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Thread: Season 5 on May 15th

  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by zodak74 View Post
    Is it weird that I just thought of Mara as being tanned, like Filmation He-Man? I never once took what her race might have been into account.
    You think she is black ? Really?


    I cant remember her.
    Any pixs?

  2. #302
    Ancient One zodak74's Avatar
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    That's actually the opposite of what I said. For lack of a better way of saying it, I always thought she was just a tan white girl.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zodak74 View Post
    Is it weird that I just thought of Mara as being tanned, like Filmation He-Man? I never once took what her race might have been into account.
    Respectfully, there's nothing 'weird" about not considering her or anyone's race...or for that matter, their sexual orientation. You're to be commended for that mindset.

  4. #304
    Ancient One zodak74's Avatar
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    Not to go too much on a tangent, but thinking about what you just said and yes- I think it's a credit to what this show did so very well... once you started getting absorbed into this show's world, you never gave any of this (sexuality, race, gender) much of a thought because none of it was presented in a "this is A REALLY BIG DEAL GUYS!" kind of way.
    And that is how it should be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    Judging based on several interviews and events over the course of the series, it almost feels as if the She-Ra crew originally intended for Adora's parents and Adam to exist and be alive in this universe, as an idea in the background that they would never explore, but purposefully left this part of the story extremely vague and open-ended so they could be free to do what felt right once they reached the final season or the show ended. Either that, or perhaps an executive stepped in at some point, asking them to completely sever any perceived ties to He-Man et al or dial back any public commentary so as to manage expectations on upcoming MotU projects.

    This was one of a few comments about MotU:

    “It’s sort of a dance of figuring out how to incorporate the larger lore of Masters of the Universe without needing to visit Eternia or see these very, very iconic characters appear,” she says. “Just letting it be about She-Ra’s story and her being disconnected from where she came from, from her family on Eternia.”

    Then late last year Noelle and AJ expressed interest in doing a Christmas crossover special with Kevin Smith's Revelations. Some folks thought they were just joking around and not at all serious about the idea. However, in some past interviews, Noelle would sometimes tell stories about crew members bringing off the wall ideas to her and then her reaction being an enthusiastic: 'That's strange, but let's do it!' I seem to recall a few instances of her going with the flow, for lack of a better way of putting it. That's why I thought there was a chance they were dead serious about wanting an X-mas crossover.

    Anyhow...

    Maybe I misunderstood something, but even in the final season it seems Horde Prime has a hazy or no recollection about things having to do with the First Ones and Etheria... even after reading the mind of the clone from that time. There's some uncertainty there.

    For example, in the episode "Save the Cat" Horde Prime says:

    "I thought the First Ones were all gone, but clearly some faction remains."

    then later:

    "...the last of the First Ones to fall at my hands."

    Did I miss something?
    Yes, clearly Noelle originally wanted to leave the possibility open for Adam, Marlena and Randor to exist out there in Adora's "home world", but even if Mattel eventually stepped in and put the breaks on them venturing into that territory - I think Noelle owed it to the viewers to bring some kind of resolution to Adora's existential question about her origins, which became a major character arc for her half-way through the series. Even if they could no longer allude to a He-Man crossover, they should have said that Horde Prime destroyed her birth planet after she was brought to Etheria - it would have made her story all the more poignant, as the implication would be that Adora wouldn't even exist anymore had Light Hope not 'kidnapped' her through a portal.

    The whole She-Ra mythos on the new show was extremely convoluted and self-contradictory. Mara and Adora are both supposed to be "First Ones" from another planet originally, on the one hand, and yet it's supposed to be the PLANET OF ETHERIA that chooses and bestows its magical powers upon whoever becomes 'She-Ra'? In other words, there apparently hasn't been anyone worthy of becoming She-Ra on Etheria itself for the past 2,000 years or so at least, and hence an "alien/outsider" has to become Etheria's Guardian.

    And yes, I really wish Noelle had made up her mind and not had Horde Prime himself go back and forth about the state/fate of the First Ones. Again, the only way I could make sense of seemingly contradictory statements like the quotes you provided was that there WAS a faction of the First Ones that remained during a previous incarnation of Horde Prime (i.e: the clone he was mind-reading), but then between that incarnation/clone and his CURRENT form, even that faction was destroyed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heeeere's Olesker! View Post
    Respectfully, there's nothing 'weird" about not considering her or anyone's race...or for that matter, their sexual orientation. You're to be commended for that mindset.
    Certainly the content of MARA'S character was much more noble and pure than Adora's, from everything we saw. Mara was a truly sympathetic heroine. Adora was the 'flawed' heroine - nothing wrong with that, but I think the "content of her character" was inferior to Mara's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zodak74 View Post
    Not to go too much on a tangent, but thinking about what you just said and yes- I think it's a credit to what this show did so very well... once you started getting absorbed into this show's world, you never gave any of this (sexuality, race, gender) much of a thought because none of it was presented in a "this is A REALLY BIG DEAL GUYS!" kind of way.
    And that is how it should be.
    Not regarding Race and Sexual Orientation with due consideration actually IS a big deal, because it totally ignores and undermines the persecution that human beings have suffered for hundreds and thousands of years on ACCOUNT of their Race and/or Sexual orientation. It is very regressive and backwards to portray a White, Blonde character as "superior" to the other characters who DO NOT fit the White, Blonde, Aryan mold.

    And Mara was definitely not just "tan" like He-Man. She was a dark-skinned character, who would be considered "ethnic" in America. The comparison with He-Man is invalid anyway because Prince Adam was clearly a Blonde, Caucasian who simply gained a tan when he turned into He-Man. Mara on the other hand was a dark-skinned, dark-haired girl...........who suddenly 'becomes' blonde when she turns into She-Ra, the supposedly more "heroic" version of herself (not a good message).

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    The whole She-Ra mythos on the new show was extremely convoluted and self-contradictory. Mara and Adora are both supposed to be "First Ones" from another planet originally, on the one hand, and yet it's supposed to be the PLANET OF ETHERIA that chooses and bestows its magical powers upon whoever becomes 'She-Ra'? In other words, there apparently hasn't been anyone worthy of becoming She-Ra on Etheria itself for the past 2,000 years or so at least, and hence an "alien/outsider" has to become Etheria's Guardian.
    Magic is a naturally-occuring resource on Etheria. The First Ones used the runestones to focus it, and created the Heart of Etheria to weaponize it. There is no indication that the power of She-Ra comes from Etheria. To the contrary, that is why Adora calls upon Grayskull, which is on Eternia. Even the princesses who are native to Etheria are not necessarily connected to its magic. Case in point: Entrapta.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Certainly the content of MARA'S character was much more noble and pure than Adora's, from everything we saw. Mara was a truly sympathetic heroine. Adora was the 'flawed' heroine - nothing wrong with that, but I think the "content of her character" was inferior to Mara's.
    Based on the five minutes of collective screentime she had in the series? You are comparing Mara's greatest moments to every moment of Adora's life for a year.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    It is very regressive and backwards to portray a White, Blonde character as "superior" to the other characters who DO NOT fit the White, Blonde, Aryan mold.

    And Mara was definitely not just "tan" like He-Man. She was a dark-skinned character, who would be considered "ethnic" in America. The comparison with He-Man is invalid anyway because Prince Adam was clearly a Blonde, Caucasian who simply gained a tan when he turned into He-Man. Mara on the other hand was a dark-skinned, dark-haired girl...........who suddenly 'becomes' blonde when she turns into She-Ra, the supposedly more "heroic" version of herself (not a good message).
    By virtue of being the titular character of the series, She-Ra is going to be presented as "superior" to the other characters—it is her story. She also happens to be blonde. Those things are not mutually exclusive.

    Mara originally appeared in the New Adventures of He-Man. She was not She-Ra in that series. She also happens to be brunette. Mara is the King Grayskull analog to She-Ra in the Princesses of Power series. And just as Adam looks like King Grayskull when he is He-Man, Adora looks like Mara when she is She-Ra. For that to work, Mara's She-Ra also needed to be blonde.

    There is nothing backwards, regressive, or "not a good message about it," unless someone is looking for a reason to be offended.

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by zodak74 View Post
    Is it weird that I just thought of Mara as being tanned, like Filmation He-Man? I never once took what her race might have been into account.
    Me too, i knew she had those amazing purple eyes but i started realising she could be more "diverse" than i realised when i opened her MOTUC blister card and looked in her face. She somehow reminded me of those Bollywood actresses who mix modern looks with some traditional elements.
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  8. #308
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    https://www.google.com/search?q=she+...7PVDNB-f0HJhLM

    She looks just like a bruntette to me.
    Maybe a bit tanned

  9. #309
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    Adora having the hero complex was integral to the crew's underlying message to the viewers and the end game for the series.

    Many of the characters were given issues to work through, and Adora's stemmed from having her world view shaken and feeling responsible for pushing Catra further to the side of darkness. Noelle has talked about this at length throughout the run of the series. How Adora takes agency away from the people around her and almost shows a lack of faith in their assertions, even though this fatal flaw of trying to take control and all of the burden is coming from a place of good intentions.

    My takeaway from the series is that She-Ra could not save Etheria and the universe on her own. She needed to rely on the power of friendship and love and those with more experience. I feel like the creatives' tried to highlight this in the series and interviews and were thoughtful and self-aware. For example, She-Ra was quite ineffectual in "The Battle of Bright Moon." It wasn't until Mermista Perfuma, and Frosta arrived that She-Ra's confidence was restored. Ultimately it was their collective princess connection and the power of friendship that turned the tide.
    Last edited by Tallstar; May 24, 2020 at 09:18am.
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  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    Adora having the hero complex was integral to the crew's underlying message to the viewers and the end game for the series.

    Many of the characters were given issues to work through, and Adora's stemmed from having her world view shaken and feeling responsible for pushing Catra further to the side of darkness. Noelle has talked about this at length throughout the run of the series. How Adora takes agency away from the people around her and almost shows a lack of faith in their assertions, even though this fatal flaw of trying to take control and all of the burden is coming from a place of good intentions.

    My takeaway from the series is that She-Ra could not save Etheria and the universe on her own. She needed to rely on the power of friendship and love and those with more experience. I feel like the creatives' tried to highlight this in the series and interviews and were thoughtful and self-aware. For example, She-Ra was quite ineffectual in "The Battle of Bright Moon." It wasn't until Mermista Perfuma, and Frosta arrived that She-Ra's confidence was restored. Ultimately it was their collective princess connection and the power of friendship that turned the tide.
    My daughter watches my lil pony cartoons, maybe this She-Ra takes something from that idea.

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  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam_Prince of Eternia View Post
    Magic is a naturally-occuring resource on Etheria. The First Ones used the runestones to focus it, and created the Heart of Etheria to weaponize it. There is no indication that the power of She-Ra comes from Etheria. To the contrary, that is why Adora calls upon Grayskull, which is on Eternia. Even the princesses who are native to Etheria are not necessarily connected to its magic. Case in point: Entrapta.
    Actually Noelle Stevenson has revealed on Twitter that Castle Grayskull does not exist in the new She-Ra show's continuity. She has said outright that all Grayskull was in this series was a Rebel Squadron led by Mara. So Adora says "For the Honor of Grayskull" as a rallying cry to fight in Mara's name. There is no Castle Grayskull in this show's universe, and if there ever was an Eternia, it certainly doesn't exist any more.


    Based on the five minutes of collective screentime she had in the series? You are comparing Mara's greatest moments to every moment of Adora's life for a year.
    I'm with Ethereal on this one. Mara was written extremely well and her voice actress did a stellar job. She would have been a far more endearing lead character for the show than Adora was.


    Mara originally appeared in the New Adventures of He-Man. She was not She-Ra in that series. She also happens to be brunette. Mara is the King Grayskull analog to She-Ra in the Princesses of Power series. And just as Adam looks like King Grayskull when he is He-Man, Adora looks like Mara when she is She-Ra. For that to work, Mara's She-Ra also needed to be blonde.
    That logic does not flow within the new show's context. People seem to keep forgetting that it was stated outright in the first season that there were multiple She-Ras throughout the millennia - hundreds if not thousands of different She-Ras, all who wore the same attire. Mara was the last She-Ra before Adora, so Mara was not the 'original' She-Ra at all. She was taking on the standard appearance of She-Ra, which happened to be blonde - and I stand with Ethereal on this, to make Mara's She-Ra blonde when she was clearly not of Caucasian ethnicity was an insensitive move.

    There is nothing backwards, regressive, or "not a good message about it," unless someone is looking for a reason to be offended.
    There is regressive nonsense all over the new She-Ra, and lots of very careless moves from writers who love to virtue-signal about how socially conscious they are. And there's so much poor writing in the final season that you could write a book about it.

    (For the record, I LOVED the new show until the final season, which I found a colossal let-down and completely turned my view of the show on its head.)
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  12. #312
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    Rae answered several questions on their Tumblr.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallstar View Post
    Rae answered several questions on their Tumblr.

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    The infatuation with ships by the staff can be a bit much at times. It makes it feel like 6 year olds to 10 year olds were definitely not the key target.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly View Post
    The infatuation with ships by the staff can be a bit much at times.
    A bit much?

    You are very diplomatic here.

    And whats that with Jewelstar? Why should he be trans? Let him be a born male when you already turned him from female to male. And when would he have to the time undergo surgery and hormone therapy? During a war transitioning might be quite difficult.

    And no im not bashing here im irritated. If you want to educate people on those matters do it wisely and in the correct way. Transitioning is not a sprint its a marathon and not an easy path.
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    This reaction is wonderful ,especially the last part.(35:00)
    It's great see people feel represented by a show , it is the great legacy of this series .
    It was a very important show for a group of people/community.


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    Quote Originally Posted by heavy-eternium View Post
    This reaction is wonderful ,especially the last part.(35:00)
    It's great see people feel represented by a show , it is the great legacy of this series .
    It was a very important show for a group of people/community.

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  17. #317
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    I don't get this perception that Adora's actions aren't ultimately pure or noble just because she has certain issues. At the end of the day she was still a very selfless person, who consistently put others before herself.

    I don't buy this argument that she's just some jerk with a hero complex and not a genuinely heroic person.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zodak74 View Post
    Not to go too much on a tangent, but thinking about what you just said and yes- I think it's a credit to what this show did so very well... once you started getting absorbed into this show's world, you never gave any of this (sexuality, race, gender) much of a thought because none of it was presented in a "this is A REALLY BIG DEAL GUYS!" kind of way.
    And that is how it should be.
    Agreed 100%.

    As I've said before, our son's 5th grade class -- at a Catholic school! -- covered a novel in class in which a character happened to be gay. I italicized 'happened' because the character's sexual orientation had no impact on or relationship to the novel's storyline. To their credit, the entire class accepted the character for just being who he is. It was, as my son said, "No big thing." This is how we have raised all of our children. But that the entire class felt this way gives me hope for the future.

  19. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosquitor View Post
    Actually Noelle Stevenson has revealed on Twitter that Castle Grayskull does not exist in the new She-Ra show's continuity. She has said outright that all Grayskull was in this series was a Rebel Squadron led by Mara. So Adora says "For the Honor of Grayskull" as a rallying cry to fight in Mara's name. There is no Castle Grayskull in this show's universe, and if there ever was an Eternia, it certainly doesn't exist any more.




    I'm with Ethereal on this one. Mara was written extremely well and her voice actress did a stellar job. She would have been a far more endearing lead character for the show than Adora was.




    That logic does not flow within the new show's context. People seem to keep forgetting that it was stated outright in the first season that there were multiple She-Ras throughout the millennia - hundreds if not thousands of different She-Ras, all who wore the same attire. Mara was the last She-Ra before Adora, so Mara was not the 'original' She-Ra at all. She was taking on the standard appearance of She-Ra, which happened to be blonde - and I stand with Ethereal on this, to make Mara's She-Ra blonde when she was clearly not of Caucasian ethnicity was an insensitive move.



    There is regressive nonsense all over the new She-Ra, and lots of very careless moves from writers who love to virtue-signal about how socially conscious they are. And there's so much poor writing in the final season that you could write a book about it.

    (For the record, I LOVED the new show until the final season, which I found a colossal let-down and completely turned my view of the show on its head.)

  20. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosquitor View Post
    Very good point about Mara. She was a much more interesting and likeable heroine than Adora, she would have made a great lead character. Mara was clearly a bit older than Adora was at the time she was She-Ra, and I've heard some fans say she was more like Filmation's She-Ra in personality. Either way she was definitely a lot more interesting and would have made a better protagonist. (I felt the MYP series made a similar mistake with King Grayskull - while I've never been a fan of the idea behind the character or his design, personality-wise he was more interesting than Adam/He-Man, which made the current-day conflict on Eternia less appealing.)

    And I see your point about the 'White Saviour' thing as well, particularly as Adora is pretty much Aryan in appearance... that is one of several areas in which I felt the show's politics came across as unwittingly regressive and backward, even though this was supposed to be a progressive and inclusive show.
    White savior? you mean like Avatar, Man called Horse, Dances with Wolves, Last Samurai, Lawrence of Arabia, Frank Herbert's Dune and all?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niki View Post
    And whats that with Jewelstar? Why should he be trans? Let him be a born male when you already turned him from female to male. And when would he have to the time undergo surgery and hormone therapy? During a war transitioning might be quite difficult.

    And no im not bashing here im irritated. If you want to educate people on those matters do it wisely and in the correct way. Transitioning is not a sprint its a marathon and not an easy path.
    Very good points. The designer has claimed she also envisioned Perfuma as being trans. They're treating the subject of transsexualism very flippantly when gender dysphoria is a real condition that causes great anxiety and stress, and the process of transitioning is likewise difficult and stressful and certainly no walk in the park. They seem to be exploiting transsexualism for the sake of appearing 'cool', and I don't see how this is respectful to trans people at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam_Prince of Eternia View Post
    You are certainly having trouble engaging in civil debate and admitting when you're wrong, aren't you sir?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryCanyon View Post
    White savior? you mean like Avatar, Man called Horse, Dances with Wolves, Last Samurai, Lawrence of Arabia, Frank Herbert's Dune and all?
    What do any of those have to do with it? We're talking about She-Ra here. Not any of those.
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  22. #322
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    Money does not care for politics or racial prejudices . She Ra looks the way she looks to keep the target consumer interested and wanting to buy ShE Ra merchandise .
    Last edited by Lokus; May 25, 2020 at 04:15pm.

  23. #323
    ber Fan Adam_Prince of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosquitor View Post
    You are certainly having trouble engaging in civil debate and admitting when you're wrong, aren't you sir?
    I am not wrong about anything. You just spouted off a bunch of personal opinions as fact. "Mara was written extermeley well" is an opinion. "She would have been a far more endearing lead character for the show than Adora" is an opinion. There is no other way to treat you parading your personal tastes as objective truths other than flippantly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam_Prince of Eternia View Post
    I am not wrong about anything. You just spouted off a bunch of personal opinions as fact. "Mara was written extermeley well" is an opinion. "She would have been a far more endearing lead character for the show than Adora" is an opinion. There is no other way to treat you parading your personal tastes as objective truths other than flippantly.
    I don't understand how anyone can formulate that kind of opinion, one way or the other with Mara, she has a couple of minutes of screen time and we don't really get a good look at her personality, in that time.

  25. #325
    Heroic Warrior HarryCanyon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosquitor View Post
    Very good points. The designer has claimed she also envisioned Perfuma as being trans. They're treating the subject of transsexualism very flippantly when gender dysphoria is a real condition that causes great anxiety and stress, and the process of transitioning is likewise difficult and stressful and certainly no walk in the park. They seem to be exploiting transsexualism for the sake of appearing 'cool', and I don't see how this is respectful to trans people at all.

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    You are certainly having trouble engaging in civil debate and admitting when you're wrong, aren't you sir?

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    What do any of those have to do with it? We're talking about She-Ra here. Not any of those.
    When someone mentioned the whole white savior thing on She-Ra's final season
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