they had that was profitable. I honestly don't think you realize how close Marvel came to closing up shop back in the late 90's. Had they gone under, it's likely these characters wouldn't be anywhere near as popular as they are today. Disney never would have bought the company, and we'd have no MCU or books. They could have been bought by WB and we'd really be in trouble.

    Disney knew all of this before they bought Marvel so it's not like this was unseen. They knew what problems they would be facing.

  17. #42
    Heroic Warrior wyldman11's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    What was it?

    And Disney/Marvel owns 100% of the toy royalties....
    Bonehead got it. And I agree with him on the movie. But how she's acted about it in real life and how she was handled in Endgame wasn't that great. I was being sarcastic about her being our lord and saviour. Well I liked the movie till the last 10 minutes or so. Well and Skrull portrayal, but that is more they are different in the comics.

    If she does pick up the hammer in the movies I might be done. Which is why I said I like Jane as Thor. Need to catch up in the comics. Also interesting to see what they do with Thor 4 with that storyline.
    One Gum Drop to rule them all, One Gum Drop to find them,
    One Gum Drop to bring them all and in the sweetness bind them
    In the Land of Candy where the Gingerbreads lie.
    -Tag line for the Candy Land Movie Adaptation

    There are sentences I should just stay a way from. - The Doctor

    Rob Liefeld isn't a comic artist, he's a women's clothing designer. Think about it

  18. #43
    Heroic Warrior Cringe's Avatar
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    I've really enjoyed the re-imagining of Spider-Man that Disney and Sony have come up with and loved seeing him play a part in major movements of the MCU, but I think it's important to get some perspective on this:

    First off, the best Spider-Man movie of all time, without any doubt, has been Into The Spider-Verse. That had nothing at all to do with Disney or the Sony/Disney deal.

    Secondly, moving forward, when Sony continues to make Spider-Man films with Tom Holland et al, nothing needs to change about the tone of the film or the friendly neighbourhood they take place in. All of the important parts of the Spider-Man world are included in the license that Sony has, including all the villains you'd really want to see Spidey take on. The only thing that will be missing from a Spider-Man 3 in this world, are cameos etc. from other MCU characters.

    In my opinion, that's actually a very good thing. I loved Far From Home, but there has definitely been a move away from the Friendly Neighbourhood part of the Spider-Man world. The stakes get too high, too quick. He's suddenly basically Iron Man the Second by the end of Far From Home, and I'm getting a little tired of the studio trying to pop the audience with constant cheap cameos, references or never-ending callbacks to Iron Man. I don't like just how much this Spider-Man relies on Tony Stark, even after he's dead. Having that element of the story surgically removed can only be a good thing. Bring Spidey back to basics - lose the Iron Spider suits and tech reliance. Lose the supporting cast of MCU C-list players and get on with telling a separate, engaging Peter Parker story with that excellent cast of Spider-Verse characters that deserve the screen time over Jon Favreau and Sam Jackson.
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  19. #44
    The First Avenger Megalodon's Avatar
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    Too many people are Sheep...Sony saved Marvel in the 1990's so what that was then this is 2019 I want all Marvel home don't care about other studios not letting that happen

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Bonehead View Post
    They will. I don't think Sony really wants to screw up something this good.




    No it's Marvel being extremely greedy. Sony in good faith bought the rights years ago and helped bail Marvel out of bankruptcy. The deal proposed by Disney is ludicrous. If you wanna blame anyone blame Marvel Entertainment Group/Toy Biz for selling the rights to Sony for only $7 million dollars. Marvel got the $7 million dollars they asked for the rights. Sony did nothing wrong.



    God I hate her. I really did enjoy Captain Marvel and she was great in it but she's just so annoying in real life.





    Well Marvel screwed up and sold them. It's their own fault. They needed money to help keep the company from going under. Selling the rights was one of the few things they had that was profitable. I honestly don't think you realize how close Marvel came to closing up shop back in the late 90's. Had they gone under, it's likely these characters wouldn't be anywhere near as popular as they are today. Disney never would have bought the company, and we'd have no MCU or books. They could have been bought by WB and we'd really be in trouble.

    Disney knew all of this before they bought Marvel so it's not like this was unseen. They knew what problems they would be facing.
    Read the links next time before you respond maybe you might LEARN something

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Cringe View Post
    I've really enjoyed the re-imagining of Spider-Man that Disney and Sony have come up with and loved seeing him play a part in major movements of the MCU, but I think it's important to get some perspective on this:

    First off, the best Spider-Man movie of all time, without any doubt, has been Into The Spider-Verse. That had nothing at all to do with Disney or the Sony/Disney deal.

    Secondly, moving forward, when Sony continues to make Spider-Man films with Tom Holland et al, nothing needs to change about the tone of the film or the friendly neighbourhood they take place in. All of the important parts of the Spider-Man world are included in the license that Sony has, including all the villains you'd really want to see Spidey take on. The only thing that will be missing from a Spider-Man 3 in this world, are cameos etc. from other MCU characters.

    In my opinion, that's actually a very good thing. I loved Far From Home, but there has definitely been a move away from the Friendly Neighbourhood part of the Spider-Man world. The stakes get too high, too quick. He's suddenly basically Iron Man the Second by the end of Far From Home, and I'm getting a little tired of the studio trying to pop the audience with constant cheap cameos, references or never-ending callbacks to Iron Man. I don't like just how much this Spider-Man relies on Tony Stark, even after he's dead. Having that element of the story surgically removed can only be a good thing. Bring Spidey back to basics - lose the Iron Spider suits and tech reliance. Lose the supporting cast of MCU C-list players and get on with telling a separate, engaging Peter Parker story with that excellent cast of Spider-Verse characters that deserve the screen time over Jon Favreau and Sam Jackson.
    And don't you THINK that if it was 100% Disney he would have more face time in the MCU??

    I don't get the thinking of some people why not just sell every marvel character to a different studio (again) and once that's done convince Warner Brothers/DC to do the same so everyone can be in on the fun and never crossover...

    So we can do this again with fighting studious and egos and money getting in the way instead of the people that TRULY count the fans and or people that buy the merchandise....I really could care less about who's ego is bigger just want who created it to get it back it has a better track record...but alas some people would spend money watching paint dry or something similar like that than NOT paying for or watching it and making them CHANGE the product instead of having some executive change it because "He or she likes it like that"

    Please....

    When you spend money on crap you get crap back but some people I guess do not care...And I am tired or only certain people's opinion's mattering because all do right not just some?

    So the fans that do not accept sub par material should not be heard and the accepted sub par crap should be the normal because people don't know and better? WOW! what happened to saying something is sucks or bad and not getting stoned...My god we have accepted anything no matter how bad it is...
    Last edited by Megalodon; August 22, 2019 at 07:21pm.

  20. #45
    Heroic Warrior IceyCat's Avatar
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    Lee's daughter puts Disney on blast:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT2AuO0huk0

    Another video on the issue:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joWYVDk04CE
    Last edited by IceyCat; August 22, 2019 at 09:44pm.
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  21. #46
    The First Avenger Megalodon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceyCat View Post
    Lee's daughter puts Disney on blast:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT2AuO0huk0

    Another video on the issue:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joWYVDk04CE
    You should read the links I posted.. that's more on the money

  22. #47
    Loco Motu Vato ehenyo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    No because it is mainly Sony trying to keep it from Disney even though Marvel Studios would benefit they don't want to sell even though in the past this came up and there are still rumblings about it:

    https://nypost.com/2019/04/08/hedgie...ment-division/

    If this is true they should sell Spider-Man back to Disney/Marvel because if a sale happens Marvel/Disney would get it back free or charge now why if you can make something out of nothing would you not SELL????

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/markhug.../#5a281e9e6b50

    And READ this to all of the people this is TRUTH and it makes sense...if you can't see this then I can't help you...
    Thank you for sharing. However, it can be shaded any number of ways, but 50/50 is still a bad deal for Sony. Whether it's for production costs or revenues, Disney dropped the ball - it can't get any clearer than that - especially with them getting all revenues from licensing. It's basic business. (Also, please note that the second article has some historical coverage, but it is not all TRUTH - a lot of it theorizes.)
    "I wouldn't be surprised if this movie has Adam as a skinny nerd from Earth battling another skinny nerd-hacker from Earth that used an alias of Keldor. They then enter Tron-style to a cyber world called Eternia, where they control muscle-bound avatars to battle (called He-Man and Skeletor). And these same avatars come to life and continue to battle in present-day Earth." - VZX

  23. #48
    Heroic Warrior GP Legend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceyCat View Post
    Lee's daughter puts Disney on blast:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT2AuO0huk0

    Another video on the issue:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joWYVDk04CE
    Read up on Lee's daughter. Take whatever she says with a massive grain of salt.

  24. #49
    Heroic Warrior PantherCult's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    Too many people are Sheep...Sony saved Marvel in the 1990's so what that was then this is 2019 I want all Marvel home don't care about other studios not letting that happen
    This cracks me up. Why should Sony care at all about what any single fan wants? They bought the rights to Spider-Man fairly for the appropriate asking price at the time. Disney bought Marvel long after the Sony deal happened with full knowledge that they didn't have the rights to that set of characters.

    Of course it would be nice if Disney had the movie rights to all of it's characters so it didn't have these limitations. But it does. Spider-Man isn't the only one they are in this boat with, incidentally. Universal still has the distribution rights to any Hulk movie - which is why there hasn't been any further Hulk films. That deal is looser than the one with Sony - it allows Marvel to use Hulk in other movies, but any Hulk title movie has to be distributed by Universal. That's why we get plenty of Hulk in Avengers films, and even in Thor Ragnarok, but not any further solo Hulk features.

    The problem for Disney is that Sony and Universal have no incentive to simply give them their characters back. And they have all the leverage right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    I don't get the thinking of some people why not just sell every marvel character to a different studio (again) and once that's done convince Warner Brothers/DC to do the same so everyone can be in on the fun and never crossover...
    I don't see many people advocating for this really. But Marvel already sold the rights to as many characters as they could to other studios. The good news for them was that many of those rights reverted back to them based on contracts - Blade, Ghost Rider, Daredevil, Punisher. And then their acquisition of Fox brought X-Men and FF back too - though we haven't even seen that bear fruit in the MCU yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
    So we can do this again with fighting studious and egos and money getting in the way instead of the people that TRULY count the fans and or people that buy the merchandise....I really could care less about who's ego is bigger just want who created it to get it back it has a better track record...but alas some people would spend money watching paint dry or something similar like that than NOT paying for or watching it and making them CHANGE the product instead of having some executive change it because "He or she likes it like that"
    I don't really know what you are on about here. The rights issue in question is entirely an argument about money between two gigantic international corporations. It has very little to do with "ego", etc.
    Last edited by PantherCult; August 23, 2019 at 02:08pm.

  25. #50
    Heroic Daddy to Hermione! Uki's Avatar
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    I know many of us are invested in the topic, but can we please remember to discuss it with respect for one another?
    MOTUC Most Wanted: Skeleteen, Prince Keldor, Captain Randor, The Great Black Wizard, Lady Slither, Spirit, Tuvar, Baddra, Cursed Marzo, Tug-O-War, Scrollos, Songster, Mini-Comics Spirit of Castle Grayskull, and for the love of the Sorceress and Julie Winston, ODIPHUS!!!

    Instagram: Just_Thommy

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