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Thread: Masters of the Universe Revelation - episode 10 [Official Talkback Thread] SPOILERS

  1. #26
    Heroic Warrior Grayskull Guardsman's Avatar
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    Liked:
    -He-Hulk
    -Duncan/Sorceress, Adam/Randor, and Adam/Marlena moments
    -Point Dread & Mystic Mountains
    -Blade appearance
    -Some cool fight scenes
    -the two little Horde cameos
    -the whole Panthor scene up to his death... and I did appreciate Skeletor's reaction to Panthor's death.

    Hated:
    -the quick forgiveness of certain actions: Skeletor's brutal murder of the Sorceress, then okay, let's work together and joke and banter; Evil-lyn destroys Pre-ternia, and attempts to destroy existence, then okay, go live peacefully on Trolla. She should be committed...
    -the fact that Evil-lyn wants to destroy existence, etc. Her character was all over the place... first she works with the Sorceress and teams up with the heroes to save the universe, mourns Orko, starts to turn over a new leaf, then she joins back up with Skeletor, but still seems to feel for Sorceress and Duncan after Skeletor kills her, then she cruelly mocks Duncan about it, then she randomly wants to destroy existence... out of character for Evil-lyn. Very weird overall.
    -the He-vil-lyn design was kind of awful... I liked her Sorceress look, but that other design was fugly and we had to look at it for so long.
    -As bad as SMG was in part one for Teela, I think Alicia Silverstone bothered me more as Marlena than Teela did in part two. "As-if!"
    -they didn't use the time available wisely here in Part Two either... too much the universe this, the power that, you have the power, I have the power, we have the power. You're the Sorceress, I'm the Sorceress, I'm the He-Sorceress... power/universe/design/blah, blah, blah; Evil-lyn was one of my favorite parts in the Part One, but I got so sick of her here. Meanwhile, Buzz-Off, Stratos, and Ram Man are just blink and you miss cameos. I would have liked more time with some other characters.
    -Evil-lyn's Origin Story - her parents wanted to eat her?!?!? Really? I mean, really? We went from the spoiled daughter of the ruler of Zalesia, with interesting Havok staff origin tie-in, etc. to her parents wanted to eat her, so she ran away to live in the sewer...


    Overall, Revelation was an interesting watch once through, but I don't want to see anymore of it. Getting that voice cast back together could be tough anyway...

    I would much rather them do another show altogether. Ideally, a continuation of 200X would be great. Bring in the Horde, and if they can work the legal loopholes, Adora/She-ra. True Adora/She-ra! If they can't get She-ra, then I guess have the Horde escape Despondos and come to Eternia, and we can still assume Adora is back on Etheria in Despondos.

    I have a feeling if we do get anything else, it could be this New Eternia stuff Mattel was hinting about during Power-Con. A New Eternia show, but I expect that would skew much more from what we know and expect from existing lore.
    Last edited by Grayskull Guardsman; November 23, 2021 at 09:28pm.

  2. #27
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    I liked it a lot, but that doesn't mean there weren't issues. Clamp Champ and Fisto are the first things that come to mind. I was also a little bummed that they completely deviated from the Evil-Lyn origin from 200X, as well as Teela's original origins, of being adopted by Duncan in both Filmation and 200X. It makes Revelation a lot harder to view as a spiritual sequel to either.

    I also think they missed out on giving Teela the snake armour for her Sorceress outfit. Plus, we shouldn't be forgiving Skeletor or Evil-Lyn. They should be locked up in Castle Grayskull Dungeon.

  3. #28
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    Fantastic second half - my main gripe is them killing off Panthor cuz I like animals. That and the reference to earth


    Loved the dialogue all around. In many respects it's what Filmation should have been by having the attempts at humor being funny instead of dull and cringe worthy

    It was pretty unpredictable- we all knew that Adam would survive and end the show with the sword and power, but I definitely didn't expect EL stealing the power from Skeletor and using it to destroy reality. And her background.. I thought that I'd misheard when she said her parents intended to eat her. Made me smile while thinking of a modest proposal.

    I'd have rather liked it if Randor killed Duncan at the final battle while shouting, "you were never pardoned!"

    I'll share some more thoughts later. What a stunning success

  4. #29
    Heroic Warrior Thrawn29's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stratos88 View Post
    Her (Evil Lynn) design was also pretty terrible, which is baffling to me because her Sorceress look was fantastic. Maybe if the gold was changed to the black metal of her circlet it'd look more villainous.
    Agreed.

    It is also confusing why she needed Skelegod to power down to steal the sword, but then when Adam gets the sword back she doesn't lose the power and revert to her previous form? Huh?
    I couldn't tell what was going on either. That was very confusing.

    Andra comes out of this season being a completely useless character. Also her haircut at the end was terrible. Why does Hollywood keep insisting that the side of the head shaved look is cool? It's not and I've never seen an actual person wearing their hair like that. Cut it out.
    It's a bad stereotype at this point.

    I felt He-Man's line to Skeletor of "It's not about us!" was thrown in to directly address the fans.
    That was a direct **** You to the fans. Which is a rather big problem. MOTU is actually all about He-Man and Skeletor.

    or having Evil-Lyn mount Skeletor.
    I was in shock when that happened.

    I...have no words.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Grayskull Guardsman View Post
    -Evil-lyn's Origin Story - her parents wanted to eat her?!?!? Really? I mean, really? We went from the spoiled daughter of the ruler of Zalesia, with interesting Havok staff origin tie-in, etc. to her parents wanted to eat her, so she ran away to live in the sewer...
    Her parents literally chased her out of the house with knife and a meat cleaver.

    Holy ****!

    On top of that, Evil Lyn says she was five when it happened, and then she lived in a sewer for 20 years. So she was 26 years old when she met Skeletor. She spent her entire youth and young adult hood living in a sewer and being Aladdin.

    You can't make this up. It's so stupid I'm not even sure I hate it.

    -----------

    Queen Marlena does have possibly THE FUNNIEST LINE IN ALL OF FICTION I have ever heard.

    In reference to Evil Lyn:

    She just killed everyone in Heaven!!!!
    I couldn't stop laughing.
    Last edited by Thrawn29; November 23, 2021 at 09:56pm.

  5. #30
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    I really wanted to love this... but I can't. It's terrible.

    So, Skeletor can have the power, Evil Lyn can have the power aaaaaaaaaaaaaand Adam can even give the most evil person in the universe the power to help stop Lyn..... BUT he didn't give the power to Man-At-Arms or Teela or Ram Man etc. on the battlefield or anyone else in his previous adventures???????????????????????????????????????? ??

    Someone explain this to me??

  6. #31
    Heroic Warrior Stratos88's Avatar
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    You know, my wife just pointed something out to me. Evil-Lyn in part 2 really pulled a Daenerys. One of if not the best character from the first part, she got the upperhand on Skeletor, finally pulling herself out from under his torment and then she just wants to destroy all of existence because reasons. The logical leap you have to take just felt like that episode of Game of Thrones all over again. You're rooting for Evil-Lyn and then it's "Wait, what are you doing? Why? Well, that was stupid."

    But in the end we all learned an important lesson. You can nuke heaven, destroying the souls of Eternia's greatest heroes and threaten to wipe out all of existence - but if you say you're sorry then we're good. Enjoy your retirement, Lynnie.

  7. #32
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    If Fisto or Clamp Champ became possessed in Filmation or 200X, He-Man would have put them in a cell and gone to the ends of Eternia and back to find a way to turn them back to normal.

    Revelation Teela and Andra just throw a grenade at them and kill them.... wow! So, so terrible...

  8. #33
    Heroic Warrior BergerKing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benvoliothefirst View Post
     
    Man, if I thought I was a motherboard stan BEFORE... Obviously there's the Horde logo, but is she a reference to something herself, with her design? I didn't recognize it but I'm a filthy casual.

    I loved seeing Skeletor in his Horde gear twenty years ago.

    She looked like a representation of Screeech to me.
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  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirsniffy View Post
    I enjoyed this finale, but there are a few things that bothered me:

    • Did we ever see Ileena? Did I miss her?

    Accordingly, she was going to show up in Part 1 - ep 2. But her scene was cut.
    He-Man & She-Ra fan, writer to official Dark Horse MOTU/POP books

    · ToonJukka - Youtube Channel with He-Man/She-Ra videos; Origins, Trivia, Top5 lists and more!

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrawn29 View Post
    Agreed.



    I couldn't tell what was going on either. That was very confusing.



    It's a bad stereotype at this point.



    That was a direct **** You to the fans. Which is a rather big problem. MOTU is actually all about He-Man and Skeletor.



    I was in shock when that happened.

    I...have no words.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Her parents literally chased her out of the house with knife and a meat cleaver.

    Holy ****!

    On top of that, Evil Lyn says she was five when it happened, and then she lived in a sewer for 20 years. So she was 26 years old when she met Skeletor. She spent her entire youth and young adult hood living in a sewer and being Aladdin.

    You can't make this up. It's so stupid I'm not even sure I hate it.

    -----------

    Queen Marlena does have possibly THE FUNNIEST LINE IN ALL OF FICTION I have ever heard.

    In reference to Evil Lyn:



    I couldn't stop laughing.
    In regards to the thing about it being about He-Man and Skeletor, that's ignoring the arguably cooler villains, the Snake Men and the Horde. Also, Evil-Lyn's childhood is delved into in one of the prequel comics, and the show left out some important details that make it slightly less awful.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by hadley View Post
    The animation of He-Man’s rampage at the end was pretty frenetic and cool, and I loved it when he sliced and diced the big dragon into the shape of his H-sigil. They took the DC comics thing of Zoar being a deity, but didn’t tie it into the symbol. That would have been a good time for it. Have the big H on screen and have Zoar fly up and kinda superimpose on it. Or maybe that would have been weird. I am very much NOT an “everything must have an explanation” type, but I think that would have tied up why everyone who held the sword had an H on their chest. But ultimately it doesn’t matter.
     

    BFEF51AC-CD5D-446C-A3A1-2E496B5372B9.jpg

    I was wondering about that too. The vision of Zoar with spread wings, risen like a Phoenix to reaffirm life itself does resemble the pointy H. (Not sure why my picture turned out upside down). The Celestial Apex might be another source for the symbol, turned on its side.

    A40DD2D8-798B-44AE-AE3D-6BFC789BB85E.jpg


  12. #37
    President of Primus Ornclown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hadley View Post
    Beast Man was done dirty. I hope we haven’t seen the last of him.
    He was defeated in the same fashion as the very first HM&MOTU episode... only this time, there was no "mud" to save him!
    We need the POWER of the GOOD and the WAY of the MAGIC !!!

    **Staunch FILMation lover!!! **** Uber NEW ADVENTURES Fan!!!**

    >>Glad supporter of the Netflix Era<<

  13. #38
    Heroic Warrior Minor's Avatar
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    I think Preternia was brought back into existence once Subternia was opened up to send all of the dead back. It is a vague thing that Teela is doing in this moment, but I took it as Subternia and Preternia were put back together and rebalanced again.

    The one thing I think that was a travesty was that Fisto and Clamp Champ were scrubbed out by Skeletor, which never saw any miraculous conclusion mentioned.

    I think Beastman falling into the void around Castle Grayskull will be hand waved away if this gets a second season. Maybe it won't, if Orko is truly gone. I have a hard time thinking anyone is actually dead in this series and they will just undergo a transformation and return. I mean we had Orko the white show up.

    I liked how it ended and teased a second season. Myself and some others that watched the first part thought the second part was better and that it had better pace. I felt the first half was too slow for me. I think the biggest issue is that Netflix chopped this in half to begin with. The first half was weak, second half had what most fans I think wanted to see and this episode was one of the better ones.

  14. #39
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    I hope it's okay that I comment on all episodes, all the stuff is jumbled in my mind, I forgot what happens in which episode.

    Didn't like:
    - Teela is not bound to the castle because she just decides to, made the sorceress before her look like an idiot
    - I'm fine with Andra and I don't mind her being MAA but wow that scene where she gets recruited, the writing was so cringe
    - "You were not born evil ... lyn". I didn't know whether to laugh or cringe or laugh.

    LOVED
    - Skeletor showing up at their door step for a team up
    - the cliffhanger
    - Adam
    - He-Man on his mom's wind shield
    - Ducan and the monster goop

    Liked
    - Orko's return
    - Teela's new look
    - The entire plot about them needing to calm down Feral He-Man

    Things where I can see why it might bother a lot of people, but personally I didn't care
    - Evil-Lyn tricking Skeletor with sex
    - The Teela vs Evil-Lyn fight (like the actual physical fighting) was kind of dumb looking
    - Too much monologuing, particularly in regards to characters spitting really clunky exposition "and this is what I'm doing right now!"

  15. #40
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    I LOVED IT!!! The Part 1 was kinda slow and plodding and had no barely had Adam / He-Man and Skeleton, but I felt that these 5 eps were fast pasted and had plenty of Skeleton and Adam / He-Man. I might say there wasn't enough "He-Man" in this one if you don't include Hulk He-Man, but I thought the character not Prince Adam, whether as himself or He-Man was very strong. It reminds me of my opinion on Iron Man and Iron Man 3. In the first movie, I though Robert Downey Jr was so good as Tony Starks, that the movie did need Iron Man, but that's because of how good the movie was. But, in Iron Man 3, I complained that there wasn't enough Iron Man and all you had was Tony Starks remotely controling a bunch of Iron Man suits and Pepper Parks in her own suit. But in the end, the story wasn't as good as the first Iron Man. So, in the end for me, it's all about the story, and Part 2 was definitely the stronger story. Man, I marked out when Blade showed up and man, even Teela was surprised that Goat Man and Pig Boy made the cut. 😄. I thought the humor was on point when needed to be, it had its very dark moments, and had its emotional moments. Yeah, I'm not a fan at what they did to Fisto and Clamp Champ either, but it is what it was. I did laugh when Orko was about to go back with the dead and Evil Lyn was the only who thought of grabbing him. 😄

  16. #41
    Heroic Warrior Orko the Great's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ornclown View Post
    ...because he wrote each and every episode, oh wait...

    And, if he had, isn't that what writers do? They make stuff up that they then put on paper.



    Yup... a 72% based on a 6 to 2 like/dislike ratio on MetaCritic

    A 94% Fresh rating for Part 1..

    And a 100% Fresh rating for Part 2 (so far) on Rotten Tomatoes...

    Yeah, Netflix is real worried about Revelation's reception. (Also, it was posted in another thread that Netflix's own algorithm considered Revelation a success, so...)
    Actually, he only wrote 2 of the episodes. The others were written by different people.

  17. #42
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    Overall I enjoyed it. I've been a big defender of this show through all of the controversy, and overall I still stand behind most of what I said. And I think a lot of the criticisms thrown at this show (many of which fall into Tar Swamp style discussion) were and still are ridiculous.

    That being said, it felt to me, especially regarding the power itself, the sword, etc., like there needed to be more solid rules and explanations around it all. It just kept jumping back and forth between very generalized, grandiose descriptions of the extent and the vastness of the power overall, and the characters (like He-Man, Skeletor, Evil Lyn) using it, but without it all being grounded in any sense of rules.

    For instance, the fact that Skeletor and Evil-Lyn were even able to call upon the Power of Grayskull at all. I didn't expect this to be explained in Part 1 since it ends with Skeletor using it for the first time. But if it is meant for one specific champion at any given time (Adam in the case of the present-day of the show), then are there any limits as to who can use the power and under what circumstances? It would have been nice if there had been more solid rules and limits around it. Like maybe Adam is technically the only one who can/should be able to use it, but Skeletor found some kind of specific spell or loophole that allowed him to use it (that by extension Evil Lyn would have used).

    As it is, now that Adam's secret is pretty much out there for all to know, it seems like any random Joe who manages to get their hands on the sword can just say "By The Power of Grayskull" and transform with there being no limits at all.... both in terms of who can use it and how many people at one time.


    This is made further questionable by the idea that Adam is the "spark" and can transform into "Savage" He-Man without the sword. If he the spark/champion/etc, then again, why would anyone else be able to just use the power without at least some kind of very specific loophole (something more substantial than just possessing the sword and saying the words)? And I would have liked more of an explanation behind both why he is able to transform without the sword at all (more than just saying "I'm the spark"), and why he takes on such a raw brute form.


    I kind of agree on Evil Lyn's character being all over the place. It made sense when she was torn between staying on the side of good and reluctantly going with Skeletor. But for her to go super self-serving evil when she had both the powers of the Sorceress and the sword, there should have at least been more of a reason for it and a transition to it than what we got. And don't get me started on her trying to seduce Skeletor (even if it was just to trick him). That's just NOT something that I need to see in any version of MOTU. It's one thing to hint at something more than just a "working" relationship (which was hinted at in 200X in the flashback scenes when Keldor and Evil-Lyn first met, for example), but of all of the things that did need to be spelled out in this series, THAT IS NOT one of them.

    He-Man willingly sharing the power with Skeletor seemed odd too, because while they had teamed up, given the history of everything Skeletor had done, there's a ton of reason for He-Man to not just instantly trust him.



    Then there's Teela becoming the Sorceress. Again, this was fully expected to happen, and it was awesome seeing it finally come to fruition. But she becomes a version of the Sorceress that is NOT tethered to Castle Grayskull because.... she just decided that is how she wants the power to work?? I'm not upset at the idea of the Sorceress being able to freely leave and enter the Castle as she pleases, but there needs to be more of an explanation behind any changes/alterations to the power of the Sorceress to allow this, and it needs to be more substantial than "the new person becoming the Sorceress just decided it!"



    I hate to be as critical of this as I am because outside of these kinds of issues, overall I enjoyed the show a lot. Including Part 2.

    But this makes me think of the Pitch Meeting videos by Ryan George on Youtube, where (for those who haven't seen them) he plays 2 characters, a script writer and movie studio executive, and he makes fun of actual movies by showing the ridiculous aspects of them (some worse than others) by breaking them down into a few-minute pitch, showing and exaggerating all of the plot holes, inconsistencies, and poorly explained aspects. And often times when the studio executive points out one of these problems and asks why it is like that, the writer responds "So the movie can happen!"

    That's kind of how I feel about how the power worked in MOTU Revelation. It was simultaneously extremely vast 'but very limited.... switching from one to the other for plot convenience. Who can use the power, the limits (or lack there of), and why is either not explained or poorly explained, and the way those things proceed on the show seem to be for the sole purpose of "so the show can happen."



    To be clear, I'm not accusing Kevin Smith and the other involved on the creative end of not doing their homework. There is A LOT of things in this series that dives very deep into MOTU lore, and I appreciate a lot of that. I have no doubt that they went into this with the honest intent of making something epic for long-time MOTU fans. And in good number of respects, I do think they delivered IMO. But when it comes to making a cohesive show with it's own internal logic (especially when it comes to the magical elements), it is very lacking in that regard.

    As I said when I watched part 1 (and I feel even more strongly about this now), this is a series that could have used at least one prior season to set up both the status quo and some of the rules of how the magic worked, and then went into this story. Or if starting from the same point, either needed more episodes to "breathe" and fill in those explanations, or they needed to find a way to include the needed exposition within the existing allotted time, but without feeling like a forced exposition dump and without sacrificing too much from other elements.

    There is a lot of good in this series IMO. I don't want it to seem like I think it is all bad... because I don't feel that way. But there are some things that should have been handled better.
    Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; November 24, 2021 at 08:32am.
    ____________________________________________

  18. #43
    Court Magician Oldfan87's Avatar
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    I'm glad so glad other people liked this story, but... I'm sorry, characters I love getting turned into monsters, killed, and sent to hell, Eternia's heaven getting wiped out, characters being shown for five seconds then killed, redemption of villains for irredeemable acts... if thisdark and depressing mess is 'compelling' storytelling that is 'metal', well... I want no part of it. This motu is not for me, I am done with revelation and any possible sequel it has. I hope the rest of you continue to enjoy it, and I hope it is successful so we can get more MOTU media and toys, of which I might enjoy more. That is all.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
    Overall I enjoyed it. I've been a big defender of this show through all of the controversy, and for the most part I still stand behind most of what I said. And I think a lot of the criticisms thrown at this show (many of which fall into Tar Swamp style discussion) were and still are ridiculous.

    That being said, it felt to me, especially regarding the power itself, the sword, etc., there needed to be more solid rules and explanations around it all. It just kept jumping back and forth between very generalized, grandiose descriptions of the extent and the vastness of the power overall, and the characters (like He-Man, Skeletor, Evil Lyn) using it, but without it all being grounded in any sense of rules.

    For instance, the fact that Skeletor and Evil-Lyn were even able to call upon the Power of Grayskull at all. I didn't expect this to be explained in Part 1 since it ends with Skeletor using it for the first time. But if it is meant for one specific champion at any given time (Adam in the case of the present-day of the show), then are there any limits as to who can use the power and under what circumstances? It would have been nice if there had been more solid rules and limits around it. Like maybe Adam is technically the only one who can/should be able to use it, but Skeletor found some kind of spell or loophole that allowed him to use it (that by extension Evil Lyn would have used).

    As it is, now that Adam's secret is pretty much out there for all to know, it seems like any random Joe who manages to get their hands on the sword can just say "By The Power of Grayskull" and transform with there being no limits at all.... both in terms of who can use it and how many people at one time.


    This is made further questionable by the idea that Adam is the "spark" and can transform into "Savage" He-Man without the sword. If he the spark/champion/etc, then again, why would anyone else be able to just use the power without at least some kind of very specific loophole (something more substantial than just possessing the sword and saying the words)? And I would have liked more of an explanation behind both why he is able to transform without the sword at all (more than just saying "I'm the spark), and why he takes on such a raw brute form.


    I kind of agree on Evil Lyn's character being all over the place. It made sense when she was torn between staying on the side of good and reluctantly going with Skeletor. But for her to go super self-serving evil when she had both the powers of the Sorceress and the sword, there should have at least been more of a reason for it and a transition to it than what we got. And don't get me started on her trying to seduce Skeletor (even if it was just to trick him). That's just NOT something that I need to see in any version of MOTU. It's one thing to hint at something more than just a "working" relationship, but of all of the things that did need to be spelled out in this series, THAT IS NOT one of them.

    He-Man willingly sharing the power with Skeletor seemed odd too, because while they had teamed up, given the history of everything Skeletor had done, there's a ton of reason for He-Man to not just instantly trust him.



    Then there's Teela becoming the Sorceress. Again, this was fully expected to happen, and it was awesome seeing it finally come to fruition. But she becomes a version of the Sorceress that is NOT tethered to Castle Grayskull because.... she just decided that is how she wants the power to work?? I'm not upset at the idea of the Sorceress being able to freely leave and enter the Castle as she pleases, but there needs to be more of an explanation behind any changes/alterations to the power of the Sorceress to allow this, and it needs to be more substantial than "the new person becoming the Sorceress just decided it!"



    I hate to be as critical of this as I am because outside of these kinds of issues, overall I enjoyed the show a lot. Including Part 2.

    But this makes me think of the Pitch Meeting videos by Ryan George on Youtube, where (for those who haven't seen it) he plays 2 characters, a script writer and movie studio executive, and he makes fun of actual movies by showing the ridiculous aspects to them (some worse than others) by breaking them down into a few-minute pitch, showing and exaggerating all of the plot holes, inconsistencies, and poorly explained aspects. And often times when the studio executive points out one of these problems and asks why it is like that, the writer responds "So the movie can happen!"

    That's kind of how I feel about how the power worked in MOTU Revelation. It was simultaneously extremely vast but very limited.... switching from one to the other for plot convenience. Who can use the power, the limits (or lack there of), and why is either not explained or poorly explained, and the way those things proceed on the show seem to be for the sole purpose of "so the show can happen."



    To be clear, I'm not accusing Kevin Smith and the other involved on the creative end of not doing their homework. There is A LOT of things in this series that dives very deep into MOTU lore, and I appreciate a lot of that. I have no doubt that they went into this with the honest intent of making something epic for long-time MOTU fans. And in good number of respects, I do think they delivered IMO. But when it comes to making a cohesive show with it's own internal logic (especially when it comes to the magical elements), it is very lacking in that regard.

    As I said when I watched part 1 (and I feel even more strongly about this now), this is a series that could have used at least one prior season to set up both the status quo and some of the rules of how the magic worked, and then went into this story. Or if starting from the same point, either needed more episodes to "breathe" and fill in those explanations, or they needed to find a way to include the needed exposition within the existing allotted time, but without feeling like a forced exposition dump and without sacrificing too much from other elements.

    There is a lot of good in this series IMO. I don't want it to seem like I think it is all bad... because I don't feel that way. But there are some things that should have been handled better.
    Yeah, I've been a big defender of this series as well, but I pretty much agree with you on everything you said here. None of the negatives come close to outweighing the positives though, so I still love it. MOTU lore has never been perfect or consistent from one iteration to the next, and so I see Revelation as being consistent in this regard. I'm sure there will be endless discussions in other threads on all these things, and I'll voice my opinions more there, but I do largely agree with you here.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldfan87 View Post
    I'm glad so glad other people liked this story, but... I'm sorry, characters I love getting turned into monsters, killed, and sent to hell, Eternia's heaven getting wiped out, characters being shown for five seconds then killed, redemption of villains for irredeemable acts... if thisdark and depressing mess is 'compelling' storytelling that is 'metal', well... I want no part of it. This motu is not for me, I am done with revelation and any possible sequel it has. I hope the rest of you continue to enjoy it, and I hope it is successful so we can get more MOTU media and toys, of which I might enjoy more. That is all.
    Even though I love both seasons, I do kind of agree with you on most of this. Killing off characters just for the sake of killing them off and trying to make it more adult-like is not really necessary. Its like when I used to play D & D. As a DM, I would only allow a player's character to get killed if it was in a manner that promoted a noble sacrifice (or if they did something really really stupid). Roboto's death was good. Clamp Champ and Fisto's not so much. It just kind of happened for no good reason.

    But I can forgive it because Revelation is just one more vision of the property. I won't let a few things kill my enthusiasm and ruin the experience. The good outweighs the bad, for me. For me, in my own head-canon, these are characters that are immortal. Even if they die off in one iteration, they still live on in another. Just the way I look at it.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orko the Great View Post
    Actually, he only wrote 2 of the episodes. The others were written by different people.
    Television doesn't work like that. There are script-editors, rewrites, second drafts etc, all of which can be 'amended' by the showrunner at a moment's notice. Kevin may have been credited with a couple of episodes, but he was 100% absolutely more hands-on with those scripts than you think.

    For example, when showrunning Doctor Who the first time, Russel T. Davies revealed he personally rewrote almost every single script that was approved for production, despite never crediting himself on those stories when they transmitted. The only scripts he didn't touch were those by Steven Moffat. Moffat himself would do some uncredited work on other people's scripts when he was showrunner, although by series eight he had began adding a co-writing credit to those he had helped to polish.

  21. #46
    He-Man historian
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cameron Samurai View Post
    Television doesn't work like that. There are script-editors, rewrites, second drafts etc, all of which can be 'amended' by the showrunner at a moment's notice. Kevin may have been credited with a couple of episodes, but he was 100% absolutely more hands-on with those scripts than you think.
    I recommend the "Writer Commentaries" that are on Smith's youtube-channel. For Part 1 the writers talk about the process, and Smith is hosting it with them. In some cases Kevin will admit that for some writer he didn't need to do much story-editing for dialogue, but maybe helped with pacing issues.
    He-Man & She-Ra fan, writer to official Dark Horse MOTU/POP books

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  22. #47
    Loco Motu Vato ehenyo's Avatar
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    Good show, but I'm'm bummed there was no Green Goddess.
    "I wouldn't be surprised if this movie has Adam as a skinny nerd from Earth battling another skinny nerd-hacker from Earth that used an alias of Keldor. They then enter Tron-style to a cyber world called Eternia, where they control muscle-bound avatars to battle (called He-Man and Skeletor). And these same avatars come to life and continue to battle in present-day Earth." - VZX

  23. #48
    Court Magician BB Shockwave's Avatar
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    -I KNEW it!!! I knew it was too out of character, too easy that Teela would make a selfless sacrifice and remain constrained, reborn as energy that cannot exist outside Grayskull. Pish-posh about generations of Sorceresses who have done this before her, naaaah. She can just easily reinvent the wheel and do her own thing with ancient magic she knows nothing about. (Why is there no facepalm icon...? Possibly with Sssqueeze. Would be nice)
    -Why aren't any of the Shadow Beasts using their fear powers? I thought that was Scare Glow's main thing...
    -Orko is back... how? Evil-Lyn did not raise the dead. She summoned Subternia's population. Last we saw of Orko, he was buried on Preternia, which she destroyed. And apparently, he is ridiculously powerful now and can be in many places at once...?
    -Lyn, you destroyed Preternia with a THOUGHT. Why are you hurling rocks at Skeletor and Adam instead of just killing them the same way? Kevin doesn't understans how power levels work. If you set up someone to have that much power, you cannot just have them NOT use it later when they would absolutely need it.
    -If Man-at-Arms' cannon has a literal death laser (seriously that scene was like the laser grid scene from that terrible Resident Evil movie) why didn't he use it ever before? He forgot the setting? Ah, no, it was so we can give some badass moment to Andra, who until now, has literally done nothing of consequence in this show. She really was just added later to the plot by marketing, and it shows.
    -"This might be a minute" - yeah, that's the kind of attitude we have come to expect from this Teela. And yeah, was anyone surprised that it has come down to this? In a show (not) called He-Man and the Masters of the Universe, we end with the two main female characters battling each other, while He-Man and Skeletor have been relegated to bystanders.
    -LOL, Adam, you are an idiot... why did you give power to Skeletor? Not your dad, or Duncan, no, your arch enemy, who of course now will try to kill you with it because let's keep in mind, this is Joker here, and he is as LOLrandom as ever.
    -Guess that was Beast-Beast's story arc, he chose to remain a lapdog and falls down a cliff. Glad you got us soooo invested in the character, Kevin. But I bet the fanboys will eat it up and demand a toy of that ugly thing.
    -Ram Man? Like, you waited this long and then he is just a glorified errand boy delivering a hoverdisk. That's... incredibly underwhelming for Marlena's "special bomb". Not to mention how it accomplished little as He-Man is grounded immediately afterwards by the dragon.
    -Call me squeamish, I don't enjoy seeing He-Man gleefully hacking shadow beasts to bits. Those are probably living beings, after a fashion, if they aren't magical and go poof when killed.
    -So all it took was Teela showing the world's creation to Evil-Lyn to make her realize the universe is magic? When in episode 2, it was SHE who explained to Teela that the universe is magic and it will get destroyed without magic? I am sorry but where was all this cliche anime villain "I will save the universe by destroying it" nonsense back in the first 5 episodes??? If Evil-Lyn was so nihilistic all the time, surely she would have never wanted to help Sorceress bring back magic and save the world, especially after Skeletor, who was basically her everything, was gone. This is just bad writing on so many levels.
    -Glad to see some things never change. Kevin Smith lied again about He-Man having 2 major battles with Skeletor, heck, He-Man - true He-Man, not Hulk-Man - was barely in the show again, only appearing in the last episode and he just throws Skeletor away. "It's not about us!" That's this show, in a nutshell. He-Man and Skeletor, the very core of the franchise, are not the important characters here, it's the OCs of the fanfic writer who barely resemble their original versions, Teela and Evil-Lyn who are the main characters here. And that's sad.
    Also I guess until he releases the Power, Skeletor is now gonna have the Power forever? No sword needed?
    -And I am betting Kevin really never saw the old show, but to think nobody at Mattel told him that Masters of the Universe needs to have, y'know, more MASTERS? That few seconds of Ram Man, and adding Fisto and Clamp Champ for a few minutes in one episode.. that's all? No Stratos, Meckaneck, Buzz-Off, Sy-Klone, Man-e-Faces, the list goes on. They should have at least been shown in the background, fighting in Randor's army...
    -And everyone suddenly forgives the woman who literally destroyed "heaven"??? No, she gets off scott free to go away to Trolla. And was everyone else just gonna let Orko die again? And Scare-Glow, boy he was a joke, had one fight scene and then Orko effortlessly defeated him, we do not even see him banished with his army, he is so inconsequential. And people say he was a standout character. LOL!
    -Andra becomes Man-at-Arms (and I guess she decided to emulate Teela's buzz haircut too - must come with the territory). Sure, why not... it's not like you need military training to run an army. And Teela can choose to just continue her life as before, without any of the responsibilities of being Sorceress. Because Mary Sues always choose the easy way, they jut CAN do things that no Sorceress for eons could do. Lazy writing.

    Revelation is not about us.jpg
    Yeah, this is this series in a nutshell. "It's not about us!" Get your toxic masculinity out of here, He-Man and Skeletor, it's not like you were the most recognizable core characters of this franchise for decades. Let big man Kevin Smith with his baseball hat and grand filmography of stoner movies show you how it is done!
    Good riddance to this show. And to anyone who even remotely thinks this will get a second season, all I have to say is, tough luck.


    Quote Originally Posted by Oldfan87 View Post
    I'm glad so glad other people liked this story, but... I'm sorry, characters I love getting turned into monsters, killed, and sent to hell, Eternia's heaven getting wiped out, characters being shown for five seconds then killed, redemption of villains for irredeemable acts... if thisdark and depressing mess is 'compelling' storytelling that is 'metal', well... I want no part of it. This motu is not for me, I am done with revelation and any possible sequel it has. I hope the rest of you continue to enjoy it, and I hope it is successful so we can get more MOTU media and toys, of which I might enjoy more. That is all.
    I really have no idea how people who supposedly love the Filmation series and see this as a continuation can enjoy this. As you said, characters got butchered, or turned into irredeemable monsters. If Hasbro did a similar continuation to the Sunbow Transformers cartoon and I dunno, had Optimus Prime die 20 minutes in, people would be ******. We had to endure that once, in 1986, and the uproar was so much Hasbro had to bring him back.
    I mean, at the end of this series, I do not understand how anyone could just let Evil-Lyn - who literally destroyed "heaven" get off and not have her punished or killed. Or Skeletor, who again, killed not just Masters but tons of civilians.
    I mean I know it is technically not the Filmation universe, but for all intents and purposes it was created to be the ending to that series, and it all but ****** on its legacy. How people can delude themselves and not see Kevin Smith is just using their beloved franchise as his playground is beyond me... But then again, I have seen the same thing in 2007 on Transformers forums when people deluded themselves into liking the travesty that were the Michael Bay Transformers movies, just because they have been waiting for so long for the franchise to get another movie. It wasn't for about a decade, after several terrible sequels, that even the most ardent supporters gave up and sulked away.
    Last edited by BB Shockwave; November 24, 2021 at 06:01am.

  24. #49
    Snoogans Dynamo of Eternia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BB Shockwave View Post
    -Orko is back... how? Evil-Lyn did not raise the dead. She summoned Subternia's population. Last we saw of Orko, he was buried on Preternia, which she destroyed. And apparently, he is ridiculously powerful now and can be in many places at once...?
    You need to go back and watch that episode again because you are not remembering it correctly.

    Orko did not escape Subternia with the rest of them when they went to Preternia. He stayed behind battling Scareglow while the others escaped. A small piece of his scarf was torn off and went through the door/portal with them. They did not bury him. This little tomb stone/memorial that they made was symbolic. He was not actually buried there.
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  25. #50
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    I wish they could have put 10 seconds in there near the end where they show Preternia was back with Fisto & Clamp Champ meeting up with Moss Man & King Grayskull there. It didn't need a 2 minute explanation, although I guess I am a little confused on the qualifications on getting to Preternia. Is it just for the major protectors of Grayskull or can anyone get there? Fisto and Clamp Champ don't seem on par with the past He-Men, Sorceresses, and even Moss Man, but Adam made it sound like they could get there. Regardless of what ultimately happens with Preternia, Evil-Lyn deserves to be in the dungeons of Castle Grayskull the rest of her days with no redemption.

    I do think they could have wrote Teela not being tethered to Castle Grayskull better.

    Overall, it was entertaining. It was very action packed. I was happy to see Blade. I didn't expect that. The voice acting of Randor and Duncan was very good.

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