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Thread: Kevin Smith at Power-Con

  1. #76
    Heroic Warrior King Kahn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonehead View Post
    What about when Toyguru and Ruben were pretty much attacked during the Mattel panel which brought the presentation to a complete stop due to a few very rude and vocal He-Man fans.

    Everyone seems to always forget that year.
    I was at that panel sitting super close to those fans if it is the panel I think you are talking about. Saying they were pretty much attacked is a bit of an over reach. Heated questions? yes. Attacked? no.
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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by King Kahn View Post
    I was at that panel sitting super close to those fans if it is the panel I think you are talking about. Saying they were pretty much attacked is a bit of an over reach. Heated questions? yes. Attacked? no.
    If that's the case Smith is going to be in some trouble unless he manages to blend in.
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  3. #78
    Heroic Warrior King Kahn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reviews2D View Post
    If that's the case Smith is going to be in some trouble unless he manages to blend in.
    Nah. He will be fine.
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  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eamon View Post
    It's interesting that folks fixate on the person and not the art they put out...as I dare say many here are fans of other creatives be that musician or whatever who are far less nice a person than Kevin Smith and will happily turn a blind eye. But hey the internet told people to be outraged with their click bait sensation tabloid headlines and some just gobbled that shiz right up.

    Youtubers said Teela would replace He-Man outright and become the new HM...she didn't. Youtubers lied not Kevin.
    Youtubers said Teela was lesbian...she wasn't. Youtubers lied not Kevin.
    Youtubers seemed to hang Kevin by saying it was a sequel to Filmation. Kevin said was the "spiritual successor" which it was. I mean seriously, when Orko and Evil Lyn and talk about 'adventures' what did you think of and what are they referring to? Of course it's Filmation. Funny how reading between the lines has become rather selective these days.

    Some of these very same Youtubers told us Kahtleen Kennedy was going to be fired, Picard was not getting season two, The King Conan movie is defo happening, the He-Man movie will go into production in 2020...none of that happened and yet folks still think these hatemongers credible??

    I have good things to say about the show and i have some things I didn't like, it's quite a shame that these critisms have been drowned out by Youtubers who originally reviewed theme parks but soon discovered they get more clicks with sensational headlines and hate peddling.
    Thinking for oneself seems to lost in many corners of fandom.

    Kevin Smith is a genuinely a good person and seeing a good person getting this flack...over little or nothing is troubling.
    I absolutely agree with all of this.

    Revelation was never given a fair shake... instead, the preemptive smearing of the show before it even released influenced so many people that major review sites were negatively skewed from day one.

    People are calling fans of the show sheep who will eat up anything with MotU in the title, but their dislike/hatred of Revelation is based on debunked conjecture, rumors, and false predictions. (Now, some of them are trying to back-pedal with the poor writing criticism...)

    Is the show perfect? No. But, I guarantee that most fans of MOTU -going back to the early 80's- will honestly find more to like than to dislike.
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  5. #80
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    I hope the people treat him well.

    I'm glad he did this. Sure I had some things I'd change.

    - He-Mans transformation closer to the Original - That was big for me, I still get chills
    - Music closer to the original (He-Man bumping in the background)
    - Mer-Mans voice closer to Original.

    But the first 2 could maybe still happen after 2nd half of this, along with He-Man taking center stage. I am really looking forward to the 2nd half. I am holding on to Hope He-Man takes over in the next 5 episodes and we get the stories he promised (teela becomes sorceress / He-Man saves Eternia with bad azz He-Man fight scenes / Maybe even Teela, He-Man ride off into the sunset together as hinted my entire life)

    I wish I could be there Saturday to tell him he does have some hard core fans since I got my first He-Man toy at Eastmont Mall in Oakland, CA riding the bus home with my mom who enjoy it & are holding on to hope!

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Man Pab View Post
    I am holding on to Hope He-Man takes over in the next 5 episodes and we get the stories he promised (teela becomes sorceress / He-Man saves Eternia with bad azz He-Man fight scenes / Maybe even Teela, He-Man ride off into the sunset together ... )
    i'm with you, but I thought I read somewhere that part 2 would be the Evil-Lyn story. someone please correct me if i'm wrong. she was probably my favorite character in part 1, so it could be good. i'll probably just wait for the youtubers to tell me how i should feel about it. (totally kidding!)

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by They-Them View Post
    i'm with you, but I thought I read somewhere that part 2 would be the Evil-Lyn story. someone please correct me if i'm wrong. she was probably my favorite character in part 1, so it could be good. i'll probably just wait for the youtubers to tell me how i should feel about it. (totally kidding!)
    That's... Actually pretty funny.
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  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by They-Them View Post
    i'm with you, but I thought I read somewhere that part 2 would be the Evil-Lyn story. someone please correct me if i'm wrong. she was probably my favorite character in part 1, so it could be good. i'll probably just wait for the youtubers to tell me how i should feel about it. (totally kidding!)


    Very good, I heard similar, but I also think they aren't trying to spoil much. I am holding on to faith He-Man is gonna shine big. Hold onnnnn to your love - in my en vogue voice

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrayskullPrime View Post
    What sort of reception does everyone think Kevin Smith will receive at Power-Con this year?
    A lot of folks, such as yours truly, is extremely angry at him. Gladly, I am not attending Power-Con, and if I did I would have given him the stink eye.

    I hope for his sake people are civil, despite their anger. He will probably be hiding or be surrounded by lots of security.
    "A true hero fights for justice and loves kindness." - He-Man, Buzz-Off's Pride, 2002.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Roye View Post
    A lot of folks, such as yours truly, is extremely angry at him. Gladly, I am not attending Power-Con, and if I did I would have given him the stink eye.
    Extremely angry? I get someone not liking the creative choices made in Revelation so far, or not liking Smith in general, but I'm honestly curious, what has you extremely angry? Is it something you can pinpoint? Just genuinely curious.
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    Quote Originally Posted by He-Roye View Post
    A lot of folks, such as yours truly, is extremely angry at him. Gladly, I am not attending Power-Con, and if I did I would have given him the stink eye.

    I hope for his sake people are civil, despite their anger. He will probably be hiding or be surrounded by lots of security.
    Why not give him the Stink Palm (from Mallrats)? Now that would be a fun twist

    *i’m not suggesting anyone actually do this

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voodoo Magic View Post
    Extremely angry? I get someone not liking the creative choices made in Revelation so far, or not liking Smith in general, but I'm honestly curious, what has you extremely angry? Is it something you can pinpoint? Just genuinely curious.
    I can't speak for anyone, and I actually don't even feel this way myself, but I've heard a number of people say it was more egregious what Smith did in changing the property (which I know is debatable) because he was one of us. He was someone who complained A LOT about George Lucas changing Star Wars with the prequels and the special editions. And then Smith goes and changes MOTU, disrespects He-Man, Man-At-Arms, Teela, etc. Now I know not everyone agrees with that (I personally don't think He-Man was disrespected but I do feel Teela was), but for those who do feel that way, Smith doing it feels like a personal betrayal. Someone who was on your side but now isn't.

  13. #88
    In Stereo Where Available Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jibernish View Post
    He was someone who complained A LOT about George Lucas changing Star Wars with the prequels and the special editions.
    Can you point to a recorded instance of this? Maybe it has happened, but I've never seen a specific instance of this.

    Also, back when he used to go to the Wizard World Chicago convention, one time around the mid 2000s at one of his panels that I attended, knowing what a huge Star Wars fan he is, I directly asked him what his opinion was of the changes to the original Trilogy, and his response was pretty much that he was fine with/ not bothered by it.

    I've also seen instances over the years of him speaking positively about the prequels.


    Most any criticisms of Star Wars that have come from him are through jokes in his movies, like the Independent Contractor conversation in Clerks, or a passing comment that Ben Affleck as Holden McNeal in Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back (not to be confused with his appearance later in the film as himself) says about Han or Greedo shooting first. And again, those are mostly meant for humor. I doubt that in real life he ever actually stayed awake at night seriously concerned about these things.

    But in terms of any really serious criticisms, I've never seen him make them. Even if he had, I doubt it would have been much beyond him stating a personal preference and maybe some degree of frustration. I doubt it would have been anything like the more harsh complaints others have made about those aspects of Star Wars/George Lucas or the vitriol aimed at MOTU Revelations.
    Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; September 10, 2021 at 10:48am.
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  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by jibernish View Post
    I can't speak for anyone, and I actually don't even feel this way myself, but I've heard a number of people say it was more egregious what Smith did in changing the property (which I know is debatable) because he was one of us. He was someone who complained A LOT about George Lucas changing Star Wars with the prequels and the special editions. And then Smith goes and changes MOTU, disrespects He-Man, Man-At-Arms, Teela, etc. Now I know not everyone agrees with that (I personally don't think He-Man was disrespected but I do feel Teela was), but for those who do feel that way, Smith doing it feels like a personal betrayal. Someone who was on your side but now isn't.
    You guys, realize that many people made decisions on MOTUR. I'm sure he didn't have the final call on everything. A lot of people liked ep1, which he wrote.
    "I wouldn't be surprised if this movie has Adam as a skinny nerd from Earth battling another skinny nerd-hacker from Earth that used an alias of Keldor. They then enter Tron-style to a cyber world called Eternia, where they control muscle-bound avatars to battle (called He-Man and Skeletor). And these same avatars come to life and continue to battle in present-day Earth." - VZX

  15. #90
    Heroic Warrior Mark M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    Can you point to a recorded instance of this? Maybe it has happened, but I've never seen a specific instance of this.

    Also, back when he used to go to the Wizard World Chicago convention, one time around the mid 2000s at one of his panels that I attended, knowing what a huge Star Wars fan he is, I directly asked him what his opinion was of the changes to the original Trilogy, and his response was pretty much that he was fine with/ not bothered by it.

    I've also seen instances over the years of him speaking positively about the prequels.


    Most any criticisms of Star Wars that have come from him are through jokes in his movies, like the Independent Contractor conversation in Clerks, or a passing comment that Ben Affleck as Holden McNeal in Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back (not to be confused with his appearance later in the film as himself) says about Han or Greedo shooting first. And again, those are mostly meant for humor. I doubt that in real life he ever actually stayed awake at night seriously concerned about these things.

    But in terms of any really serious criticisms, I've never seen him make them. Even if he had, I doubt it would have been much beyond him stating a personal preference and maybe some degree of frustration. I doubt it would have been anything like the more harsh complaints others have made about those aspects of Star Wars/George Lucas or the vitriol aimed at MOTU Revelations.
    Smith did an epiosde of the Clerks cartoon series where he put George Lucas on trial for Episode 1....

  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    Can you point to a recorded instance of this? Maybe it has happened, but I've never seen a specific instance of this.

    Also, back when he used to go to the Wizard World Chicago convention, one time around the mid 2000s at one of his panels that I attended, knowing what a huge Star Wars fan he is, I directly asked him what his opinion was of the changes to the original Trilogy, and his response was pretty much that he was fine with/ not bothered by it.

    I've also seen instances over the years of him speaking positively about the prequels.


    Most any criticisms of Star Wars that have come from him are through jokes in his movies, like the Independent Contractor conversation in Clerks, or a passing comment that Ben Affleck as Holden McNeal in Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back (not to be confused with his appearance later in the film as himself) says about Han or Greedo shooting first. And again, those are mostly meant for humor. I doubt that in real life he ever actually stayed awake at night seriously concerned about these things.

    But in terms of any really serious criticisms, I've never seen him make them. Even if he had, I doubt it would have been much beyond him stating a personal preference and maybe some degree of frustration. I doubt it would have been anything like the more harsh complaints others have made about those aspects of Star Wars/George Lucas or the vitriol aimed at MOTU Revelations.
    I get your point - and I actually agree with it. Jokes are jokes - sometimes they point to real beliefs, but other times someone is just trying to get a laugh. I'm just relaying something I've seen a number of people talk about. I personally didn't feel betrayed or anything by Smith. I haven't researched his opinion on the prequels, but I have heard him joke about them enough that I can see why others felt betrayed.

    I do think the jokes count as far as some people feeling betrayed though. I think that feeling of betrayal is sometimes worse when it comes from a joke rather than an interview or article or something. You know you get your fans laughing along with you, having fun, you're having fun at Lucas' expense, and then you do the same thing you were joking about. I don't care what the business suits say about MOTU or Star Wars or anything, people like Iger and Kathleen Kennedy. I expect them to tow the corporate line. But I personally held Smith to a higher level because I do feel, shockingly, he was pretty honest about geek culture, that he understood it better than Iger and Kennedy and Siskel and Ebert and whoever you want to throw in there. He was more like us than, kinda on our side.

    Just for an example, I'm not saying this is what happened but to prove the point - IF Smith actually liked the prequels but was making jokes about them not being great in order to get laughs from people who actually were upset with the prequels, well that would not be cool. It's like these click-bait youtube channels acting like they are upset over MOTUR when we know most of them don't care about MOTU at all. That's not cool, using other people's emotions for your own gain.

    Again, I'm not accusing Smith of doing that. I actually liked the prequels myself and I have heard him say good things about them. But like you said, he has joked about them and maybe some people took the jokes the wrong way, thinking he was on their side when he really wasn't. I honestly can't speak to the man's opinion on Star Wars.

    But I do know people felt like he was 'one of us' and now some people think he stabbed 'us' in the back with what he did to MOTU. And that's all i was doing - relaying an argument I've heard because another member was trying to understand why someone might be angry at Smith. I'm not making any arguments myself.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ehenyo View Post
    You guys, realize that many people made decisions on MOTUR. I'm sure he didn't have the final call on everything. A lot of people liked ep1, which he wrote.
    Of course I realize this. I was just answering a question about why some people might be mad at Kevin Smith. I don't care either way. I'm not mad at Smith. But I also don't like MOTUR. I'm not interested in arguing anything. But I do understand both sides of the argument and I feel it's useful to try and understand each other. I think 99% of people who are in this forum just want the best for the brand and we genuinely love the same thing. It's like parents arguing because they have different ideas of what is best for their kid.
    Last edited by jibernish; September 10, 2021 at 11:28am.

  17. #92
    Heroic Warrior ToyCulture's Avatar
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    Kevin Smith is a liar(1). The whole show teaser was a lie. Itīs not rude to point out facts.

    (1) https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAct..._about_hemaam/

  18. #93
    In Stereo Where Available Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark M View Post
    Smith did an episode of the Clerks cartoon series where he put George Lucas on trial for Episode 1....
    And your point is?...

    Like I said in my last post, most any references to this type of thing are in his content for the sake of humor (movies, TV shows, etc.), and not him complaining about these things on end in day to day life.

    And in the episode, it is Randal who puts George Lucas on trial, not Kevin Smith himself. Kevin wasn't even the sole writer on the Clerks cartoon episodes. There were other writers involved besides him on the various episodes. So we don't even know for sure if that particular joke was his idea. And regardless of who's idea it was, it was more so making a joke around the general backlash against Episode 1, and not necessarily a comment that Smith himself hated it.

    Even if it was his idea, unless you equally believe that in real life Kevin Smith was equally concerned/upset about the independent contractors on the Death Star in Return of the Jedi, or genuinely believes all of the race commentary (which I won't go into detail about here for obvious reasons) that Hooper makes in the comic panel scene in Chasing Amy, then there's no reason to believe that he takes that joke in the Clerks cartoon any more seriously than any of that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by jibernish View Post
    Just for an example, I'm not saying this is what happened but to prove the point - IF Smith actually liked the prequels but was making jokes about them not being great in order to get laughs from people who actually were upset with the prequels, well that would not be cool. It's like these click-bait youtube channels acting like they are upset over MOTUR when we know most of them don't care about MOTU at all. That's not cool, using other people's emotions for your own gain.
    The only substantial example of him making fun of the prequels that I can think of offhand is the one instance in the court room scene of the 4th episode of the Clerks cartoon. And he makes fun of more movies than just that. Or I should say the episode does... again, we don't know for sure if he came up with those specific jokes or not.

    I also see absolutely no similarity between that and the youtube channels.

    These youtubers that are acting more upset over MOTUR than they are in reality are presenting these ideas and feelings as their own. They are acting outraged over something for the sake of clicks and attention, and creating a lot of actual drama in the process.

    Kevin is writing comedic works of fiction. While he has drawn from his own life for bits and pieces of it, he is coming up with ideas for the sake of the story and the humor. In the specific example of the Clerks cartoon, it is Randal who is expressing these opinions when he has George Lucas take the stand in court (if you haven't seen the episode, don't worry about how things even got to that point, the whole thing is meant to be silly and surreal). Randal has always been the bigger ''jerk'' of the two main Clerks characters. He's also the one who was concerned about the independent contractors in the first Clerks movie.

    And whether for the sake of comedy or not, when someone is writing a movie or TV show, they are telling an overall story involving many characters with different motivations and points of view. Based on your logic, any opinion that a writer of fiction gives to a character in the story must somehow be representative of their own. But that's not necessarily true. And when they are writing multiple characters with differing opinions, clearly whatever opinion the writer would have in real life about the topic in question cannot possibly simultaneously match all of the opposing opinions of the characters in the story. Heck, based on your logic, it must mean that George Lucas agrees with BOTH the Rebellion AND the Empire!

    I mean no disrespect, but this is a very ridiculous, straw-grasping argument if ever there was one.

    Plus in general I've never seen Kevin Smith say that the people who dislike the prequels are wrong for having their opinions. He just doesn't have the same issues with the movies.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ToyCulture View Post
    Kevin Smith is a liar(1). The whole show teaser was a lie. Itīs not rude to point out facts.

    (1) https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAct..._about_hemaam/
    This quote already covers this issue...

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam_Prince of Eternia View Post
    No one was lied to. Some people interpeted something someone else said incorrectly. And instead of being frustrated with themselves, they are blaming someone else for "being lied to." Grow up.

    You know what, I will do you one better. Let us presume for the sake of argument that they were lied to. So what? That does not suddenly change the content or the quality of the program. If someone had been "honest" with them, would they suddenly have no complaints, and be singing the praises of the program? Of course not. Because the people being dishonest are the people complaining about lies. "Being lied to" is just the shield they hide behind to hurl invective at the series and its creators. Their real objections are things that people will not support, but no one supports "being lied to," so it is a way for them to tear down the series without having to present or defend their real arguments. It is not fooling anybody.

    Plus how many times in life have many of us seen a movie trailer, thinking it looks good or bad, only for the end result to be to the contrary when we eventually see the movie? Or anything similar to this?

    At some point people really need to get over this. If you hate the show as-is, then you hate the show as-is. It's not like if Kevin Smith and the advertising around this show had given away all of the plot points and surprises from the get-go, the people who hate it would suddenly love it.

    Literally every single one of us has lied at some point in your lives, including you. You really need to get over this, unless you think you should also be perpetually held to task for any lie that you've ever told.
    Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; September 10, 2021 at 03:35pm.
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  19. #94
    Heroic Warrior Mark M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    And your point is?...
    My point is George Lucas had a lot of backlash for Epsiode 1 from fans like Kevin Smith yet Lucas never resorted to lying and insulting fans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post

    - - - Updated - - -
    The only substantial example of him making fun of the prequels that I can think of offhand is the one instance in the court room scene of the 4th episode of the Clerks cartoon. And he makes fun of more movies than just that. Or I should say the episode does... again, we don't know for sure if he came up with those specific jokes or not.

    I also see absolutely no similarity between that and the youtube channels.

    These youtubers that are acting more upset over MOTUR than they are in reality are presenting these ideas and feelings as their own. They are acting outraged over something for the sake of clicks and attention, and creating a lot of actual drama in the process.

    Kevin is writing comedic works of fiction. While he has drawn from his own life for bits and pieces of it, he is coming up with ideas for the sake of the story and the humor. In the specific example of the Clerks cartoon, it is Randal who is expressing these opinions when he has George Lucas take the stand in court (if you haven't seen the episode, don't worry about how things even got to that point, the whole thing is meant to be silly and surreal). Randal has always been the bigger ''jerk'' of the two main Clerks characters. He's also the one who was concerned about the independent contractors in the first Clerks movie.

    And whether for the sake of comedy or not, when someone is writing a movie or TV show, they are telling an overall story involving many characters with different motivations and points of view. Based on your logic, any opinion that a writer of fiction gives to a character in the story must somehow be representative of their own. But that's not necessarily true. And when they are writing multiple characters with differing opinions, clearly whatever opinion the writer would have in real life about the topic in question cannot possibly simultaneously match all of the opposing opinions of the characters in the story. Heck, based on your logic, it must mean that George Lucas agrees with BOTH the Rebellion AND the Empire!

    I mean no disrespect, but this is a very ridiculous, straw-grasping argument if ever there was one.

    Plus in general I've never seen Kevin Smith say that the people who dislike the prequels are wrong for having their opinions. He just doesn't have the same issues with the movies.
    You're missing my point. I said I wasn't making any argument at all - just explaining what I had heard others say of why they were mad at Smith. And I was also trying to see things from that perspective.
    And to characterize what I said with this statement: "Based on your logic, any opinion that a writer of fiction gives to a character in the story must somehow be representative of their own" is just bizarre and tells me we aren't even having the same conversation. You read right over a lot of what I said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark M View Post
    My point is George Lucas had a lot of backlash for Epsiode 1 from fans like Kevin Smith yet Lucas never resorted to lying and insulting fans.
    No, but he did get his revenge by selling to Disney.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark M View Post
    My point is George Lucas had a lot of backlash for Epsiode 1 from fans like Kevin Smith yet Lucas never resorted to lying and insulting fans.
    Just want to point out two things:

    1. The drunk guy being a complete piece of trash at the local football game is still a "fan".

    2. If you ask a vague or stupid question you're probably going to a vague or stupid answer.
    "A fool always finds a greater fool to admire him."

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    I gotta tell you I'm thinking he got the call most of the time. When I created, wrote the series bible and all those episodes for NA, Mattel basically gave me carte blanche -- very few corrections and rarely, if ever insisting upon changes. And I was just a rising writer and nowhere near being in the pantheon that KS is in.

    That said, I'm still not taking 'credit' for Skeletor's eyeballs or the scientists voices. Yeah, yeah. Aside from their voice, I own the scientists. What the heck. No quarterback throws a perfect pass every time.

    Quote Originally Posted by ehenyo View Post
    You guys, realize that many people made decisions on MOTUR. I'm sure he didn't have the final call on everything. A lot of people liked ep1, which he wrote.

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    All this drama surrounding Smith is still surprising me to be honest. Next, people will show up at Power-Con dressed in yellow raincoats chanting, Kevin Smith lied! And my childhood died!



    Just joking... hopefully.
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  25. #100
    Master of New Adventures!
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    This, THIS!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    And your point is?...

    Like I said in my last post, most any references to this type of thing are in his content for the sake of humor (movies, TV shows, etc.), and not him complaining about these things on end in day to day life.

    And in the episode, it is Randal who puts George Lucas on trial, not Kevin Smith himself. Kevin wasn't even the sole writer on the Clerks cartoon episodes. There were other writers involved besides him on the various episodes. So we don't even know for sure if that particular joke was his idea. And regardless of who's idea it was, it was more so making a joke around the general backlash against Episode 1, and not necessarily a comment that Smith himself hated it.

    Even if it was his idea, unless you equally believe that in real life Kevin Smith was equally concerned/upset about the independent contractors on the Death Star in Return of the Jedi, or genuinely believes all of the race commentary (which I won't go into detail about here for obvious reasons) that Hooper makes in the comic panel scene in Chasing Amy, then there's no reason to believe that he takes that joke in the Clerks cartoon any more seriously than any of that.

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    The only substantial example of him making fun of the prequels that I can think of offhand is the one instance in the court room scene of the 4th episode of the Clerks cartoon. And he makes fun of more movies than just that. Or I should say the episode does... again, we don't know for sure if he came up with those specific jokes or not.

    I also see absolutely no similarity between that and the youtube channels.

    These youtubers that are acting more upset over MOTUR than they are in reality are presenting these ideas and feelings as their own. They are acting outraged over something for the sake of clicks and attention, and creating a lot of actual drama in the process.

    Kevin is writing comedic works of fiction. While he has drawn from his own life for bits and pieces of it, he is coming up with ideas for the sake of the story and the humor. In the specific example of the Clerks cartoon, it is Randal who is expressing these opinions when he has George Lucas take the stand in court (if you haven't seen the episode, don't worry about how things even got to that point, the whole thing is meant to be silly and surreal). Randal has always been the bigger ''jerk'' of the two main Clerks characters. He's also the one who was concerned about the independent contractors in the first Clerks movie.

    And whether for the sake of comedy or not, when someone is writing a movie or TV show, they are telling an overall story involving many characters with different motivations and points of view. Based on your logic, any opinion that a writer of fiction gives to a character in the story must somehow be representative of their own. But that's not necessarily true. And when they are writing multiple characters with differing opinions, clearly whatever opinion the writer would have in real life about the topic in question cannot possibly simultaneously match all of the opposing opinions of the characters in the story. Heck, based on your logic, it must mean that George Lucas agrees with BOTH the Rebellion AND the Empire!

    I mean no disrespect, but this is a very ridiculous, straw-grasping argument if ever there was one.

    Plus in general I've never seen Kevin Smith say that the people who dislike the prequels are wrong for having their opinions. He just doesn't have the same issues with the movies.

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    This quote already covers this issue...




    Plus how many times in life have many of us seen a movie trailer, thinking it looks good or bad, only for the end result to be to the contrary when we eventually see the movie? Or anything similar to this?

    At some point people really need to get over this. If you hate the show as-is, then you hate the show as-is. It's not like if Kevin Smith and the advertising around this show had given away all of the plot points and surprises from the get-go, the people who hate it would suddenly love it.

    Literally every single one of us has lied at some point in your lives, including you. You really need to get over this, unless you think you should also be perpetually held to task for any lie that you've ever told.

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